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GQ article on brain trauma/CTE in NFL players and a true scientists, one that isn't in it for money or fame but to try and save lives. But be wary its a 19 page long article.

TLDR; is a bunch of former football players are going crazy and dying young due to tau protein build-up in the brain from hundreds/thousands of concussions during their football career.

http://men.style.com/gq/features/landing?id=content_10980

Well, guess we better shut down the NFL. And while we're at it, get rid of pro wrestling and baseball. All that steroid usage just isn't healthy. Hockey's clearly gone. And screw medical research too, all those drugs that come out with side effects. Sheesh.

Bungie jumping? Sky diving? Flying a plane, period? Out. So dangerous. And don't even think about driving to work, have you seen what being in a car accident does? Insane. Bicycles are right out as well, even with a helmet there is so much potential for dangerous and life-threatening crashes. Walking is ok, but make sure you're always looking down so you see where you're going. One errant trip over a rock and BOOM HEAD TRAUMA.

Christ I shouldn't have checked the forums before going to bed on this college football eve. My inner snark has no check on it.

Did you read the article? There are guys that are 35 years old with worse going on in their head than a 90 year old with Alzheimer's and if you read it you will see the guy doesn't want to just get rid of football, he wants to try and find something to stop the build-up of tau proteins or to prevent as many brain injuries as possible during the course of the game.

Think of it this way Qonas... imagine that Boxing and Football were never invented. Now imagine that somebody first introduced them today. Without the decades of history and nostalgia backing them up, do you honestly see a sport that causes serious brain damage in it's best players when nothing goes wrong lasting very long? Admit it... it'd be shut down over night.

AshburnerX said:

Think of it this way Qonas... imagine that Boxing and Football were never invented. Now imagine that somebody first introduced them today. Without the decades of history and nostalgia backing them up, do you honestly see a sport that causes serious brain damage in it's best players when nothing goes wrong lasting very long? Admit it... it'd be shut down over night.

Click to expand...

UFC

AshburnerX said:

Think of it this way Qonas... imagine that Boxing and Football were never invented. Now imagine that somebody first introduced them today. Without the decades of history and nostalgia backing them up, do you honestly see a sport that causes serious brain damage in it's best players when nothing goes wrong lasting very long? Admit it... it'd be shut down over night.

Click to expand...

Decades? Try pretty much all of culture and society?

Football is culture?

GQ.

/thread

Shannow;268064][quote=AshburnerX said:

Think of it this way Qonas... imagine that Boxing and Football were never invented. Now imagine that somebody first introduced them today. Without the decades of history and nostalgia backing them up, do you honestly see a sport that causes serious brain damage in it's best players when nothing goes wrong lasting very long? Admit it... it'd be shut down over night.

Click to expand...

UFC[/QUOTE]

UFC is just building on the foundations set by Boxing and Martial Arts competitions. It's not exactly doing anything new or surprising.

North_Ranger said:

Football is culture?

Click to expand...

In America it's the pinnacle of culture.

In Soviet Russia, culture pinnacles you.

phil;268160][quote=North_Ranger said:

Football is culture?

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In America it's the pinnacle of culture.[/QUOTE]

Yep. Depressing, isn't it?

AshburnerX;268168][quote=phil;268160][quote=North_Ranger said:

Football is culture?

Click to expand...

In America it's the pinnacle of culture.[/QUOTE]

Yep. Depressing, isn't it?[/QUOTE]

I weep for thee, but won't stoop to Idiocracy analogies.

Smurf no, it ain't depressing. It's smurfing awesome. My Smurfing Lions smurfing won last week! Wooooooooo!

It'll likely be smurfing depressing, and smurfing shameful, tomorrow though.

North_Ranger;268171][quote=AshburnerX;268168][quote=phil;268160][quote=North_Ranger said:

Football is culture?

Click to expand...

In America it's the pinnacle of culture.[/QUOTE]

Yep. Depressing, isn't it?[/QUOTE]

I weep for thee, but won't stoop to Idiocracy analogies.[/QUOTE]


Oh please, like graphic novels and cosplay is any better?

I don't see whats so bad about football being a major part of our culture. It unites communities better than basically everything else.

Football is about as absurd and meaningless as video-games and masturbating to Felicia Day. I don't endorse enjoying football, but Jesus Christ, you nerds are being hypocritical.

I enjoy sports, too (okay, very little, but still)... but I wouldn't call it culture by any means.

Not culture like art and opera, but there is "a culture" that surrounds it for those who follow certain teams or sports closely. Does that make sense?

blotsfan said:

It unites communities better than basically everything else.

Click to expand...

Not as well as random outbursts of violence.

I mean, have you ever gotten into a gang and beat someone to a bloody pulp and not just felt like your neigborhood was the tits?

It's entirely possible for a hobby to have a culture associated with it, but still lack what most would consider "culture". Gaming is especially guilty of this: It's full of deep stories, astounding music, an amazing visuals... and yet how many of those expletive spewing 12-year old Xbox Live kiddies stop to appreciate them?

Christmas Truces, dudes.

Sure, football can be cultural. That Frankensteined rugbyish abomination you Yanks play, on the other hand... :tongue:

ElJuski said:

Football is about as absurd and meaningless as video-games and masturbating to Felicia Day. I don't endorse enjoying football, but Jesus Christ, you nerds are being hypocritical.

Click to expand...

Thank you.

Actually, there is cultural significance behind many sports. The ancient Greeks, for example, played ruby. Sports are a very big part of human history.

---------- Post added at 06:30 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:28 PM ----------

AshburnerX said:

It's entirely possible for a hobby to have a culture associated with it, but still lack what most would consider "culture". Gaming is especially guilty of this: It's full of deep stories, astounding music, an amazing visuals... and yet how many of those expletive spewing 12-year old Xbox Live kiddies stop to appreciate them?

Click to expand...

Eh...not really... Most video games are designed specifically to pander to those 12 year olds, not to older folks. It's pretty much 99% Michael Bay films, which aren't cultured.

Whenever videogames have as rich of a tapestry as any of the literary canon, give me a call. I will wash your nerdy feet. They might have good stories, yes, but there really isn't any game out there that is exemplary of "high culture" status.

Which, there is a distinction, although "culture" can be used for both: "high culture", in terms of the appreciated arts, and pop culture--which I would put "sports" in.

ITT: butthurt jocks put down video games and defend their preference for mindless violence.

ElJuski said:

Whenever videogames have as rich of a tapestry as any of the literary canon, give me a call. I will wash your nerdy feet. They might have good stories, yes, but there really isn't any game out there that is exemplary of \"high culture\" status.

Click to expand...

Shadow of the Colossus and Ico are the two most often cited examples of "Games as Art", probably because of the minimalistic nature of both and how both ask you to fill in the blanks of the story yourself. This results in a story that is mainly driven by what you imagine it to be, instead of what you are told it is. It looks like The Last Guardian is going to follow in both games footsteps.

Cuyval Dar said:

ITT: butthurt jocks put down video games and defend their preference for mindless violence.

Click to expand...

Yeah that's it :eyeroll:

Speaking of mindless violence...anyone pick up the latest Manga or comic book? No graphic violence there. No sir.

Chazwozel;268306][quote=Cuyval Dar said:

ITT: butthurt jocks put down video games and defend their preference for mindless violence.

Click to expand...

Yeah that's it :eyeroll:

Speaking of mindless violence...anyone pick up the latest Manga or comic book? No graphic violence there. No sir.[/QUOTE]
I have never, and never will, read the Weeaboo garbage known as manga. And don't get me started on the financial sinkhole that are comic books.

I watch football. And football. And baseball, hockey, and formula 1. I have no need to apologize for that, and I refuse to apologize for that anyway.

I also play video games. No apologies for that either.

If either one lessens me in your eyes, that's a you problem and you can suck it. :finger:

Chazwozel;268186][quote=North_Ranger;268171][quote=AshburnerX;268168][quote=phil;268160][quote=North_Ranger said:

Football is culture?

Click to expand...

In America it's the pinnacle of culture.[/QUOTE]

Yep. Depressing, isn't it?[/QUOTE]

I weep for thee, but won't stoop to Idiocracy analogies.[/QUOTE]


Oh please, like graphic novels and cosplay is any better?[/QUOTE]

I was trying to be funny, Chaz ol' boy. I thought my use of "thee" made that clear. Maybe I should have added a in the back for good measure...

Wait . . . when people talk about American culture as regards sports - football and NASCAR in particular - the first thing that springs to mind is the Tailgate Party. It's a significant part of American Culture. It may not be a part of the culture you participate in, but to ignore that as part your country is to be smurfing blind.

Also, the worse thing about the Bills leaving Buffalo for Toronto will be the loss of the tailgate party.

^Especially because Bills fans are the best tailgaters in the league (lots of national media has said that).

AshburnerX;268296][quote=ElJuski said:

Whenever videogames have as rich of a tapestry as any of the literary canon, give me a call. I will wash your nerdy feet. They might have good stories, yes, but there really isn't any game out there that is exemplary of \"high culture\" status.

Click to expand...

Shadow of the Colossus and Ico are the two most often cited examples of "Games as Art", probably because of the minimalistic nature of both and how both ask you to fill in the blanks of the story yourself. This results in a story that is mainly driven by what you imagine it to be, instead of what you are told it is. It looks like The Last Guardian is going to follow in both games footsteps.[/QUOTE]

The difference between "Shadow of the Colossus" and "The Tempest" being one is part of the literary canon, the other is a video game. Not saying that video games can be moving and transcendent; I'm saying, for the most part, they are not, and play their role in pop culture. The examples you cited would still be considered pop culture, as well. Perhaps one day...but I doubt it. The chasm between high culture and pop culture grows as more cultures and hobbies fill our entertainment needs.

ElJuski;268615][quote=AshburnerX;268296][quote=ElJuski said:

Whenever videogames have as rich of a tapestry as any of the literary canon, give me a call. I will wash your nerdy feet. They might have good stories, yes, but there really isn't any game out there that is exemplary of \"high culture\" status.

Click to expand...

Shadow of the Colossus and Ico are the two most often cited examples of "Games as Art", probably because of the minimalistic nature of both and how both ask you to fill in the blanks of the story yourself. This results in a story that is mainly driven by what you imagine it to be, instead of what you are told it is. It looks like The Last Guardian is going to follow in both games footsteps.[/QUOTE]

The difference between "Shadow of the Colossus" and "The Tempest" being one is part of the literary canon, the other is a video game. Not saying that video games can be moving and transcendent; I'm saying, for the most part, they are not, and play their role in pop culture. The examples you cited would still be considered pop culture, as well. Perhaps one day...but I doubt it. The chasm between high culture and pop culture grows as more cultures and hobbies fill our entertainment needs.[/QUOTE]

These are genre defying masterpieces that are almost universally held up as the perfect example of what a game should aspire to be. People in other fields of art have looked at them and sang their praises as bright spots in a genre otherwise filled with consumerism and tripe. But by your own words, those games can't be high culture explicitly because they are games? That seems awful petty of you. In a world where someone can place a toilet in an art gallery or throw feces on a picture of the Virgin Mary and have it be called art, it seems to me that the barrier for entry isn't as high as you claim it is.

Yes, 90% of games are definitely not what I'd consider enduring pieces of art, but by that same measure, 90% of movies and books are crap as well... and yet they don't ever have to explain themselves. This seems arbitrary and purely vindictive.

And don't use Shakespeare as an example of high art... even by his own time's standards, his ideas weren't original. He literally cribbed almost everything he wrote from other, earlier sources and only endures to this day because of misaimed fandom and because he had the ear of the English Royals in his time. He is quite frankly, undeserving of the praise he gets. Next time, use someone like Dante Alighieri as an example.

I know I'd rather watch the Buffalo Bills instead of Ol' Billy Shakes.

ugh. I hate the fucking bills, and yet, I have gone to soooo many of their games.

I'm a fanatical hockey fan, play fantasy football, tailgate for football and hockey games, follow the Minnesota Twins religiously, and yet I also possess a 145 IQ and two college degrees. The tailgate group I hang out with is populated by engineers, scientists, architects, and the like. So when people make the mistake of saying sports fans are "dumb" or "uncultured," they're being willfully ignorant at best, outright prejudiced at worst.

Shannow said:

ugh. I hate the fucking bills, and yet, I have gone to soooo many of their games.

Click to expand...

Then how about you don't go to the games? We don't need your kind.

But he'll fit right in at a Toronto Bills game.

(yeah, I know I'm beating this Bills-moving-to-Toronto shtick into the ground, but this time I'm doing it to also make fun of Toronto sports fans as boring, lifeless and even a little hateful)

Armadillo said:

I'm a fanatical hockey fan, play fantasy football, tailgate for football and hockey games, follow the Minnesota Twins religiously, and yet I also possess a 145 IQ and two college degrees. The tailgate group I hang out with is populated by engineers, scientists, architects, and the like. So when people make the mistake of saying sports fans are "dumb" or "uncultured," they're being willfully ignorant at best, outright prejudiced at worst.

Click to expand...

This.

AshburnerX;268719][quote=ElJuski;268615][quote=AshburnerX;268296][quote=ElJuski said:

Whenever videogames have as rich of a tapestry as any of the literary canon, give me a call. I will wash your nerdy feet. They might have good stories, yes, but there really isn't any game out there that is exemplary of \"high culture\" status.

Click to expand...

Shadow of the Colossus and Ico are the two most often cited examples of "Games as Art", probably because of the minimalistic nature of both and how both ask you to fill in the blanks of the story yourself. This results in a story that is mainly driven by what you imagine it to be, instead of what you are told it is. It looks like The Last Guardian is going to follow in both games footsteps.[/QUOTE]

The difference between "Shadow of the Colossus" and "The Tempest" being one is part of the literary canon, the other is a video game. Not saying that video games can be moving and transcendent; I'm saying, for the most part, they are not, and play their role in pop culture. The examples you cited would still be considered pop culture, as well. Perhaps one day...but I doubt it. The chasm between high culture and pop culture grows as more cultures and hobbies fill our entertainment needs.[/QUOTE]

These are genre defying masterpieces that are almost universally held up as the perfect example of what a game should aspire to be. People in other fields of art have looked at them and sang their praises as bright spots in a genre otherwise filled with consumerism and tripe. But by your own words, those games can't be high culture explicitly because they are games? That seems awful petty of you. In a world where someone can place a toilet in an art gallery or throw feces on a picture of the Virgin Mary and have it be called art, it seems to me that the barrier for entry isn't as high as you claim it is.

Yes, 90% of games are definitely not what I'd consider enduring pieces of art, but by that same measure, 90% of movies and books are crap as well... and yet they don't ever have to explain themselves. This seems arbitrary and purely vindictive.

And don't use Shakespeare as an example of high art... even by his own time's standards, his ideas weren't original. He literally cribbed almost everything he wrote from other, earlier sources and only endures to this day because of misaimed fandom and because he had the ear of the English Royals in his time. He is quite frankly, undeserving of the praise he gets. Next time, use someone like Dante Alighieri as an example.[/QUOTE]

Sounds like somebody got hurt because I'm not calling the game he likes a "high art masterpiece".

Shakespeare and Dante are both part of the high-culture literary canon. They're both exemplary of the division between the two aspects of culture. And no, feces in a toilet isn't an example of "high culture" either. Whereas Vangogh would be.

Obviously these lines divide and cohere through time. But the "high culture" canon is very selective and very much ingrained in the history of art and culture politics.

The whole argument, regrettably, is pretty inane. Culture is a fluctuating thing, relative to the age, and relative to the consumer. I do believe that there is a definitive scale to good versus bad; I do think that certain arts are more accessible to the matters of the human soul more than others. I think videogames as a story-telling channel can be moving--but I think even the best video games pale in comparison to certain forms of art that have persisted throughout humanity. Not to mention the plenty of awesome new art forms which are pop-culture now (say, comic books) but are slowly forming into the oeuvre of mankind's creative world.

That does not mean, however, that it fits into the prescribed notion of the forms of culture that we have now. Or, necessarily, that it ever will, although I'm not throwing that notion into the trash bin all together.

Finally, I'm not even going to bother with your whole Shakespeare example. I heard he was a flaming homosexual, too, from this guy, like, once. And it was totally on this website this one professor, like, wrote! Again, it sounds like you just got personally offended. If you think that Shakespeare is overrated...heh, that's unfortunate. Your loss, man! Not to mention that the comparison to Dante is laughable; Dante, whose major body of work is completely based in political brown-nosing and vindication.

You guys do realize that Shakespeare really only became considered "high art" after his death, right?

During his life, its generally accepted that he was respected, to be sure, but he was known more a the popular writer and producer of stage performances for the masses than anything else.

It took years of consideration, and scholarly recognition of his contributions to culture and the English language, for his reputation as an artist to reach the point where it is today.

You can debate the artistic merit of video-games all day, but the discussing separation between high-culture and low-culture art is anything more than aggregate cultural impact over time is pretty meaningless.

For all we know, in 200 years, scholars will look back on Pokemon, recognizing it as high-culture for its contributions towards the cultural melange of the English and Japanese languages into "Nipponish".

blotsfan;268730][quote=Shannow said:

ugh. I hate the fucking bills, and yet, I have gone to soooo many of their games.

Click to expand...

Then how about you don't go to the games? We don't need your kind.[/quote]

Because I love watching nfl football, and when I went to college at UB, it was right there? Also, being in Syracuse, it the closest NFL team to me? And so damn cheap to, compared to some other teams.

And based on tickets..you need anyone you can get

Except we sell out our games...

Slowly, but surely.

TeKeo said:

For all we know, in 200 years, scholars will look back on Pokemon, recognizing it as high-culture for its contributions towards the cultural melange of the English and Japanese languages into "Nipponish".

Click to expand...

Engrish. It'll definitely be called Engrish.

AshburnerX;268794][quote=TeKeo said:

For all we know, in 200 years, scholars will look back on Pokemon, recognizing it as high-culture for its contributions towards the cultural melange of the English and Japanese languages into "Nipponish".

Click to expand...

Engrish. It'll definitely be called Engrish. [/QUOTE]

I didn't pick "engrish" because was have that now, but on second thought, what we have now could just be re-classified as "Old Engrish"

O'd Engrish you mean.

Gruebeard said:

O'd Engrish you mean.

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I stand collected.

"Ricky Williams, Polite with the block"

Just heard that during today's game. Makes the game sound so gentlemanly. Cultured, even

TeKeo said:

You can debate the artistic merit of video-games all day, but the discussing separation between high-culture and low-culture art is anything more than aggregate cultural impact over time is pretty meaningless.

For all we know, in 200 years, scholars will look back on Pokemon, recognizing it as high-culture for its contributions towards the cultural melange of the English and Japanese languages into "Nipponish".

Click to expand...

Hence me calling it an inane argument. Although I think that there are still differences between posthumous recognition of an author's work, and pop-culture getting subjugated into high-culture. Both require a different perception than what's given at the current time; one, however, requires that the material truly transcend its contemporaries in its aesthetic.

Either way, I confess: I welcome my moon-english speaking progeny.