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DC Comic's Big Announcement

May 31, 2011#1

kaykordeath

http://dcu.blog.dccomics.com/2011/0...d-landmark-day-and-date-digital-distribution/

Personally, I'm more intrigued by the digital day and date. If I can finally get all of my monthly titles day and date, and at a reduced price, I will happily, for the firs time, pay twice for the same material....digitally day and date and then in trade format down the road.

May 31, 2011#2

Espy

Hmmm. Once I get an iPad, which is still a year or two out, being able to get digital comics will be VERY tempting to get me back in the comics game.

Also, I guess say goodbye to your local comics store. It won't be next week but once the rest of the industry follows suit it's going to be harder and harder to make a living selling comics.

May 31, 2011#3

Covar

iPad still isn't quite there for digital comics. Better than anything previous, but IMO still not there.

I also can't believe they're going to drop their numbers on every title so soon after celebrating Action Comics #900.

May 31, 2011#4

strawman

No one wants to buy Action Comics 783 at an auction. They should just start reseting the numbers every year. And organize them into volumes each year. Oh wait, that would make too much sense, and it would be too easy to see that their publishing schedule is horrible.

May 31, 2011#5

Covar

stienman said:
No one wants to buy Action Comics 783 at an auction. They should just start reseting the numbers every year. And organize them into volumes each year. Oh wait, that would make too much sense, and it would be too easy to see that their publishing schedule is horrible.

I bet that would only increase the number of idiot calls comics shops get claiming to have the first appearance of Superman. I love the calls from people with the first appearance of Spider-man, you know Spider-man (vanilla, or even recently "Web of") #1.

May 31, 2011#6

ThatNickGuy

Rebooting the whole danged universe again, with #1's? Sure, why not. But then when one of those series gets close to a milestone (like Action Comics or Detective Comics #1000), they'll put it back to its original numbering.

Besides, continuity hardly even matters anymore. A creative team will come on board and just undo or re-introduce something from someone else's run without a second thought. The absolute best stuff in mainstream comics (mainstream being DC & Marvel) have been the ones where creative teams have been allowed to tell their own beginning, middle and end. Very rarely, it works out within the title's main book (Captain America, Daredevil, Green Lantern (up until Blackest Night, anyway)). Most times, though, they're mini-series. All Star Superman, Long Halloween, Kingdom Come, etc. In the latter's case, they're outside of the "mainstream" continuity, free to do whatever they want and focus on just telling a good story with a clear beginning, middle and end.

Fact is, the longer these characters exist, the bigger their iconology becomes. Superman, Batman, Spider-Man and other cash cows are more or less unchangeable (at least in any kind of permanent sense). Their mythos is tweaked here and there, usually due to outside mediums (radio, TV, movies), but their basic mythology remains the same. I wonder if the companies were able to realize that. Maybe instead, we could see maybe a single creative team have a specifically limited run (12-24 issues) to tell the story they want and finish they way they want. Screw these attempts to tell any kind of concrete contunity, anymore.

So yeah, eat it up, fanboys. I'm sure this'll rake in a lot of moolah for DC, with the leigion of braindead fanboys.

Jun 1, 2011#7

Sara_2814

I like how Comixology handles comics on the iPad, especially considering they're trying to translate print to screen.

I love reading on the iPad, but I feel guilty as hell about going completely digital with comics. I really like my comic shop, so I keep buying my DC titles there. Though it's been Crossover Overload, not digital versions, that has made me cut down my pull-list.

ThatNickGuy said:
All Star Superman, Long Halloween, Kingdom Come, etc. In the latter's case, they're outside of the "mainstream" continuity, free to do whatever they want and focus on just telling a good story with a clear beginning, middle and end.

I would buy more comics if we got more of this. Most of the DC trades I own are these types of stories. I wish they'd do more Elseworlds. I love those!

Jun 1, 2011#8

@Li3n

ThatNickGuy said:
Fact is, the longer these characters exist, the bigger their iconology becomes. Superman, Batman, Spider-Man and other cash cows are more or less unchangeable (at least in any kind of permanent sense). Their mythos is tweaked here and there, usually due to outside mediums (radio, TV, movies), but their basic mythology remains the same. I wonder if the companies were able to realize that. Maybe instead, we could see maybe a single creative team have a specifically limited run (12-24 issues) to tell the story they want and finish they way they want. Screw these attempts to tell any kind of concrete contunity, anymore.

I'd rather they use new characters or expies for that... Watchmen showed it works better that way (using the Charlton characters after it wouldn't work any more then a sequel or a prequel, YOU HEAR ME DC?).

Jun 1, 2011#9

kaykordeath

Sara_2814 said:
I love reading on the iPad, but I feel guilty as hell about going completely digital with comics. I really like my comic shop, so I keep buying my DC titles there.

Supposedly, Comixology has a Digital Sotrefront program for local shops. But I've yet to find details on it in practice.

As for the re-boot...if handled smoothly, without too many "shocking" character changes, but rather simply a fresh start WITH THE CHARACTERS we know and have followed, this COULD work well. Details are starting to unfold that many of the recent events and "events" will not be wiped out, so the characters will have memories of them, and the consequences, rather than a wipe.

I'm staying tuned for now.

Jun 1, 2011#10

ThatNickGuy

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2011/05/31/flashpost-the-hooking-up-of-superman-and-wonder-woman/

Supes and Wonder Woman are hooking up in this new universe. So, looks like they're divorcing Lois & Clark. More than likely, it's another publicity stunt that'll last a year, if that.

Jun 1, 2011#11

Gryfter

Hey look! The DC universe is rebooting... again.

Jun 1, 2011#12

AshburnerX

Honestly, the only four DC series I care about are Zatanna, Powergirl, Gotham City Sirens, and Batman Beyond, and I really don't see how you could mess with two of those. That being said, I'm sure DC is going to fuck it up somehow.

I'm also betting that we're going to see a lot of characters get tossed aside. For instance, I honestly don't expect Renee Montoya to be around any more now that they have an excuse to bring back the original Question.

Why can't they just do what Marvel did when they made the Ultimates universe? That worked really well until they decided to fuck it all up with things like Ultimatum.

Jun 1, 2011#13

Espy

As someone who stopped buying most mainstream comics a few years ago, not because I don't love the characters, I do, but because the stories just got to repetitive after almost 20 years of reading comics, I think it's a great idea and I hope they really shake it up and let it stick. I think with Johns in charge it probably will, this won't just be a stunt.
Added at: 11:00
In fact I gotta say, having spent some time reading about it I'm kind of interested in picking up a few of these titles.

Jun 1, 2011#14

Gryfter

Espy said:
As someone who stopped buying most mainstream comics a few years ago, not because I don't love the characters, I do, but because the stories just got to repetitive after almost 20 years of reading comics, I think it's a great idea and I hope they really shake it up and let it stick. I think with Johns in charge it probably will, this won't just be a stunt.
Added at: 11:00
In fact I gotta say, having spent some time reading about it I'm kind of interested in picking up a few of these titles.

All the previous ones have ended up being stunts why shouldn't this one.

Jun 1, 2011#15

ThatNickGuy

Because Johns is in charge, it won't be a stunt? You mean like Infinite Crisis, 52, Flashpoint, Rebirth (both GL and Flash), Blackest Night (which didn't need to be crossed over with everything else...and now half the DC titles NEED to be something about white lanterns or something)...

I'm sorry to say, but Johns isn't just someone who does NOT avoid stunts, but has been the key reason for a lot of them for a good number of years.
Added at: 13:38
Well, that and Dan Dildio.

Jun 1, 2011#16

Covar

Green Lantern Rebirth was a stunt?

I didn't realize we're back to Kyle stories, with him being the only Green Lantern.

Jun 1, 2011#17

Espy

Yeah, I don't see how half of those are stunts but whatever man, I'm not going to nerd fight over whether or not this looks interesting to me and why.

Jun 1, 2011#18

ThatNickGuy

Eh, I guess it depends on your definition of "stunt". I include characters who don't need to come back and aren't any more interesting as a result in that definition.

I certainly preferred having one Green Lantern over the Rainbow Light Brigade.

Jun 1, 2011#19

Gryfter

Espy said:
Yeah, I don't see how half of those are stunts but whatever man, I'm not going to nerd fight over whether or not this looks interesting to me and why.

A stunt would be any storyline that encourages readers to purchase titles they otherwise would not purchase. They are not the creators trying to tell a cool story, they are publishers trying to sell more comics. Most of those Nick mentioned fall into this category.

Not saying a stunt can't have a cool storyline but don't for a second think that DC is rebooting their whole line to #1 because they think it will make an interesting story. That might have been true in the pre-Dido age but not anymore.

Jun 1, 2011#20

strawman

Espy said:
I'm not going to nerd fight

Jun 1, 2011#21

Vagabond

Superboy Prime was RIGHT.

Jun 1, 2011#22

LittleSin

I'm actually looking forward to this. Just wanted to say that.

Jun 1, 2011#23

wana10

Vagabond said:
Superboy Prime was RIGHT.

Vagabond Johnson is right about Superboy Prime Johnson being right!

Jun 2, 2011#24

kaykordeath

We now have pricing:
http://dcu.blog.dccomics.com/2011/06...-digital-copy/

Both digital and print editions of DC’s comics will have parity pricing for the first four weeks of release; thereafter, the digital titles drop in price down to our standard 1.99 digital price point. Oversized issues, including JUSTICE LEAGUE #1, will start at $3.99 and drop to $2.99 after four weeks.

Also note that JL#1 will have a standard issue available as well as a combo pack pollybaged with a code for the digital copy at $4.99 total.

As for the full price and 4 week drop off...I think that was pretty much as expected, is the "right" choice for both the business and the fans.

Now I have to make up my mind which way I'm going to go...

Jun 4, 2011#25

linglingface

http://www.toplessrobot.com/2011/06/dc_hits_the_reset_button.php
I pretty much agree with everything this article had to say.

I'm a newer comic book reader myself so I'm mostly excited for this. I also love comics on the iPad. Being that I'm new to the scene, I depend heavily on wiki for backstory because I just need to know! So I'm excited for that. However, I do also like going into comic book stores and definitely do not want to see them go because of this.

I'm also interested in seeing if Marvel will do something similar.

Jun 4, 2011#26

AshburnerX

heatherling said:
I'm also interested in seeing if Marvel will do something similar.

They did. It was called the Ultimates Universe and they fucked it up with events like Ultimatum and The Ultimates. I don't even think they have it around anymore... which is sad because it was actually interesting.

Jun 4, 2011#27

ThatNickGuy

I'd say they also fucked it up because the Ultimate universe was meant to be continuity free for new readers.

Unfortunately, that idea kinda gets thrown out the window the longer the series runs, thus creating continuity.

Jun 4, 2011#28

checkeredhat

AshburnerX said:
They did. It was called the Ultimates Universe and they fucked it up with events like Ultimatum and The Ultimates. I don't even think they have it around anymore... which is sad because it was actually interesting.

Aren't they basically continuing the Ultimate Marvel universe under the new title of Ultimate Comics or something stupid like that? Or are they only doing that for Spider-Man? I don't know. The only Ultimate comic I found to be consistently good was Spider-Man and when they "ended" it and relaunched it, I decided not to follow cause I figure they're going to muck it up.

Jun 4, 2011#29

LittleSin

I'm excited about the Green Lantern news I'm hearing. I think they have four GL books coming out.

One follows Kyle Rayner as the leader of a team. The other follows Red Lantern Atrocitus and his corp is a judge/jury/exeutioner anti-hero style book. Then ther GL:Corp with John Stewart and Guy Gardner. The main book will still feature Hal Jordan.

I'm glad to see they aren't writing out the 'rainbows corps', I'm probably one of the few that really enjoys them.

Jun 4, 2011#30

kaykordeath

DC has been making a big point of clarifying that this is a relaunch and not a reboot.

The general opinion is that this is not an ignoring or erasing of continuity but rather a folding in of some new on top of the old and a new creative vision.

Jun 4, 2011#31

Espy

Yeah, it's not going to destroy continuity, nor is it meant to. It's probably meant to shake some things up and give new opportunities for story.

Jun 4, 2011#32

Vagabond

The Ultimate comic line is still around. Still my favorite batch of books too. Other then most of the X-men being dead (who cares), a lot of the terrible changes from Ultimatum have been outright ignored, or even better, made fun of.

Also, Warner Brothers should do what it really wants to do. Scale down DC to just a few Earth One style graphic novels a year, and make tons of profit from that sweet, sweet merchandising.

Jun 4, 2011#33

linglingface

But the big thing is the same day digi comic releases. I know comic shop owners are pissssed.

Jun 5, 2011#34

Covar

Vagabond said:
The Ultimate comic line is still around. Still my favorite batch of books too. Other then most of the X-men being dead (who cares), a lot of the terrible changes from Ultimatum have been outright ignored, or even better, made fun of.

Also, Warner Brothers should do what it really wants to do. Scale down DC to just a few Earth One style graphic novels a year, and make tons of profit from that sweet, sweet merchandising.

Why would they want to do that? You realize it would cost them money right?

Jun 5, 2011#35

figmentPez

Covar said:
Why would they want to do that? You realize it would cost them money right?

Not if it increased overall sales. If fewer, better, titles come out that are easier to follow then you stand a better chance at broadening your audience beyond the hardcore comic fans.

That's part of the reason I don't read comics regularly. I don't want to find a title I like only to have to work trying to figure out when the next issue comes out, what tie-in books I need to read as well to follow the story and figure out if I can afford to keep reading. Is it even possible to get a subscription to a comic book? If not, "why so stupid comic industry?"

I want to be a fan, I really do, I love the medium, I love the characters... I just hate the bullshit. I'd buy trades, but I never know when even those are going to be an incomplete story. Plus, it's damn hard to search for some trades on Amazon and elsewhere. For some reason it can be hard to find the right search terms. (No, I can't make it out to a local comic shop very easily.)

Also, digital does not thrill me. Maybe the paid content is better, but the free previews I've seen have left me feeling like they're offering a crappy DRM-laden version for the same price. Some of the issues I couldn't even read because the resolution was too low to read anything but black & white text; all the colored text boxes were illegible. If that's how they're trying to entice customers, they're too stupid to deserve my business.

Jun 5, 2011#36

AshburnerX

Honestly... all DC needs to do is make an app for smart phones and web browsers that tells you when they release something new and a short description of what it is about. Maybe include a page from the work. It would make following series much easier, not to mention clue people into new stuff.

Jun 5, 2011#37

Espy

All I know is this. Comic shops around here are scarce. It's an annoyance to go deal with the asshole who runs the one nearest me, who clearly doesn't want to be there. Add into that I just can't spend 3-4 bucks on 20-30 comics a month and... bam. I don't buy comics anymore. If I had an iPad and could download issues right when they came out for 99c a pop? Holy crap. I'd go broke.
I think it's about damn time DC decided to do this. Like it or not it's inevitable and it's probably going to mean lots of new business for them. I know several folks who feel exactly how I do about it.

Jun 7, 2011#38

Frankie Williamson

Woof, so in the wake of all these fresh number ones, Bruce Wayne will once again be the Batman in Batman and Robin along with Damien aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand Barbara Gordon will be uncrippled.

Hey, next thing you'll tell me that all the old Flashes are alive again and Hal Jordan is....wait a minute.

Jun 7, 2011#39

Gryfter

Frankie Williamson said:
Woof, so in the wake of all these fresh number ones, Bruce Wayne will once again be the Batman in Batman and Robin along with Damien aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand Barbara Gordon will be uncrippled.

Hey, next thing you'll tell me that all the old Flashes are alive again and Hal Jordan is....wait a minute.

Wow... just wow. That means no more Oracle.

That isn't just sad it's disrespecting what has come before and there is absolutely no reason for it beyond the spectacle of the event. Barbara Gordon hasn't been Batgirl for over 20 years and she has been Oracle from most of those 20 years, a character that has been an integral part of the Batman Lore and extended family.

Fuck Didio.

Jun 7, 2011#40

LittleSin

I want to see where they go with it.

It may be time for her to be Batgirl again...though, I guess, she is no longer a 'girl'.

I don't know. I guess I'm just not as against retcons and stuff as the average comic fanboy. I'm pretty open minded.

Jun 7, 2011#41

AshburnerX

LittleSin said:
It may be time for her to be Batgirl again...though, I guess, she is no longer a 'girl'.

It's her "time"? No, it's Stephanie Brown's time, seeing as how she's the character that made the comic worth reading again. Seriously... I was never interested in the series before they gave it the more lighthearted, youthful angle it has now. I don't see how they could do that with Barbara Gordon of all people, especially while dealing with the backlash of destroying her entire point as a character.

Seriously... and she's not even the one I'm most worried about! You just know that poor Renee Montoya is gonna get thrown under the bus to make way for the original Question... never mind that she's far more interesting than he ever was! Jaime Reyes is likely to get pulled back too, just to bring back Ted Kord (who was only ever interesting when he was with Booster Gold). What about Terry McGinnis? His series (Batman Beyond) was only JUST made canon and it's had less than 6 issues! Are they undoing that now too?

Jun 7, 2011#42

Frankie Williamson

The only reason most people today give a crap about the original Question is because of his portrayal in the Justice League cartoon. All the reverting back to older characters is revolting and I barely read DC.

Jun 7, 2011#43

kaykordeath

Frankie Williamson said:
The only reason most people today give a crap about the original Question is because of his portrayal in the Justice League cartoon.

A lot of this might come down to the cartoon/animated universe. Where Babs is Batgirl. Bruce is the only Batman.

On the bright side, where Jaime is still Blue Beetle.

Jun 7, 2011#44

Vagabond

So Batwoman #1 is likely never getting released, eh?

Jun 7, 2011#45

Covar

Vagabond said:
So Batwoman #1 is likely never getting released, eh?

It's one of the books. Believe me they would never get rid of a lesbian "character" (I use quotes since it's really her only characteristic).

Jun 7, 2011#46

AshburnerX

Frankie Williamson said:
The only reason most people today give a crap about the original Question is because of his portrayal in the Justice League cartoon. All the reverting back to older characters is revolting and I barely read DC.

If the original Question was anything AT ALL like his DCAU depiction, they wouldn't have needed to replace him at all. Still, I'm glad they did because it allowed the DC Universe to have a gay character that isn't defined by her orientation. Hell, no one even knew she was for a long time... it wasn't till the end of Gotham Central (which needs a movie or TV series btw) that it even came out. She spent most of that run just kicking ass and being tortured by Twoface.

kaykordeath said:
On the bright side, where Jaime is still Blue Beetle.

Only sometimes. Other times it's Ted Kord. Though it would be interesting if they did a "Blue Beetles" kind of thing where they both meet up and do stuff.

At any rate, Jaime is already confirmed as the Blue Beetle in the upcoming TV series.

Jun 8, 2011#47

Vagabond

Whelp.

Jun 8, 2011#48

MindDetective

Wildstorm infects DC...

Jun 8, 2011#49

kaykordeath

Each "grouping" of these announcements has been very distinct...The Swamp Thing/Animal Man/Frankesntein titles were very unexpected and very different.

Then there's today's "teen heroes" group. And the above, from Teen Titans, isn't even the worst of it from this group...

It’s up to the living avatars of war and peace to root out the hidden forces who look to plunge the country into a deadly civil war in HAWK AND DOVE #1. The exciting new series will be written by Sterling Gates and illustrated by legendary superstar comics artist Rob Liefeld.

Jun 8, 2011#50

Frankie Williamson

The shoulder bicep connection....is....someone PLEASE buy Rob Liefeld a copy of

Jun 8, 2011#51

Allen who is Quiet

Illustrated by Rob Liefeld? Who decided that was a good idea?

Jun 8, 2011#52

Espy

Allen who is Quiet said:
Illustrated by Rob Liefeld? Who decided that was a good idea?

Dude. If he doesn't keep getting work we don't get to keep laughing at how insane his stuff is. Hell, I wish he'd get some really high profile stuff, think of the possibilities!

DC: "Hey Rob, we were looking at the Justice League and we were thinking, boy, there are really not a lot of pouches on these guys..."
Rob: "I thought that too!"
DC: "Sweet, here's a year contract, you go nuts big guy!"

I mean, come on!

Jun 8, 2011#53

@Li3n

So now the 90's are back... just in the wrong medium.

Jun 8, 2011#54

LittleSin

Liefield...Hawk and Dove.....NOOOOOO.
Added at: 19:11
Why do they always fuck with my Charelston comic characters? Why? Is it because of me?

Jun 8, 2011#55

AshburnerX

Meh... I'm just happy their bringing back Static. I could never understand why they didn't put him in the Teen Titans or something when his comic ended.

Jun 8, 2011#56

Covar

I love the new Red Robin costume, as much as I love Kingdom Come it just looked funny on Tim. I'm excited to see what happens with ~~Young Jus~~...err Teen Titans.

Jun 8, 2011#57

Gryfter

Vagabond said:
Whelp.

LOOK! It's the new X-me.... oh wait.
Added at: 12:57

Covar said:
I love the new Red Robin costume, as much as I love Kingdom Come it just looked funny on Tim. I'm excited to see what happens with ~~Young Jus~~...err Teen Titans.

That's Robin?!? The Falcon called he wants his costume back. Next you're going to tell me the alien chick crawling in the corner is the new Cyborg.

Jun 8, 2011#58

@Li3n

Gryfter said:
Next you're going to tell me the alien chick crawling in the corner is the new Cyborg.

Looks more like something out of Witchblade...

Jun 8, 2011#59

Covar

@Li3n said:
Looks more like something out of Witchblade...

No that's the teaser art/cover for Voodoo #1.
Added at: 16:18

Gryfter said:
LOOK! It's the new X-me.... oh wait.
Added at: 12:57

That's Robin?!? The Falcon called he wants his costume back. Next you're going to tell me the alien chick crawling in the corner is the new Cyborg.

Red Robin/Tim Drake. Damian Wayne is still Robin.

Jun 8, 2011#60

kaykordeath

Bet ya didn't know Little Red Riding Hood next to Red Robin is actually Wonder Girl...actually...
the

belligerent powerhouse thief known as Wonder Girl

Jun 8, 2011#61

Frankie Williamson

I assumed because of the lasso.

Who's the Magmagirl looking character on the right.

Jun 8, 2011#62

figmentPez

Frankie Williamson said:
Who's the Magmagirl looking character on the right.

Starfire?

Jun 8, 2011#63

Covar

My money is on Secret.

Jun 8, 2011#64

Gryfter

Frankie Williamson said:
Who's the Magmagirl looking character on the right.

I assumed it was Terra but I was wrong about the others so *shrug*

Jun 8, 2011#65

figmentPez

Linkara retweeted this comic:

Jun 8, 2011#66

Vagabond

Frankie Williamson said:
Who's the Magmagirl looking character on the right.

Raven

AshburnerX said:
Meh... I'm just happy their bringing back Static. I could never understand why they didn't put him in the Teen Titans or something when his comic ended.

Static was on the Teen Titans. You probably didn't realize because that book is always terrible and no one ever reads it.

Jun 8, 2011#67

AshburnerX

That's sort of the elephant in the room about making Barbara Gordon Batgirl again: If they do it, they have to make it so she was never paralyzed/was healed. It also means that DC basically thinks her 20+ years of being a nigh-omniscience information gatherer means nothing because she wasn't kicking ass herself... which sort of spits in the face of the handicapped fans.

This is why Marvel doesn't have Reed Richards basically solve all of the world's problems over night with his amazing super science; the people reading the comic would have to go back to the real world once they put the comic down.

Vagabond said:
Static was on the Teen Titans. You probably didn't realize because that book is always terrible and no one ever reads it.

What seriously? I never knew. I may have to look for some back issues...

Jun 8, 2011#68

ThatNickGuy

Covar said:
It's one of the books. Believe me they would never get rid of a lesbian "character" (I use quotes since it's really her only characteristic).

Having reading the first 12 or so issues of Rucka and JH Williams' run on Batwoman, I can emphatically confirm that statement to be untrue.

Ash: Hell, even in a wheelchair, she was kicking ass. I'd read a lot of Birds of Prey and Nightwing in their heyday and believe me, that girl could fight, even in a chair.

Jun 9, 2011#69

Gryfter

You know what really bothers me about Babs being retconned? Once they let her walk again it means that the two most permanent displays of just how evil the Joker is are gone. Killing Jason Todd is already gone but at least the crippling of Barabara Gordon was still proof that you don't mess with the Joker. Well... at least it was.

You know what would make a great story? The Joker, breaking the fourth wall, goes on a killing spree in the DC offices to demonstrate just how permanent death and a shattered spine really are.

Jun 9, 2011#70

Covar

If they do it without retconning things (i.e. she gets healed somehow) I'll be really upset if they just ignore the fact that she's done and can do more to fight evil as Oracle than she ever could do wearing a costume and leaping across rooftops.

Jun 9, 2011#71

kaykordeath

That is absolutely my biggest worry as well. If they want to get her to "walking" again, that's fine...but tell the story of getting her from where she is now to where they want her. Make the character grow but also have to DEAL with the history.

Jun 9, 2011#72

Covar

So looks like the more popular Wildstorm characters have migrated out of their universe into DC. joy </sarcasm>.

Jun 9, 2011#73

kaykordeath

I will give DC credit for this: while very few of the books will appeal to everyone, and very few readers will be interested in all the books, everyone should be able to find at least 2 or 3 books that will appeal to them. The variety is quite wide. And I've yet to see any individual title that doesn't have the potential to find some audience. Even among yesterday's "teen"heroes announcements.

Jun 9, 2011#74

ThatNickGuy

This looks like crap.

Why does this look like crap? Not even Perez can salvage this horrendous new costume.

Jun 9, 2011#75

Covar

I never understand why they feel the need to give Superman a new costume. It's been tweaked over the years, but it's a very solid, identifiable design that just works.

Jun 9, 2011#76

Espy

Unlike some of the other costume changes, I promise that supes one will be changed back sooner than later. Mainly cuz its sucks, well at least in that drawing,

Jun 9, 2011#77

LittleSin

It isn't that different....but different enough to make me gag.

Jun 10, 2011#78

linglingface

http://theuniblog.evilspacerobot.com/?p=5959

WTF IS THIS?? What did they do to Harley??
I hope nobody cosplays this shit.

Jun 10, 2011#79

Frankie Williamson

I hate the costume, but I disagree about the cosplay part.

I hope many attractive and damaged girls DO cosplay her and near me.

Jun 10, 2011#80

figmentPez

heatherling said:
http://theuniblog.evilspacerobot.com/?p=5959

WTF IS THIS?? What did they do to Harley??
I hope nobody cosplays this shit.

Ugh, and I thought that the design for Harley was bad in Batman: Arkham Asylum.

Jun 10, 2011#81

AshburnerX

figmentPez said:
Ugh, and I thought that the design for Harley was bad in Batman: Arkham Asylum.

At least the design for Harley in Arkham Asylum made sense: Harley loves to dress up in costumes to fuck with people, mainly because The Joker does too. I hope this costume doesn't stick though... her old one had a classic timeless appeal, but this new one just seems to be a cash in on a pop style.

God damn it... are they planning to cancel Gotham City Sirens or fuck it up even more? They just had Harley break in to try and kill the Joker (because of the bullshit he's done to her FOR YEARS) but ended up springing him instead. I understand the status que but it does run counter to her entire character arc that's been going for years.

Jun 10, 2011#82

Frankie Williamson

Isn't the new Birds of Prey going to be Poison Ivy and someone else, I assume that yes, Gotham Sirens is fucked.

Jun 10, 2011#83

AshburnerX

Frankie Williamson said:
Isn't the new Birds of Prey going to be Poison Ivy and someone else, I assume that yes, Gotham Sirens is fucked.

Yeah, I just looked up the relaunch stuff... Catwoman is getting her own comic and Ivy is going to Birds of Prey. Considering Harley just sprung the Joker, it's likely she's going to be sticking with him for awhile. So yeah, I'm guessing Gotham City Sirens is done, unless it gets a whole new cast.

Jul 19, 2011#84

evilmike

The new digital age of DC Comics -- now available in hardcover.

Jul 19, 2011#85

ThatNickGuy

Jul 19, 2011#86

Frankie Williamson

I know those hardcovers are meant to be collector's items but fuck do I hate them. I got a Powers hardcover collection and the middle 100 or so pages were nearly impossible to read with breaking the spine in half. You just couldn't see the inner inch of the page.

Jul 19, 2011#87

@Li3n

So, who should we kill using that book?

Jul 19, 2011#88

Covar

Dan Didio.

I have to say at least that's better than their latest practice of putting out hard cover trades with maybe 4 issues in them. Or their last Omnibus they did for the Flash which was maybe 10 issues for $75.

Jul 19, 2011#89

ThatNickGuy

Covar said:
Dan Didio.

I have to say at least that's better than their latest practice of putting out hard cover trades with maybe 4 issues in them. Or their last Omnibus they did for the Flash which was maybe 10 issues for $75.

More like 18. 12 regular-sized issues and 3 double-sized issues. But $75 is still pricey. Even though I bought it.

Also, I like to call him "Dan Dildio".

Jul 19, 2011#90

Covar

ThatNickGuy said:
More like 18. 12 regular-sized issues and 3 double-sized issues. But $75 is still pricey. Even though I bought it.

I did the same. bottom line is there was no good reason for charging ~$3.50 per issue of content in that book, especially when you compare it with the omnibus's Marvel puts out. Of course comparing those two companies' trade policies would be like looking at the success of MLS to the NFL.

I hate how we'll never get a Mark Waid Flash omnibus again, because he and Chuck Dixon dared to criticize Didio.

Jul 19, 2011#91

kaykordeath

See, that's exactly the kind of thing I'd love to get as a gift. Still waiting for someone to pick me up the Hardcover collection of Wednesday Comics as well.

Jul 19, 2011#92

Shegokigo

I'm already picking up 22 of these #1s in Sept. so I can see this being a deal. Problem is I'm really not interested in about 20 or so of the titles.....

Jul 19, 2011#93

Cog

I don't care about the reboot. I'm more interested in seeing an ending for the current continuity.

Jul 19, 2011#94

Covar

Shegokigo said:
I'm already picking up 22 of these #1s in Sept. so I can see this being a deal. Problem is I'm really not interested in about 20 or so of the titles.....

I think my numbers were similar. I'm picking up quite a few #1s to try, but only 5 books are on my current ongoing list for the restart. (Flash, Batman & Robin, Legion Lost, Legion of Super-Heroes, and Superman). I'll almost certainly wind up reading more, but I just don't know yet.

Jul 19, 2011#95

kaykordeath

My count was 22 titles with 11 maybes. At full price for 22 I can get all 33 at the delayed digital price, so that's the current plan.

Anyone else going digital?

Jul 19, 2011#96

Jiarn

Nah, I'm getting 20+ issues and I like having them on paper. Just for the nostalgic kid in me. Also my kids love to read them, at home, on trips, etc.

Jul 19, 2011#97

ThatNickGuy

I'm getting 0. I have no interest in any of this.

Jul 19, 2011#98

Jiarn

Why? Because they changed the number? They're not rebooting the series, they're continuing with the storylines they already had in place. Passing on continuing a series you love just because the number changed to get more new readers? I'm failing to see your point.

Jul 19, 2011#99

Frankie Williamson

Isn't there a metric butt ton of rebooting and changing happening?

Like Supes not being married to Lois and such.

Jul 19, 2011#100

Jiarn

Changes yes, which if that's what bothers you: Yeah I can see the complaint.

If you're refusing to continue buying/reading because the numbers on the cover changed, that, I take issue with.

Jul 19, 2011#101

ThatNickGuy

Jiarn said:
Why? Because they changed the number? They're not rebooting the series, they're continuing with the storylines they already had in place. Passing on continuing a series you love just because the number changed to get more new readers? I'm failing to see your point.

No, because it's taking the "big changes! Nothing will ever be the same again! Your character will be forever changed!" on a grand scale. And I've been sick of that crap for near a decade now. I don't care about these big, sweeping changes anymore because eventually, someone will come along and decide they'll undo that because they don't like it and tell their own stories. I still love superheroes and a lot of these characters, but I'm tired of the need to create these big events.

Jul 19, 2011#102

Frankie Williamson

Events sell comics....well, to the tiny comic buying fanbase that Marvel and DC have left anyway. The heyday of comics this ain't.

Jul 19, 2011#103

Jiarn

Events are what has kept comics surviving during the hardest financial times they've had and you're hating on that?

Jul 19, 2011#104

ThatNickGuy

The irony is that an event got me back into comics in the first place: The Death of Superman.

No, what bothers me is that some of the best, most well-known stories that are always high on people's recommendations...are not giant crossover events. The stuff that's actually sold in the long-term have been stuff that's mostly (or entirely) self-contained, sometimes even free of continuity in general. Batman: Year One, Dark Knight Returns, Long Halloween, All Star Superman, etc. Hell, look at all of Alan Moore's stuff. Swamp Thing, Watchmen, etc. Grant Morrison's run on Animal Man. James Robinson's Starman. Even if they reference events or even if it's an ongoing title that's in the middle of events (Brubaker's run on Captain America), they can still be read on their own without interruption.

The average reader picks up trades because they want just a full story. Doing these stupid events where not only does it change within six months so it doesn't matter, but where you need to read half a dozen other titles just to understand the full story is ridiculous.

Idiot fanboys who eat up this crap out of some psychological, Pokemon-like need to "get it all" is what's selling these comics. That's why comics are struggling: because the average person can't say "Huh, I want a good Superman story" and can't just pick up a random Superman issue because there's stupid amounts of continuity.

The problem is: continuity means crap. New creative teams ignore previous ones. Deaths are forgotten. Changes are forgotten. When they're not forgotten, someone just hits the reset button (this new DC, Crisis, Spider-Man's One More Day).

Yet, the stuff most enjoyed and recommended are the self-contained stuff that simply tells a story with a clear beginning and end. No spin-offs or crossovers (some sequels, like Long Halloween's Dark Victory) where you need to buy twenty other books to understand it. I'm not talking about an event that pops the sales chart for a month. I'm talking about long-term longevity where you the casual reader can pick up a book in the bookstore and go "Huh! This looks interesting!" without needing to buy six other books to get the full story.

The funniest thing is, as I mentioned at the beginning, The Death of Superman was what got me back into comics. Hell, it even had a brief crossover with the Justice League. But I read the trade, which got the whole story in one volume. Someone could still, today, read the Death, Funeral and Return trades and feel satisfied without being confused.

What maddens me the most is that, while these giant, mainstream mythological characters get all this goddamn spotlight, there's dozens (if not more) of comics out there that are so much better. They're creator-owned, self-contained and much more accessible. Invincible, Chew, Atomic Robo, Kabuki, Elephantmen, Northlanders, DMZ, Queen & Country, Fables, Y: The Last Man, Godland, The Unwritten, Criminal, Sleeper, Incognito, Walking Dead (though the TV series has REALLY given this a boost), Sweet Tooth, Astro City, The Goon, Parker. Cripes, the list goes on and on. These are seriously some of the absolute BEST comics out there, both in terms of writing and art, and yet this rebooted, mainstream crap gets the news just because it's DC hitting the reset button...again.

They did this in the 80s, already, after Crisis on Infinite Worlds. Silver Age elements and extended Superman and Batman families were wiped clean from existence. Yet, eventually, we got Supergirl, Superboy, Krypto, Batwoman, etc, all back. And it's going to happen again. Which means NONE OF THIS SHIT MATTERS.

Sorry for the rant (call it nerd rage if you will), but I'm just tired of it.

Jul 19, 2011#105

Frankie Williamson

Yeah, I'm one of those trades people. I do not buy individual comics. I want, as you said, a whole story or at the very least some of one.

Jul 19, 2011#106

kaykordeath

I'd call the relaunch a gimmic or publicity stunt more so than an event and that's not to say it as a negative. The industry needs something akin to a wake up call or at least something new. Everythingis going back to a basic foundation. And if some writer comes along and has a story to tell, leading to Lois and Clark getting (back) together, then it will be done in the context of what has been built uopn those foundations, just like it was done within athe context of the past

As for the event itself of "Flashpoint" the main series has been incredibly smooth, straightfoward, and fun unlike many of the other recent events. At only 5 issues it's got a great pace, and the Elsewhere nature of the story has made it veryaccessable. As an added bonus, the miniseries have been not only self contained, but also not esential reading and MOST important, REALLY DAMN GOOD. Batman Knight of Vengeance is one of the best stories I've ever read, 2/3rds of the way in.
Added at: 21:27
OK, just saw your response Nick...and I understand that. And while it may be blowing smoke up our collective asses (like your prom night?) there is talk from DC that there is a concerted effort to let the writers tell their stories and stop "writing for the trade" which, I strongly hope will lead to more 1 off or 2 part stories. Yes, I enjoy the serial nature of the story telling, but don't nee to get bogged down with continuity. With that, I am very relieved that The Unwritten is not getting touched inany of this.

Jul 19, 2011#107

ThatNickGuy

Stop "writing for the trade" doesn't save from "writing for current giant crossover event".

Jul 19, 2011#108

kaykordeath

No, but it does address "the self-contained stuff that simply tells a story with a clear beginning and end."

Giant Cross over event is even becoming a misnomer. The most recent piece of the Green Lantern saga was the War of the Lanterns. 10 parts, told across GL, GL Corps and GL Emerald Warriors. And yet the individual monthly titles each told very distinct threads. You care about the whole story, buy all 10. Only care about Guy, buy those 3 issues. Technically a crossover, but by no means a "giant event." 3 months and done and all entirely in the GL universe. Then there's all the tangential titles, Secret Six, Power Girl, Jonah Hex, even Wonder Woman that are entirely self contained threads (again, my complaint would be decompressed stories that feel written for the trade).

Would I put any of these up against your list of things like Chew, Fables, The Unwritten, etc...no, not at all. But for the love of the super hero genre, I think what's going on has the potential to be a fun trip infused with some excitement. Who gives a shit about how it relates to stuff from 20 years ago or if it will matter in 20 years. Without these reboots, we either get no continuity at all (which has it's own pluses and minuses) or we have to start dealing with a Bruce Wayne in his 40s, 50s, etc..and while that works int he corner of the universe with Beyond, you'd have to apply it everywhere...an aging Joker, and elderly Green Arrow, and so on...

So now we get some hooey about de-aging and early-in-their-careers Leaguers...it's an opportunity for something a little fresh..I won't let it take away from my enjoyment of what has come before.

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