I've been to Paris and Barcelona!

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Just out of curiosity for those of you who didn't think Parisians were very friendly -- do you speak French at all? I found there to be a definite difference in how I was treated when I spoke French vs. when I didn't.
 
I found there to be a difference when I even TRIED to speak French. You do get credit for trying.

Also, regarding Granada, if your schedule does not permit visiting this time around, then definitely go next time. It's pretty damned impressive.

--Patrick
 
Just out of curiosity for those of you who didn't think Parisians were very friendly -- do you speak French at all? I found there to be a definite difference in how I was treated when I spoke French vs. when I didn't.
I don't, however a friend that was with us did (and was born in Southern France, English was her second language), but she was treated like we were. Whether it was an accent in her French or her association with us, I don't know.
 
I may have been in barcelona once or twice, tell me what kinds of things you would like to see (museums, architecture, "must be seen" places?) and I can suggest you what the best places are!

( my "basic" suggestions though are basically what Baerdog said! )
 
Just out of curiosity for those of you who didn't think Parisians were very friendly -- do you speak French at all? I found there to be a definite difference in how I was treated when I spoke French vs. when I didn't.
When asking for directions or help from people with public functions, not all but certainly most of them were kind of grumpy and short with the replies, whether I made an effort to speak a few words of French or just asked them if they parlez-vous anglais straight away.

Then again, you should never go to a highly tourist-populated place during a holiday season...
 
Now that I've taken the week to check out what we initially want to do and get the information for it. It's now time to start answering some posts and consult with people with experiences of the places we plan to go to.



When in Paris, make a slight detour north and visit Brussels :p

As for the Louvre, decide BEFOREHAND whether you want to wander through the halls and take in all the beauty, or rather just see the highlights (Mona Lisa/Venus of Milo/...). In one case, you can spend 2 full days there and not have seen everything, on the other hand, you can go through it in roughly 90 minutes if you know what you're doing.

The Moulin Rouge may have a famous name, but, if you and your wife are interested in such acts at all...Well, firstly, you've probably seen it done bigger and better in Vegas, and secondly, there are better cabarets in Paris by far. The MR just lives off of its name from days long gone by.
Merci beaucoup pour ton feedback.

Sadly, we don't have time for Brussels and most likely other places like Toulouse or Carcasonne. Mostly because from what I initially saw (will check again), train fares in Europe are ridiculous... pay triple the far of a flight directly to Barcelona and only take 1/6 of the time? Yes please.

We are going to check out the Louvre and will plan to take it in for one entire day. We plan to go see the big three and spend the rest of the day admiring the rest until we get bored/tired. I've checked a lot of online tips and recommendations on this place such as ideal days, preferred entrances, even gallery maps.

Sadly, I'm not interested in the Moulin Rouge. Maybe we'll check a show but a lot of reviews state it's not what it used to be and eating there is basically expensive tourist crap. So, it's not on my list.

When I honeymooned in Europe, we went through Paris. Like Bubble said, the Louvre is tough to do in one day, let alone two. Paris is VERY crowded with tourists at the usual spots, so it could be worth it to explore some parts of the city that are less crowded. We didn't go up in the Eiffel tower, for example, because the crowds were crazy.

To be honest, Paris was okay but we really loved Lyon. If you are taking the train to or from Barcelona, you should definitely stop in one or two of the cities outside of Paris. Since you speak French, you'll have no trouble getting around and you can find all kinds of pleasant little surprises in those towns.

If you post a little list of the places your considering visiting, we might be able to let you know we we thought of them.
Merci mec.

I do have an initial list but I'm not ready to post it yet... I'll do it later, maybe in about a week or so.

As for Lyon, I'd love to... but not on this trip and while Paris is indeed a tourist trap, we have to do it. We always wanted to and the wife will be happy. Since I speak the language and have been checking out the proper tips and guides on how to visit busy sites like the Louvre and Eiffel tower..... I hope that with a "zen-like" approach I can endure the waits.

Maybe one day I'll go backpacking in Europe... but not on this day.

I had the best hot dog of my entire life -- and this is coming from a Chicago girl -- at a boulangerie right down the street from that hotel. It was baked into some sort of sourdough roll with a bit of horseradish and a lot of cheese on top -- OH GOD MOAR.

If you're going to do the Eiffel Tower, do it at night when the city below is all lit up. You'll have to wait in a bit of a line, but I thought it was very much worth it. Don't go to the very top -- go to the level below it. It's cheaper, and I think you get a better view.

If you think you're going to do a lot of museums, DEFINITELY get a museum pass; it'll save you money quickly and you get to jump the lines at places like Versailles/Louvre/d'Orsay... etc

One of the places you TOTALLY have to go if it at all appeals to you at all is the Catacombs -- it was one of the creepiest, most surreal experiences of my life. Another long line, but if there was any line that was worth it, it was that one.
We haven't checked hotels yet but will sooner rather than later once we have checked flights better and assign the proper dates to our Europe 2012 excursion! I know it'll be at a Bed & Breakfast... let's be honest.... breakfast in Paris baby... YEAAAAAAAH.

As far as french Boulangeries, yes, they are renowned and have many of the sort here in Montreal.

We do plan to visit the Eiffel tower at night since it's a better overall experience. The night shows, the better view, smaller crowds... and yes, I did notice many mentioning that the 2nd etage has the best view... sorry to hear that your ex was a dumbass and gave you a hard time at one of the most notable places in the world. I promise to be zen-like during the long waits.... zen.... like.

Thank you for the recommendation of the museum pass, I do indeed plan to visit all three and getting the pass info is definitely on my to do list.

We plan to go to the Catacombs... heard the lines are long there as well since they only allow 200 people inside at all times.... looks like I'll wake up early that morning. :)

As for the rest of your recommendations, we're kindred spirits, they are all on our list and I thank you kindly for your feedback.

- Depending on how long you stay, get a metro-pass. They usually sell weekend passes and I think week-passes, which are always cheaper than buying a ticket for every individual trip. Driving in Paris is a nightmare, and the metro is super convenient, aside from the stairs at the Montmartre station, but there's always a lift :p

- Eat your breakfast in wherever it is you're staying. Go down to your nearest boulangerie at like 8am, get yourself a nice baguette - fresh from the oven - and pick up some cold cuts or cheese, milk and orange juice or a piece of fruit from a nearby convenience store. Unless your hotelprice has breakfast included with the price, but I've never stayed in a hotel in Paris, so I can't judge their food.

- Echoing HowDroll's recommendation for the Eiffel Tower at night. It's amazing. Or, if the weather is particularly nice, you can do it during the day and afterwards relax in the nearby park with an ice cream while sitting in the shade of a tree.

Finally, I'd like to recommend my favourite restaurant in all of Paris: Chartier.
We do plan to get metro passes for our stay as our main method of transportation will indeed be the metro. Apparently Paris has one of the best in the world.

I don't think we'll have any problems finding a good breakfast or lunch in Paris. Dinners are still to be researched though.

We do plan to visit the Trocadero which will give us exactly the view you were speaking of of the Eiffel tower at night and beat most crowds early in the morning. I'm easy to convince... the wife however loves her sleep but she tends to be a trooper about this stuff during our vacations... we can sleep at home... we shouldn't be sleeping in Vegas/Paris/Rome... etc.

Thank you for the glowing resto recommendation. It's now on my potential list.

If you can, I would go see the Sagrada Familia in Barcelona. It is probably the most beautiful buildings on the planet, to me anyway. But I've never been anywhere over seas, so sorry I don't have any real recommendations for you.
You should get on that Kaggie, get the hubby to take you to nice places!

And yes, the Sagrada Familia in Barcelona is indeed on my list!

Merci la femme.

I could put in a word for Sacre Coeur. I found the basilica quite beautiful and the view over Paris from the hill rather impressive. And if you want a portrait of yourselves done, the nearby Place du Tetre is the traditional place for that, and there are a lot of artists there selling their pieces.

Personally I would recommend Les Invalides, if you are in any way interested in matters military. The museums there are well worth the visit for military buffs, and the church holds the tomb of Napoleon which is demanding you take a picture of it. Plus, Les Invalides is pretty near to the Eiffel Tower, which you will probably visit regardless.

And a useful thing to notice is that there is a straight line going through Arc de Triomphe, Champs-Élysées, Place de la Concorde, Jardin des Tuileries, and the Louvre. All are places worth seeing, and might make for an efficient one day's worth of program right there.
Both the Sacre Coeur and the Place du Tetre is indeed on my list! Thanks TIMMMMMAAAAAAHY for the recommendations.

Napoleon's Tomb (Les Invalides) is on my optional list... simply because I'm unsure how much time we'll be staying.

As for Barcelona:
- The Sagrada Cathedral is a must see for a reason, the interior is fantastic (as in it looks like actual fantasy artwork embedded in the walls and ceilings)
- Las Ramblas is very cool to take leasurely strolls on, it's always busy and lively, so there's plenty to see.
- The Montjuic Castle sits atop a large hill, it's really nice to walk around there ánd you get a great view of the city. There used to be a military history museum which I found very interesting, but I just came across one source that it had closed down in 2009..
- There's a water fountain that does a light show from Thursday-Sunday which is cool to see, it's called the Font Màgica de Montjuïc
Than k you for some Barcelona tips.

All of these are on my list, we're excited to see them to say the least!

I only spent a weekend there, and spent most of it just walking the streets and eating baguettes (I figured, hey, it's France! I gotta try the baguettes!)

One piece of advice I can give is to remember the phrase "Parlez-vous anglais?" If you don't use it, there will be plenty of people who will pretend that they don't speak English even if they do, because they'll think you're an obnoxious tourist who doesn't even try to communicate on their terms.

Also: The crepe stands are amazing. If you see a crepe stand, buy a crepe. One with Nutella, preferably.
Thank you for the recommendation of the crepe stand, that's a must!

As for language barrier, I speak fluent French, English and Italian and some Spanish and Japanese. So I think I should be fine beyond trying to understand the terrible Parisian french accent.

I have a friend currently living in Gibraltar who travels to Spain regularly. I'll see if she has gone to Barcelona (I seem to remember she and her family went there for vacation) and if she has any recommendations.
Please do, especially dining recommendations. We plan to eat well... TAPAAAAAAAS!!!!!!!

When are you going? We're going three weeks in September ;)
hah.
Guess we'll miss eachother.... we're going mid-August.

La Sagrada Familia cathedral is a must-see, definitely the most impressive cathedral I've been to. Parque Guell is also really great for a morning of walking around and is filled with Gaudi architecture. If you like art museums, MNAC (National Art Museum of Catalonia) is very good. If you don't mind heading out of town about an hour or so, Montserrat is a pretty cool cliffside church/monastery.

I had a good time in Barcelona but only got to see a small part of the city. Silver Jelly could probably give you more detailed advice.
Silver Jelly is a sexy beast.

Thanks for the recommendations for Barcelona. Oddly enough, they are all on our list... we'll be doing a Gaudi binge this summer I think... :)

Agreed. Don't take the guide tours by boat, though, they're expensive and boring.
Any recommendations though? The woman does want to do the Seine thing and it goes beyond the "take the bus boat".

Paris was a beautiful city for sure, but the people weren't terribly friendly. My friends and I were mostly in the touristy spots, though, so I'm sure that was part of it.
I expect them to be generally indifferent/rude. Parisians are renowned for their character and snobbishness, it's nothing new.

Can't blame them, they see a shitload of tourists EVERY SINGLE DAY and most of them couldn't be bothered to speak to them in a language they don't understand. Most of them who live/work at the touristy spots are numbed by the sheer numbers and frankly, don't give a fuck.

I hope my charming smile and good looks along with my french will win them over and help me if I need help. :)

Just out of curiosity for those of you who didn't think Parisians were very friendly -- do you speak French at all? I found there to be a definite difference in how I was treated when I spoke French vs. when I didn't.
Yep, pretty much this.

The only place where I didn't get credit for speaking their language was Naples.... where they have completely murdered the language.

Ummmm thanks but no thanks?




I'll have a list in about a week's time. Maybe I'll copy/paste my itinerary and ask for advice.
 
Oh, the lines in Paris aren't so bad, really. Tourist watching is an activity in itself, and if you and your wife are at all social, you can always find people from all over the world to chat with while you're waiting. It's easy to be zen when you remember that you're on vacation in one of the most beautiful cities in the world!
 
Any recommendations though? The woman does want to do the Seine thing and it goes beyond the "take the bus boat"
You could do it if you don't have a lot of time, - I took the tour when I was in Paris for a day with my high-school class - but personally I found going to the actual places themselves more interesting than taking a boat to see them from afar.
 
I'm late to the party but extra Barcelona pointers from a Barceloneesian:


- Pretty much anything Gaudi (Sagrada Familia, La Pedreda/Casa Milà, Casa Batlló, Parc Güell, Colonia Güell), which I understand you already have on your preliminary list.
- Gastronomy?: There are some pretty famous restaurants here and around. Ferran Adrià, who was considered for a while the best cook in the world, opened a new restaurant with his brother (I think) called Tickets. Anyway, I can't recommend any specific restaurant or cook because they're expensive as fuck and have never gone to any of them, but if you can spend the money it's supposed to be a fantastic experience going to any of these modern famous restaurants. Going to a good traditional restaurant is also a nice idea, but I'm at a loss as to what to recommend. I'll try to think about it.
- The Tibidabo (the mountain that limits the city on the West) has a nice view of the city... in the sense that you can see it all from a height, not in the sense that it's a beautiful thing to see. I dunno, I take people up there all the time, but I'm not really sure it's worth it.
- For a drink at night, Gracia neighborhood or the older part of the city (The Raval, the Barri Gotic, the Born)have a lot of personality, and are quite lively at night (I prefer Gracia personally).


- If you can travel around Catalonia (~250 km North, South and West of Barcelona) on minitrips, I really recommend the rocky beaches of the Costa Brava (everyone agrees that the town of Cadaques is gorgeous, and there's the Dali museum in Figueres, these you can maybe see on a one day trip and I think it's really worth it) or going to the Pyrinees (some nice medieval towns, nice landscapes), and a lot nearer Barcelona you have Montserrat (already mentioned by Baer), which I wholeheartedly recommend, if only because it's a very curious geological formation, visually.

I think that's all... You've probably already heard about most of these but whatever, if only one is new to you then that's enough! If you have any specific questions later on I'm sure we'll be of much more help :p
 
With all due respect, if you can't admit French food is great nor have anything positive to say about either Barcelona or Paris at one point or another maybe you should quit posting in this thread as I don't want negative nancies to take away from the overall amazing good sound advice from multiple people. :)
 
- Pretty much anything Gaudi (Sagrada Familia, La Pedreda/Casa Milà, Casa Batlló, Parc Güell, Colonia Güell), which I understand you already have on your preliminary list.
- Gastronomy?: There are some pretty famous restaurants here and around. Ferran Adrià, who was considered for a while the best cook in the world, opened a new restaurant with his brother (I think) called Tickets. Anyway, I can't recommend any specific restaurant or cook because they're expensive as fuck and have never gone to any of them, but if you can spend the money it's supposed to be a fantastic experience going to any of these modern famous restaurants. Going to a good traditional restaurant is also a nice idea, but I'm at a loss as to what to recommend. I'll try to think about it.
- The Tibidabo (the mountain that limits the city on the West) has a nice view of the city... in the sense that you can see it all from a height, not in the sense that it's a beautiful thing to see. I dunno, I take people up there all the time, but I'm not really sure it's worth it.
- For a drink at night, Gracia neighborhood or the older part of the city (The Raval, the Barri Gotic, the Born)have a lot of personality, and are quite lively at night (I prefer Gracia personally).


- If you can travel around Catalonia (~250 km North, South and West of Barcelona) on minitrips, I really recommend the rocky beaches of the Costa Brava (everyone agrees that the town of Cadaques is gorgeous, and there's the Dali museum in Figueres, these you can maybe see on a one day trip and I think it's really worth it) or going to the Pyrinees (some nice medieval towns, nice landscapes), and a lot nearer Barcelona you have Montserrat (already mentioned by Baer), which I wholeheartedly recommend, if only because it's a very curious geological formation, visually.

I think that's all... You've probably already heard about most of these but whatever, if only one is new to you then that's enough! If you have any specific questions later on I'm sure we'll be of much more help :p
Thank you kindly for this advice. A lot of Google-fu shall be done tonight due to this.

Gracias!
 
Sounds like you've gotten a lot of good advice about sights to see and places to go, so let me offer up another tidbit. In Paris, be ever vigilant against pickpockets and beggars. Visiting the Eiffel Tower was where I came closest to having someone snatch my bag. There are beggars who will come up to you and ask for money in front of Notre Dame and other churches. They may use their children to tug at your heartstrings. Ignore them. Once you give them money, you're a mark. Another thing to be aware of is dishonest merchants selling knickknacks and such on the street. A common scam is to get a pretty woman to come to the stall and to get her close enough to loop a string around her wrist and not let her go until she buys something. Not all of them do this, but it happens so be aware. Thieves are a concern in any big European city but due to all the tourists in Paris they have a lot more practice.

Paris and Barcelona are beautiful cities with rich cultures and I'm sure you'll be great. By being alert and aware of your surroundings, you won't have to deal with the stress of having your things stolen.
 
Sounds like you've gotten a lot of good advice about sights to see and places to go, so let me offer up another tidbit. In Paris, be ever vigilant against pickpockets and beggars. Visiting the Eiffel Tower was where I came closest to having someone snatch my bag. There are beggars who will come up to you and ask for money in front of Notre Dame and other churches. They may use their children to tug at your heartstrings. Ignore them. Once you give them money, you're a mark.
This is also true for Barcelona
 
you should quit posting in this thread, negative nancy
Hey now, I *do* have a lot of positive things to say about Paris. Since I've never been to Barcelona, the only thing I can say about that is that I'd like to go there too.
However, there's about a million websites ,books and guides pointing out the good. There's a lot less pointing out the bad. I thought Paris the world and was disappointed. It's better to go and be amazed at how awesome it is, than to go and be let down because it isn't literal Heaven on Earth.
That said, I *did* mention quite a few positives in my first two posts. Or what, saying you should have a look at Père Lachaise doesn't count as positive? How about my mention of the Arche de la Défense? Besides, I said "you might as well skip the Moulin Rouge" and your reply is.... "I'm going to skip the Moulin Rouge". Alright, so you already heard the same advice elsewhere - sorry about that. I still maintain it's better to warn you about something and have you avoid it or go there with lower expectations, than to sing its praises and watch you get disappointed.

As for the French cuisine: I'm very serious and absolutely not sarcastic or chauvinistic when I say the Belgian cuisine is, generally, better, to my taste.
To put it one way: in Germany, you get unrefined food, but lots of it. In France, you get refined food, but little of it. In the Netherlands, you get unrefined food and little of it. In Belgium you get refined food and lots of it. These being the stereotypes, of course, and at least 3 of those are false - I've eaten very good in both the Netherlands and Germany, and I know plenty of places with "Belgian" cuisine who aren't exactly refined and offer small portions to boot.
However, I've eaten at star restaurants in 7 countries, and France was by far the weakest of the lot when I compare those (it's obviously unfair to compare a hot dog stand in New York with El Bulli) (obviously this whole bit is based on personal taste and not an objective judgement; and equally obviously it's anecdotal. Anyone trying to tell you otherwise on this sort of matter is fooling themselves.) I only meant to say that, from my point of view, there's a pretty decent chance you'll eat better in Spain than in France, compared to the price.

Here's another bit of positive advicez for you; there's an exposition in Paris at the moment (and I think it's still there for a few more months) which has come to Brussels as well a few months ago. It's a pretty amazing recosntruction of the Tomb of Tutankhamon. If you're at all interested in Egyptian art/history/..., be sure to check it out.

And a last bit, and after this, fine, I'll leave the thread if you insist on nothing but positive news (though others have posted as "negatively" as I have): the palace of Versailles is neat; the gardens are especially nice unless you don't like "artificial" gardens (it's the embodiment of everything a French garden wants to be, and everything an English garden tries to avoid). I loved the water and light show they have in the evenings, over the fountains. I can't compare to Vegas, of course, so you might be disappointed...Vegas tends to do everything "bigger". I wouldn't go there *just* for the water fountain thing, but if you *do* plan to go to Versailles, be sure to stay 'till after dark.
 
Jay - I'm still waiting to hear back from my friend. She and her family are moving back to the US soon, so I think she may be elbow deep in getting their house packed up.
 
5 nights in Paris, 4 nights in Barcelona.

Flights booked, hotels booked, time to look at restos.

Gonna have to read this thread again during lunch.

Thanks for the advice peeps, much obliged.
 
Hey, I'm pretty bad with restaurants, but in case I can help, can I ask about your itinerary in and around Barcelona? I don't want to start recommending restaurants that you won't be able to get to!
 
Oh good, hadn't heard anything in a while. I was beginning to wonder if you'd just called off the whole trip. Make sure you let us know how y'all were treated.

--Patrick
 
Tuesday - Leave Montreal, flight at 9 PM.

Wednesday - Land in Paris (direct flight) at 10 AM local time. Hope to sleep in the plane. Hotel is a 5 minute walk from the Eiffel Tower. Easy day planned with places of interest such as St-Germain-des-Pres, Pantheon, Luxembourg gardens, Trocadero and Pont Alexander the III. No plans for resto this day, we'll try to find a decent bistro and hit the sack early. Jet lag and all.

Thursday - Wake up early and go to the Sacre-Ceour and Palais Garnier in the morning. Parc des Buttes Chaumont in the afternoon and Eiffel Tower at night. Reservation are already set for dinner at 9PM at the 58 Tour Eiffel... special seat view. :)

Friday - Wake up early and hit the Louvre. Then go to the Jardins Tuilerie, Place de la Concorde amd Arc de Triomphe. Reservation are already set for dinner at 7PM for a dinner cruise on the Seine. :)

Saturday - Wake up early... yeah I know. Chateau Versailles all day. No dinner plans yet.

Sunday - Wake up... derrr.... Notre-Dame Cathedral and the Sainte-Chapelle in the morning. Musee d'Orsay in the afternoon. No dinner plans yet.

Monday - Flight at 7:30 from Paris to Barcelona. Check in hotel then go to Tididabo Mountain for the afternoon. Hit Magic Mountain at Monjuic and Placa Espagne in the evening. Dinner at some Tapas on the Ramblas.

Tuesday - Familia Sagrada, Casa Battlo, Hopital Sant Pau, Casa Mila and Passeig da Gracia. Dinner at some Tapas on the Ramblas.

Wednesday - Cattedrale Santa Maria del mar, Arc de Triomf, Ciutadella Park, Gothic Quarter, Port Vell, La Barceloneta, Coloumbus monument, Palaca Reial, Palau de la Musica Catalana, Palau Grell, Cathedral de Santa Eulalia... dinner at the Port.

Thursday - Guell Park and Casa Museo Gaudi... then if we have time or missed anything on Wednesday, hit the beach! Dinner on the Ramblas.

Friday - Breakfast on the Ramblas, leave Barcelona at 13h30, back to Montreal.


Then start planning my November cruise in the Caribbean :)
 
You are forgetting to include how much coffee you will be drinking to get up so early every day, but you should be able to seriously decimate some tapas after all that running around.

--Patrick
 
I assume you're staying near the ramblas? I recommend looking for some place in the ciutat vella/barri gotic (barri=quarter, in catalan), Raval or el Born for the tapas, especially the Born is supposed to have fancier places. Although to be fair these neighborhoods may look a bit dangerous and quite dirty, especially at night. I'm super sleepy right now, I'll try to think of something more specific...
 
Currently in Paris.....

Short term goals accomplished

Visited a few places...

Ate a baguette

Ate parties

Ate waffles with ice cream...

Paris is a bigger city to visit compared to Rome....[DOUBLEPOST=1345045586][/DOUBLEPOST]Ate pastries.... Wtf

iPad autocorrect fail

I read panties at first damn
 
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