Export thread

How much do you pirate?

#1



JCM

Spinning of the offtopic banter of the DRM thread, it seems an interesting idea to gauge how many people actually buy everything. I doubt any RIAA suit will be here, so tell me, how much do you pirate?

Movies: buy around 5 a week, but I´ll download one or two that arent avaliable in Brazil.
TV shows: pretty much all pirated. only 4 box sets bought.
Games: Rom of every game I buy, plus a few
ROMS of old games: Never bought any, all downloaded
Books: All bought
Manga and comics: Read manga online, buy graphic novels of all comic industries.
MP3s: Used to buy through iTunes, now barely buying cds.


#2

CrimsonSoul

CrimsonSoul

IT'S A TRAP!


#3

Krisken

Krisken

I have a little music from friends, but nothing impressive as far as volume is concerned. Oh, and a few episodes of MST3K. I'm buying episodes now though.


#4

Tress

Tress

I downloaded music 8-9 years ago as an undergrad. At the time I didn't fully understand the concept of pirating. To me, it was just people sharing music. While I don't agree with the RIAA, I avoid illegal downloads these days.

I played around with ROMS briefly, but that didn't really hold my interest either. Now I'm much happier playing a few retro games on my Wii and not worrying about all the hurdles that go along with ROMS.

I have always purchased everything else (books, movies, etc.). And now that I think about it, I haven't downloaded anything I didn't pay for (excluding free things) in the last 7 years or so.


#5

Cat

Cat

A lot


#6



Rubicon

years ago I used to pirate like mad, even before bittorrent made it so damn easy

these days, doctor who is all i "pirate" but eh, non-profit show from a foreign country, BBC tends to turn a blind eye to us Americans getting it the same time the UK fans do


#7

Cog

Cog

Let me see...

There is not video rental in this city.
All the good movies are dubbed
There are not game stores
There are not comic stores
There are not libraries or book stores. :facepalm:
I don't have an international credit card. And even if I had, everything computer related (games) have a 35% tax.

If there is an alternative, I would like to know.


#8

Charlie Don't Surf

The Lovely Boehner

I have never bought a CD, but I own a staggering wall of TV and movie DVDs. I'm some weird sort of hypocrite.


#9

figmentPez

figmentPez

I only pirate TV, but I try and catch it legitimately first. If I can I watch it live. Then, since I don't have a DVR or VCR, I try and catch it via a legit streaming service. If it's not available streaming, or the streaming just doesn't work right, and I still really want to see it, then I go to bittorrent. I'm using a lot less BT than I used to, since there's a lot more streaming than there was, and I'm being pickier about what I watch so I can have more time for video games.


#10



JCM

CrimsonSoul said:
IT'S A TRAP!
Click to expand...
Nah, its just a poll.

After screams by Shego over being corrected and LeQuack that one who pirates shouldnt talk about DRM, I wanted to see how many people here have never pírated.


#11

klew

klew

The cable tv service here actually pirates their signal from a New York area station, and I only download tv stuff that I miss when it originally airs, and movies that I already own and left at home, no games, music, or other. I like adding to my DVD collection, and the rest of the movies were borrowed from Netflix or the local library.


#12

Shegokigo

Shegokigo

Awww JCM did I really get that under your skin you have to bring it to this thread too?

Let's go back and play in the sandbox I made for you. Cmon now JCM, let's let this thread stay the way it is.

Oh since this is a serious thread and not one to make you rage over, I can tell you (like I did in the other thread) Pirates can talk about DRM all they want, as long as they understand it's there because of them in the first place.


#13



JCM

Yep, its amazing, wherever I call her, she comes!! I´ll give you last post here. :uhhuh:

Now if people believe the only reason DRM exists is Pirates, well, god help them.


#14

Cog

Cog

But if DRM is there because of the pirates, why is still there even if it doesn't work?


#15



JCM

Cog said:
But if DRM is there because of the pirates, why is still there even if it doesn't work?
Click to expand...
Bingo.

Its now more "what can we get away in controlling our stuff" than "stopping pirates"


#16

Shegokigo

Shegokigo

Wow JCM, you really can't get a joke? I'm reminded of Kanye West in the "fishsticks" joke South Park episode.

I'm not playing any games with you here in this thread JCM. I keep my stuff contained and civil in most threads. I know where jokes belong and conversations belong.

Try and learn the difference.


#17

Cog

Cog

Forget JCM and answer my question please? If you answer it you are going to demostrate you are right and JCM is going to shut up. And you will be right and we all are going to be happy.


#18

Shegokigo

Shegokigo

Sorry Cog, I missed your post. Anyway, it's there because a new system hasn't come up yet, DRM hasn't been around that long and is just one in a very long list of things that will attempt to keep pirates away from products.

DRM won't be around much longer, especially if a new system comes around.


#19

Necronic

Necronic

Now that I am in a position to buy things I never pirate. Well......except some porn....


#20

Cog

Cog

Ahhhh DRM is there because the companies are used to it. Ok this is solved. Next... What should I do to get legal things in this third world place I live?


#21

Shegokigo

Shegokigo

Sadly Cog, not a whole lot. Pirating is only a loss (in my eyes) to a company, when someone completely capable of aquiring a product of theirs and instead of purchasing, downloads the product. Of course, if said product is ever released in the area, you'd be on the wrong side by not purchasing it at that point after downloading.


#22



JCM

Shego said:
Sorry Cog, I missed your post. Anyway, it's there because a new system hasn't come up yet, DRM hasn't been around that long and is just one in a very long list of things that will attempt to keep pirates away from products.

DRM won't be around much longer, especially if a new system comes around.
Click to expand...
New systems HAVE come around.

DRM has changed, media has been hardware locked, new systems are created every time. CD-keys, "must have cd in drive to play" Securom, online activation, online verification, rootkits, etc.

The question is WHY IS IT USED, when only customers have to put up with it, and pirates get torrents with everything hacked and cracked for them? I´d love to hear a serious opinion from you.


#23

Cog

Cog

I just said: Because they are used to it. Case solved. :humph:

Do you know a wii cost $600 here? Guess how much for a ps3.


#24



JCM

*ugh*

That explains why so little noise was made by the media when blind people, who are the number one purchasers of text-to speech enabled books, suddenly discovered last night Amazon deleted that function from a few books they bought, and stuff like that.

Makes me wonder if in the future we wont own any media, but simply borrow/rent it.


#25

Necronic

Necronic

Actually there is some possible truths to that. I know there has already been talks of people not buying operating systems or productivity suites (MS office) but leasing them or running them remotely.


#26



Pojodan

I ACT like a pirate a lot.


ARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!


#27

Gurpel

Gurpel

P2P is legal in canada


#28



JONJONAUG

Games: ROMs of titles I can't get any other way (like say, through Nintendo's Virtual Console) and fan translated titles.

I do my fair share of pirating TV shows, movies, anime, and manga. I am more likely to buy anime than live action TV shows because anime is cheaper by far. I'll usually buy or rent a movie, but if I can't get a good price I'll pirate it and watch it, then wait until I can pick up my own copy at a low price.


#29

Bowielee

Bowielee

JCM, you've NEVER owned digital media. You've only owned a liscence to said media. That's been stated very clearly in EULAs since EULAs existed.


#30

@Li3n

@Li3n

Unless he's french, then the EULA means nothing.


Oh, and i'm from Eastern Europe, so 90% of stuff is pirated even if you buy it from the store (ok, that was in the 90's).

I only buy stuff when it's gotten cheap enough to be worth it, which is getting harder coz since we got in the EU they've been putting EU prices on games etc... which did wonders for us continuing to not buy stuff.


#31



JCM

Bowielee said:
JCM, you've NEVER owned digital media. You've only owned a liscence to said media. That's been stated very clearly in EULAs since EULAs existed.
Click to expand...
No EULAs in my PSP, DS, PS2 games and books. Nor dvds.

Although it is illegal to watch DVD in a non-windows/Mac pc (as it was never permitted and it took DVD John to crack the dvd encryption).

But then its also illegal to sing a copyrighted song in public, so copyright laws are rather difficult.


#32

@Li3n

@Li3n

Eh, no, i think what illegal is breaking the protection, because you're modifying it etc... but so are mods.


Oh, and i forgot to mention how one of the biggest ISP's here has a DC++ channel and a tracker site... now all we need is a grog fad and we're golden.


#33



Chazwozel

JCM said:
Bowielee said:
JCM, you've NEVER owned digital media. You've only owned a liscence to said media. That's been stated very clearly in EULAs since EULAs existed.
Click to expand...
No EULAs in my PSP, DS, PS2 games and books. Nor dvds.

Although it is illegal to watch DVD in a non-windows/Mac pc (as it was never permitted and it took DVD John to crack the dvd encryption).

But then its also illegal to sing a copyrighted song in public, so copyright laws are rather difficult.
Click to expand...

PSP EULA: http://www.scei.co.jp/psp-eula/psp_eula_en.html

DS EULA: http://www.nintendo.com/consumer/system ... a/EULA.jsp

Every game, cd, and DvD has an End user license agreement that you agree to when you purchase a product.


#34

@Li3n

@Li3n

Chazwozel said:
Every game, cd, and DvD has an End user license agreement that you agree to when you [strike:2o91rulx]purchase[/strike:2o91rulx] install a product.
Click to expand...
:batman:



Also, look at this:

Blizzard argued, and Judge Campbell agreed, that when users violated the World of Warcraft EULA, they no longer had a license to play the game and were therefore guilty of copyright infringement. As Siy noted in a blog post last year, Blizzard’s theory, if taken literally, would mean that violating any of the rules in the EULA and Terms of Service, such as choosing a screen name that didn’t meet Blizzard’s guidelines, would be an act of copyright infringement. And distributing software that helps users infringe copyright itself constitutes secondary copyright infringement, which could expose MDY to copyright law’s draconian “statutory damages” of $150,000 per act of infringement. The law gives aggrieved parties to contract disputes much less potent powers.
Click to expand...
Nice one... now they need to make it so one can't read books on the toilet, and doing so means the writer can come and get the book back...


#35



JCM

Chazwozel said:
JCM said:
Bowielee said:
JCM, you've NEVER owned digital media. You've only owned a liscence to said media. That's been stated very clearly in EULAs since EULAs existed.
Click to expand...
No EULAs in my PSP, DS, PS2 games and books. Nor dvds.

Although it is illegal to watch DVD in a non-windows/Mac pc (as it was never permitted and it took DVD John to crack the dvd encryption).

But then its also illegal to sing a copyrighted song in public, so copyright laws are rather difficult.
Click to expand...

PSP EULA: http://www.scei.co.jp/psp-eula/psp_eula_en.html

DS EULA: http://www.nintendo.com/consumer/system ... a/EULA.jsp

Every game, cd, and DvD has an End user license agreement that you agree to when you purchase a product.
Click to expand...
My bad, those are the EULA of the DSi online service, and EULA of the software running the and PSP, and I was talking about the games themselves.

All I get in my PSP manuals are a Limited warranty and Unauthorized use. Daxter's and Lemmings doesn't even have any copyright-related announcement.

The DS game manuals have no copyright notice. Cant find any in any DVD film, and only a short copyright notice in books.

Wont make much of a lawsuit, if they dont have anything I can read, and Brazil is pretty much creative commons.


#36



Le Quack

Cog said:
But if DRM is there because of the pirates, why is still there even if it doesn't work?
Click to expand...
Because companies don't know how to deal with pirates any other way. They don't know how to stop it, so they try this and that.
I don't see how we can blame them for trying.


#37

@Li3n

@Li3n

Le Quack said:
Cog said:
But if DRM is there because of the pirates, why is still there even if it doesn't work?
Click to expand...
Because companies don't know how to deal with pirates any other way. They don't know how to stop it, so they try this and that.
I don't see how we can blame them for trying.
Click to expand...
Easy: http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2009 ... -today.ars

There's trying and there's being retarded. CD's that can't be copied easily and a good MP experience goes a long way...


#38



Le Quack

@Li3n said:
\"Le Quack\":bklyxs54 said:
Cog said:
But if DRM is there because of the pirates, why is still there even if it doesn't work?
Click to expand...
Because companies don't know how to deal with pirates any other way. They don't know how to stop it, so they try this and that.
I don't see how we can blame them for trying.
Click to expand...
Easy: http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2009 ... -today.ars

There's trying and there's being retarded. CD's that can't be copied easily and a good MP experience goes a long way...[/quote:bklyxs54]

That's still DRM. Its a method of protecting their Digital media.
Click to expand...


#39



JCM

A game you buy is limited until January 28, 2009? Thank god Ive stopped gaming on PC, otherwise I'd have to put up with this shit.


#40

MindDetective

MindDetective

Don't really have the mindset to bother with it all. I have so much media at my fingertips that it seems like a hassle to go look for more. But I've never had a collector's mindset (not since comic books in high school!) I own a scant handful of DVDs (and I love movies!) and my music collection would be considered pathetic by modern standards (and I like music too!) I guess I am just not that invested in media to feel the need to go shopping for more of it.

On piracy: If the creators of the media had absolute control over it so that the only people that had access to it were those that paid for it (and this was not a time consuming, costly, or disruptive process) then I don't think sales of said media would change much from what they are right now. And I think the purveyors of media are well aware of this.


#41



elph

Movies: If it's a movie I want to see in the theater, I see it there. If it's a 'wait till DVD relase' I've often downloaded it and waited until it went down to a reasonable price to buy it.

TV shows: My patience for watching TV, on TV isn't there anymore. It's not that I have to watch it all now, but with kids and stuff to do around the house when shows come on, I can't really watch it on it's time table. I also don't see the point in spending more money to see TV my way. My current practice is, I will watch it on Hulu or other available online option if it's there. However, if it's not (or if it puts a delay on the online broadcast) I will probably download it before that 'week' is up.

Games: I only game on my PC & PS2. I have gotten quite tired of spending $50 on games that just simply are not what they are advertised, or run like complete and total shit on my PC, even though my system specs are at or slightly above their suggested level. I feel that many game companies drop their system requirements on the box simply to get more people into buying their product. If it's a game I like and play often, I will buy it when it goes down to a reasonable price (usually $20 - $30).

Books: I buy pretty much all the 'story' books I read. My family has always grown up with a collector's mindset to reading books. Gaming books (DnD, Heroes [Champions], World of Darkness, etc...) I don't usually buy unless I am activily using them. The cost for a full book when you may hardly use 1% of the information just isn't right to me. It's also fairly difficult [near impossible] to even get to play a table top game in my area. A current example is that a friend & I are looking to get into a tabletop wargame called Warmachine / Hordes (2 different games sort of). Wargaming like this is a very expensive hobby to get into (at least to me) and I just don't want to spend a lot of money on things I will not actively use. So we are grabbing what we can from online to take a deeper look into it.

Manga and comics: I've only somewhat gotten back into comic books here and most of those that I've read are suggested by friends or from here (Chew, Unwritten, Y - The Last Man, etc...). Because of the slow, drawn out nature of comic books, I tend to download them more often then not and pick up trades of what I've read when I have the money.

MP3s: I will buy the music of artists I like. I will download some stuff just to get a feel for it, but most of the time I end up never listening to it beyond 2 or 3 runs.


#42

Gared

Gared

Honestly, the only things I download are porn and those cheap ass games like you can download 1 hour trials of from msn.com; and even then I prefer to pay for my porn.


#43

DarkAudit

DarkAudit

To answer the poll: I refuse to answer on the grounds that I may tend to incriminate myself. :tongue:

DRM: Smurf DRM. In my experience it's done nothing but keep me locked out of my rightfully purchased media. In the days when Musicmatch was the big dog, I bought an album from them. A couple of 'puters later, it became harder and harder to find a player that would allow me to unlock the tracks. First Musicmatch's own player got bought by Yahoo!, and no longer included the old store, then WMP's update from 10 to 11 eliminated the Musicmatch store plugin. Now the entire operation is dead. Leaving me with unplayable, but completely paid for, tracks.


#44

Seraphyn

Seraphyn

- Most games, not many are worth the money they're going for. I usually pick the good ones up later when prices have gone down, I never install those however, due to DRM shite.
- Most movies and all series. Movies mainly just because it's just so much more convenient, all series because they never even get shown on tv here. The legal downloads stuff just sucks ass in quality compared to the pirates work.
- Some songs. I still like to buy an actual cd, and then just rip it in FLAC. I do download the occasional song / soundtrack if it's too annoying/hard to get.


#45



Wyrminarrd

Tv - I download most TV shows I watch since I´m unwilling to wait many, many months to watch them on TV and thats assuming they are even shown here.

Movies -I download the occasional movie but usually only movies that I´m marginally interested in. I prefer seeing movies in cinemas since the experience is a lot more fun imo.

Games - I don't download a lot of games lately but then I´ve really stopped playing as much as I used to.

Books - Never downloaded a book, I always buy them since I love reading and vastly prefer holding them in my hands rather then reading of a computer screen


#46

SpecialKO

SpecialKO

Netflix, Hulu, and the fact that movies come out on DVD like 3 months after they finish their theater-run the like have ensured that I basically don't pirate anything anymore.

That said:

-new Lupin IIIrd TV Specials/OVA/movies
-fan-subbed anime that hasn't crossed over yet
-songs that I'm uncertain about (if I like them, I tend to buy them, if I don't, I tend to delete)


#47

figmentPez

figmentPez

Cog said:
But if DRM is there because of the pirates, why is still there even if it doesn't work?
Click to expand...
Because companies have discovered it limits fair use. RIAA lawyers have stated, in court, that they believe that ripping CDs for personal use is illegal. That people should not be allowed to encode their own MP3s. They want the chance to sell us our media all over again in every new format that comes out. In the US, with the DMCA, they've got so much control it's disgusting.

I just realized I have to add to my list. I've pirated DVDs I've purchased. I've broken the encryption on them in order to convert them to files I can play on my portable media player, my netbook, etc. I've also broken encryption on at least one CD I own (Yes, I broke the law by having autoplay off in Windows and ripping a CD. I wouldn't have even known I did it, if I didn't read tech news.) If it weren't for the DMCA I wouldn't be breaking the law, because my goals were fair use, and not infringing on copyright. How absurd is it that motive has no bearing on this law? When I was a juror, the judge went to lengths to explain to us that motive was important in determining guilt.


#48



JCM

This.

And DRM is not because of only piracy, but more a mix of piracy being the cause, or the excuse.

Itunes exists to force people to use Ipods, DVD region encoding exists to force people to buy locally (otherwise brit gamers would import instead of buying overpriced UK games), online account checks exists to create a profile to track achievements, Amazon´s DRM exist so it can cancel your ebook anytime, anyplace.

Its idiotic to assume DRm exists only because of piracy.


#49

T

The Messiah

Pirates!


#50



JCM

There can be only one MESSIAH!!


#51

SpecialKO

SpecialKO

JCM said:
DVD region encoding exists to force people to buy locally (otherwise brit gamers would import instead of buying overpriced UK games)
Click to expand...
Isn't DVD region encoding more to prevent people from watching movies before they come out in theaters locally? Not that this makes much more sense anymore, but still...


#52

T

The Messiah

JCM said:
There can be only one MESSIAH!!
Click to expand...
Don't get uppity.


#53

Bubble181

Bubble181

Games: used to pirate lots and lots, nowadays, I buy everything I play. Sometimes I copy a game from a friend to try it out before buying (because decent demos really don't exist anymore) but if I like it, I will go buy it.

Movies: I tend to buy classics and good/great movies, rarely I'll download a crappy movie I want to see for some reason... Really, rare though. Maybe twice a year or so.

TV shows: depends. I buy a lot of good stuff on DVDs, but I do tend to watch things like whose line is it anyway, the simpsons,... on line. I have very irregular working hours and Belgian TV is literally years behind American tv, so, yeah, sorry there.

Books: never pirated anything

Music: I hardly ever buy music, and if I do, they're collectors I want for in my car. I don't pirate any either, though...I just listen to the few cds I have, or I listen to the radio. Or, you know, silence. I know, shocking.


#54

MindDetective

MindDetective

Bubble181 said:
Or, you know, silence.
Click to expand...
It is golden, after all.


#55

Bubble181

Bubble181

MindDetective said:
Bubble181 said:
Or, you know, silence.
Click to expand...
It is golden, after all.
Click to expand...

There's the reason I get along with Allen so well!


#56



Philosopher B.

[youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-LkWKvMCzqA:10yppv29][/youtube:10yppv29]


#57

PatrThom

PatrThom

I've never pirated anything.
I have exercised my fair use rights a number of times, though.

--Patrick


#58

Allen who is Quiet

Allen, who is Quiet

Bubble181 said:
MindDetective said:
Bubble181 said:
Or, you know, silence.
Click to expand...
It is golden, after all.
Click to expand...

There's the reason I get along with Allen so well!
Click to expand...
I should have known you only wanted me for my golden silence! IT ALWAYS HAS TO BE ABOUT YOU AND PERSONAL FINANCE, DOESN'T IT? :waah:


#59

Simfers

Simfers

I can honestly and truthfully say that I have never pirated anything. I have paid for every single CD, DVD, comic book, book and game I own (except for those I received as gifts, obviously). Hell, the only time my CDs even come near my computer is when I import them into iTunes to get them in my iPod.

I am extraordinarily law-abiding. :batman:


#60

Bubble181

Bubble181

Allen said:
Bubble181 said:
MindDetective said:
Bubble181 said:
Or, you know, silence.
Click to expand...
It is golden, after all.
Click to expand...

There's the reason I get along with Allen so well!
Click to expand...
I should have known you only wanted me for my golden silence! IT ALWAYS HAS TO BE ABOUT YOU AND PERSONAL FINANCE, DOESN'T IT? :waah:
Click to expand...

No, no, no, you misunderstand. Your golden silence allows me to stay home from work, so that I can spend more quality time with YOOUUU! That's all!


#61

@Li3n

@Li3n

Simfers said:
(except for those I received as gifts, obviously).
Click to expand...

Where any of those used?! Or did you ever borrow a game from a mate?!

-- Tue Jul 28, 2009 9:18 am --

JCM said:
A game you buy is limited until January 28, 2009? Thank god Ive stopped gaming on PC, otherwise I'd have to put up with this shit.
Click to expand...
Unless you're in a country where cracks aren't illegal...

Also, the game was ported over from consoles... so it's the consoles fault... it's always the consoles fault.


#62

T

The Messiah

Uppity ass pirates


#63



Joe Johnson

I rarely pirate, if at all. Not necessarily due to morals - more because I barely have time to watch/read/play the games I actually BUY. If I pirated gobs of stuff, I wouldn't have time to use it anyway.


#64

Simfers

Simfers

@Li3n said:
Simfers said:
(except for those I received as gifts, obviously).
Click to expand...

Where any of those used?! Or did you ever borrow a game from a mate?!
Click to expand...
Yes on both counts. Does Canadian law consider either of those acts to be piracy? Not trying to be snarky here, I am genuinely wondering.


#65

Allen who is Quiet

Allen, who is Quiet

Bubble181 said:
No, no, no, you misunderstand. Your golden silence allows me to stay home from work, so that I can spend more quality time with YOOUUU! That's all!
Click to expand...
Then why do you always call me your nest egg?


#66

@Li3n

@Li3n

Le Quack said:
\"@Li3n\":1yfmc32p said:
\"Le Quack\":1yfmc32p said:
Cog said:
But if DRM is there because of the pirates, why is still there even if it doesn't work?
Click to expand...
Because companies don't know how to deal with pirates any other way. They don't know how to stop it, so they try this and that.
I don't see how we can blame them for trying.
Click to expand...
Easy: http://arstechnica.com/gaming/news/2009 ... -today.ars

There's trying and there's being retarded. CD's that can't be copied easily and a good MP experience goes a long way...[/quote:1yfmc32p]

That's still DRM. [/quote:1yfmc32p]




Its a method of protecting their Digital media.
Click to expand...
From people that might decide to use it after 2 years of buying it... what a brilliant concept... Blizzard must feel so stupid for allowing SC to still run after all this time. (oh, and this is another case of not protecting it against pirates, but against ppl re-selling it, or at least that's the only reason i can think of, which isn't illegal yet... but give it time).
Click to expand...
Click to expand...


#67

Bubble181

Bubble181

Allen said:
Bubble181 said:
No, no, no, you misunderstand. Your golden silence allows me to stay home from work, so that I can spend more quality time with YOOUUU! That's all!
Click to expand...
Then why do you always call me your nest egg?
Click to expand...

Because I just want to smother you with love like a mama bird does her babies, of course!


#68



Gill Kaiser

If someone pirates a game to use as a demo, and then buys it if it's good enough, should that "count"?

Also, if I have bought Mass Effect on the 360, but then decide I want to play it on my new PC when the PC version is released, should downloading the PC version "count"?


Top