figmentPez
Staff member
Really? That's what you're going for. I don't care if you like Dodger's videos or not, but its' really rude to label her an attention whore.
[Question] Attention Whores - Bad labeling or real thing?
- Thread starter figmentPez
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I was going for funny, not insulting. I didn't even realize all the videos except the animal were the same person until after I posted, and I haven't a clue who that person is anyway. Sorry to have offended, post removed.
GasBandit
Staff member
She seems to... usually... have the right idea about hair color, but that's all I know. Oh that and I think she was in that "most complicated board game ever" video I posted.
That said, it does seem to me that if you put yourself on camera for youtube more than once, much less 11 times, you do seem to have a bit of an attention... thing. But really, that's show business. I mean, how successful would Cary Grant have been if he'd kept angrily insisting "stop pointing that camera at me!"
That said, it does seem to me that if you put yourself on camera for youtube more than once, much less 11 times, you do seem to have a bit of an attention... thing. But really, that's show business. I mean, how successful would Cary Grant have been if he'd kept angrily insisting "stop pointing that camera at me!"
figmentPez
Staff member
Bullshit. Just being on camera doesn't make you an "attention whore". Vlogging does not make you an "attention whore". Being a celebrity, even a minor one, does not mean that you have sold out for the sake of attention.
GasBandit
Staff member
Mmmmnnnnnnnnyes. Yes it does. Especially if the camera is pointed *at you*, instead of showing what you're talking about.
figmentPez
Staff member
I strongly disagree. Just being on camera does not mean a person has compromised morality for the sake of attention. Seeking attention is not being a "whore".
GasBandit
Staff member
Anyway, funny picture.
[DOUBLEPOST=1370546006][/DOUBLEPOST]
I never said they compromised morality, and I dispute that is the definition of "attention whore." I've never heard or used it in that context... merely that being one means that you actively crave and seek attention to an extraordinary degree.
figmentPez
Staff member
From Dictionary.com:
Whore - a woman who engages in promiscuous sexual intercourse, usually for money; prostitute; harlot; strumpet.
Prostitute - a person who willingly uses his or her talent or ability in a base and unworthy way, usually for money. - to put to any base or unworthy use: to prostitute one's talents.
The term "whore" or "prostitute" both imply someone who is using their bodies or their talents in an immoral manner. Hence the term "attention whore" implies the same thing. It is a wholly rude and unnecessary accusation to fling at someone simply because they put themselves on camera for the entertainment of others.
GasBandit
Staff member
Boy, I'd hate to hear what you think chocoholic or killer app means.
figmentPez
Staff member
Chocoholic - a person who is excessively fond of chocolate.
Killer - Slang. something or someone having a formidable impact, devastating effect, etc.: The math test was a real killer.
Golly, what do you know, words have meaning. Chocoholic and killer both have established social meaning beyond their original root. Whore and prostitute don't. They're still highly charged words and looking at the UrbanDictionary entry for Attention Whore easily shows that is a derogatory term, usually aimed at women, and even a more moderated source like Wiktionary backs up my stance that it's applied to those seeking attention via inappropriate means. In short, calling someone a "whore" or a "prostitute" is a weighty accusation, even if you put "attention" in front of it.
GasBandit
Staff member
Attention whore does have "established social meaning beyond the original root," even if it seems to have one of your trigger words imbedded in it. Of course it's a derogatory term because attention seeking is negative behavior. It doesn't mean someone is literally sexually promiscuous for whatever reason. Same as a ladykiller isn't actually murdering women. "Attention whore" means that attention is the currency, not that sex is the method.
Attention whoring: No sexual favors were exchanged in the making of this ragecomic.[DOUBLEPOST=1370547912][/DOUBLEPOST]Another example, so old it's trite, with absolutely no sexual overtones whatsoever.
Citing the dictionary is dumb. It doesn't define the way language is used, it describes it, and it does so imperfectly. Language is fluid and I don't consult a dictionary before I speak. The dictionary consults people and how they speak. And it doesn't capture every nuance.
I think GB saying he was not implying any moral compromise (as many do when using whore in that manner... Merriam-Webster has an example using the phrase "blurb whore") means your claim of whore only meaning one thing (that of its root meaning) is too strong.
figmentPez
Staff member
So every news reporter, every actor, every person who has given a public speech, every teacher, every person who has stood in front of a crowd for the purposes of having people pay attention to them is engaging in negative behavior? Bullshit. There are negative ways to seek attention, but not all attention seeking is negative.[DOUBLEPOST=1370547985][/DOUBLEPOST]
He damn well is implying moral compromise. "attention seeking is negative behavior"
GasBandit
Staff member
Biting my nails is negative behavior, but it doesn't indicate that my morality is broken. There's a difference between negative and immoral.
So is biting your toenails but no moral implications are necessary in stating that.
figmentPez
Staff member
A blurb whore is someone who has used their social connections for personal gain. They're showing off who they got to read their book in an immodest manner. It's exactly the definition of prostitute. "a person who willingly uses his or her talent or ability in a base and unworthy way, usually for money."
That was creepy, GasBandit Don't do that again.[DOUBLEPOST=1370548162][/DOUBLEPOST]
But not an immoral manner.
But not an immoral manner.
GasBandit
Staff member
Boy oh boy did we tug the wrong sweater, huh.[DOUBLEPOST=1370548272][/DOUBLEPOST]
I almost typed "picking my nose" instead, but didn't want to make people think that was something I actually did.
That's semantics for ya.
figmentPez
Staff member
figmentPez
Staff member
Granted, there is not always overlap between what is negative and what is immoral, look at how the term "attention whore" is actually used, and is defined by sources seeking to discover it's public usage. The specific use of the word negative in association with "attention whore" very much retains the implied immorality of the word "whore". People who bite their nails aren't seeking gain at the expense of others, as "attention whores" are implied to be. That's the difference that brings about the moral issue. The negative harm from someone biting their own nails is personal. If someone were biting their nails in a public place, especially if they were biting their toenails in a restaurant, then it would become a morality issue because they are engaging in negative behavior that affects others. The behavior you claim is negative in "attention whores" is a public behavior, that is implied to be of negative impact on those around the "attention whore" and thus is a moral issue.
I think you're getting more worked up over this than is called for.
For my part, "attention whore" merely refers to someone who acts out in a manner meant specifically to gather attention they wouldn't otherwise obtain merely by being themselves.
I have no idea if the person in those videos is an attention whore or not, according to my definition.
My definition does not touch on morality or ethics.
It could be considered negative - Implied is the idea that they are gaining undue attention, and there are people who believe that receiving something you don't deserve makes you a bad person. I dunno about that though, a lot of people put in a lot of time and effort to get some attention, and if so, why not receive it without someone else judging them for it?
For me it's only negative if they are annoying me in order to gain attention. If they are annoying others then it amuses me.
As far as the idea that it could only apply to women, I don't make a distinction. Lots of guys are attention whores.
So, again, I apologize for using a phrase which you find so offensive, and I hope that this explanation helps you understand that I did not mean any offense whatsoever, and I hope when you see me use it in the future you will keep this in mind.
For my part, "attention whore" merely refers to someone who acts out in a manner meant specifically to gather attention they wouldn't otherwise obtain merely by being themselves.
I have no idea if the person in those videos is an attention whore or not, according to my definition.
My definition does not touch on morality or ethics.
It could be considered negative - Implied is the idea that they are gaining undue attention, and there are people who believe that receiving something you don't deserve makes you a bad person. I dunno about that though, a lot of people put in a lot of time and effort to get some attention, and if so, why not receive it without someone else judging them for it?
For me it's only negative if they are annoying me in order to gain attention. If they are annoying others then it amuses me.
As far as the idea that it could only apply to women, I don't make a distinction. Lots of guys are attention whores.
So, again, I apologize for using a phrase which you find so offensive, and I hope that this explanation helps you understand that I did not mean any offense whatsoever, and I hope when you see me use it in the future you will keep this in mind.
GasBandit
Staff member
I never said people who bite their nails were attention whores, I used it to defeat your assertion that negative behaviors are automatically immoral. Yes, people generally hold more disdain for attention whores than they do for nailbiters, but that doesn't pass the morality threshold. I feel very negatively about people who park diagonally across two parking spaces as well, for example, but I wouldn't be able to reasonably call that act immoral. People who double dip also I find revolting. Not, however, from a moral standpoint. I'm sorry, but if you feel that the phrase "attention whore" actually implies literal whoring, I'm afraid you're in the vast minority - and in socially defined terminology, that's an important distinction.
figmentPez
Staff member
I'm not in the minority if Wiktionary, UrbanDictionary, TV Tropes and other sources are any indication. All of these sources talk about "attention whore" as a highly negative label applied to people who shamelessly seek any sort of attention, positive or negative, at any cost.
GasBandit
Staff member
You're sure selective of what definitions you accept and bendy about what the words there actually mean. Well, except the words "attention whore," of course.
In tangentially related news, I found it noteworthy that the first safe-for-work image that came up when I did a GIS for attention whore was male, and very apropos.
Just popped into say that I haven't seen anyone take GasBandit to town like that in a long time. figmentPez was right about 90% of the time in his posts and GasBandit was backpeddling/changing his point so many times I lost count.
Simply put, Dodger is an awesome and humble Youtuber and GasBandit has no idea what he's talking about on the subject.
Simply put, Dodger is an awesome and humble Youtuber and GasBandit has no idea what he's talking about on the subject.
I like how you simply come off as -try hard- in this post. That's about the best way I can put it without picking it apart, which would just be pointless since I've seen your style of -arguing-. This post in particular reminds me of Amy/Crone style of responding.
Alot of empty words disguised with a wonderful thesaurus open on a second browser window.
GasBandit
Staff member
I'll countenance a lot of insults, but I never, never use a thesaurus. Any who say otherwise fellate strangers by choice.
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