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Why Europe is awesome...
#1
@Li3n
@Li3n
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/8453878.stm
In your face America.
Stop-and-search powers ruled illegal by European court
Police have faced criticism of their use of Section 44
Police powers to use terror laws to stop and search people without grounds for suspicion are illegal, the European Court of Human Rights has ruled.
The Strasbourg court has been hearing a case involving two people stopped near an arms fair in London in 2003.
It said that Kevin Gillan and Pennie Quinton's right to respect for a private and family life was violated.
Home Office Minister David Hanson MP said he was \"disappointed\" and would considering whether to appeal.
Section 44 of the Terrorism Act 2000 allows the home secretary to authorise police to make random searches in certain circumstances.
But the European Court of Human Rights said the pair's rights under Article 8 of the European Convention on Human Rights had been violated.
The court said the stop and search powers were \"not sufficiently circumscribed\" and there were not \"adequate legal safeguards against abuse\".
FROM THE WORLD AT ONE
More from The World At One
It also concluded that \"the risks of the discriminatory use of the powers\" were \"a very real consideration\".
The pair were awarded 33,850 euros (£30,400) to cover legal costs.
They were both stopped outside the Defence Systems and Equipment International exhibition at the Excel Centre in London Docklands in 2003, where there had already been protests and demonstrations.
Mr Gillan, 32, from London, was detained by police for about 20 minutes as he was cycling to join the demonstration.
Ms Quinton, 39, a journalist from London, was in the area to film the protests. She said she felt she was detained for about 30 minutes, although police records said it was five minutes.
Speaking to BBC Radio 4's The World At One, Ms Quinton said she hoped the ruling would lead to the government drawing up a \"fairer body of legislation to protect us\".
She said: \"The court hasn't said that there's no longer any scope for stops and searches, but that safeguards need to be in place to prevent misuse of these powers, because right now if somebody is stopped and searched, they have got no redress if they feel they were mistreated during the stop and search process.
\"It's not about saying that there's no need for stop and search. What we're really saying is people have a right to privacy and there needs to be a balance between police powers to ensure our safety but also our rights to a private life.\"
Parliamentarians must finally sort out this mess
Corinna Ferguson
Liberty
Mr Gillan said: \"It's fantastic news after a long struggle. I look to the government for a strong response.\"
Both were represented by Corinna Ferguson, legal officer for Liberty, who said the pressure group had \"consistently warned\" the government about the \"dangers\" of the powers.
Ms Ferguson added: \"The public, police and Court of Human Rights all share our concerns for privacy, protest, race equality and community solidarity that come with this sloppy law.
\"In the coming weeks, parliamentarians must finally sort out this mess.\"
But Mr Hanson, the policing and security minister, said he was disappointed at the decision given that the government had won all previous challenges in the UK courts.
He said: \"Stop and search under section 44 of the Terrorism Act 2000 is an important tool in a package of measures in the ongoing fight against terrorism.\"
'Balancing exercise'
Lord Carlile, the government's independent reviewer of anti-terrorist legislation, told the World At One that the implications of the ruling were potentially \"quite serious\" and may require a change in the law.
He added: \"In my view, section 44 is being used far too often on a random basis without any reasoning behind its use.
\"The fundamental point that the court is making is that it increases the possibility of random interference with the legitimate liberties of the citizen.
\"On the other hand, we have to be safe against terrorism. There is therefore a very difficult balancing exercise to be done and I'm sure Section 44 will come under intelligent scrutiny in the coming months.\"
The decision overturned a 2003 High Court ruling - subsequently upheld by the Court of Appeal and the House of Lords - that the use of stop and search, and any consequent violation of human rights, was proportionate under the European Convention on Human Rights and justified in the light of the threat of terrorism.
The Section 44 search powers have proved controversial, and in May last year the Metropolitan Police in London said they would be scaled back.
The force had faced criticism that such searches had been alienating people from ethnic minorities in the capital.
Its commissioner, Sir Paul Stephenson, said the powers should be restricted to \"iconic\" sites, including Parliament and Buckingham Palace.
In your face America.
#2
WolfOfOdin
WolfOfOdin
#3
makare
makare
#4
Shannow
Shannow
Final Countdown, thats why.
#5
Kitty Sinatra
Kitty Sinatra
#6
North_Ranger
North_Ranger
#7
strawman
strawman
#8
@Li3n
@Li3n
#9
Silver Jelly
Silver Jelly
#10
North_Ranger
North_Ranger
#11
Silver Jelly
Silver Jelly
#12
tegid
tegid
#13
Silver Jelly
Silver Jelly
#14
Green_Lantern
Green_Lantern
#15
tegid
tegid
What? You can't deny Europe's history is richer than that of America, the southern part of Africa or Oceania... Especially from the present perspective since much of the world's culture comes from (besides Asia).
Even if all this wasn't true... All the continents have millenia-long history, great. It doesn't make ours any less awesome
Even if all this wasn't true... All the continents have millenia-long history, great. It doesn't make ours any less awesome
#16
Silver Jelly
Silver Jelly
#17
tegid
tegid
#18
@Li3n
@Li3n
#19
Silver Jelly
Silver Jelly
#20
Green_Lantern
Green_Lantern
#21
tegid
tegid
#22
Biardo
Biardo
#23
Green_Lantern
Green_Lantern
#24
Silver Jelly
Silver Jelly
#26
@Li3n
@Li3n
Hey, most of that was the UK... and if you weren't an ignorant american you'd know they don't even consider themselves european... 
Also, fall into the ocean? And then who exactly would have founded your country?
And it's Rwanda...
:laugh:
Some nice reading material: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dollar#Etymology
Also, fall into the ocean? And then who exactly would have founded your country?
And it's Rwanda...
:laugh:
You mean the euromark? Sure, that wouldn't get shortened to Euro either.
Some nice reading material: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dollar#Etymology
#27
D
Dubyamn
Yeah that's bullshit. But I am well aware that in my scenario America would never be founded which ultimately is a worthwhile sacrifice for the good of the world.
D
Dubyamn
And the rest of Europe keeps on insisting that they are and that they should be more involved with the EU.Hey, most of that was the UK... and if you weren't an ignorant american you'd know they don't even consider themselves european...
Well the land already had people living on it and without the influence of Europe they probably would have estabilshed a Utopian society based on the belief that everyman woman and child had the inalienable rights...
Yeah that's bullshit. But I am well aware that in my scenario America would never be founded which ultimately is a worthwhile sacrifice for the good of the world.
Damn Europeans even gave it a stupidly spelled name. Another crime to add to their ever growing list.
#28
Green_Lantern
Green_Lantern
#29
@Li3n
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_country_name_etymologies#R
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Rwanda
@Li3n
That's all part of the 12 step plan to take over the world and impose socialism on it... Convincing the UK to join us completely is step 11... unleashing MechaObama on you is step 9, right after step 8, which is giving you universal health care.And the rest of Europe keeps on insisting that they are and that they should be more involved with the EU.Hey, most of that was the UK... and if you weren't an ignorant american you'd know they don't even consider themselves european...
Who needs stuff like democracy or human rights anyway...
That's so totally not our fault, natch:Damn Europeans even gave it a stupidly spelled name. Another crime to add to their ever growing list.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_country_name_etymologies#R
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Rwanda
#30
tegid
tegid
#31
@Li3n
@Li3n
#33
Biardo
Biardo
#34
North_Ranger
North_Ranger
#35
Chazwozel
Chazwozel
#36
Chazwozel
Chazwozel
#38
Krisken
Krisken
#39
Chazwozel
Chazwozel
#40
Krisken
Krisken
#41
Chazwozel
Chazwozel
#42
makare
makare
#43
WolfOfOdin
WolfOfOdin
.......Soooooo....
We can agree Europe gave us Pie, right? Pie is delicious and everyone loves pie. This thread is thusly now about pie, the different kinds and the appreciation of it.
EVERYONE EAT PIE
We can agree Europe gave us Pie, right? Pie is delicious and everyone loves pie. This thread is thusly now about pie, the different kinds and the appreciation of it.
EVERYONE EAT PIE
#44
tegid
Yeah, that's what I said. I don't know what you're arguing here
Anyway, I already agreed with you that many european countries fucked up like half of the world so, again, I don't know what you are arguing over. Still, since you seem to be bent on discussing who's fault is the fucked up state of the world, think about this: the US have been the most powerful country in the world for about the last century. Don't you think if something's wrong right now, it may be at least partly your fault? (as a country, which I'm not sure of, but if Europe as a continent or as an emergent joint of nations can be, why the hell not).
(Also, the history I like, if any, is the one before most of colonialism. Ya know, ancient world, then middle ages, etc. That's because I said there's more of it. We know much more about the ancient history of Europe. Maybe it's that way because some european people did fucked up things in the past, well, I'm sorry about that)
PS: What's the point of the stolen generation link? I'm sincerely asking. I have some ideas but I'm not sure of them.
tegid
You're right we can't really compete with Europe's History of Atrocities and exploitation. [/quote]Dubyamn;328729 [quote said:
Yeah, that's what I said. I don't know what you're arguing here
What you are missing is that not every nation in Europe, maybe even not most of them, had a significant part in colonialism or is to blame with the same kind of things. You can't blame Europe as a whole.Dubyamn said:
Anyway, I already agreed with you that many european countries fucked up like half of the world so, again, I don't know what you are arguing over. Still, since you seem to be bent on discussing who's fault is the fucked up state of the world, think about this: the US have been the most powerful country in the world for about the last century. Don't you think if something's wrong right now, it may be at least partly your fault? (as a country, which I'm not sure of, but if Europe as a continent or as an emergent joint of nations can be, why the hell not).
(Also, the history I like, if any, is the one before most of colonialism. Ya know, ancient world, then middle ages, etc. That's because I said there's more of it. We know much more about the ancient history of Europe. Maybe it's that way because some european people did fucked up things in the past, well, I'm sorry about that)
PS: What's the point of the stolen generation link? I'm sincerely asking. I have some ideas but I'm not sure of them.
#45
The Lovely Boehner
The Lovely Boehner
#46
Shannow
Shannow
Attachments
#48
tegid
tegid
#49
@Li3n
@Li3n
#50
Dave
Dave