Interesting read on the difference between marvel and DC, when related to films.

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The trouble with DC movies lately is that the films are put into the hands of amateurs at best, or people that think putting in the lowest amount of effort is acceptable because it is for kids at worst.
 
Metal Men were such a terribly stupid idea... I pray that there is no more movement on a movie about them...
It was a wacky Silver Age concept when comic creators were basically throwing out everything and anything just to see if it would work or just for the hell of it. Personally, while I haven't read a lot of Metal Men comics, I like the concept behind it just because it's so vastly unique from so many other superhero comics out there.
 
In regards to the article, I have to agree. That's not just a comparison between the movies; it applies to the comics, as well. Before Marvel, most comics were about these powerful, usually unrelatable heroes in the same vein as ancient heroes like the mentioned Gilgamesh and Hercules. I say this, of course, a huge fan of DC. They're vastly more iconic than Marvel partly because they've been around longer and partly because many of them are likened to gods. Grant Morrison even went as far as to have a JLA roster comparable to the Greek pantheon (Superman/Zeus, Wonder Woman/Hera, etc.). I think it's also because when many of the familiar DC heroes were created, it was in the Silver Age: where concepts and adventures were more important than character development. Flash, Green Lantern, and others were the same character from each issue.

Marvel, on the other hand, had full-on character development. We saw Spider-Man grow as a character along the way. Ditto for the Fantastic Four. They weren't these unbreakable gods who beat up the bad guys on a monthly basis. They had faults and things you could relate with them. I'll admit that, even as a fan of Superman, he fell into that same trap in the Silver Age. He was relatable when he first appeared because, similar to Spider-Man, he was empowering for those that had little power (Jews, the poor and downtrodden, etc).

DC has certainly made their characters more relatable over the years while Marvel has stopped some character development on their universe in favour of hitting the reset button for new creative teams. But there are still a number of DC mainstays that have little character. Hal Jordan, for example, the prime example of a Silver Age character, really doesn't have much character. Even Geoff Johns' run on Green Lantern isn't memorable for the character or his development (because there isn't much), but the various new colours of Lanterns created and the subsequent wars. Basically, it's just a modern version of the Silver Age formula.

Unfortunately for DC, their very much more powerful characters to Marvel's makes it hard to make movies. Wonder Woman's Greek mythology demands a big budget. Ditto for GL (and we saw how well that worked out). Superman is a great character, but the audience demands threats that he can tackle, which make it hard to make, budget-wise.

Whereas with Marvel, their characters are - for the most part - much more down to earth with smaller threats (in comparison) and more focus on character development. Heck, look at Thor. He's basically Marvel's Superman and what did most of his movie have? Him without powers trying to prove his worth. It was still a great movie, but the fact that you can do that with Thor says something. At least half of Spider-Man 2 was spent completely out of costume, focusing more on Peter Parker, and it was still a great movie. I say this as a tried-and-true DC fanboy, but that's not as easy to do with many of their characters.
 
It was a wacky Silver Age concept when comic creators were basically throwing out everything and anything just to see if it would work or just for the hell of it. Personally, while I haven't read a lot of Metal Men comics, I like the concept behind it just because it's so vastly unique from so many other superhero comics out there.
Yea. Lets see someone here fill a feature length story in the course of 24 hours. :( So popular they kept coming back from the dead, only to be destroyed at the end of the story. Also Did you know Mercury is the only metal that's liquid at room temperature?

/me goes back to waiting for a Challengers of the Unknown tv show done like a modern day Johnny Quest.
 
I really don't think you can do a Metal Men movie unless it's an action comedy. It's just too Silver Age to have the seriousness that DC wants from a franchise.
 
You're right. It would absolutely have to embrace the silliness and just run with it.

Ask me, it would be a great, new movie in the same vein as Mystery Men.
 
At least half of Spider-Man 2 was spent completely out of costume, focusing more on Peter Parker, and it was still a great movie. I say this as a tried-and-true DC fanboy, but that's not as easy to do with many of their characters.
That's one of the reasons I liked the Spider-Man comic. There were large sections of the comic book where he never even put on the suit at different points. When Spider-Man is written well, the fact that he's a super hero is secondary to who he is as a character. That's why whenever they try to focus too much on the super hero side of him and ignore his supporting cast, he becomes just a super hero who whines all the time.

As a side note, the Green Lantern ring not working on wood was only for Alan Scott, the Golden Age Green Lantern. He has no affiliation with the Green Lantern Corps other than being a friend to some of the modern GLs and Jade being involved with the Corps occasionally. His ring is completely different as it is based on magic, not science.

As for the yellow weakness, it doesn't exist anymore. The yellow impurity, IE Parallax was what caused the rings not to function on yellow stuff. Spoilering the next bit because it's a complete and total tangent:

It's ironic that the yellow weakness is eventually what led to Parallax being purged from the central power battery. The reason that Hal was able to be pushed over the edge by Parallax was because he was unable to stop Mongul because he has yellow skin (see the Return of Superman storyline). Had the weakness against yellow caused by Parallax not existed, Hal never would have given himself over to Parallax in his grief and agony over the destruction of Coast City. He never would have returned to OA and destroyed the central battery, which means that Parallax would still be trapped there. He then wouldn't have gone through the events that eventually led to Parallax being purged from Hal Jordan. So, in the end, Parallax was the architect of his own downfall.


Now that Parallax is no longer within the central power battery in OA, even if the GL corps members are pissing their pants in fear, their rings will still work on yellow stuff. The yellow power rings work more effectively against anyone who is feeling fear, so that will make a difference in a fight between a Sinestro Corps member and a GL corps member, but it has less to do with the GL ring not working, but the yellow ring being stronger.
 

Necronic

Staff member
DC was written better in the individual heros, marvel was better about making a "universe". The universe of marvel is such that it demands human interaction, which works better in movies. One of the more interesting/recent examples of that is with Luke Cage and whatshername from Alias. It doesn't really matter that neither of them have particularly interesting powers (I think they are both just invulnerable and strong). That is a "universe" story.

JLA could never really do that, everythign is too epic, or too focused on the epic individuals. Most people would agree that Superman and Batman are probably the top two greatest superheros of all time. Yet I have never read a story arc involving both Superman and Batman (yes including Frank Millers) that are as interesting as some of the stories involving minor characters in Marvel. The problem may be that they are both too damned big for any subtletly and dynamism to be told between them.

One exception to that may be the Hitman comics. They are fantastic, and they are about a "universe". Note though that the Hitman himself is a pretty weak guy. Very simple super power. Nothing amazing, except that it serves as such an excellent platform for story telling, as does his morally ambiguous lifestyle.

Well, that and the Sandman, but that's different.
Edit:

You know, there's also a problem with DC just never growing up. So much of it just oozes campiness because it never really got with the times. The "Unjustice League"? And when they do try to be modern, like with teh Dr Light story, it just feels hamfisted and over the top. Like they had been told that this kind of story would be more modern, but didn't really get it.
 
I still don't understand all the hate towards the FF movies. Were they great? No, but they weren't the pariah that everybody seems to think they are.

Also, I still think making Galactus a giant dick in a purple helmet would look just plain stupid on film, regardless of how much JCM disagreed with me.
 
I don't know. When I first saw the pictures of Thor and the other Asgardians, I thought they looked stupid. But given the grande regalement that the movie gave them, it vanished.

You do the same thing with Galactus and the audience will shit their pants. Certainly more intimidating than a space cloud.
 
I also understand what the movie was trying to do. Galactus is supposed to be such a force beyond our understanding that you can't really see him. The cloud itself wasn't supposed to be Galactus, just what we could percieve. That was my takeaway from the end of that movie.

I loved the hell out of the Silver Surfer, though. The only thing I really hated about the second movie was they went with the stupid power switching thing.

Dr. Doom in particular was very much like his comic book counterpart in the second one.[DOUBLEPOST=1341200346][/DOUBLEPOST]I just had another thought about the differences between Marvel and DC. It has to do with the percieved campiness between the two worlds.

Names.

Though there are some exceptions, for the most part, Marvel villains have regular old names. Curt Connors, Norman Osborne, etc... The obvious exceptions being Victor VonDoom, Otto Octavius. However, in DC a lot of the villains seem to have campy names that tie to their identities as villains. Johnathan Crane (Scarecrow), Edward Nygma(Riddler), etc...
 
I watched it for the first time yesterday and while it wasn't the worst super hero movie I have ever seen it certainly wasn't very good either. The B plot lines such as the marriage between Sue and Reed were uninteresting and the interplay between the actors wasn't particularly well done.

It seemed like they were going for humor but none of it really worked for me.

Julian McMahon seemed to be a poor fit for Victor von Doom.

I can understand not wanting to use the original Galactus and I don't really have any particular attachment to the villain however the replacement gas cloud made for a poor driving force for the movie and was resolved too quickly and easily leaving everything up to Von Doom and the Silver Surfer.

And sadly while the Silver Surfer was done pretty well, his character didn't develop very much. I guess we are meant to see a struggle in the character in how he is serving this genocidal monster but I think that it could have been done much better and with more importance.
 
I hated the Dr. Doom in the movies. Greedy businessman out for revenge is a shitty stand-in for autocratic, maniacal genius with a serious hate grudge for one of the only men in the world smarter than him.
 
In the second movie he was much more Doom-ish. The whole deal with him stealing the power of the surfer was straight out of the Secret Wars.
 
Wait.... DC is considering making a Metal Men movie? Wow, that's a pretty obscure one to option did they learn nothing from Jonah Hex?
 
Jonah Hex isn't actually the obscure. He's had plenty of exposure in the various Batman and Justice League shows, had a pretty popular comic for a while, and is generally considered to be one of the more interesting, if lesser known heroes in the DC portfolio. The problem was that they had a shit script and tried to spruce it up with "supernatural" and super science stuff.

I still contend that if they had done a straight up Western like Unforgiven or 3:10 to Yuma, it would have been a much better movie and made more sense.
 

Necronic

Staff member
Loveless would fit that bill about 20 times better than Jonah Hex.

Honestly the success of Jonah Hex vs that of Loveless should tell you everything you need to know about why DC kind of sucks.
 
I never even bothered seeing Jonah Hex because I like the character too much. I hear that James Brolin did a good job for what he was given.

Also... Megan Fox... no thank you sir.

What I REALLY want to see is a Dr. Strange movie.
 

Necronic

Staff member
MAN I WAS JUST SAYING THAT!

Seriously he's like one of the only truly A-List guys left to do. You've hit soooooooo many of the others. He really needs his own movie. And, comeon, tell me there isn't a Hollywood studio that wouldn't love to be told "Ok seriously do WHATEVER you want with CGI, the fans expect it and want it"

But who would he battle?
Shuma goroth?
the Dread Dormamu?
Or Baron Mordo?
WHO I ASK YOU?
 
Wait.... DC is considering making a Metal Men movie? Wow, that's a pretty obscure one to option did they learn nothing from Jonah Hex?
If taking risks with obscure characters means no movies, then we wouldn't have very many Marvel movies. It was Blade's success that opened a lot of new doors.
 
MAN I WAS JUST SAYING THAT!

Seriously he's like one of the only truly A-List guys left to do. You've hit soooooooo many of the others. He really needs his own movie. And, comeon, tell me there isn't a Hollywood studio that wouldn't love to be told "Ok seriously do WHATEVER you want with CGI, the fans expect it and want it"

But who would he battle?
Shuma goroth?
the Dread Dormamu?
Or Baron Mordo?
WHO I ASK YOU?
They are making a Dr. Strange film. Not much word on casting or stuff like that, but I could kinda see Benedict Cumberbatch as him.

Also, I would guess that they would use Baron Mordo as the villain of the first film and set up Dormammu for another film.
 
I never even bothered seeing Jonah Hex because I like the character too much. I hear that James Brolin did a good job for what he was given.
Have you seen the Jonah Hex animated short they released with one of the DC movies on DVD? It's AMAZING.
 
If taking risks with obscure characters means no movies, then we wouldn't have very many Marvel movies. It was Blade's success that opened a lot of new doors.
Right, but that is not the situation now. Comic Book movies are now mainstream. Why are they picking third and fourth rate heroes when there are top tier heroes that still haven't gotten a movie. No one outside of a comic store has probably heard of the Metal Men whereas a lot of people have heard of The Flash or Aquaman or hell even Green Arrow.

Now I am not saying that I think DC could do a better job at those heroes than the obscure Metal Men in a live action movie but it would be nice to see some effort.

And on Jonah Hex, I have to disagree that he is well known. Most of my friends who've seen it didn't even know he was a DC character and some of them are comic fans.
 
Hex in a Weird, Weird Western would be cool. But the trailers for Hex was just too painful to watch. And it turned out the movie was worse.

And it could be worse. There was a DC property in Development Hell, SUPER MAX. Green Arrow is a prisoner in a Maximum Security Prison for Super Villains. His power is being a white Jackie Chan (can make a weapon out of anything he picks up.) And he has to escape... It just sounded like a terrible waste of a movie. I am kinda glad that it has not made it out of D.H.
 
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