The meter is running: Obama's first year

[Krisken]

I just don't see how Bush made the US look strong.

Same way the idiot everyone avoids because he's so annoying looks strong...[/QUOTE]

Or a hillbilly with a shotgun...[/QUOTE]
Damn, all this time I thought he was trying to bluster his way through like countries ruled by dictatorships. His administration just never understood that when you don't have an opposing superpower you don't have to act like you are strong when you are strong. Gives the impression you are pretending.

 

[@Li3n]

Meh, the US has been doing that to small, dictatorship run countries for ages...

I just don't see how Bush made the US look strong.

Same way the idiot everyone avoids because he's so annoying looks strong...[/QUOTE]

Or a hillbilly with a shotgun...[/QUOTE]

Hey now... no need to insult the poor hillbillies.

 

[GasBandit]

makare1: actually, we started projecting strength AFTER we were attacked... and then we weren't attacked successfully again, until xmas 2009, which only avoided being a tragedy by a nigerian's lack of expertise with binary explosives.

as for everybody else re:strength, remember it was bush foreign policy that got libya to simmer down and start playing ball. It was obama foreign policy that got him up on the podium in the UN to make demands of us.

 

[Seraphyn]

After all is said and done, ~1/4th of promises kept, 1/4th of the way in on his presidency is a pretty good track record for a politician in my opinion.

As for strength: I think everyone and their mother knows the US has great military power, the only difference between the 2 presidents from my point of view was that Bush would attack just about any opponent without any real justifications while Obama would rather reason first. I think most are confusing weak with actually using diplomacy.
Of course how this works for the US itself is something different, Obama plays more ball and is thus more likely to give up something to get something while Bush would just demand to get something. Which lead to deteriorating relations. All in all I think the 'weaker' approach gets more positive results in the end. There is a time and place to play hard-ball and while Obama still needs to use it more, Bush just played it 24/7.

 

[crono1224]

makare1: actually, we started projecting strength AFTER we were attacked... and then we weren't attacked successfully again, until xmas 2009, which only avoided being a tragedy by a nigerian's lack of expertise with binary explosives.

as for everybody else re:strength, remember it was bush foreign policy that got libya to simmer down and start playing ball. It was obama foreign policy that got him up on the podium in the UN to make demands of us.

You know minus the DC sniper? The midwest mailbox bomber, the Los Angeles Airport Shooting You mean minus all those?

 

[makare]

makare1: actually, we started projecting strength AFTER we were attacked... and then we weren't attacked successfully again, until xmas 2009, which only avoided being a tragedy by a nigerian's lack of expertise with binary explosives.

as for everybody else re:strength, remember it was bush foreign policy that got libya to simmer down and start playing ball. It was obama foreign policy that got him up on the podium in the UN to make demands of us.

After we were attacked is when we started projecting dickishness, not strength.

 

[Shakey]

Don't forget the anthrax scare.

 

[Troll]

makare1: actually, we started projecting strength AFTER we were attacked... and then we weren't attacked successfully again, until xmas 2009, which only avoided being a tragedy by a nigerian's lack of expertise with binary explosives.

as for everybody else re:strength, remember it was bush foreign policy that got libya to simmer down and start playing ball. It was obama foreign policy that got him up on the podium in the UN to make demands of us.

You know minus the DC sniper? The midwest mailbox bomber, the Los Angeles Airport Shooting You mean minus all those?[/QUOTE]

Don't bother. Gas isn't interested in facts, he's just here to make wild claims for the rest of us to laugh at.

 

[GasBandit]

makare1: actually, we started projecting strength AFTER we were attacked... and then we weren't attacked successfully again, until xmas 2009, which only avoided being a tragedy by a nigerian's lack of expertise with binary explosives.

as for everybody else re:strength, remember it was bush foreign policy that got libya to simmer down and start playing ball. It was obama foreign policy that got him up on the podium in the UN to make demands of us.

You know minus the DC sniper? The midwest mailbox bomber, the Los Angeles Airport Shooting You mean minus all those?[/QUOTE]

DC Sniper: Domestic serial killer, not foreign terrorist. Only turned jihadist after being imprisoned as smokescreen. Accepted motive for mass murder was to kill his estranged wife but have enough other murders so as to make it all appear random, thus not leading to his being suspected.

Mailbox bomber: Domestic murder and mayhem, not foreign terrorism.

LA Airport shooting: While terrorist in intent, ruled to be one guy with a gun, no foreign backing. Killed 2, wounded 4, shot dead.



On another note, I find it very telling that so many of the "I like obama" posts are coming from Europeans. Polls of Europeans have shown they overwhelmingly desire america weakened on the international stage.

 

[@Li3n]

makare1: actually, we started projecting strength AFTER we were attacked... and then we weren't attacked successfully again, until xmas 2009, which only avoided being a tragedy by a nigerian's lack of expertise with binary explosives.

Hmmm... i don''t think you're using that word the way i was taught it should be used...

After we were attacked is when we started projecting dickishness, not strength.

Actually seem to recall that for a while there after 9/11 everyone was on your side...

 

[makare]

makare1: actually, we started projecting strength AFTER we were attacked... and then we weren't attacked successfully again, until xmas 2009, which only avoided being a tragedy by a nigerian's lack of expertise with binary explosives.

Hmmm... i don''t think you're using that word the way i was taught it should be used...

After we were attacked is when we started projecting dickishness, not strength.

Actually seem to recall that for a while there after 9/11 everyone was on your side...[/QUOTE]

What choice did anyone have?

 

[Krisken]

makare1: actually, we started projecting strength AFTER we were attacked... and then we weren't attacked successfully again, until xmas 2009, which only avoided being a tragedy by a nigerian's lack of expertise with binary explosives.

Hmmm... i don''t think you're using that word the way i was taught it should be used...

After we were attacked is when we started projecting dickishness, not strength.

Actually seem to recall that for a while there after 9/11 everyone was on your side...[/QUOTE]
Yup. Until, of course, the rhetoric turned to Iraq. We squandered a whole lot of world sympathy on that one.

 

[WolfOfOdin]

I'm surprised the "Europeans love Obama because they want the US to be teh weak!" hadn't come up earlier. I'm to the point of thinking Europeans like Obama because he's willing to try negotiation first before letting the hammer drop.

 

[tegid]

we started projecting strength AFTER we were attacked... and then we weren't attacked successfully again, until xmas 2009, which only avoided being a tragedy by a nigerian's lack of expertise with binary explosives.

Yeah it wasn't because of paranoid airport control, tighter controls everywhere or anything like that. I mean, the terrorists were SO scared of you and now with Obama they're like 'yay! back to bombing! It was getting boring here in Iraq'

I'm surprised the "Europeans love Obama because they want the US to be teh weak!" hadn't come up earlier. I'm to the point of thinking Europeans like Obama because he's willing to try negotiation first before letting the hammer drop.

In my case it's more or less that. It's a matter of attitude more than anything else.

 

[Troll]

I'm surprised the "Europeans love Obama because they want the US to be teh weak!" hadn't come up earlier. I'm to the point of thinking Europeans like Obama because he's willing to try negotiation first before letting the hammer drop.

In my case it's more or less that. It's a matter of attitude more than anything else.

No, I'm pretty sure you are just a communist who hates America and wants to see it destroyed. That's how EVERYONE outside of America is, afterall. Just ask Gas!

 

[WolfOfOdin]

I'm surprised the "Europeans love Obama because they want the US to be teh weak!" hadn't come up earlier. I'm to the point of thinking Europeans like Obama because he's willing to try negotiation first before letting the hammer drop.

In my case it's more or less that. It's a matter of attitude more than anything else.

No, I'm pretty sure you are just a communist who hates America and wants to see it destroyed. That's how EVERYONE outside of America is, afterall. Just ask Gas![/QUOTE]

Nah, just someone who believes Foreign Policy doesn't have to grow out of the end of an artillery emplacement.

 

[North_Ranger]

On another note, I find it very telling that so many of the "I like obama" posts are coming from Europeans. Polls of Europeans have shown they overwhelmingly desire america weakened on the international stage.

I'll try to be as tactful as possible... You, sir, may go and fuck yourself. Once again you've loosened up your shit-bags and started spewing all over an entire goddamn continent with very different cultural and political aspirations. I'd like to see those polls you are quoting, since the wording sounds like you've been sticking your head in some pretty deep conservative shi... I mean, sites again. Most of the people I know and have discussed politics with are of the mind that it's a good thing the United States might now be more of a reasonable guy willing to talk softly before using the big stick instead of a paranoid, lying loony.

Oh, and did I already tell you to go fuck yourself? I did? Oh well, never hurts saying it twice...

 

[Dave]

On another note, I find it very telling that so many of the "I like obama" posts are coming from Europeans. Polls of Europeans have shown they overwhelmingly desire america weakened on the international stage.

I'll try to be as tactful as possible... You, sir, may go and fuck yourself. Once again you've loosened up your shit-bags and started spewing all over an entire goddamn continent with very different cultural and political aspirations. I'd like to see those polls you are quoting, since the wording sounds like you've been sticking your head in some pretty deep conservative shi... I mean, sites again. Most of the people I know and have discussed politics with are of the mind that it's a good thing the United States might now be more of a reasonable guy willing to talk softly before using the big stick instead of a paranoid, lying loony.

Oh, and did I already tell you to go fuck yourself? I did? Oh well, never hurts saying it twice...[/QUOTE]

Play. Nice.

 

[Kitty Sinatra]

Next year's Secret Santa, whoever gets North_Ranger really oughtta send him a coupon for tact lessons.

 

[North_Ranger]

On another note, I find it very telling that so many of the "I like obama" posts are coming from Europeans. Polls of Europeans have shown they overwhelmingly desire america weakened on the international stage.

I'll try to be as tactful as possible... You, sir, may go and fuck yourself. Once again you've loosened up your shit-bags and started spewing all over an entire goddamn continent with very different cultural and political aspirations. I'd like to see those polls you are quoting, since the wording sounds like you've been sticking your head in some pretty deep conservative shi... I mean, sites again. Most of the people I know and have discussed politics with are of the mind that it's a good thing the United States might now be more of a reasonable guy willing to talk softly before using the big stick instead of a paranoid, lying loony.

Oh, and did I already tell you to go fuck yourself? I did? Oh well, never hurts saying it twice...[/QUOTE]

Play. Nice.[/QUOTE]

Sorry, boss. Won't happen again.

 

[makare]

I liked it

 

[Krisken]

I can understand how you feel NR. Sometimes it's hard to resist the troll when you're in his cave.

 

[North_Ranger]

Next year's Secret Santa, whoever gets North_Ranger really oughtta send him a coupon for tact lessons.

Oh come on It's not like I fly off the handle at the drop of a hat.

I just hate listening to a *BEEP*ing donkey-*BEEP*ing know-it-*BEEP*-all go all "Urop hatz uz, hurhurhurhur!".

 

[North_Ranger]

I can understand how you feel NR. Sometimes it's hard to resist the troll when you're in his cave.

It's not that. I just hate him dissin' my neighbourhood.

 

[Espy]

It would have been more effective to ask him for a source to those polls he brought up. I'd love to see them.

 

[Troll]

I can understand how you feel NR. Sometimes it's hard to resist the troll when you're in his cave.

At the end of the day I take solace in the certainty that ultimately he will be proven wrong, as he has so many times before.

 

[North_Ranger]

It would have been more effective to ask him for a source to those polls he brought up. I'd love to see them.

I thought I did. I just did so while giving an opinion of his "fact-finding" habits.

 

[Kitty Sinatra]

Next year's Secret Santa, whoever gets North_Ranger really oughtta send him a coupon for tact lessons.

Oh come on It's not like I fly off the handle at the drop of a hat.[/QUOTE]
You know me, Ranger. I'm just playing off your comment about trying to be tactful.

 

[@Li3n]

makare1: actually, we started projecting strength AFTER we were attacked... and then we weren't attacked successfully again, until xmas 2009, which only avoided being a tragedy by a nigerian's lack of expertise with binary explosives.

Hmmm... i don''t think you're using that word the way i was taught it should be used...

After we were attacked is when we started projecting dickishness, not strength.

Actually seem to recall that for a while there after 9/11 everyone was on your side...[/QUOTE]

What choice did anyone have?[/QUOTE]

Stay out of it, like some did with Iraq.

 

[Seraphyn]

You remember, the whole "if you're not with us you're against us" thing?

Staying out of it would've probably resulted in a lot of lost deals, and lost political support. For most countries that was not an option.

 

[@Li3n]

I remember that was still in place when Iraq happened, which is why i mentioned it.

 

[JCM]

makare1: actually, we started projecting strength AFTER we were attacked... and then we weren't attacked successfully again, until xmas 2009, which only avoided being a tragedy by a nigerian's lack of expertise with binary explosives.

Hmmm... i don''t think you're using that word the way i was taught it should be used...

After we were attacked is when we started projecting dickishness, not strength.

Actually seem to recall that for a while there after 9/11 everyone was on your side...[/QUOTE]

What choice did anyone have?[/QUOTE]

Stay out of it, like everybody (but 3-4 countries) did with Iraq.[/QUOTE]Corrected that for you

 

[tegid]

One of which was Spain

 

[GasBandit]

The poll was linked in a previous GBPT thread... like a year ago unfortunately, so lost it probably is to the sands of time. It was a Pew research center poll conducted in early 2008... lemme see if I can find it.

Oh and Dave, don't worry about NR - he's just mad cause I laughed at his summer hovel in the woods I'm a big boy and can take the slings and arrows. Plus, you know me - when someone melts down like that and degenerates into slinging vitriol like that, it just confirms in my mind that he knows he's got nothing. I take it as a sign of capitulation, kind of like when a feminist can't win a logical argument with a man, so she tries to "trump" him by calling him a misogynist.

Anyway, closest thing I can find right off the cuff is this 2004 report on page 9, where it shows overwhelming support for the EU being as strong as america (read: America weakened on the global stage to the level of the EU) would be a good thing for the world.

 

[GasBandit]

One of which was Spain

And then terrorism successfully grabbed the reins of Spain's political system with the train bombings 3 days before the election, and they cast off their spines faster than the french ever have in the entirety of recorded history.