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Comic book movies dumbing down Hollywood???

#1

Steve

Steve

Director William Friedkin (The French Connection, Exorcist) claims the recent trend in comic book themed movies are catering to the lowest common denominator. At one time comic books were considered to be the bottom of the barrel of literature and several titles have proven those critics wrong (unfortunately several titles have supported that belief). I do freely admit that I'm one of the dumbed down consumer. Raised on MTV I have the attention span of a gnat and don't care much for substance but love flash. Perhaps Mr Friedkin is correct. Your thoughts?

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=CNG.77591e6bbe1ccd5c2f79f962f82a47ec.b11&show_article=1


#2

Hailey Knight

Hailey Knight

I'm a substance guy--I want stories with character and personality, not just lasers and explosions. And I still enjoy many comic book movies. So no, he's wrong. Hollywood has always been dumb. It's not the fault of comic book movies.

Hirsch recalled, during filming "the makeup girl would be dabbing me with blood with a paintbrush. Friedkin would come up and go, 'No! No! No!' and grab her bucket of blood and douse me in the face with it and then go get another bucket of blood.
"I was just soaking with blood."
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His movie is literally buckets of blood and he accuses Hollywood of lowest common denominator? The Exorcist isn't exactly a deep film anyway.


#3

ThatNickGuy

ThatNickGuy

I wouldn't say it's just superhero movies to blame. In fact, as far as quality, fun, popcorn action flicks go, superhero movies are among the better ones. But then you have total, non-sensical crap like Transformers that makes stupid amounts of money. Or the endless non-sensical remakes that are often more miss than hit.

I'd bet Friedkin is just jealous. When was the last time any of his recent films were relevent?


#4

ThatNickGuy

ThatNickGuy

Eh, it's a live action toy commercial adapted from an animated toy commercial. I'd say superhero movies are at least slightly more cerebreal. Sometimes.


#5

drifter

drifter

Meh. That dude more seems to be lamenting Hollywood's risk-averse nature than explicitly calling out comic book movies. If you ignore the trashy headlines, he's basically saying Hollywood movies go for the broadest audience possible, at the expense of original material. Is anyone really going to argue that? He presents comic book movies as symptomatic, not the cause of the problem, and even that seems to be a casual line that got pounced on by some AFP writer looking for a good spin.


#6

ThatNickGuy

ThatNickGuy

Now, if he had said it like that, I'd agree. Of course, Friedkin came from the part of filmmaking history where Hollywood took a lot of big risks (and where a lot of the best movies came from).


#7

Charlie Don't Surf

Charlie Don't Surf

I'm on record saying this latest trend of Superhero movies have been annoyingly cookie-cutter. But they aren't to blame and aren't really the cause, it's just another effect.


#8

Espy

Espy

I'm sorry, just NOW things are getting dumbed down? Did he miss the previous decades full of Pauly Shore films?


#9

Shegokigo

Shegokigo

If anything "dumbed down" Hollywood it was the lastest batch of parody movie genre. Epic Movie, Date Movie, etc


#10

@Li3n

@Li3n

Espy said:
I'm sorry, just NOW things are getting dumbed down? Did he miss the previous decades full of Pauly Shore films?
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#11

@Li3n

@Li3n

And someone explain to me why Twilight is a novel, just like actually non-masturbatory fantasy books, but any serious comic has to be called a graphic novel...

Also, Greg Rucka talk about it from another perspective: http://blog.newsarama.com/2011/08/25/smart-versus-realism/


#12



Chibibar

The dumb down movies are what the general audience seems to want (i.e. more box office sales)

I hardly see any original films that wasn't from a comic book, a book, remake or re-remake ;)


#13

ThatNickGuy

ThatNickGuy

Charlie Don't Surf said:
I'm on record saying this latest trend of Superhero movies have been annoyingly cookie-cutter. But they aren't to blame and aren't really the cause, it's just another effect.
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In what ways, exactly, are they cookie cutter?


#14

Shegokigo

Shegokigo

Origin Story, has girl hero likes, kidnapping of some sort/chick doesn't dig him yet, most likely loses his powers at some point but gets them back, saves her/he impresses her with powers, defeats final villain.... or did he? The end.


#15

Gusto

Gusto

Yeah I get that completely. I enjoyed Thor but I could have written it, knowing NOTHING of the comic.


#16

ThatNickGuy

ThatNickGuy

Shegokigo said:
Origin Story, has girl hero likes, kidnapping of some sort/chick doesn't dig him yet, most likely loses his powers at some point but gets them back, saves her/he impresses her with powers, defeats final villain.... or did he? The end.
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*nods* Okay, I get that and agree. Just wanted to hear it in a non-Charlie way. :p


#17

Shegokigo

Shegokigo

Just because it follows a formula though, doesn't make it the amazing/awesome film that it is.

Spidey 1&2, X-Men 1&2, IM 1&2, Hulk, Thor, etc etc were all fantastic films, as well as a ton of fun to watch. Calling a movie crap because it's formulaic is just trying too hard to hate something mainstream/good.


#18

ThatNickGuy

ThatNickGuy

Oh, totally agreed. There's a reason why it's formulaic: because it's a formula that works.


#19



Chibibar

ThatNickGuy said:
Oh, totally agreed. There's a reason why it's formulaic: because it's a formula that works.
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It is like writing. It works for a long time and will work in the years to come.

I know that Captain America was formulaic BUT IT WAS AWESOME (to us)


#20

Frank

Frankie Williamson

ThatNickGuy said:
Oh, totally agreed. There's a reason why it's formulaic: because it's a formula that works.
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That's some of what I think Friedkin is getting at.


#21

BananaHands

BananaHands

I have to admit, I enjoy the Avenger films. The occasional (although sometimes forced) tie-ins give it that comic book feel.

I just really want Deadpool done correctly. That'll be a movie I stand in line for.


#22

Shegokigo

Shegokigo

According to Ryan Reynolds, it's in the works and they've already acknowldged that they're going in the exact opposite direction of Wolverine Origins.


#23

Gusto

Gusto

I've enjoyed the hella formulaic Marvel franchises too. They're fun! Because, surprise surprise, they're based on fun and formulaic source material!

What I enjoyed most of out Cap was the war era pulp feel the whole movie was given, especially in it's visual design. It felt like a modern era WW2 propaganda flick, which was kind of awesome.

I've heard Captain America described as the best Indian Jones movie in years.


#24

Charlie Don't Surf

Charlie Don't Surf

I don't think all of those are created equal. I agree that's the formula in general. But X2 and Spidey 2 are definitely a cut above all those other ones. Captain America is also a bit better, too.

I'm not really attacking that basic plot structure (the one Shego posted), but just more... what these marvel movies are hanging on that structure. I just thought Spidey/X 2 did more with that formula than the rest of them.


#25

BananaHands

BananaHands

Charlie Don't Surf said:
I don't think all of those are created equal. I agree that's the formula in general. But X2 and Spidey 2 are definitely a cut above all those other ones. Captain America is also a bit better, too.

I'm not really attacking that basic plot structure (the one Shego posted), but just more... what these marvel movies are hanging on that structure. I just thought Spidey/X 2 did more with that formula than the rest of them.
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I agree with those two films being the better of the lot. They were sequels, they had already taken on the origin of the characters and were able to focus more on developing the characters. I also feel like Spider-Man 2 put more of the focus on how being Spider-Man was affecting his personal life.

Captain America had some great parts and I felt it stood out because it was the first movie in those films leading up to the Avengers that didn't feel like a teaser for the Avengers (since the first Iron Man).


#26

Shegokigo

Shegokigo

I found Iron Man 1 to be the most fun of the Marvel Production films so far. It was fun, didn't spend too long on the origin, did everything right by the source material and was just a perfect 1st step for the production company.


#27

fade

fade

I liked Iron Man, but I am also a sucker for origin stories, I admit.


#28

Charlie Don't Surf

Charlie Don't Surf

Iron Man was good except for the whole having a compelling action scene and interesting villain thing.


#29

ThatNickGuy

ThatNickGuy

Oh, I'm sorry. Guess I must have been a sucker for the part where he fought his way out of that terrorist camp or blew up a flipping tank. Final action scene, yeah, I'll agree with that. A lot of people thought the final fight was kind of ho-hum (like Incredible Hulk). As for the villain, it was sort of cliche, but like Goblin in Spidey 1, it had a great actor behind it that at least made it watchable.


#30

Hailey Knight

Hailey Knight

That scene where he fights the terrorists after seeing the missiles on TV? We could've done with some of that in Iron Man 2. Actually being a superhero and all that... would've been nice. That was probably my favorite part of the first one.


#31

SpecialKO

SpecialKO

Yeah, it was a little mind-boggling that in IM2, they told us that he wiped out international terrorism instead of showing us anything.


#32

Espy

Espy

SpecialKO said:
Yeah, it was a little mind-boggling that in IM2, they told us that he wiped out international terrorism instead of showing us anything.
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No kidding, I enjoyed IM2 alright but man, that stuff was the best part of the first one.


#33

checkeredhat

checkeredhat

The influx of Comic Book movies is a symptom, not the cause, and they're getting better. Give credit where credit is due.


#34



WarBeer

The super-hero movies are actually some of the best actions films in a long time. Yes, they're a bit silly and just for fun. But....isn't that exactly the point? At least with the hero films....the producers/directors seem to actually care about the genre and pay homage to it. I think there's a lot more depth in the (let's say) Spider-man or Iron man series...than that action packed debacle called "Conan the Barbarian". No, not all the hero films are great...but some have been. The Christian Bale Batman's were pretty darn good. As have been some others. I think if you know and understand the history and importance of the American comic hero...one might gain a bit of respect for the genre.


#35

Dave

Dave

Nicely put, WarBeer! Some thread necros are better than others!


#36

Bowielee

Bowielee

Shegokigo said:
Origin Story, has girl hero likes, kidnapping of some sort/chick doesn't dig him yet, most likely loses his powers at some point but gets them back, saves her/he impresses her with powers, defeats final villain.... or did he? The end.
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For the record, this is also the story arc for every adventure story going all the way back to mythology.

Yes, I know you're saying that formulaic doesn't necessarily mean bad, I'm just backing that up.


#37

Necronic

Necronic

OMG ACTION MOVIES ARE NOT ARTISTIC.

This is what the guy is saying. For someone who is supposedly a filmaking genius (I'll admit French Connection is amazing), the fact that he thinks that this is a major point that needs be said kind of makes him look like an idiot. And there's nothing new here. Action movies have always been thin.


#38

sixpackshaker

sixpackshaker

With this latest spam brigade... should we fire Threadnecromancer?


#39

Necronic

Necronic

Stupid necro threads makin me look dumb.


#40

Dave

Dave

This was not a spam thread, merely a necro. If it was spam I'd welcome more like it.


#41

ThatNickGuy

ThatNickGuy



#42

Adam

Adammon

I want a MASK movie.


#43

Hailey Knight

Hailey Knight

Adammon said:
I want a MASK movie.
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So you're to blame.



#44

Adam

Adammon

Quotemander Prime said:
So you're to blame.

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Probably hard to translate the stereotypes across to the big screen though.


#45

LittleSin

LittleSin

MA MA MA MASK.


#46

fade

fade

What about Centurions? They were like Transformers, but with people inside!


#47

LittleSin

LittleSin

I thought that was Power Rangers? :p


#48

Shegokigo

Shegokigo

I think you mean Voltron LilSin


#49

Covar

Covar

Shegokigo said:
I think you mean Voltron LilSin
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The Super Sentai Series (produced by Toei) had the giant transforming robot a year before GoLion (produced by Toei Animation). Of course the idea for the giant robot in sentai was taken from the Japanese Spider-man tokustatsu show which was also produced by Toei.


#50

SpecialKO

SpecialKO

Covar said:
The Super Sentai Series (produced by Toei) had the giant transforming robot a year before GoLion (produced by Toei Animation). Of course the idea for the giant robot in sentai was taken from the Japanese Spider-man tokustatsu show which was also produced by Toei.
Click to expand...


#51

fade

fade

LittleSin said:
I thought that was Power Rangers? :p
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The Centurions were people-sized. They wore airplane suits, which would click together and turn them into man-sized airplanes. IIRC.


#52

Bowielee

Bowielee

The Centurians were awesome. They had this satelite that could beam components onto their suits.

Need to fly, BAM, you got wings.

Need to be under water, BAM, you got a helmet and turbines.


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