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So, I decided to re-format my hard drive only to find out that once you delete your itunes music, they do not give you the option to re-download it. That is some fucking bullshit.

Yeah, I bought a season of a show on Itunes once only to have some cataclysmic shit go down before I had a chance to watch it. After everything is reinstalled and after my reformat I found out there's no redownloading anything for free.

I completely agree. Fuck Apple.

smurf apple

You wiped your HD and didn't back up your media?
I had some stuff get deleted that I had just downloaded (meaning no backup yet since it had just downloaded). I wrote their iTunes help and they set it up to re-download for free. Try emailing them. Tell them something happened and you had to reformat, etc, etc, and pray they don't just ask you why you didn't back it up.

But I have to ask... why did you wipe your hd without backing up? :bush: That's crazy.

smurf apple

This is my big complaint with iTunes. Don't get me wrong, I use it all the time, but I don't see why Apple can't keep simple records to verify purchases like this. It would go a long way to earning some serious customer loyalty and support.

Wow, even Games for Windows Live lets you re-download.

That's why... I'm a PC.

smurf apple

Tress said:

This is my big complaint with iTunes. Don't get me wrong, I use it all the time, but I don't see why Apple can't keep simple records to verify purchases like this. It would go a long way to earning some serious customer loyalty and support.

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They do, you can go look at your purchase history. I'm guessing they just don't think it's their problem if you delete what you bought. (Yup, just looked it up. Official policy is one download per purchase and they say it's your responsibility to back up your files)
If you have your stuff on an iPod you can get it all back from it using a program like iDump (I think that's what it's called). I did a little googling and it seems that like me, some people have gotten their deleted files back by simply emailing the iTunes folks. It's worth trying, just don't tell them you wiped your stuff with no backup.
Here's what you do:
Go to Store in the menu, then View My Account, click Purchase History. Click Report a Problem and then fill the stuff in. (Unless you have stuff on your iPod. Then you are fine)

smurf apple

Well, I did luck out. I just plugged in my backup drive and it does have all my itunes stuff on in, but I still think it's fucktarded that you can't re-download your purchases. I can't think of any other digital distribution media that doesn't let you re-download what you've purchased.

smurf apple

Bowielee said:

Well, I did luck out. I just plugged in my backup drive and it does have all my itunes stuff on in, but I still think it's fucktarded that you can't re-download your purchases. I can't think of any other digital distribution media that doesn't let you re-download what you've purchased.

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As far as I know neither Amazon nor iTunes allows redownloading, at least not without a sob story (like in my case).
Glad you had your stuff backed up, that always makes life easier. I've had to learn the hard way to many times before I got an auto backup program. Why did you wipe it without making a backup though? Talk about living dangerously...

smurf apple

Espy said:

Bowielee said:

Well, I did luck out. I just plugged in my backup drive and it does have all my itunes stuff on in, but I still think it's fucktarded that you can't re-download your purchases. I can't think of any other digital distribution media that doesn't let you re-download what you've purchased.

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Glad you had your stuff backed up, that always makes life easier. I've had to learn the hard way to many times before I got an auto backup program. Why did you wipe it without making a backup though? Talk about living dangerously...

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I did make a backup, that's why I still have my stuff. I didn't think I copied my music folder over, though. Luckily, I was wrong.

Unfortunately, I have lost at least 4 apps because I hadn't synced my ipod for a while.

smurf apple

Bowielee said:

Well, I did luck out. I just plugged in my backup drive and it does have all my itunes stuff on in, but I still think it's fucktarded that you can't re-download your purchases. I can't think of any other digital distribution media that doesn't let you re-download what you've purchased.

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I agree. They keep enough tabs on every song so that they know when you've hit your "authorized computer" limit, but you can't download it again to the same authorized computer?

That's some bullshit right there. Glad Xbox Live doesn't work that way.

Arr.

smurf apple

ZenMonkey said:

Bowielee said:

Well, I did luck out. I just plugged in my backup drive and it does have all my itunes stuff on in, but I still think it's fucktarded that you can't re-download your purchases. I can't think of any other digital distribution media that doesn't let you re-download what you've purchased.

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I agree. They keep enough tabs on every song so that they know when you've hit your "authorized computer" limit, but you can't download it again to the same authorized computer?

That's some bullshit right there. Glad Xbox Live doesn't work that way.

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They do allow you to re-download.

Its just a matter of emailing them saying that your HD was deleted by (insert type of accident), then they´ll tell you how to do it. Dont tell them you deleted everything and didnt backup.

smurf apple

JCM said:

ZenMonkey said:

Bowielee said:

Well, I did luck out. I just plugged in my backup drive and it does have all my itunes stuff on in, but I still think it's fucktarded that you can't re-download your purchases. I can't think of any other digital distribution media that doesn't let you re-download what you've purchased.

Click to expand...

I agree. They keep enough tabs on every song so that they know when you've hit your "authorized computer" limit, but you can't download it again to the same authorized computer?

That's some bullshit right there. Glad Xbox Live doesn't work that way.

Click to expand...

They do allow you to re-download.

Its just a matter of emailing them saying that your HD was deleted by (insert type of accident), then they´ll tell you how to do it. Dont tell them you deleted everything and didnt backup.

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Yup. Both Apple and Amazon do this but if you contact them you are pretty likely to get your stuff back.

The point is: That step shouldn't be necessary at all. :slywink:

smurf apple

Shegokigo said:

The point is: That step shouldn't be necessary at all. :slywink:

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You are right. Thats what back-ups are for. :slywink:

But really, aside from that (which if you aren't backing up your stuff... well... :blue: ) I don't know why Apple and Amazon don't allow it, they really should. I assume it must be a record company thing... it doesn't seem like a smart business practice.

Back-up or not, imagine losing everything to a virus/power outage.

Why should you have to take extra steps to recover your own files?

well.. consider you have to "authorize" your PC with iTunes (you still have to do that right? my wife takes care of my itunes need now-a-days) they have a list of stuff you purchases, they (apple) should let you download them in case anything gone wrong. just like STEAM!

smurf apple

What really annoys me is that those purchases are tied to a specific account, which is tied to a specific computer. If Steam can manage to realize that "Person A purchased Game B, They can download it at any time if they sign in to their account" why can't Itunes. Especially because they tout themselves as being the simple, user friendly option.

Chibibar said:

well.. consider you have to "authorize" your PC with iTunes (you still have to do that right? my wife takes care of my itunes need now-a-days) they have a list of stuff you purchases, they (apple) should let you download them in case anything gone wrong. just like STEAM!

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Bowielee said:

What really annoys me is that those purchases are tied to a specific account, which is tied to a specific computer. If Steam can manage to realize that "Person A purchased Game B, They can download it at any time if they sign in to their account" why can't Itunes. Especially because they tout themselves as being the simple, user friendly option.

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:uhhuh:

Shegokigo said:

Chibibar said:

well.. consider you have to "authorize" your PC with iTunes (you still have to do that right? my wife takes care of my itunes need now-a-days) they have a list of stuff you purchases, they (apple) should let you download them in case anything gone wrong. just like STEAM!

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Bowielee said:

What really annoys me is that those purchases are tied to a specific account, which is tied to a specific computer. If Steam can manage to realize that "Person A purchased Game B, They can download it at any time if they sign in to their account" why can't Itunes. Especially because they tout themselves as being the simple, user friendly option.

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:uhhuh:

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Totally agree!!!

Hmmm... if you purchased the songs and can prove it would they be able to do anything if you re-obtained them from other sources?!

smurf apple

Bowielee said:

What really annoys me is that those purchases are tied to a specific account, which is tied to a specific computer. If Steam can manage to realize that "Person A purchased Game B, They can download it at any time if they sign in to their account" why can't Itunes. Especially because they tout themselves as being the simple, user friendly option.

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I agree to an extent, I assume, since this seems to be something that neither Apple nor Amazon allow (the other big online distributor, Walmart, gives you 3 months to re-download. After that you are SOL) that it has to do with the record companies, not the actual online distributor, although I wouldn't put it past Apple and Amazon to want you to have to pay for it again...
With the exception though that, if you google around you see that people who had "cataclysmic" stuff happen (including myself) have had great success in getting their stuff replaced by both Apple and Amazon, despite them both saying that you only get one download of your purchased content.
As for the user friendly thing? Well, I seem to recall that every now and then when I purchase stuff through iTunes it asks me if I want to back up my purchases. That's pretty straightforward.

Shegokigo said:

Back-up or not, imagine losing everything to a virus/power outage.

Why should you have to take extra steps to recover your own files?

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I agree, it sucks when something like that happens but I hardly see backing up your stuff as an "extra step". It's computer basics 101. Never trust someone else to take care of your files.

smurf apple

Espy said:

I agree, it sucks when something like that happens but I hardly see backing up your stuff as an "extra step". It's computer basics 101. Never trust someone else to take care of your files.

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So everytime I download a song I should put it on a backup? Every video? Every text file?

Besides I wasn't talking about backing up your info as the extra step. I mean having to email a company just to re-download something you already own.

smurf apple

Espy said:

JCM said:

Its just a matter of emailing them saying that your HD was deleted by (insert type of accident), then they´ll tell you how to do it. Dont tell them you deleted everything and didnt backup.

Click to expand...

Yup. Both Apple and Amazon do this but if you contact them you are pretty likely to get your stuff back.

Click to expand...

Espy said:

Bowielee said:

What really annoys me is that those purchases are tied to a specific account, which is tied to a specific computer. If Steam can manage to realize that "Person A purchased Game B, They can download it at any time if they sign in to their account" why can't Itunes. Especially because they tout themselves as being the simple, user friendly option.

Click to expand...

I agree to an extent, I assume, since this seems to be something that neither Apple nor Amazon allow (the other big online distributor, Walmart, gives you 3 months to re-download. After that you are SOL) that it has to do with the record companies, not the actual online distributor, although I wouldn't put it past Apple and Amazon to want you to have to pay for it again...
With the exception though that, if you google around you see that people who had "cataclysmic" stuff happen (including myself) have had great success in getting their stuff replaced by both Apple and Amazon, despite them both saying that you only get one download of your purchased content.
As for the user friendly thing? Well, I seem to recall that every now and then when I purchase stuff through iTunes it asks me if I want to back up my purchases. That's pretty straightforward.

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This.

I´ll take Apple´s policies over WallMart anyday.

Bowielee said:

What really annoys me is that those purchases are tied to a specific account, which is tied to a specific computer. If Steam can manage to realize that "Person A purchased Game B, They can download it at any time if they sign in to their account" why can't Itunes. Especially because they tout themselves as being the simple, user friendly option.

Click to expand...

Werent you for amazon deleting stuff from your computer (kindle) without telling you or asking permission?

smurf apple

JCM said:

I´ll take Apple´s policies over WallMart anyday.

Bowielee said:

What really annoys me is that those purchases are tied to a specific account, which is tied to a specific computer. If Steam can manage to realize that "Person A purchased Game B, They can download it at any time if they sign in to their account" why can't Itunes. Especially because they tout themselves as being the simple, user friendly option.

Click to expand...

Werent you for amazon deleting stuff from your computer (kindle) without telling you or asking permission?

Click to expand...

If Apple were refunding me my money, I wouldn't have a problem with this. Sorry, bucko, 2 completely different situations.

In the case of the Kindle thing, the customers got their money back, so they LOST NOTHING.

smurf apple

Shegokigo said:

Espy said:

I agree, it sucks when something like that happens but I hardly see backing up your stuff as an "extra step". It's computer basics 101. Never trust someone else to take care of your files.

Click to expand...

So everytime I download a song I should put it on a backup? Every video? Every text file?

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Yes. Every time you BUY a file, whether it be songs or software the smart and responsible thing to do is to back them up. It's not rocket science. We all use computers here and we all know crap happens, backing up purchases is a safe and smart thing to do.

Shegokigo said:

Besides I wasn't talking about backing up your info as the extra step. I mean having to email a company just to re-download something you already own.

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Gotcha. Yes, that is annoying but it seems to be something the record companies have demanded, I suppose in an effort (silly though it is) to stop people from downloading multiple copies of a song.

Bowielee said:

If Apple were refunding me my money, I wouldn't have a problem with this. Sorry, bucko, 2 completely different situations.

In the case of the Kindle thing, the customers got their money back, so they LOST NOTHING.

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Yeah, SUPER different situations. If the USER deletes his files then whines about not getting refunded his money I have a big ol' slap on the head right here for 'em. :slap:

smurf apple

Espy said:

Gotcha. Yes, that is annoying but it seems to be something the record companies have demanded, I suppose in an effort (silly though it is) to stop people from downloading multiple copies of a song.

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I don't think it's required by the record companies, because Napster will allow you to re-download music.

smurf apple

Bowielee said:

JCM said:

I´ll take Apple´s policies over WallMart anyday.

Bowielee said:

What really annoys me is that those purchases are tied to a specific account, which is tied to a specific computer. If Steam can manage to realize that "Person A purchased Game B, They can download it at any time if they sign in to their account" why can't Itunes. Especially because they tout themselves as being the simple, user friendly option.

Click to expand...

Werent you for amazon deleting stuff from your computer (kindle) without telling you or asking permission?

Click to expand...

If Apple were refunding me my money, I wouldn't have a problem with this. Sorry, bucko, 2 completely different situations.

Click to expand...

So if I delete any shit I sold you from your computer, without asking you for permission, then giving you money = Good

You having to email Apple to re-download all your stuff because you unticked the backup option and formatted = Bad?

In the case of the Kindle thing, the customers got their money back, so they LOST NOTHING

Click to expand...

Of course people didnt lose anything, except their privacy when a company can freely delete what it wants from your computer without telling you. Oh, and the time wasted reading a book which suddenly isnt there anymore, and Amazon (a great company, it seems, by your standards) deleted it, without permission, and without offering a legal replacement/option to aquire the book.

Just trying to understand your confusing standards, defending terrible DRM like Steam and Amazon´s, and complaining over having to send Apple an email. :heythere:

smurf apple

JCM said:

Bowielee said:

JCM said:

I´ll take Apple´s policies over WallMart anyday.

Bowielee said:

What really annoys me is that those purchases are tied to a specific account, which is tied to a specific computer. If Steam can manage to realize that "Person A purchased Game B, They can download it at any time if they sign in to their account" why can't Itunes. Especially because they tout themselves as being the simple, user friendly option.

Click to expand...

Werent you for amazon deleting stuff from your computer (kindle) without telling you or asking permission?

Click to expand...

If Apple were refunding me my money, I wouldn't have a problem with this. Sorry, bucko, 2 completely different situations.

In the case of the Kindle thing, the customers got their money back, so they LOST NOTHING.

Click to expand...

So if I delete any poop I sold you from your computer, without asking you for permission, then giving you money = Good

You having to email Apple to re-download all your stuff because you unticked the backup option and formatted = Bad?

Of course people didnt lose anything, except their privacy when a company can freely delete what it wants from your computer without telling you. :heythere:

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First of all, Kindle =/= computer. It's more analogue to an Ipod than a PC.

Secondly, Yes, if Apple were to delete songs off my ipod due to some issue with regulation, as long as they reimbursed me for the money I gave them to purchase the song, I have no issue.

You're trying to equate apples to oranges.

Are you comparing songs to a book?

Just trying to understand your standards, one side I have you defending Steam´s "must activate online" offline mode, or Amazon´s violating your privacy by deleting stuff from your computer without asking for your permission and wasting your time by not offering a legal option for the book you were reading and now no longer have.

On the other side, youre bitching because you have to send Apple an email to get back songs you unticked the "backup" option and formatted a PC.

Weird standards.

Espy said:

Bowielee said:

If Apple were refunding me my money, I wouldn't have a problem with this. Sorry, bucko, 2 completely different situations.

In the case of the Kindle thing, the customers got their money back, so they LOST NOTHING.

Click to expand...

Yeah, SUPER different situations. If the USER deletes his files then whines about not getting refunded his money I have a big ol' slap on the head right here for 'em. :slap:

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My thoughts, exactly.

smurf apple

JCM said:

Just trying to understand your confusing standards, defending terrible DRM like Steam and Amazon´s, and complaining over having to send Apple an email. :heythere:

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I can tell you right now, DRM and STEAM have nothing to do with each other.

smurf apple

Shegokigo said:

JCM said:

Just trying to understand your confusing standards, defending terrible DRM like Steam and Amazon´s, and complaining over having to send Apple an email. :heythere:

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I can tell you right now, DRM and STEAM have nothing to do with each other.

Click to expand...

Authorising a game online is a form of DRM. Even an 8-year old (aka my brother) knows that.

smurf apple

JCM said:

Shegokigo said:

JCM said:

Just trying to understand your confusing standards, defending terrible DRM like Steam and Amazon´s, and complaining over having to send Apple an email. :heythere:

Click to expand...

I can tell you right now, DRM and STEAM have nothing to do with each other.

Click to expand...

Authorising a game online is a form of DRM. Even an 8-year old (aka my brother) knows that.

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And Steam allows me to re-download my software if I reformat my hard drive. I have a problem seeing where my points are disseperate.

Also, using that logic, then this site has DRM, because you can't access it unless you're online.

smurf apple

JCM said:

Shegokigo said:

JCM said:

Just trying to understand your confusing standards, defending terrible DRM like Steam and Amazon´s, and complaining over having to send Apple an email. :heythere:

Click to expand...

I can tell you right now, DRM and STEAM have nothing to do with each other.

Click to expand...

Authorising a game online is a form of DRM. Even an 8-year old (aka my brother) knows that.

Click to expand...

Steam needs you to get online to download the game, but have you heard of offline mode?

smurf apple

Espy said:

I agree, it sucks when something like that happens but I hardly see backing up your stuff as an "extra step". It's computer basics 101. Never trust someone else to take care of your files.

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The laymen does not really back up files, only geeky type people like us on these forums do.

I don't know but maybe one or two normal everday people who back up their music, videos, pictures and thats because I told those two...

People just don't think about it, they don't they their hard drive is going to fail, they don't think the lightning storm is going to fry everything, they don't think that virus from that porn site would screw everything up... Plus most normal computer users I see are pretty dumb, like probably couldn't even copy and paste to back stuff up or know a program to use.


Oh and when it asks you to back up your files when you purchase shit its always at the worst time... I usually buy songs like 5 minutes before im leaving because I am in the mood to listen to it, and its like "Herro user would you like to back up your 30 gigs on music and video onto 7-8 DVDs right now?"

smurf apple

Denbrought said:

Steam needs you to get online to download the game, but have you heard of offline mode?

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Unless you're online or you've run Steam while online recently offline mode doesn't work.

smurf apple

Cat said:

Denbrought said:

Steam needs you to get online to download the game, but have you heard of offline mode?

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Unless you're online or you've run Steam while online recently offline mode doesn't work.

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Yeah that makes sense... Generally you have to get online to get digitally distributed games online...

To play in offline mode you download the game through steam and run it once while online and then you can play it offline, you have to run it once so it authorizes the game.

smurf apple

Cat said:

Denbrought said:

Steam needs you to get online to download the game, but have you heard of offline mode?

Click to expand...

Unless you're online or you've run Steam while online recently offline mode doesn't work.

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That is completely untrue in my experience, as stated in the other thread. There are a few games where this is true because the PUBLISHER has online verifications incorporated into the game.

smurf apple

Cat said:

Denbrought said:

Steam needs you to get online to download the game, but have you heard of offline mode?

Click to expand...

Unless you're online or you've run Steam while online recently offline mode doesn't work.

Click to expand...

I haven't had problems when my internet went suddenly wonky for good lengths of time with the games I usually play/played on Steam.

smurf apple

Espy said:

Bowielee said:

Well, I did luck out. I just plugged in my backup drive and it does have all my itunes stuff on in, but I still think it's fucktarded that you can't re-download your purchases. I can't think of any other digital distribution media that doesn't let you re-download what you've purchased.

Click to expand...

As far as I know neither Amazon nor iTunes allows redownloading, at least not without a sob story (like in my case).
Glad you had your stuff backed up, that always makes life easier. I've had to learn the hard way to many times before I got an auto backup program. Why did you wipe it without making a backup though? Talk about living dangerously...

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I would have done the same and assumed that you can redownload songs you bought. I only backup, you know, actually important data (which all fits nicely on a 128 MB flashdrive).

smurf apple

JCM said:

Shegokigo said:

JCM said:

Just trying to understand your confusing standards, defending terrible DRM like Steam and Amazon´s, and complaining over having to send Apple an email. :heythere:

Click to expand...

I can tell you right now, DRM and STEAM have nothing to do with each other.

Click to expand...

Authorising a game online is a form of DRM. Even an 8-year old (aka my brother) knows that.

Click to expand...

smurf apple

New funny turn. I was re-downloading the applications that I purchased. Guess what?

They let you re-download the apps for free.

I find that hilarious.

OK, I've been away, let's throw in my €0.02.
Backing up non-essential, downloaded files, should be completely unnecessary. Why? Because they're ALREADY backed up - on the servers of iTunes. Why should I make yet another copy of them? It's like printing out a copy of every mail you receive. Don't do it. It's a huge waste of my time, HD space, etc, to back them up. I buy the rights to a song, let me have my damn song.
Besides, backing up isn't always easy to do. I use my laptop almost exclusively now. There's one physical hard drive in there. I don't hook it up to 17 devices wherever I go - you really think I should devote 3 to 4 hours a week to backing up every little thing on there on a NAS or something? Good lord. I back up some 200 MB of personal files every week or so, and any larger things I'm working on very actively (usually papers, stories, thesis,... that I spend days and weeks on) every day and on several different places (mail them to myself, put a copy on a flash drive, burn one to a CD, whatever). My own stuff needs backing up, of course, but, just like no sensible person takes the time to back up stuff you can jsut reinstall (back up the save games, not the game content!), I don't see why I should back up stuff iTunes would give me, anyway.

(I only have MP3s that are copies of my physical CDs, but I'm a dinosaur on the issue of music.)

smurf apple

Guys you're all missing the important logic here. It's not like Apple doesn't know that they can allow people to redownload songs they already purchased. They damn well know it's possible and fair to the customer. They just would rather fuck you over and have you pay for your music again.

Bowlie, if you hadn't found your music backup, I do believe you would be legally allowed to download the same song through *ahem* alternate means...

Shegokigo said:

The point is: That step shouldn't be necessary at all. :slywink:

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That was, in fact, precisely my point.

Funny how that's hard for some people in this thread to grasp huh?

Shegokigo said:

Funny how that's hard for some people in this thread to grasp huh?

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It is markedly odd, yes.

smurf apple

Shegokigo said:

Funny how that's hard for some people in this thread to grasp huh?

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The shining white knights of Apple, you mean?

smurf apple

Chazwozel said:

The shining white knights of Apple, you mean?

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I am a Mac fangirl to some extent, I'll admit, but FFS I also admit when they engage in dumbfuckery.

I'm about as Anti-Apple as one can be. :bush:

Shegokigo said:

I'm about as Anti-Apple as one can be. :bush:

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Which is why when I'm the one saying "fuck you, Apple" it means more. :tongue:

Yeah, I've been in this situation. Massive HD crash, lost hundreds of songs. I also was in the middle of downloading an album I paid for when my internet died on me for about 15 minutes. I had to send an e-mail to them and waited a few days before they allowed me to get it without paying again.

smurf apple

Sorry, but I don't see where it's Apple's responsibility to recover your music for you. Apple makes a small amount per song purchased (most goes to the record companies) and bandwidth costs money. If you don't back up, the only one to blame is yourself. If your house burns down, and your CD collection goes up in flames, do you expect someone to give you back those CDs?

edit to add: I realize, in the interest of full disclosure, I should add I used to work for Apple; I quit about a year ago. I feel the same for any company providing digital content that can be backed up, though. If they allow you re-download, they're going above and beyond, but it's not something they have to do.

smurf apple

KarateKidMcFly said:

Sorry, but I don't see where it's Apple's responsibility to recover your music for you. Apple makes a small amount per song purchased (most goes to the record companies) and bandwidth costs money. If you don't back up, the only one to blame is yourself. If your house burns down, and your CD collection goes up in flames, do you expect someone to give you back those CDs?

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Because it's exactly the same! A fluctuation in electrical power can burn your cd collection!!

-- Tue Jul 21, 2009 9:30 am --

(I'm sorry, I understand comparisons don't need to be THAT similar, and I get angry when someone doesn't get mine because this kind of things. I do understand what you are saying, but I'm trying to make a point: it is MUCH easier to lose a digital collection.)

smurf apple

KarateKidMcFly said:

Sorry, but I don't see where it's Apple's responsibility to recover your music for you. Apple makes a small amount per song purchased (most goes to the record companies) and bandwidth costs money. If you don't back up, the only one to blame is yourself. If your house burns down, and your CD collection goes up in flames, do you expect someone to give you back those CDs?

edit to add: I realize, in the interest of full disclosure, I should add I used to work for Apple; I quit about a year ago. I feel the same for any company providing digital content that can be backed up, though. If they allow you re-download, they're going above and beyond, but it's not something they have to do.

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Actually seeing how they all claim that you don't buy the song, just the right to hear it etc. they shouldn't be allowed to deny you the right to hear it just because you no longer have the songs on you...

Replacing your CD's is another thing because they also would have to give you new pieces of plastic...


And the difference isn't between physical stuff and digital stuff, but between tangible and intangible stuff... which includes ideas and other stuff... which is why theft and copyright laws are different... and why taking a physical copy of a book from whoever owns it that someone wrote in 1756 is still illegal, but making a copy isn't any more...

Shego said:

I can tell you right now, DRM and STEAM have nothing to do with each other.

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As much as it pains me to agree with JCM, any type of check, even if it does it only once, to see if you're legit is a form of DRM... Steam just uses a less crappy way of doing it (as long as you have a connection that is).

Even not allowing you to just burn a copy of the original CD is DRM...

smurf apple

KarateKidMcFly said:

Sorry, but I don't see where it's Apple's responsibility to recover your music for you. Apple makes a small amount per song purchased (most goes to the record companies) and bandwidth costs money. If you don't back up, the only one to blame is yourself. If your house burns down, and your CD collection goes up in flames, do you expect someone to give you back those CDs?

edit to add: I realize, in the interest of full disclosure, I should add I used to work for Apple; I quit about a year ago. I feel the same for any company providing digital content that can be backed up, though. If they allow you re-download, they're going above and beyond, but it's not something they have to do.

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They're not losing any bandwidth chief. You download the same song from the same source that they allow you access to.

If your house burns down, your insurance company compensates you for your lost CD collections value. Considering that comparing CD's to MP3s is what got us all in this legal mess of copyright rights, let's stop comparing apples to oranges, shall we?

You pay for the rights to listen to the song, you shouldn't lose those rights if you delete the song. It should be right there for you if you want to listen to it again. I'm so glad I obtain my music through *ahem* alternative means... This exact thing is what turns people off from legit modes of downloading music. The RIAA and Apple both love to fuck people in the ass.

smurf apple

Chazwozel said:

The RIAA and Apple both love to fuck people in the ass.

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They can't help it, they where born that way....

/offensive joke...

smurf apple

Chazwozel said:

KarateKidMcFly said:

Sorry, but I don't see where it's Apple's responsibility to recover your music for you. Apple makes a small amount per song purchased (most goes to the record companies) and bandwidth costs money. If you don't back up, the only one to blame is yourself. If your house burns down, and your CD collection goes up in flames, do you expect someone to give you back those CDs?

edit to add: I realize, in the interest of full disclosure, I should add I used to work for Apple; I quit about a year ago. I feel the same for any company providing digital content that can be backed up, though. If they allow you re-download, they're going above and beyond, but it's not something they have to do.

Click to expand...

They're not losing any bandwidth chief. You download the same song from the same source that they allow you access to.

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Actually it does, 5 computers, 5 downloads of each song, up to 5X the bandwidth.

Its dickish, but I doubt its RIAA´s decision, its Apple´s, just to save bandwidth. Anyway, you can get your music back
http://thecontent.wordpress.com/2006/05 ... usic-once/
But it requires emailing back and forth details, then waiting for someone there to pess the big red button that allows you to redownload them.

So yes, Apple wants you to backup everything, and save bandwidth, so lets throw the

If your house burns down, your insurance company compensates you for your lost CD collections value. Considering that comparing CD's to MP3s is what got us all in this legal mess of copyright rights, let's stop comparing apples to oranges, shall we?

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Sorry to goo BowieLee on this, but its a terrible comparison. Does the record company where you bought the cds pay that insurance and give new cds to replace the destroyed ones, or are you suggesting Apple have a "dumb user who unclicked the backup option" insurance? :heythere: I kid.

Its an unecessary step, but the fact is that you can redownload, My doubt is still with BowieLee´s saying that Amazon deleting shit from one´s computer/Kindle without his permission, not notifying him and not giving him an option to download a legal copy to continue reading the book is GOOD BUSINESS, but Apple making you email to get your songs back to save bandwidth is BAD BUSINESS.

To me both seem equally dickish.

smurf apple

Chazwozel said:

The RIAA and Apple both love to fuck people in the ass.

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RIAA are dicks! They're reckless, arrogant, stupid dicks. And the we are pussies. And Apple is an asshole. Pussies don't like dicks, because pussies get fucked by dicks. But dicks also fuck assholes: assholes that just want to shit on everything. Pussies may think they can deal with assholes their way. But the only thing that can fuck an asshole is a dick, with some balls. The problem with dicks is: they fuck too much or fuck when it isn't appropriate - and it takes a pussy to show them that. I don't know much about this crazy, crazy world, but I do know this: If you don't let us fuck this asshole, we're going to have our dicks and pussies all covered in shit!

smurf apple

JCM, the reason I'm saying that it's fine for them to have deleted the books from people's kindles is because they reimbursed them the purchase price of what was deleted. Therefore, those who lost their e-books have the option of re-purchasing it in some other way without any loss.

Also, for the record, the whole Apple thing pissed me off because it's not something that was readily apparent. Looking around the net, I think it sucks that there are so many stories of "learning the hard way" when it comes to itunes.

I do take responsibility for making the assumption that you could re-download your music, but I've never used Itunes prior to getting my Ipod, and the only other music service I've used was Napster and they DO let you re-download your songs at least a few times no questions asked.

smurf apple

Fair enough. I´ll disagree with amazon, as I´d hate to have anyone deleting stuff from my hardware without telling me, or finding out a book I am reading has disappeared, but on the Apple case, I agree.

Yeah, its a business decision to avoid people downloading the same song over and over for each authorized pc and save bandwidth, but its still an extra step and rather dickish.

Shegokigo said:

Chazwozel said:

The RIAA and Apple both love to fuck people in the ass.

Click to expand...

RIAA are dicks! They're reckless, arrogant, stupid dicks. And the we are pussies. And Apple is an asshole. Pussies don't like dicks, because pussies get fucked by dicks. But dicks also fuck assholes: assholes that just want to shit on everything. Pussies may think they can deal with assholes their way. But the only thing that can fuck an asshole is a dick, with some balls. The problem with dicks is: they fuck too much or fuck when it isn't appropriate - and it takes a pussy to show them that. I don't know much about this crazy, crazy world, but I do know this: If you don't let us fuck this asshole, we're going to have our dicks and pussies all covered in shit!

Click to expand...

Except in this case, Apple is the dick, and asshole,

It is the digital age and space is cheap (especially network space) itune connects to their server all the time just like Steam. If you purchase the songs, I feel you should be able to redownload it since you have to authorize the machine (which is more than Steam does you just have to log in) Apple still limit to 6 authorization right? (I don't buy anything from iTunes BUT do have 2 iPods. We buy all of our CDs and upload to iTunes and we backup those to an external hdd.

Even the RIFFTRAX people have a storage for their downloadable content on the web site.

It seems silly to me that Apple, being larger, wouldn't. Must be a record company thing.

General Fuzzy McBitty said:

Even the RIFFTRAX people have a storage for their downloadable content on the web site.

It seems silly to me that Apple, being larger, wouldn't. Must be a record company thing.

Click to expand...

Nah.. I say more of a money thing

Just found out that apparently some publishers on Kindle only allow you to download a book you've purchased three times (to the same device, mind you). After that you have to BUY IT AGAIN.

After I heard that the iTunes thing didn't sound so bad.

smurf apple

ZenMonkey said:

Just found out that apparently some publishers on Kindle only allow you to download a book you've purchased three times (to the same device, mind you). After that you have to BUY IT AGAIN.

After I heard that the iTunes thing didn't sound so bad.

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How is allowing you to re-download something 3 times worse then never allowing you to re-download it?

smurf apple

Well fuck me in the goat ass.....

I don't think I have ever seen a more civil discussion of apple involving JCM, Chazwozel and the rest of you scrubs......

Congrats bitches.

smurf apple

Jake said:

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Bowielee said:

ZenMonkey said:

Just found out that apparently some publishers on Kindle only allow you to download a book you've purchased three times (to the same device, mind you). After that you have to BUY IT AGAIN.

After I heard that the iTunes thing didn't sound so bad.

Click to expand...

How is allowing you to re-download something 3 times worse then never allowing you to re-download it?

Click to expand...

I think she was comparing having unlimited downloads but requiring e-mails VS. not having to send e-mails but being limited to three downloads.

smurf apple

Viggs said:

Jake said:

Click to expand...

Bowielee said:

ZenMonkey said:

Just found out that apparently some publishers on Kindle only allow you to download a book you've purchased three times (to the same device, mind you). After that you have to BUY IT AGAIN.

After I heard that the iTunes thing didn't sound so bad.

Click to expand...

How is allowing you to re-download something 3 times worse then never allowing you to re-download it?

Click to expand...

I think she was comparing having unlimited downloads but requiring e-mails VS. not having to send e-mails but being limited to three downloads.

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The e-mail to Apple to re-download is not guaranteed, and is actually against their policy, it depends on if you get someone nice or not.

smurf apple

Bowielee said:

The e-mail to Apple to re-download is not guaranteed, and is actually against their policy, it depends on if you get someone nice or not.

Click to expand...

But you still think that system is worse than having to PAY for a book again after those three downloads?

smurf apple

ZenMonkey said:

Bowielee said:

The e-mail to Apple to re-download is not guaranteed, and is actually against their policy, it depends on if you get someone nice or not.

Click to expand...

But you still think that system is worse than having to PAY for a book again after those three downloads?

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You don't get what I'm saying. It's against apple's policy to let you re-download for free. You're supposed to pay if you re-download even once. For instance, when I reinstalled Itunes, and went to download the songs I'd already purchased it told me that I had already downloaded and if I wanted to do so again, I'd have to pay for the song again. From what I've read on the web, it's hit or miss if their customer service department will allow you to re-download the songs for free again.

So, I'm not a math wiz or anything but seems to me that 2 re-downloads is > 0 re-downloads

smurf apple

Bowielee said:

You don't get what I'm saying.

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I believe I do, thank you.

smurf apple

ZenMonkey said:

Bowielee said:

You don't get what I'm saying.

Click to expand...

I believe I do, thank you.

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Apparently you don't, because Amazon will allow you to re-download 2 times without paying anything. Apple will not let you re-download at all without paying unless you can sweet talk their customer service, which I'm sure you could also do with Amazon to get over the 3 download limit as well.

so it boils down to your Charisma saves.

Chibibar said:

so it boils down to your Charisma saves.

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Chibibar said:

so it boils down to your Charisma saves.

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Doesn't everything?

@Li3n said:

Chibibar said:

so it boils down to your Charisma saves.

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Doesn't everything?

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Not sniping....

You just haven't gotten the right feat missy.

My head hurts.

Oh, and both are dicks, Apple and Amazon.