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Cripes Israel, lay off a bit.
#1
Chazwozel
Chazwozel
#2
Singularity.EXE
Singularity.EXE
#3
Chazwozel
Chazwozel
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Wyrminarrd
Wyrminarrd
#5
ElJuski
ElJuski
#7
Chazwozel
Chazwozel
#8
TheBrew
TheBrew
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Matt²
Matt²
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Chazwozel
Chazwozel
#11
Espy
Espy
#12
Shakey
Shakey
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Chazwozel
Chazwozel
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The Lovely Boehner
The Lovely Boehner
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Espy
Espy
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Seraphyn
Seraphyn
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Silvanesti
Silvanesti
#23
GasBandit
Remember to keep the true distinction in mind.
GasBandit
It's pretty much guaranteed there will be no peace until one side just wipes the other out. The fact of the matter is there's just too much antipathy and too divergent opinion on the matter. Hell, even when we called Arafat's bluff and basically agreed to give Arafat everything he ever asked for, he still backed away from the table because they really don't WANT peace, they want dead jews.Silvanesti said:
Remember to keep the true distinction in mind.
#24
LordRendar
LordRendar
the pic says it all...GasBandit said:Remember to keep the true distinction in mind.
#25
Scarlet Varlet
Scarlet Varlet
#27
Scarlet Varlet
Scarlet Varlet
#28
Matt²
Matt²
#29
JCM
JCM
#30
GasBandit
GasBandit
#31
JCM
JCM
#32
Veteran
Veteran
#33
GasBandit
GasBandit
#34
Matt²
Matt²
#35
blotsfan
blotsfan
#36
JCM
Israel itself now isn't accepting any ceasefire, and as usual, counting on the USv eto to attack and take more land, and I'd be glad to bet that there will be some more settlers in Palestinian lands. Again, I suggest you comfy Fox viewers to travel there and compare the life of a palestinian to of an Israeli,
While the UN is not perfect, it has done more humanitarian work than any other organization, and has saved much more than anyone (with the Red Cross a close second). What have you done for humanity, may I ask?
JCM
Bullshit. They are a)on Palestinian land, b)not allowing any peacekeeping or human rights inspection group, c)letting Palestinians live in what can be equaled to concentration camps, and time after time cutting off electricity, water and food,and has had thousands of complaints of human rights abusesblotsfan said:
Israel itself now isn't accepting any ceasefire, and as usual, counting on the USv eto to attack and take more land, and I'd be glad to bet that there will be some more settlers in Palestinian lands. Again, I suggest you comfy Fox viewers to travel there and compare the life of a palestinian to of an Israeli,
Funnily, the same quote can be applied to Palestinians on the other side, teaching Israel a lesson.
[/quote]I forgot, Fox news only shows the occasional corruption, and never shows billions in food, medicine and educational aid given,nor millions of lives saved.
While the UN is not perfect, it has done more humanitarian work than any other organization, and has saved much more than anyone (with the Red Cross a close second). What have you done for humanity, may I ask?
#37
blotsfan
While the UN is not perfect, it has done more humanitarian work than any other organization, and has saved much more than anyone (with the Red Cross a close second). What have you done for humanity, may I ask?[/quote]
Should I remind you that the Gaza strip was part of Israel. The reason that the Palestinians have control over is was because the Israelis gave it to them as part of a ceasefire agreement (gee, what happened to that?).
Comparing the situations that the Palestinians live in to the concentration camps shows a huge amount of ignorance and disrespect, though I guess I shouldn't expect more from a self-righteous MSNBC viewer(see? I can make stupid and wrong generalizations too). People are forgetting that the Israelis let food and medical supplies into the Gaza right before they started the invasion. You know, if all Israel cared about was getting more land, why were they willing to give up the Sinai to make peace with Egypt? Or give up the Gaza Strip to make peace with the Palestinians. Yeah, the Gaza was a part of Israel. Israel could have done these attacks the moment the Intifada, but they tied to make peace diplomatically, something the Palestinians have shown time and time again, that they don't really care about. Why should Israel let these people who have done nothing to show that they really want peace continue attacking them?
Oh, and you could say that the Palestinians are teaching the Israelis a lesson. However, there is one major difference: The Palestinians attack civilians, the Israelis attack the terrorists. Yes Palestinian civilians are dying, but that is not the goal of the Israeli army. Pretty tough for Palestinians to say that when they fire into civilian areas with intent to kill civilians.
Yes Israel is not perfect, but they're a hell of a lot better than the Palestinians.
blotsfan
[/quote:1nhcd7us]I forgot, Fox news only shows the occasional corruption, and never shows billions in food, medicine and educational aid given,nor millions of lives saved.JCM said:
While the UN is not perfect, it has done more humanitarian work than any other organization, and has saved much more than anyone (with the Red Cross a close second). What have you done for humanity, may I ask?
[/quote]Should I remind you that the Gaza strip was part of Israel. The reason that the Palestinians have control over is was because the Israelis gave it to them as part of a ceasefire agreement (gee, what happened to that?).
Comparing the situations that the Palestinians live in to the concentration camps shows a huge amount of ignorance and disrespect, though I guess I shouldn't expect more from a self-righteous MSNBC viewer(see? I can make stupid and wrong generalizations too). People are forgetting that the Israelis let food and medical supplies into the Gaza right before they started the invasion. You know, if all Israel cared about was getting more land, why were they willing to give up the Sinai to make peace with Egypt? Or give up the Gaza Strip to make peace with the Palestinians. Yeah, the Gaza was a part of Israel. Israel could have done these attacks the moment the Intifada, but they tied to make peace diplomatically, something the Palestinians have shown time and time again, that they don't really care about. Why should Israel let these people who have done nothing to show that they really want peace continue attacking them?
Oh, and you could say that the Palestinians are teaching the Israelis a lesson. However, there is one major difference: The Palestinians attack civilians, the Israelis attack the terrorists. Yes Palestinian civilians are dying, but that is not the goal of the Israeli army. Pretty tough for Palestinians to say that when they fire into civilian areas with intent to kill civilians.
Yes Israel is not perfect, but they're a hell of a lot better than the Palestinians.
#38
Mr_Chaz
Mr_Chaz
#39
JCM
JCM
#40
blotsfan
blotsfan
#41
Ravenpoe
Ravenpoe
#42
I
Icarus
Israel bombs buildings without being sure there's terrorists present. They've killed families of terrorists including babies, they've opened fire on schools killing children for no reason, they have blown kids to pieces for throwing rocks, etc. etc. etc.
Heck, a few years back there was a documentary and the reporter went to visit the school. A few infantry soldiers came walking down the street and the teacher quickly told all kids to hide under their desks. The reporter said "surely they won't harm you - they're just there as a sign of authority". So all the kids get out from under the desks and class continues while the soldiers are standing outside the school. Suddenly they opened fire at the school - right in front of the camera, a 6 year old girl got a bullet right in her head. None of the camera crew got harmed but several kids were badly wounded and a few were killed. Shocked, the reporter went over to the soldier who spouted racist bullshit, calling all Palestinians dogs & pigs & whatever and his colleague threatened the reporter to leave or he'd end up like the kids. This was in front of a CAMERA. God knows what else they pull off when there's none around.
That's just one of the many documentaries or amateur clips I've seen that show the real behavior of Israel soldiers. Palestinians are treated as scum and criminals everywhere they go. There's no way for any Palestinian kid to grow up not hating them because of what they see. Every check point is filled with soldiers throwing insults and threats at even old ladies and infants.
So yeah, they're just as bad really except they got bigger guns.
I
Icarus
Unfortunately the reality is often THIS:GasBandit said:Remember to keep the true distinction in mind.
Israel bombs buildings without being sure there's terrorists present. They've killed families of terrorists including babies, they've opened fire on schools killing children for no reason, they have blown kids to pieces for throwing rocks, etc. etc. etc.
Heck, a few years back there was a documentary and the reporter went to visit the school. A few infantry soldiers came walking down the street and the teacher quickly told all kids to hide under their desks. The reporter said "surely they won't harm you - they're just there as a sign of authority". So all the kids get out from under the desks and class continues while the soldiers are standing outside the school. Suddenly they opened fire at the school - right in front of the camera, a 6 year old girl got a bullet right in her head. None of the camera crew got harmed but several kids were badly wounded and a few were killed. Shocked, the reporter went over to the soldier who spouted racist bullshit, calling all Palestinians dogs & pigs & whatever and his colleague threatened the reporter to leave or he'd end up like the kids. This was in front of a CAMERA. God knows what else they pull off when there's none around.
That's just one of the many documentaries or amateur clips I've seen that show the real behavior of Israel soldiers. Palestinians are treated as scum and criminals everywhere they go. There's no way for any Palestinian kid to grow up not hating them because of what they see. Every check point is filled with soldiers throwing insults and threats at even old ladies and infants.
So yeah, they're just as bad really except they got bigger guns.
#43
JCM
Jesus, its amazing how you untraveled Fox viewers not only have never been there, but also dont seemto know anything about the region but whats spoonfed to you.
Isreal is as much in the wrong as Palestine here, I suggest selling the Xbox, HDTV and traveling there before talking blabber I've seen first-hand as BS propaganda, or reading a few history books.[/quote:e7im6rjh]
JCM, wanna take a guess as to where I was this summer? Untraveled my ass.[/quote:e7im6rjh]$50 its not Palestine, nor Beirut, and unless you've been to much of Middle East, Asia, Africa and Latin America, you're untraveled to me, just from your posts I can see you dont know anything about Israel, Kissinger or the whole realpoltik gamble that brought US into this Catch22 (damned if you support Isreal, damned if you dont)
But I love how you ran away from your BS, just as I was rounding up the border agreements, every single treaty broken by Israel and Red Cross' report, I really suggest traveling there, because from EXPERIENCE I know two people, one who think that Isreal have done no wrong, and those who have been to Palestine and seen the concentration camp-like existence they lead.
JCM
Both drawings are basically correct, heck, if you play them in sequence, one after another, its pretty much what happens there.Icarus said:Unfortunately the reality is often THIS:GasBandit said:Remember to keep the true distinction in mind.
Israel bombs buildings without being sure there's terrorists present. They've killed families of terrorists including babies, they've opened fire on schools killing children for no reason, they have blown kids to pieces for throwing rocks, etc. etc. etc.
Heck, a few years back there was a documentary and the reporter went to visit the school. A few infantry soldiers came walking down the street and the teacher quickly told all kids to hide under their desks. The reporter said "surely they won't harm you - they're just there as a sign of authority". So all the kids get out from under the desks and class continues while the soldiers are standing outside the school. Suddenly they opened fire at the school - right in front of the camera, a 6 year old girl got a bullet right in her head. None of the camera crew got harmed but several kids were badly wounded and a few were killed. Shocked, the reporter went over to the soldier who spouted racist bullshit, calling all Palestinians dogs & pigs & whatever and his colleague threatened the reporter to leave or he'd end up like the kids. This was in front of a CAMERA. God knows what else they pull off when there's none around.
That's just one of the many documentaries or amateur clips I've seen that show the real behavior of Israel soldiers. Palestinians are treated as scum and criminals everywhere they go. There's no way for any Palestinian kid to grow up not hating them because of what they see. Every check point is filled with soldiers throwing insults and threats at even old ladies and infants.
So yeah, they're just as bad really except they got bigger guns.
Check again.blotsfan said:
BS again. They sat down and talked ONCE, with Clinton, then refused to give back more than 30% of occupied land, and to let a Palestinian state be declared officially, the two biggest talking point.
Jesus, its amazing how you untraveled Fox viewers not only have never been there, but also dont seemto know anything about the region but whats spoonfed to you.
Isreal is as much in the wrong as Palestine here, I suggest selling the Xbox, HDTV and traveling there before talking blabber I've seen first-hand as BS propaganda, or reading a few history books.[/quote:e7im6rjh]
JCM, wanna take a guess as to where I was this summer? Untraveled my ass.[/quote:e7im6rjh]$50 its not Palestine, nor Beirut, and unless you've been to much of Middle East, Asia, Africa and Latin America, you're untraveled to me, just from your posts I can see you dont know anything about Israel, Kissinger or the whole realpoltik gamble that brought US into this Catch22 (damned if you support Isreal, damned if you dont)
But I love how you ran away from your BS, just as I was rounding up the border agreements, every single treaty broken by Israel and Red Cross' report, I really suggest traveling there, because from EXPERIENCE I know two people, one who think that Isreal have done no wrong, and those who have been to Palestine and seen the concentration camp-like existence they lead.
#44
Bubble181
Bubble181
#45
JCM
JCM
#46
Mr_Chaz
Mr_Chaz
#47
Sparhawk
Sparhawk
#51
Shawn
Shawn
#52
Dusty668
Dusty668
#57
JCM
JCM
#58
GasBandit
After all, look what a bang-up job their presence did of keeping the Rwandans from ethnically cleansing the shit out of each other.
GasBandit
The issue is not what *I* have done, as I am not being touted as a solution to the middle east conflict. The UN is a great "humanitarian" provider, sure. But that's not what you're talking about. It's not so great a "peacekeeper." In fact, it's largely useless before and during conflict. Billions in food and medicine won't stop belligerents from riddling each other with 7.62 millimeter holes, and it's been shown that to an entity determined to cause carnage, a UN presence means exactly dick.JCM said:I forgot, Fox news only shows the occasional corruption, and never shows billions in food, medicine and educational aid given,nor millions of lives saved.
While the UN is not perfect, it has done more humanitarian work than any other organization, and has saved much more than anyone (with the Red Cross a close second). What have you done for humanity, may I ask?
After all, look what a bang-up job their presence did of keeping the Rwandans from ethnically cleansing the shit out of each other.
#59
JCM
I'm not even going to talk about conflicts avoided through diplomacy and trade agreements, and as usual, here's a nice list to awaken the Fox crowd-
UN peacekeeping missions in Africa
1960–1964 United Nations Operation in the Congo (ONUC)
1988–1991 United Nations Angola Verification Mission I
1989–1990 United Nations Transition Assistance Group Namibia
1991–1995 United Nations Angola Verification Mission II
1992–1994 United Nations Operation in Mozambique (
1992–1993 United Nations Operation in Somalia I
1993–1997 United Nations Observer Mission in Liberia
1993–1994 United Nations Observer Mission Uganda-Rwanda
1993–1996 United Nations Assistance Mission for Rwanda
1993–1995 United Nations Operation in Somalia II
1994 United Nations Aouzou Strip Observer Group in Libya
1995–1997 United Nations Angola Verification Mission III
1997–1999 United Nations Observer Mission in Angola
1998–1999 United Nations Observer Mission in Sierra Leone
1998–2000 United Nations Mission in the Central African Republic
1999–2005 United Nations Mission in Sierra Leone (UNAMSIL)
2000–2008 United Nations Mission in Ethiopia and Eritrea
2004–2007 United Nations Operation in Burundi (ONUB)
Peacekeeping in the Americas
1965–1966 Mission of the Representative of the Secretary-General in the Dominican Republic
1989–1992 United Nations Observer Group in Central America (ONUCA)
1991–1995 United Nations Observer Mission in El Salvador
1993–1996 United Nations Mission in Haiti
1996–1997 United Nations Support Mission in Haiti
1997 United Nations Verification Mission in Guatemala
1997 United Nations Transition Mission in Haiti (UNTMIH)
1997–2000 United Nations Civilian Police Mission in Haiti (MIPONUH)
2000–2001 United Nations General Assembly International Civilian Support Mission in Haiti (MICAH)
Peacekeeping in Asia
1962–1963 United Nations Security Force in West New Guinea (UNSF)
1965–1966 United Nations India-Pakistan Observation Mission (UNIPOM)
1988–1990 United Nations Good Offices Mission in Afghanistan and Pakistan (UNGOMAP)
1991–1992 United Nations Advance Mission in Cambodia (UNAMIC)
1992–1993 United Nations Transitional Authority in Cambodia (UNTAC)
1994–2000 United Nations Mission of Observers in Tajikistan (UNMOT)
1999 United Nations Mission in East Timor (UNAMET)
1999–2002 The United Nations Transitional Administration in East Timor (UNTAET)
2002–2005 United Nations Mission of Support in East Timor (UNMISET)
Peacekeeping in Europe
1992–1995 United Nations Protection Force (UNPROFOR)
1994–1996 United Nations Confidence Restoration Operation (UNCRO)
1995–2002 United Nations Mission in Bosnia and Herzegovina (UNMIBH)
1995–1999 United Nations Preventive Deployment Force (UNPREDEP)
1996–1998 United Nations Transitional Authority in Eastern Slavonia, Baranja and Western Sirmium (UNTAES)
1996–2002 United Nations Mission of Observers in Prevlaka (UNMOP)
1998 United Nations Civilian Police Support Group (UNPSG)
Peacekeeping in the Middle East
1956–1967 First United Nations Emergency Force (UNEF I)
1958 United Nations Observation Group in Lebanon (UNOGIL)
1962–1964 United Nations Yemen Observation Mission (UNYOM)
1973–1979 Second United Nations Emergency Force (UNEF II)
1988–1991 United Nations Iran-Iraq Military Observer Group (UNIIMOG)
1991–2003 United Nations Iraq-Kuwait Observation Mission (UNIKOM)
Mind you, there'd be more in the Middle East if USA didn't veto any mission, may it be peacekeeping or humanitarian, by the UN, to Palestine, Lebanon or Israel.
Missions in place right now, avoiding conflict as we speak, and the date of initiation-
1948 United Nations Truce Supervision Organization (UNTSO) Egypt
1949 United Nations Military Observer Group in India and Pakistan (UNMOGIP) yes, until today, UN is there
1974 United Nations Disengagement Observer Force (UNDOF) Golan Heights
1978 United Nations Interim Force in Lebanon (UNIFIL) Funnily Israel killed many peacekeepers there
1964 United Nations Peacekeeping Force in Cyprus (UNFICYP)
1991 United Nations Mission for the Referendum in Western Sahara (MINURSO)
1993 United Nations Observer Mission in Georgia (UNOMIG)
1999 United Nations Interim Administration Mission in Kosovo (UNMIK)
1999 United Nations Organization Mission in the Democratic Republic of the Congo (MONUC)
2003 United Nations Mission in Liberia (UNMIL)
2004 United Nations Operation in Côte d'Ivoire (UNOCI)
2004 United Nations Stabilization Mission in Haiti (MINUSTAH)
2005 United Nations Mission in the Sudan (UNMIS)
2006 United Nations Integrated Mission in Timor-Leste (UNMIT)
2007 United Nations/African Union Mission in Darfur (UNAMID)
2007 United Nations Mission in the Central African Republic and Chad (MINURCAT)
So again Gasbandit,I say on UN's track record, its not perfect, but it will have a better success than the current USA policy, and again, Gas, what have you done for humanity?
JCM
Its not being touted as THE solution, but a better solution than US losing face over and over as it agrees with whatever shit Israel comes up with. And UN, as flawed as it is, has stopped more wars and conflict, and helped more people than ANY government or group.GasBandit said:The issue is not what *I* have done, as I am not being touted as a solution to the middle east conflict.JCM said:I forgot, Fox news only shows the occasional corruption, and never shows billions in food, medicine and educational aid given,nor millions of lives saved.
While the UN is not perfect, it has done more humanitarian work than any other organization, and has saved much more than anyone (with the Red Cross a close second). What have you done for humanity, may I ask?
As I said, Fox news will slam Sudan, Rwanda and Timor, and the viewers forget that UN has had over 200 missions, with high profile successes in all-out wars like Suez Canal conflict, Hindo-Pakistani conflict, the Six Day war, Korea and Gulf War I, and even in the case of Rwanda, much more bloodshed would've happened without UN there. Most African missions were successful, democracies allowed to be established, and even in the unsuccessful one much bloodshed was avoided and refugees were helped, and police forces were trained, and overall in the world outside Africa and Timor, UN has had a pretty good track record of maintaining peace
I'm not even going to talk about conflicts avoided through diplomacy and trade agreements, and as usual, here's a nice list to awaken the Fox crowd-
UN peacekeeping missions in Africa
1960–1964 United Nations Operation in the Congo (ONUC)
1988–1991 United Nations Angola Verification Mission I
1989–1990 United Nations Transition Assistance Group Namibia
1991–1995 United Nations Angola Verification Mission II
1992–1994 United Nations Operation in Mozambique (
1992–1993 United Nations Operation in Somalia I
1993–1997 United Nations Observer Mission in Liberia
1993–1994 United Nations Observer Mission Uganda-Rwanda
1993–1996 United Nations Assistance Mission for Rwanda
1993–1995 United Nations Operation in Somalia II
1994 United Nations Aouzou Strip Observer Group in Libya
1995–1997 United Nations Angola Verification Mission III
1997–1999 United Nations Observer Mission in Angola
1998–1999 United Nations Observer Mission in Sierra Leone
1998–2000 United Nations Mission in the Central African Republic
1999–2005 United Nations Mission in Sierra Leone (UNAMSIL)
2000–2008 United Nations Mission in Ethiopia and Eritrea
2004–2007 United Nations Operation in Burundi (ONUB)
Peacekeeping in the Americas
1965–1966 Mission of the Representative of the Secretary-General in the Dominican Republic
1989–1992 United Nations Observer Group in Central America (ONUCA)
1991–1995 United Nations Observer Mission in El Salvador
1993–1996 United Nations Mission in Haiti
1996–1997 United Nations Support Mission in Haiti
1997 United Nations Verification Mission in Guatemala
1997 United Nations Transition Mission in Haiti (UNTMIH)
1997–2000 United Nations Civilian Police Mission in Haiti (MIPONUH)
2000–2001 United Nations General Assembly International Civilian Support Mission in Haiti (MICAH)
Peacekeeping in Asia
1962–1963 United Nations Security Force in West New Guinea (UNSF)
1965–1966 United Nations India-Pakistan Observation Mission (UNIPOM)
1988–1990 United Nations Good Offices Mission in Afghanistan and Pakistan (UNGOMAP)
1991–1992 United Nations Advance Mission in Cambodia (UNAMIC)
1992–1993 United Nations Transitional Authority in Cambodia (UNTAC)
1994–2000 United Nations Mission of Observers in Tajikistan (UNMOT)
1999 United Nations Mission in East Timor (UNAMET)
1999–2002 The United Nations Transitional Administration in East Timor (UNTAET)
2002–2005 United Nations Mission of Support in East Timor (UNMISET)
Peacekeeping in Europe
1992–1995 United Nations Protection Force (UNPROFOR)
1994–1996 United Nations Confidence Restoration Operation (UNCRO)
1995–2002 United Nations Mission in Bosnia and Herzegovina (UNMIBH)
1995–1999 United Nations Preventive Deployment Force (UNPREDEP)
1996–1998 United Nations Transitional Authority in Eastern Slavonia, Baranja and Western Sirmium (UNTAES)
1996–2002 United Nations Mission of Observers in Prevlaka (UNMOP)
1998 United Nations Civilian Police Support Group (UNPSG)
Peacekeeping in the Middle East
1956–1967 First United Nations Emergency Force (UNEF I)
1958 United Nations Observation Group in Lebanon (UNOGIL)
1962–1964 United Nations Yemen Observation Mission (UNYOM)
1973–1979 Second United Nations Emergency Force (UNEF II)
1988–1991 United Nations Iran-Iraq Military Observer Group (UNIIMOG)
1991–2003 United Nations Iraq-Kuwait Observation Mission (UNIKOM)
Mind you, there'd be more in the Middle East if USA didn't veto any mission, may it be peacekeeping or humanitarian, by the UN, to Palestine, Lebanon or Israel.
Missions in place right now, avoiding conflict as we speak, and the date of initiation-
1948 United Nations Truce Supervision Organization (UNTSO) Egypt
1949 United Nations Military Observer Group in India and Pakistan (UNMOGIP) yes, until today, UN is there
1974 United Nations Disengagement Observer Force (UNDOF) Golan Heights
1978 United Nations Interim Force in Lebanon (UNIFIL) Funnily Israel killed many peacekeepers there
1964 United Nations Peacekeeping Force in Cyprus (UNFICYP)
1991 United Nations Mission for the Referendum in Western Sahara (MINURSO)
1993 United Nations Observer Mission in Georgia (UNOMIG)
1999 United Nations Interim Administration Mission in Kosovo (UNMIK)
1999 United Nations Organization Mission in the Democratic Republic of the Congo (MONUC)
2003 United Nations Mission in Liberia (UNMIL)
2004 United Nations Operation in Côte d'Ivoire (UNOCI)
2004 United Nations Stabilization Mission in Haiti (MINUSTAH)
2005 United Nations Mission in the Sudan (UNMIS)
2006 United Nations Integrated Mission in Timor-Leste (UNMIT)
2007 United Nations/African Union Mission in Darfur (UNAMID)
2007 United Nations Mission in the Central African Republic and Chad (MINURCAT)
So again Gasbandit,I say on UN's track record, its not perfect, but it will have a better success than the current USA policy, and again, Gas, what have you done for humanity?
#60
Mr_Chaz
Mr_Chaz
#61
GasBandit
[/quote:7t9oxn05] Hark, is that the "We haven't had a terrorist attack since 9/11 so Dubya must be doing great protecting against terrorism" argument I hear, from the other direction? They've done a grand job outside of the times they've screwed up royally because they were helpless when the shit really started to hit the fan? Ok. Thing is, more shit hits more fans on a daily basis on Israel/Palestine than (randomly picking from your voluminous list) Cyprus experiences in a decade. The UN is a *joke*. With a terrible punch line. Not to mention a great many members of the general assembly have great antipathy for Israel. How many pages would the UN's sternly worded disapproval letter to Iran be, when Iran finally gets around to making good on their threats and manages to lob something massively destructive to the Mediterranean? No, currently nobody but the US can prop them up.
And hang on just a sec there professor... are you giving the UN credit for Korea and Gulf War 1?
GasBandit
As I said, Fox news will slam Sudan, Rwanda and Timor, and the viewers forget that UN has had over 200 missions, with high profile successes in all-out wars like Suez Canal conflict, Hindo-Pakistani conflict, the Six Day war, Korea and Gulf War I, and even in the case of Rwanda, much more bloodshed would've happened without UN there. Most African missions were successful, democracies allowed to be established, and even in the unsuccessful one much bloodshed was avoided and refugees were helped, and police forces were trained, and overall in the world outside Africa and Timor, UN has had a pretty good track record of maintaining peaceJCM said:Its not being touted as THE solution, but a better solution than US losing face over and over as it agrees with whatever shit Israel comes up with. And UN, as flawed as it is, has stopped more wars and conflict, and helped more people than ANY government or group.GasBandit said:The issue is not what *I* have done, as I am not being touted as a solution to the middle east conflict.JCM said:I forgot, Fox news only shows the occasional corruption, and never shows billions in food, medicine and educational aid given,nor millions of lives saved.
While the UN is not perfect, it has done more humanitarian work than any other organization, and has saved much more than anyone (with the Red Cross a close second). What have you done for humanity, may I ask?
[quote:7t9oxn05]It's not so great a "peace keeper... blabla Rwanda
[/quote:7t9oxn05] Hark, is that the "We haven't had a terrorist attack since 9/11 so Dubya must be doing great protecting against terrorism" argument I hear, from the other direction? They've done a grand job outside of the times they've screwed up royally because they were helpless when the shit really started to hit the fan? Ok. Thing is, more shit hits more fans on a daily basis on Israel/Palestine than (randomly picking from your voluminous list) Cyprus experiences in a decade. The UN is a *joke*. With a terrible punch line. Not to mention a great many members of the general assembly have great antipathy for Israel. How many pages would the UN's sternly worded disapproval letter to Iran be, when Iran finally gets around to making good on their threats and manages to lob something massively destructive to the Mediterranean? No, currently nobody but the US can prop them up.
And hang on just a sec there professor... are you giving the UN credit for Korea and Gulf War 1?
Again with the meaningless and irrelevant "what have you done?" The choices are not "Put the UN in charge or buy Gas Bandit a plane ticket to Tel Aviv." Unless by "you" you mean the United States, in which case the question is laughable seeing as how we're the most charitable, most foreign-aid giving nation on the planet.
#62
JCM
JCM
#63
JCM
JCM
Oh, and just to top it off, lets also remember that US asked to lead he UN coalition in Korea during the time of communism fear-mongering, and that the USA's participation came with some very lucrative oil incentives from Kuwait and Saudi Arabia (not to mention the free Kuwait advertising campaign in the US paid by the Kuwaiti government itself)
(not to mention the free Kuwait advertising campaign in the US paid by the Kuwaiti government itself)
#64
Tinwhistler
Tinwhistler
#65
Singularity.EXE
Singularity.EXE
I always enjoy these threads with JCM because they are so gosh-darned educational.
#66
GasBandit
[/quote:34h1meaf]
FAUX NEWS! *click* FAUX NEWS! *click* FAUX NEWS! *click* WHAARGARBL!
If the arab world was REALLY concerned with the plight of the palestinian refugees, they would have absorbed them instead of basically forcefully rejecting them just so they'd have a neverending excuse to hate Israel, at the expense of palestinian lives and poverty.
GasBandit
You cited success on UN Peacekeeping by quoting them keeping peace in quite a number of places, many about as dangerous as the half foot of space under my bed. That's what the comparison to bush's defense vs terrorism was about. Cypress? Come ON man. Not only that, but you also put such lovely successes as BOSNIA, AFGHANISTAN, and other things that flew apart badly?JCM said:
Right when the UN was barely formed and people still thought it had some actual power, you mean?
Let me guess, Fox tells you that US went alone on a horse with a six-shooter, and there weren't many others that died for that peace?
[/quote:34h1meaf]
FAUX NEWS! *click* FAUX NEWS! *click* FAUX NEWS! *click* WHAARGARBL!
Go study the numbers of troops and materiel provided by each of those lovely coalition members, and ask yourself which one was the one that it was absolutely most crucial to the effort. That wasn't the UN, that was America with the UN coming in on the coattails.
I love how you left the US out of that list of yours... with their 480,000 troops.
Well, it would have been kind of silly for the Koreans to sit their own war out, now wouldn't it have?
And how fortunate we were to have those token 11 Luxembourgains... they really turned the tide. Seriouly, all those together add up to 39,411. Less than 10% of the US commitment to the fight. It's a nice show of solidarity and all, but that's all it was... for show.
AHA! Nice try to subtly change what you were advocating! Permanent AMERICAN bases SANCTIONED by the UN now, not just American support! How is that different? It's just slapping a UN bumper sticker on American tanks and letting them go from proxy war support mode to direct conflict on the ground... but then I guess that's pretty much what the UN always does when something is a success for them, isn't it?
Avoids answering[/quote:34h1meaf] I didn't avoid answering, you asked an irrelevant question and I tried to answer the only way I could think of it having any relevancy at all. What I, Gas Bandit "have done for humanity" is completely disconnected from this discussion. Answer ME how this question has any bearing. If you come back and you say "I meant what has the US done," I did answer that and even provided links.
May I compare that with your military spending,[/quote:34h1meaf]Which is again, an irrelevant comparison. Or even worse, damaging to your own position since it has been shown that american military spending has been what has given the UN what you claim to be its greatest successes.
Ok, you got us. We're evil. I guess that means we should just stop donating more to charity than the rest of the world combined, and stop giving more than twice the amount in foreign aid than any other country... and get back to cackling as we wring our hands, set up puppet dictators and siphon oil from dead babies.
See, here you're pulling a double whammy. You're backpedalling again from "a permanent UN presence" to a "permanent UN-sanctioned U.S. Base" which is a different matter entirely. Not only that, but you're mischaracterizing US policy. It's not "let Israel and Palestine blow each other up," it's "let Israel defend itself as it sees fit, with the support of the United States." But then the entire (largely antisemitic) world screams "overreaction" and the US has to go put its arm around Israel's shoulder and say "Look buddy, I know this is a big load of bullshit and that you're only defending yourself, but just so everybody will shut up and we can all get along, can you just turn the other cheek on this for once?" It's happened over and over again... and I guess both the US and Israel are sick of it.
If the arab world was REALLY concerned with the plight of the palestinian refugees, they would have absorbed them instead of basically forcefully rejecting them just so they'd have a neverending excuse to hate Israel, at the expense of palestinian lives and poverty.
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GasBandit
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Mr_Chaz
Mr_Chaz
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GasBandit
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JCM
I mention Bosnia, several civil wars and several African countries with ethnic genocide, and as usual, Gasbandit takes the weakest one, Greece, and focuses on that.
Gulf War? Again, I already noted, USA was asked by,and got some very lucrative rewards fro Kuwait and Saudi Arabia.
Got anything else, or are you going to babble about Cyrus out of 200 conflicts, where 2 thousand UN troopers died, not because of oil or installing petty dictators, or are you going to tell us how is a UN base, or a UN-sanctioned American base, in any way a bad strategy?
Because in the end, UN did more good, and has stopped a few civil wars, aided with much humanitarian aid, managed a few treaties and stopped a few wars and although its not powerful as people think, has managed to save more lives than the typical republican worms will ever save.
JCM
You just found an image explaining your entire post.GasBandit said:
I mention Bosnia, several civil wars and several African countries with ethnic genocide, and as usual, Gasbandit takes the weakest one, Greece, and focuses on that.
Yes, as I noted above, the Korean war was during USA's "kill all communist" phase, remember Myanmar, Vietnam and Afghanistan? They are still fucked from the effects of USA's anti-communist stance.
Gulf War? Again, I already noted, USA was asked by,and got some very lucrative rewards fro Kuwait and Saudi Arabia.
Got anything else, or are you going to babble about Cyrus out of 200 conflicts, where 2 thousand UN troopers died, not because of oil or installing petty dictators, or are you going to tell us how is a UN base, or a UN-sanctioned American base, in any way a bad strategy?
Because in the end, UN did more good, and has stopped a few civil wars, aided with much humanitarian aid, managed a few treaties and stopped a few wars and although its not powerful as people think, has managed to save more lives than the typical republican worms will ever save.
#71
Espy
Espy
Are they?Singularity.EXE said:I always enjoy these threads with JCM because they are so gosh-darned educational.
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GasBandit
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Bubble181
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JCM
JCM
Seeing Im talking facts, while the kiddies are just babbling about how USA and Isreal are bleeding white vestal virgins who are always disturbed by big bad UN and Palestine, I guess yeah :heythere:
Maybe you can tell me why a UN base,or a UN-sanctioned US base there is a bad thing, since ewok there is raving about how UN is evil because he thinks Greece and Rwanda is all they did?
Can you, espy?
Is their power limited? Yes. Can they declare war anytime? Nope, you'd be amazed how hard it is to get anything done, however, they have done much good.
You haven't shown ANYTHING that shows that a UN base, or US base with the UN, would be in any way worse than the current situation, I know that your view is the far right, but can you show us how is that in any way worse than today's Israeli situation?
I really suggest sending these guys back to school and history 101, and only return when they can explain the tribal differences in Africa, the Sunni-Shiite struggle, or all the effects from Kissinger's realpolitik or Truman's docrine.
Between removing democratically-elected leaders and installing puppets, supporting guerrilla groups, providing weapons to Middle eastern dictators like Saddam and the Ayatollah and the whole Iraq fiasco, to supporting Israel 100% no matter how many human rights are broken, USA hasn't shown much moral higher ground, and its laughable to hear you pots calling the kettles black.
Where is that broken record image again, its tiring hearing this "UN bad! Only USA good!" crap over and over.
Now, can anyone tell me how in any way in a UN base/UN-sanctioned US permanent base worse than the current situation, or are you guys keep feeding me O'Reilly talking points?
Maybe you can tell me why a UN base,or a UN-sanctioned US base there is a bad thing, since ewok there is raving about how UN is evil because he thinks Greece and Rwanda is all they did?
Can you, espy?
Nobody is touting Un as perfect Gas, however your warped "Greece! Rwanda!" view is a bot too far from reality, ignoring altogether truces by UN that have lasted until today, like Egypt, or the Hindo-Pakistani one, and the fact that they have helped most of the time.Gasbandit said:
Is their power limited? Yes. Can they declare war anytime? Nope, you'd be amazed how hard it is to get anything done, however, they have done much good.
You haven't shown ANYTHING that shows that a UN base, or US base with the UN, would be in any way worse than the current situation, I know that your view is the far right, but can you show us how is that in any way worse than today's Israeli situation?
I but try to correct the rewriting of history so favored by the Fox-viewing side, like the "Bill Clinton cause Sept 11" myth (guess what, he tried to declare state of emergency, and had many bills trying to shut Alqaeda down shot down by the republicans, and it was Clinton's people who were the last ones warning against Sept 11 before Bush fired them), I find the "UN has done no good" crap propagated by the right after the UN didn't accept the Iraq War as ridiculous.Singularity.EXE said:I always enjoy these threads with JCM because they are so gosh-darned educational.
I really suggest sending these guys back to school and history 101, and only return when they can explain the tribal differences in Africa, the Sunni-Shiite struggle, or all the effects from Kissinger's realpolitik or Truman's docrine.
Corrected that for you.Futureking said:
Between removing democratically-elected leaders and installing puppets, supporting guerrilla groups, providing weapons to Middle eastern dictators like Saddam and the Ayatollah and the whole Iraq fiasco, to supporting Israel 100% no matter how many human rights are broken, USA hasn't shown much moral higher ground, and its laughable to hear you pots calling the kettles black.
Where is that broken record image again, its tiring hearing this "UN bad! Only USA good!" crap over and over.
Now, can anyone tell me how in any way in a UN base/UN-sanctioned US permanent base worse than the current situation, or are you guys keep feeding me O'Reilly talking points?
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Mr_Chaz
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Iaculus
There was a rather good cartoon on it at the time:
Admittedly, the global political climate has changed a fair bit since then, but the U.S. is still a very powerful country.
Iaculus
Check out what happened with the League of Nations, which failed largely due to its lack of U.S. involvement.Mr_Chaz said:
There was a rather good cartoon on it at the time:
Admittedly, the global political climate has changed a fair bit since then, but the U.S. is still a very powerful country.
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269, but yes, it seems it did.
Note: My removed paragraph above was about how the US influence on foreign nations outside the UN is true, but not necessarily good. And referenced calls for Blair to be tried for War Crimes. Hence JCM's post. Just to clear that up, so no one can accuse JCM of random attacks on Bush, it was more my fault.
Note: My removed paragraph above was about how the US influence on foreign nations outside the UN is true, but not necessarily good. And referenced calls for Blair to be tried for War Crimes. Hence JCM's post. Just to clear that up, so no one can accuse JCM of random attacks on Bush, it was more my fault.
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Kitty Sinatra
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Mr_Chaz
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JCM
Yes, the US has sent a large number of troops to the peace-keeping forces. That's true. You seem to be suggesting though that only the US could have done. As if other countries have committed their entire armed forces and there still just aren't really enough troops. I know, let's invite the US. Well, no, that's not quite right. It's called distribution. It means spreading things around. If the US weren't involved in a UN operation and more troops were required the UN wouldn't just be stuck.
[Edit: I'm off to bed, nice chatting with y'all, it's been fun][/quote:8af4ra2a]This.
A I noted, and if anyone cared to check REALITY (nicely linked) there are about 40 ongoing UN peacekeeping missions, many NOT led by US, and many without a US majority.
But then (and mind me, I'll requote this everytime the Fox crowd does this) the only defense they have is to focus on 3 bad peacekeeping missions out of dozens, or point out that in two missions US had a bigger %, and again, ignore the fact that UN has STOPPED several conflicts, many UN treaties between countries lasted until today, and that even in most fucked-up cases like Civil War, UN still has managed to do a difference. But expect the "America, fuck yeah" crowd to do exactly this, and we'll see the conversation below over and over as Gasbandit repeats my talking points.
Corrected that for you.
And please, whining about me using my talking points (Israel will die if US backs off? Said that two pages back) and pretending to be blind (unable to read US permanent base in Israel, with UN backing) to run away from the fact that UN did have many successful missions, and some of them *GASP!* did not have an American majority, and that US policy worked best when it backed UN, which it helped create for this very purpose?
Sadly republicans, post-Iraq, like to pretend that UN can only exist because of the US, yes, its it probably provides 10%-20% of UN's total manpower and funding, but its amusing to see people pretend that UN couldn't have handled a peacekeeping without the US, when US hasn't been in every UN peacekeeping mission.
Let US go back to the pre-Bush days and actually work with UN on Israel, or keep hearing that broken record of UN BAD! US GOOD! over and over in this thread. :heythere:
JCM
Okay, evidence might not be the best word. Fair point, if a bit nitpicky. I suppose theoretical examples would be more appropriate. Suggestions of why only US decisions within the UN are of any importance.Mr_Chaz said:
Yes, the US has sent a large number of troops to the peace-keeping forces. That's true. You seem to be suggesting though that only the US could have done. As if other countries have committed their entire armed forces and there still just aren't really enough troops. I know, let's invite the US. Well, no, that's not quite right. It's called distribution. It means spreading things around. If the US weren't involved in a UN operation and more troops were required the UN wouldn't just be stuck.
[Edit: I'm off to bed, nice chatting with y'all, it's been fun][/quote:8af4ra2a]This.
A I noted, and if anyone cared to check REALITY (nicely linked) there are about 40 ongoing UN peacekeeping missions, many NOT led by US, and many without a US majority.
But then (and mind me, I'll requote this everytime the Fox crowd does this) the only defense they have is to focus on 3 bad peacekeeping missions out of dozens, or point out that in two missions US had a bigger %, and again, ignore the fact that UN has STOPPED several conflicts, many UN treaties between countries lasted until today, and that even in most fucked-up cases like Civil War, UN still has managed to do a difference. But expect the "America, fuck yeah" crowd to do exactly this, and we'll see the conversation below over and over as Gasbandit repeats my talking points.
Gasbandit said:JCM: America needs to stop VETOING every UN resolution, and let the UN go in and handle it.
GB: UN bad!
JCM: Nope- *lists humanitarian aid and avoided onflicts*
GB: But UN bad!
JCM: Read again, it isn't that bad, and what have you done that any better?
GB: I will repeat what JCM said on page one and say "without American support, Israel is doomed. Without America, the UN won't be able to stop violence of this magnitude."
JCM: A-duh Ewok, I said UN bases or a US permanent base with UN support.
GB: UN Bad!!! Only US good!!
JCM: Nobody says UN will do it without USA dumbass. But let Un handle it, and establish a UN/US base like Korea/Kuwait
GB: But UN bases baaaad US good! Rwanda!
JCM: Nope, UN has done some good, *puts huge list, including hindo-pakistani peace settlement, Suez canal, Haiti*
GB: UN Baaaad, US good! UN only handles Cyrus!
JCM: Nope, UN has done more than that, *again explains huge list, including hindo-pakistani peace settlement, Suez canal, Haiti*
GB: Korean war and Gulf not UN! UN Baaaad! US good!
JCM: Err, they were two out of many peacekeeping UN resolutions, with many others having been led by other countries, like Brazil in Haiti.
GB: But two had 95% and 73% American troops! UN baaad! US good!
JCM: Err, two out of how many missions? *posts link to many missions, and countries that helped*
GB: US gives money!! UN baaaad!
JCM: US also places dictators,cause much bloodshed and should act with UN if it wants to have any face
GB: UN Baaad! US good!
JCM: Now tell me why in any way this can be bad, to have a UN base, or an UN-sanctioned US base there?
GB: UN Baaad! US good!
JCM: Even though every poster has agreed that US cant do this alone? And that most missions were succesful?
GB: UN Baaad! US good!
JCM: *sigh*
GB:
Nevermind facts. Nevermind more than 3/4 of UN aid comes from other countries.
UN BAAAAAAAD! US GOOOD
Corrected that for you.
And please, whining about me using my talking points (Israel will die if US backs off? Said that two pages back) and pretending to be blind (unable to read US permanent base in Israel, with UN backing) to run away from the fact that UN did have many successful missions, and some of them *GASP!* did not have an American majority, and that US policy worked best when it backed UN, which it helped create for this very purpose?
Agreed.Gruebeard said:
Sadly republicans, post-Iraq, like to pretend that UN can only exist because of the US, yes, its it probably provides 10%-20% of UN's total manpower and funding, but its amusing to see people pretend that UN couldn't have handled a peacekeeping without the US, when US hasn't been in every UN peacekeeping mission.
Let US go back to the pre-Bush days and actually work with UN on Israel, or keep hearing that broken record of UN BAD! US GOOD! over and over in this thread. :heythere:
#90
blotsfan
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Iaculus
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JCM
JCM
Right, and 2-year blockades, cutting of water, electricity and humanitarian aid isnt killing anyone, nor making 1.5 million suffer in misery?
We all know Hamas has no good in them, and they are as bad as any other terrorist group, but why dont you read the past 3 pages and all the shit Isreal did before trying to sugarcoat Isreal, because believe me, its as morally bad as Hamas, unless you consider killing a few Isrealis worse than collectively punishing 1.5 million for two years, making them live in misery with virtually no electricity, clean water or medicine, causing god knows how much death and sickness.
Again, read thread, and all links posted on Israel's shit, before making us laugh telling us that Israel is in any way better,unless you're Gasbandit, then UN is EVIL! and Israel, US and Bush are so awesome, maybe we will find WMDs there too and all that crap.
The same Israal that didn't end a blockade that lasted two years into Gaza, which has cut down medicine supplies, food, and almost killed of any commerce within Gaza, and has had 12 UN resolutions condemning it for its human rights abuse in the last 2 years drawn up (vetoed by US of course)?blotsfan said:
We all know Hamas has no good in them, and they are as bad as any other terrorist group, but why dont you read the past 3 pages and all the shit Isreal did before trying to sugarcoat Isreal, because believe me, its as morally bad as Hamas, unless you consider killing a few Isrealis worse than collectively punishing 1.5 million for two years, making them live in misery with virtually no electricity, clean water or medicine, causing god knows how much death and sickness.
Again, read thread, and all links posted on Israel's shit, before making us laugh telling us that Israel is in any way better,unless you're Gasbandit, then UN is EVIL! and Israel, US and Bush are so awesome, maybe we will find WMDs there too and all that crap.
#95
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Iaculus
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Mr_Chaz
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GasBandit
GasBandit
Heh, we're truly through the looking glass when I'm providing accuracy and JCM's going full bore ad-hominem 
I love how all these mistakes and complete and utter blunders are suddenly minority examples of minor consequence when they were major quibbles pages ago. You've combined your favorite standbys, "ignoring what the other guy posted and repeating yourself" and "editing quotes to make a grammar school 'this is you: blaaagh blablabla' insult" with some other fun tactics... slowly changing your position over the course of the entire thread so that no matter what somebody comes back with, you can have a quote making it look like they weren't paying attention and they agreed with you.
Your positions have mutated from "let them blow each other away" to "the US should stop propping them up and let the UN take care of everything" to "the US should put permanent bases there, oh with UN approval of course." No wonder I sound like a broken record to you, since I haven't changed my stance whereas you have claimed every position so you can oppose every position! And I thought I liked to argue!
Along the way you make indefensible claims and then abandon them when they're challenged, employ falsehood by omission, and of course, grandstand to blinkered eurotrash who are all too eager to bandwagon on with the america-bashing and overlook the gaping swiss-cheese holes in your assertions because UHMURRICA BAD! :roll: I know you like to pretend to knowledgeability and post your information flood lists which disintegrate under scrutiny, but that last list was particularly pathetic. And all the while, throwing around the "Fox news" epithet so the peanut gallery will think "yeah! YEAH! Fox news SUCKS! I like this guy!"
And you still haven't even addressed the point I made about how the other middle eastern countries would consider permanent US bases to be the mask slipping off "another infidel crusade." I'm not even sure the American public would go for the idea, personally. Especially if it was advanced by the current hypocritical party in charge... can't you just hear the pundits now? "When we went into Iraq, they kept bleating about an exit strategy and a time table... NOW, they don't even bother to pretend there will be either!"
I love how all these mistakes and complete and utter blunders are suddenly minority examples of minor consequence when they were major quibbles pages ago. You've combined your favorite standbys, "ignoring what the other guy posted and repeating yourself" and "editing quotes to make a grammar school 'this is you: blaaagh blablabla' insult" with some other fun tactics... slowly changing your position over the course of the entire thread so that no matter what somebody comes back with, you can have a quote making it look like they weren't paying attention and they agreed with you.Your positions have mutated from "let them blow each other away" to "the US should stop propping them up and let the UN take care of everything" to "the US should put permanent bases there, oh with UN approval of course." No wonder I sound like a broken record to you, since I haven't changed my stance whereas you have claimed every position so you can oppose every position! And I thought I liked to argue!
Along the way you make indefensible claims and then abandon them when they're challenged, employ falsehood by omission, and of course, grandstand to blinkered eurotrash who are all too eager to bandwagon on with the america-bashing and overlook the gaping swiss-cheese holes in your assertions because UHMURRICA BAD! :roll: I know you like to pretend to knowledgeability and post your information flood lists which disintegrate under scrutiny, but that last list was particularly pathetic. And all the while, throwing around the "Fox news" epithet so the peanut gallery will think "yeah! YEAH! Fox news SUCKS! I like this guy!"
And you still haven't even addressed the point I made about how the other middle eastern countries would consider permanent US bases to be the mask slipping off "another infidel crusade." I'm not even sure the American public would go for the idea, personally. Especially if it was advanced by the current hypocritical party in charge... can't you just hear the pundits now? "When we went into Iraq, they kept bleating about an exit strategy and a time table... NOW, they don't even bother to pretend there will be either!"
#100
JCM
Pathetic BS, really-
My position, from page 1, hasnt changed, as I said-
a) They can blow themselves away for all I care, if Isreal wont stop abusing the human rights of 1.5 million and using US to veto 12 resolutions against such abuses, and the Palestinians wont stop supporting terrorists
b) The only viable solution now is a UN permanent base, or ala Korea/Kuwait, a permanent US base sanctioned by the UN (due to the US not having the trust from Arab world and allowing Isreal´s human rights abuse, and due to the Arab world wanting to destroy Israel, both wont be able to act well by themselves).
Oh, and just in case if someone suggests E.U. as a middleman, forget it, USA and UN run laps around it in competence.
EDIT: Great, two brazilians there are reporting invasions of homes and shooting into markets. My guess is that there will be videos circulating of it, and of the families and close ups of dead children on Al JAzeera all day long; god Arabic new channels suck.
JCM
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:GasBandit said:I didnt read the thread. And as usual
UN BASE BAAAD! US GOOOD!
Pathetic BS, really-
My position, from page 1, hasnt changed, as I said-
a) They can blow themselves away for all I care, if Isreal wont stop abusing the human rights of 1.5 million and using US to veto 12 resolutions against such abuses, and the Palestinians wont stop supporting terrorists
b) The only viable solution now is a UN permanent base, or ala Korea/Kuwait, a permanent US base sanctioned by the UN (due to the US not having the trust from Arab world and allowing Isreal´s human rights abuse, and due to the Arab world wanting to destroy Israel, both wont be able to act well by themselves).
Oh, and just in case if someone suggests E.U. as a middleman, forget it, USA and UN run laps around it in competence.
Err, thats what they did for over 50 years, go through a heavily-guarded route thorugh Isreal, before Isreal decided to collectively punish 1.5 million in Gaza and let them live without sanitation, proper water or electricity for 2 years over some kidnapped soldiers.Mr_Chaz said:
Its PR, because a) it just blew up a hospital and two UN schools yesterday, live, on brasilian TV, and b) you have shitload of aid just waiting for Isreal to allow it to come, but as UN as usual is probably breaking every human right, they as hell dont want UN snooping around there, nor the media, thus the attempt at the media blackout.Mr_Chaz said:
EDIT: Great, two brazilians there are reporting invasions of homes and shooting into markets. My guess is that there will be videos circulating of it, and of the families and close ups of dead children on Al JAzeera all day long; god Arabic new channels suck.
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Denbrought
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Espy
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ElJuski
godbless google ads.
ElJuski
godbless google ads.
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Iaculus
Iaculus
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GasBandit
GasBandit
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Armadillo
Armadillo
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Yoink
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GasBandit
GasBandit
Whatever works for you. If you can't convince em, confuse em, eh Jon?JCM said:
#131
LordRendar
LordRendar
I know a couple of Jews and they are actually quite decent folks.Sometimes they are kinda stuck up,but those are rare moments.Same goes with my Muslim friends.
What I cant stand though are people who like to swing around their Religion/Nationality around like a Club.
Like some Turks I know who are like "Im from Turky and a Muslim,dont mess with me." And I usally reply "Im a guy and Im gonna punch your lights out,dosn't matter where I am from or who my God is." :humph:
Haven't met any Christian Zeots here in Germany yet,though quite a few in the Philippines,problem is that everyone on the Island was a Catholic,so they didn't really have anyone to call heathen swine.I did get whacked on the head by an old crone with an bag for kissing my Girlfriend in public though.
What I cant stand though are people who like to swing around their Religion/Nationality around like a Club.
Like some Turks I know who are like "Im from Turky and a Muslim,dont mess with me." And I usally reply "Im a guy and Im gonna punch your lights out,dosn't matter where I am from or who my God is." :humph:
Haven't met any Christian Zeots here in Germany yet,though quite a few in the Philippines,problem is that everyone on the Island was a Catholic,so they didn't really have anyone to call heathen swine.I did get whacked on the head by an old crone with an bag for kissing my Girlfriend in public though.
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Sparhawk
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Iaculus
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Troll
Troll
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Troll
Troll
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Hailey Knight
Hailey Knight
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Sparhawk
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Iaculus
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JCM
Its super-jew
Or is it "superjew"?
JCM
Nopeescushion said:
Its super-jew
Or is it "superjew"?
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Sparhawk
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#155
B
bhamv
B
bhamv
I have a feeling this one thread alone is enough for JCM to exceed my total postcount.
Oh well, it was fun having more posts than him while it lasted.
Oh well, it was fun having more posts than him while it lasted.
#156
Iaculus
Iaculus
Screw your postcount, what about mine?bhamv said:I have a feeling this one thread alone is enough for JCM to exceed my total postcount.
Oh well, it was fun having more posts than him while it lasted.
#157
JCM
Maybe if you guys got Invader here.
JCM
Nah, Gas just repeats the same talking points when you give him sources and backing up data, and that Catholic hater was too easy to prove wrong...Iaculus said:Screw your postcount, what about mine?bhamv said:I have a feeling this one thread alone is enough for JCM to exceed my total postcount.
Oh well, it was fun having more posts than him while it lasted.
Maybe if you guys got Invader here.
#159
Mr_Chaz
Mr_Chaz
#160
Iaculus
Iaculus
#161
ElJuski
ElJuski
#162
GasBandit
GasBandit
#163
JCM
JCM
#164
GasBandit
GasBandit
#165
North_Ranger
North_Ranger
#166
JCM
JCM
#167
blotsfan
blotsfan
#168
Twitch
Twitch
#169
Iaculus
Iaculus
#170
Hailey Knight
Hailey Knight
#171
aranoid:
Oh shit...now I'm afraid to go back and read it in case it doesn't make sense.escushion said:
aranoid:
#172
Twitch
Twitch
It will, trust me.ZenMonkey said:Oh shit...now I'm afraid to go back and read it in case it doesn't make sense.escushion said:
#173
Bubble181
Bubble181
#174
Espy
Espy
I think we should revoke JCM and Gasbandits ability to use the quote feature.
#175
Twitch
Twitch
#176
Bubble181
Bubble181
#177
Espy
Espy
#178
Bubble181
Bubble181
#179
Espy
Espy
#180
Bubble181
Bubble181
#181
Espy
Espy
#182
Bubble181
Bubble181
#183
Espy
Espy
#184
Bubble181
Pfft, you're american. You probably wouldn't taste the difference between what you call "beer" and my True Belgian Piss anyway.
*goes to get you a...beer*
Cheers
Bubble181
Espy said:
Pfft, you're american. You probably wouldn't taste the difference between what you call "beer" and my True Belgian Piss anyway.
*goes to get you a...beer*
Cheers
#185
Espy
Espy
Hmmm... tastes like bud light?Bubble181 said:Espy said:
Pfft, you're american. You probably wouldn't taste the difference between what you call "beer" and my True Belgian Piss anyway.
*goes to get you a...beer*
Cheers
#186
Bubble181
Dude, don't insult me! Perhaps Bud regular.
I mean, I've had a lot of water today,b ut not THAT much. I thought we were jsut having a laugh,but...man, that hurt :-(
Bubble181
Espy said:Hmmm... tastes like bud light?Bubble181 said:Espy said:
Pfft, you're american. You probably wouldn't taste the difference between what you call "beer" and my True Belgian Piss anyway.
*goes to get you a...beer*
Cheers
Dude, don't insult me! Perhaps Bud regular.
I mean, I've had a lot of water today,b ut not THAT much. I thought we were jsut having a laugh,but...man, that hurt :-(
#187
ElJuski
ElJuski
#188
Bubble181
Bubble181
#189
ElJuski
ElJuski
#190
blotsfan
blotsfan
#191
Bubble181
Bubble181
#192
JCM
JCM
#194
JCM
JCM
#195
#197
GasBandit
GasBandit
#198
TheBrew
TheBrew
#199
Armadillo
Armadillo
#200
ElJuski
ElJuski
#201
Armadillo
Armadillo
#202
JCM
Nobody here agreed with your position, and you havent even put foward anything but "US great, UN nothing, yeeehaw test weapons on palestinians" as a better solution.
pathetic X9
Since first quote, page 1
And also Israel´s choice of solution. :heythere: Again, only Gasbandit and Hamas don't want any peacekeeping there. And I know you untraveled Fox viewers (another nickel for the poor sob who can only post from work) cant think well, but NO PREVIOUS CEASEFIRES had a UN base installed there. Now any more BS for me to clean up?
JCM
Wow, again, just two cases, ignoring the Suez canal that remains open until today, Sina mountains disputes, trade agreements with the Arab countries post-Isreal that allowed US to get enough oil for its growth, treaties with Egypt that have lasted until today (even a semi-alliance with Israel, closing off Gaza borders on request of Israel), the Hindo-pakistani peace that lasts until today, the drastic reduction of deaths in Haiti etc, of course you are going to find some civil war or small peacekeeping mission in tribal Africa (which, by the way, is not under the UN charter, but something they do as well) to try and keep your little Bush sheep UNphobia, go ahead.GasBandit said:
Nobody here agreed with your position, and you havent even put foward anything but "US great, UN nothing, yeeehaw test weapons on palestinians" as a better solution.
pathetic X9
Bullshit.GasBandit said:
Since first quote, page 1
[Whether its a UN base ala Haiti, or a UN-sanctioned base ala Korea, its my solution since page 1, guess you've been looking for WMD´s so long that you are also starting seeing fictional mutations, but I´d be glad to re quote every post saying the same position just to emphasize how your bias somehow seems to be affecting your reading skills.JCM said:
And also Israel´s choice of solution. :heythere: Again, only Gasbandit and Hamas don't want any peacekeeping there. And I know you untraveled Fox viewers (another nickel for the poor sob who can only post from work) cant think well, but NO PREVIOUS CEASEFIRES had a UN base installed there. Now any more BS for me to clean up?
Heh, its a pity the pvp image forum was wiped, you´d have loved the "All Muslims are terrorists" threads by Dragoonkain" we had there, he made extremists like Invader and Gasbandit sound like sane moderates in comparison.TheBrew said:
#203
Chazwozel
Chazwozel
#204
JCM
JCM
#205