a Trump vs Clinton United States Presidential Election in 2016

Who do you vote into the office of USA President?


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hillary has 30, maybe 40 years of public service and writing policy and speeches and rhetoric to tell you exactly what she believes, at almost every level and arena of the federal government

trump has never been elected nor appointed to dogcatcher, nor ever made any action recorded in his long life that wasn't meant to make him more money and fuck over every person on earth not named Trump (actually he's raped at least one person named Trump, so that's not even true)
 
I mean, Trump('s social media people) posts stuff like this to his Twitter, I know of no bigger ego.

 

GasBandit

Staff member
hillary has 30, maybe 40 years of public service and writing policy and speeches and rhetoric to tell you exactly what she believes, at almost every level and arena of the federal government
Hillary has had 30, maybe 40 years of personal enrichment through scandal-ridden politics which taught her that belief is unimportant, and a good speech just tells the proles what they want to hear, while personally often doing the opposite of what she professes. Seriously, as often as she plays the "war on women" card, she's personally crushed the lives of more women (her husband's dalliances) and quite possibly is the accomplice/enabler/coverup artist for a bona fide rapist (same). Every position she's held in government was a political payoff, starting with her Senate seat in New York for not divorcing Bill in the 90s, through her secretary of state consolation prize for having to postpone her anointment to the presidency behind Obama. She probably hasn't spoken a true word in front of a camera since Bill's gubernatorial run.

trump has never been elected nor appointed to dogcatcher, nor ever made any action recorded in his long life that wasn't meant to make him more money and fuck over every person on earth not named Trump
Prior to 2000, the same was true for Hillary. She just got to politics sooner because she didn't have an inheritance to squander, first.

Trump is a horrible person, and a horrible presidential candidate, and if the world was a just place, he would probably be rotting in prison.
Hillary is a horrible person, and a horrible presidential candidate, and if the world was a just place, she would probably be rotting in prison.
 
trump becoming president would immediately cause a crisis worse than brexit and probably worse than anything that's happened to the country short of pearl harbor or the civil war.

hillary becoming president would change nothing really.

they're not the same thing. not even close. you can write all the sentences where they have similar verbs and adjectives and clauses, but you're still completely wrong
 

GasBandit

Staff member
trump becoming president would immediately cause a crisis worse than brexit and probably worse than anything that's happened to the country short of pearl harbor or the civil war.

hillary becoming president would change nothing really.

they're not the same thing. not even close. you can write all the sentences where they have similar verbs and adjectives and clauses, but you're still completely wrong
You're a complete and utter fool, and I continue to take solace that I'm correct whenever you disagree with me.

Neither Hillary nor Trump becoming president will make them dictators, congress will still be a thing.

But if you want a real scare, just imagine how terrible whoever the next pair of career criminals the major parties dredge up in 4-8 years to top the current crop.
 
I heard 80+ percent of Congress is up for re-election and/or ousting. Is that true?
100% of the House and 33% of the Senate. Its always the same every 2 years. Which is around 87% of Congress, but again that happens every election cycle so don't let talking heads and idiotic Facebook posts fear monger you with it.
 
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GasBandit

Staff member
What Covar said. 100% of the House is up for reelection every 2 years, and the senate rotates a third every two years (as they have six year terms). Same as always.

Now, how that gets interpreted as "80% up for grabs" is a little dishonest, and ignores the fact that incumbents almost always get re-elected. People don't like "congress" but they think their own congressman/senator is the one good one in the bunch.
 
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What Covar said. 100% of the House is up for reelection every 2 years, and the senate rotates a third every two years (as they have six year terms). Same as always.

Now, how that gets interpreted as "80% up for grabs" is a little dishonest, and ignores the fact that incumbents almost always get re-elected. People don't like "congress" but they think their own congressman/senator is the one good one in the bunch.
The Democratic candidate for my district ran unopposed in the primary. He'll face the incumbent in November. No senate race here this year. Not that either is worth a damn.

As the "Blue Dogs" gradually go extinct, this state is going hard red. Thanks to an old and uneducated electorate, fed a steady diet of talk radio, Fox Noise, and "War on Coal."

The young ones who can get out are, as fast as they possibly can.


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trump becoming president would immediately cause a crisis worse than brexit and probably worse than anything that's happened to the country short of pearl harbor or the civil war.

hillary becoming president would change nothing really.

they're not the same thing. not even close. you can write all the sentences where they have similar verbs and adjectives and clauses, but you're still completely wrong

The world is rapidly changing and spiraling - Erdogan, Brexit and the (for now) slow unraveling of the EU, Putin, the migration crisis, the climate crisis, the economy that is still suffering from the mistakes from the late '90s and early aughts,.... The liberal dream of globalization, and the left answer of different globalization, have failed. Exporting Liberty, Justice, Reality TV and McDonalds to all corners of the world and making everything a Happy Place hasn't worked. We're faced with the return of right wing nationalism, not just in the US where it never really went away (oh sorry, I meant "patriotism"), but in Europe, too, and in some of the seemingly-more-advanced Middle Eastern nations, and across central Asia. NATO is falling apart, China has established control in most of Africa, Russia is busily claiming most of Asia, Western Europe is collapsing in a combination of debt, age and failed integration of immigrants and lack of environmental control.
What the Western world needs is strong leadership, vision, a new pact, a new dream.
What we get is either a quick descent into madness, or (at least) 4 more years of the Same Old Recipes that have already failed and are part of the problem, not the solution. Hillary won't be the one to usher in a new age of hope and prosperity. She's the biggest defender of the establishment, a last gasp of a dying oligarchy trying to make the most of their power as it lasts.
Both will leave the world a worse place than they found it. Which particular brand of Crapsack World we'll end up in might differ, but I'm not entirely convinced the very hard and rough Boot to the Balls wake up call of a Trump presidency might, in the long run, not be a better thing for the Western world than the slow festering of a Hillary presidency.

I'll gladly agree Trump is a worse person and a worse presidential candidate than Clinton. I'm sure she'll do less harm in the short term. I'm sure neither is what you or we need. As long as Trump is kept somewhat in check by Congress, though, he might actually change some things and force people to rethink some "common sense truths" about US politics. A rupture on both parties into a 4 or 5 party system would really help matters, for example.
 
Hillary/Humphrey, Trump/Nixon. Is this the biggest "fuck you" election since 1968?

At least no major candidate was assassinated this time. And there's no Wallace to throw a wrench into things.
 
So how about all that hubub about Trump being in unbelievable debt to Russian oligarchs.

With his recent change of stance on NATO and Ukraine (a U-turn for the Republican party) it's beginning to look a little frightening.
 
So how about all that hubub about Trump being in unbelievable debt to Russian oligarchs.

With his recent remarks about NATO and Ukraine (a U-turn for the Republican party) it's beginning to look a little frightening.
What's all the hubbub, bub?

No, really. This is the first I've heard of it. If true, they're calling the wrong candidate traitor. Or potential traitor.
 
It doesn't matter. Trump's voters will never read it. Those of us with any sort of education and interest in things like facts can't vote any harder than we are already. Nothing matters.
 

Dave

Staff member
Not that I don't believe a blog on the internet, but don't you think this is the kind of thing that would have been mentioned by the dems? Seriously, if it's that bad why wouldn't they trot this out?

The only reason I can think of is a tin-foil hat conspiracy that says either Trump has enough on Hillary that neither one wants to pull the trigger (mutually assured destruction kind of thing) or they agreed to be nice. They are friends of a sort.
 
Not that I don't believe a blog on the internet, but don't you think this is the kind of thing that would have been mentioned by the dems? Seriously, if it's that bad why wouldn't they trot this out?

The only reason I can think of is a tin-foil hat conspiracy that says either Trump has enough on Hillary that neither one wants to pull the trigger (mutually assured destruction kind of thing) or they agreed to be nice. They are friends of a sort.
It's a blog that uses multiple sources. He draws some big conclusions but there's a lot there.
 
It's a blog that uses multiple sources. He draws some big conclusions but there's a lot there.
I acknowledge that conspiracy is always possible, but I evaluate Putin's actions under the lens of "Does it advance what I want? I'm going to do it." And for him, he doesn't like Hillary. So he'll do whatever he can to advance Trump. And that's it. He doesn't NEED collaboration. And Trump, assuming he even knows about this would be FAR better off to just do nothing. Putin going after his biggest opponent? Go nuts!

Don't assume that because two people's goals align that they are in cahoots. Especially if the penalty for being found out is huge. May as well just each play their own game. Very similar to how Gasoline prices are always in sync. They don't NEED to be in cahoots if they are all acting in self-interest that aligns with everybody else's self-interest.
 
Some of Trump's pre-election tweets blatantly sucking up to Putin and begging for a scrap of attention would be more funny than terrifying if he wasn't close to being elected President.
 
I acknowledge that conspiracy is always possible, but I evaluate Putin's actions under the lens of "Does it advance what I want? I'm going to do it." And for him, he doesn't like Hillary. So he'll do whatever he can to advance Trump. And that's it. He doesn't NEED collaboration. And Trump, assuming he even knows about this would be FAR better off to just do nothing. Putin going after his biggest opponent? Go nuts!

Don't assume that because two people's goals align that they are in cahoots. Especially if the penalty for being found out is huge. May as well just each play their own game. Very similar to how Gasoline prices are always in sync. They don't NEED to be in cahoots if they are all acting in self-interest that aligns with everybody else's self-interest.
Even without the conspiracy stuff, why would anyone in their right mind want someone who's entire business and livelihood NEEDS Russia that badly to stay afloat in charge of their nation?
 

Necronic

Staff member
I'm sorry but trump is a fucking garbage person. I really don't see any need to dress that up and fill it out, it's self evident to anyone who hasn't intentionally blinded themselves. And I'm not saying that Clinton isn't a god damned terrible candidate herself. But at least she won't drive this country off a cliff with a smug grin while jerking himself off with the constitution.[DOUBLEPOST=1469475766,1469475283][/DOUBLEPOST]Also, following the Putin stuff, it's worth mentioning that Trump supporters have a tendency to prefer authorotarians.

A big warm daddy for a party of cowards.
 
The world is rapidly changing and spiraling - Erdogan, Brexit and the (for now) slow unraveling of the EU, Putin, the migration crisis, the climate crisis, the economy that is still suffering from the mistakes from the late '90s and early aughts,.... The liberal dream of globalization, and the left answer of different globalization, have failed. Exporting Liberty, Justice, Reality TV and McDonalds to all corners of the world and making everything a Happy Place hasn't worked. We're faced with the return of right wing nationalism, not just in the US where it never really went away (oh sorry, I meant "patriotism"), but in Europe, too, and in some of the seemingly-more-advanced Middle Eastern nations, and across central Asia. NATO is falling apart, China has established control in most of Africa, Russia is busily claiming most of Asia, Western Europe is collapsing in a combination of debt, age and failed integration of immigrants and lack of environmental control.
We didn't start the fire!
 

GasBandit

Staff member
I'm sorry but trump is a fucking garbage person. I really don't see any need to dress that up and fill it out, it's self evident to anyone who hasn't intentionally blinded themselves. And I'm not saying that Clinton isn't a god damned terrible candidate herself. But at least she won't drive this country off a cliff with a smug grin while jerking himself off with the constitution.[DOUBLEPOST=1469475766,1469475283][/DOUBLEPOST]Also, following the Putin stuff, it's worth mentioning that Trump supporters have a tendency to prefer authorotarians.

A big warm daddy for a party of cowards.
Every time.

 

GasBandit

Staff member
I don't think so, personally. I could be wrong, but the post convention bump wasn't big enough for Trump (even though it put him a few percentage points ahead of Hillary), the democrat conviction.. er, convention, heh, sorry, freudian slip... bump will put her back over, and things will get ugly and stupid for a few months, but unless the October Surprise is an indictment (which won't happen even if she murders someone live on national TV because laws don't apply to the ruling class), I think the story will be something more like Hillary wins 40-35 or so.
I just hope some of the missing 25% makes the 15% libertarians need to get in on the debates.
 

Zappit

Staff member
Donald Trump will get fucking destroyed during the national debates. He's promised to protect parts of the constitution that don't actually exist, praised multiple authoritarian leaders/monsters for their "leadership", and resorts to cheap, childish name-calling when he can't answer a question. Never mind the fact that he changes his positions more often than a sex-addicted couple working through the Kama-Sutra. People will see just how dangerously incompetent he really is, and the Cult of Trump will prove to be less than yoooooge.

I think the Dems are biding their time with the Russia ties until the debate. More evidence will come out, and I'm sure they're investigating those links themselves. They're saving that one for the days closer to the election. If a Trump keeps playing the e-mail card, they'll have the potential traitor card to play.

Funny how that's the one conspiracy Trump can't get behind.
 
Donald Trump will get fucking destroyed during the national debates. .
probably not. the bar is so low for him that all he has to do is not call hillary a [insert your favorite slur], and the media will fall over themselves to say it was a spirited tie. also he'll say his greatest hits and BUILD A WALL and 42% of the american voting public will say he won

with literally any two candidates on earth, someone would have to shit their pants and throw it at the moderator for the debate "results" to not be X wins 1, Y wins 2, 3rd is a draw. also "debates" aren't debates at all, they're always two people saying stump speeches in the same room while a moderator asks questions for them to blithely ignore
 
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