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Not the bees, arrghhh...

Nov 19, 2009#1

@Li3n

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/11/091117124009.htm

Run for your lives, our future insect overlords are already counting us!

Bigger Not Necessarily Better, When It Comes to Brains

ScienceDaily (Nov. 18, 2009) — Tiny insects could be as intelligent as much bigger animals, despite only having a brain the size of a pinhead, say scientists at Queen Mary, University of London

"Animals with bigger brains are not necessarily more intelligent," according to Lars Chittka, Professor of Sensory and Behavioural Ecology at Queen Mary's Research Centre for Psychology and University of Cambridge colleague, Jeremy Niven. This begs the important question: what are they for?
Research repeatedly shows how insects are capable of some intelligent behaviours scientists previously thought was unique to larger animals. Honeybees, for example, can count, categorise similar objects like dogs or human faces, understand 'same' and 'different', and differentiate between shapes that are symmetrical and asymmetrical.

"We know that body size is the single best way to predict an animal's brain size," explains Chittka, writing in the journal Current Biology. "However, contrary to popular belief, we can't say that brain size predicts their capacity for intelligent behaviour."
Differences in brain size between animals is extreme: a whale's brain can weigh up to 9 kg (with over 200 billion nerve cells), and human brains vary between 1.25 kg and 1.45 kg (with an estimated 85 billion nerve cells). A honeybee's brain weighs only 1 milligram and contains fewer than a million nerve cells.

While some increases in brain size do affect an animal's capability for intelligent behaviour, many size differences only exist in a specific brain region. This is often seen in animals with highly developed senses (like sight or hearing) or an ability to make very precise movements. The size increase allows the brain to function in greater detail, finer resolution, higher sensitivity or greater precision: in other words, more of the same.

Research suggests that bigger animals may need bigger brains simply because there is more to control -- for example they need to move bigger muscles and therefore need more and bigger nerves to move them.
Chittka says: "In bigger brains we often don't find more complexity, just an endless repetition of the same neural circuits over and over. This might add detail to remembered images or sounds, but not add any degree of complexity. To use a computer analogy, bigger brains might in many cases be bigger hard drives, not necessarily better processors."

This must mean that much 'advanced' thinking can actually be done with very limited neuron numbers. Computer modelling shows that even consciousness can be generated with very small neural circuits, which could in theory easily fit into an insect brain.
In fact, the models suggest that counting could be achieved with only a few hundred nerve cells and only a few thousand could be enough to generate consciousness. Engineers hope that this kind of research will lead to smarter computing with the ability to recognise human facial expressions and emotions.

Nov 19, 2009#2

Shegokigo

Nov 19, 2009#3

Hylian

Nov 19, 2009#4

Jay

Jesus Christ

Nov 19, 2009#5

Chazwozel

@Li3n said:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/11/091117124009.htm

Run for your lives, our future insect overlords are already counting us!

Bigger Not Necessarily Better, When It Comes to Brains

ScienceDaily (Nov. 18, 2009) — Tiny insects could be as intelligent as much bigger animals, despite only having a brain the size of a pinhead, say scientists at Queen Mary, University of London

\"Animals with bigger brains are not necessarily more intelligent,\" according to Lars Chittka, Professor of Sensory and Behavioural Ecology at Queen Mary's Research Centre for Psychology and University of Cambridge colleague, Jeremy Niven. This begs the important question: what are they for?
Research repeatedly shows how insects are capable of some intelligent behaviours scientists previously thought was unique to larger animals. Honeybees, for example, can count, categorise similar objects like dogs or human faces, understand 'same' and 'different', and differentiate between shapes that are symmetrical and asymmetrical.

\"We know that body size is the single best way to predict an animal's brain size,\" explains Chittka, writing in the journal Current Biology. \"However, contrary to popular belief, we can't say that brain size predicts their capacity for intelligent behaviour.\"
Differences in brain size between animals is extreme: a whale's brain can weigh up to 9 kg (with over 200 billion nerve cells), and human brains vary between 1.25 kg and 1.45 kg (with an estimated 85 billion nerve cells). A honeybee's brain weighs only 1 milligram and contains fewer than a million nerve cells.

While some increases in brain size do affect an animal's capability for intelligent behaviour, many size differences only exist in a specific brain region. This is often seen in animals with highly developed senses (like sight or hearing) or an ability to make very precise movements. The size increase allows the brain to function in greater detail, finer resolution, higher sensitivity or greater precision: in other words, more of the same.

Research suggests that bigger animals may need bigger brains simply because there is more to control -- for example they need to move bigger muscles and therefore need more and bigger nerves to move them.
Chittka says: \"In bigger brains we often don't find more complexity, just an endless repetition of the same neural circuits over and over. This might add detail to remembered images or sounds, but not add any degree of complexity. To use a computer analogy, bigger brains might in many cases be bigger hard drives, not necessarily better processors.\"

This must mean that much 'advanced' thinking can actually be done with very limited neuron numbers. Computer modelling shows that even consciousness can be generated with very small neural circuits, which could in theory easily fit into an insect brain.
In fact, the models suggest that counting could be achieved with only a few hundred nerve cells and only a few thousand could be enough to generate consciousness. Engineers hope that this kind of research will lead to smarter computing with the ability to recognise human facial expressions and emotions.

How smart are you now assholes?

Smart yet? How bout some of this?

Nov 19, 2009#6

Wahad

Nov 19, 2009#7

Chazwozel

Nov 19, 2009#8

Soliloquy

Computer modelling shows that even consciousness can be generated with very small neural circuits, which could in theory easily fit into an insect brain.

Did... did they just imply what I think they implied?

Have we created a computerized consciousness, and nobody told me about it?

Nov 19, 2009#9

Bowielee

Soliloquy said:
Computer modelling shows that even consciousness can be generated with very small neural circuits, which could in theory easily fit into an insect brain.

Click to expand...

Did... did they just imply what I think they implied?

Have we created a computerized consciousness, and nobody told me about it?

That caught my attention as well. If that were the case, I think that it would be bigger new than the bee thing.

Nov 19, 2009#10

drawn_inward

Bees make honey.

Nov 19, 2009#11

@Li3n

I think they meant that the computer told them insect brains work... not that they actually build a computer that aproximates the brain of an insect.

Chazwozel said:
How smart are you now assholes?

Smart yet? How bout some of this?

Sure, make their lives miserable while you can, because once you're in the real world they'll be the ones you'll be collecting nectar for.

Nov 19, 2009#12

figmentPez

Nov 19, 2009#13

Draxo

Bees? ARGH!

Nov 19, 2009#14

Laurelai

I love bees

I have these

in my yard and these!

Green metallic bee and Leaf cutter bee)

Nov 20, 2009#15

IronBrig4

Actually, recent studies have shown bees disappearing. It's called "colony collapse disorder" in which thousands of bees at a time will simply vanish and presumably die. The rate of colony collapse has spiked in recent years, creating concern among agriculture experts. Many of our crops depend on bees for pollination.

So next time you see a bee, don't try to scorch it with a flamethrower.

Nov 20, 2009#16

Soliloquy

IronBrig4 said:
Actually, recent studies have shown bees disappearing. It's called "colony collapse disorder" in which thousands of bees at a time will simply vanish and presumably die. The rate of colony collapse has spiked in recent years, creating concern among agriculture experts. Many of our crops depend on bees for pollination.

So next time you see a bee, don't try to scorch it with a flamethrower.

But... but... BEES!

Nov 20, 2009#17

@Li3n

IronBrig4 said:
Actually, recent studies have shown bees disappearing. It's called "colony collapse disorder" in which thousands of bees at a time will simply vanish and presumably die. The rate of colony collapse has spiked in recent years, creating concern among agriculture experts. Many of our crops depend on bees for pollination.

Dude... they're obviously building an army at the centre of the Earth... all those disappearing bees are being drafted....

Nov 20, 2009#18

Silver Jelly

They didn't know that already? How did they imagine gnomes and fairies think?

Nov 20, 2009#19

Green_Lantern

So... what stops animals to be inteligent?

Nov 20, 2009#20

@Li3n

Silver Jelly said:
They didn't know that already? How did they imagine gnomes and fairies think?

They always assumed their heads where like the TARDIS, bigger on the inside. Now they'll have to rethink the whole field of fae-folk-ology.

Nov 20, 2009#21

Dave

Green_Lantern said:
So... what stops animals to be inteligent?

Best post EVER! Unintentional humor FTW!

Nov 20, 2009#22

Koko

Ants still have the highest brain size to body size ratio.
Fun fact: Ants never ever sleep.

Nov 20, 2009#23

Chazwozel

Green_Lantern said:
So... what stops animals to be inteligent?

opposable thumbs and really big fucking guns.

Nov 20, 2009#24

Bowielee

Chazwozel;303048][quote=Green_Lantern said:
So... what stops animals to be inteligent?

opposable thumbs and really big fucking guns.[/QUOTE]

Crap, we're screwed.

Nov 20, 2009#25

Green_Lantern

Dave;303023][quote=Green_Lantern said:
So... what stops animals to be inteligent?

Best post EVER! Unintentional humor FTW![/QUOTE]

Chazwozel said:
opposable thumbs and really big fucking guns.

Indeed Unintentional, I have no idea what just happened :confused:

Also, opposable thumbs rules!

Koko said:
Ants still have the highest brain size to body size ratio.
Fun fact: Ants never ever sleep.

Great, more nightmare fuel.

Nov 20, 2009#26

Silver Jelly

Lantern, we are all intelligent animals! Unintentional!

Nov 20, 2009#27

Green_Lantern

Silver Jelly said:
Lantern, we are all intelligent animals! Unintentional!

Wait a minute, are you guys telling me that you are animals and not robots?

Nov 20, 2009#28

Soliloquy

Halforums: what stops animals to be intelligent.

Nov 20, 2009#29

Dave

Soliloquy said:
Halforums: what stops animals to be intelligent.

I'm laughing like a damned loon here. Thanks, man!

Nov 20, 2009#30

GasBandit

http://gasbanditry.com/twg163/pictures/Animated/wicker-man-nicholas-cage-bees-in-my-ass.gif

Nov 20, 2009#31

General Specific

Wahad said:

Halforums: I like my forum the way I like my women... covered in BEES!

Halforums: Covered in BEES!

Nov 23, 2009#32

Green_Lantern

http://gasbanditry.com/twg163/pictures/Unsorted/omg-bees-bbq-fogger.jpg

what you did with the hive?

Nov 23, 2009#33

Gurpel

Dave;303185][quote=Soliloquy said:
Halforums: what stops animals to be intelligent.

I'm laughing like a damned loon here. Thanks, man![/QUOTE]

well, i just missed my bus refreshing the site to see if you had added that to the title rotation yet...

please do.

Nov 23, 2009#34

Green_Lantern

Gurpel;304010][quote=Dave;303185][quote=Soliloquy said:
Halforums: what stops animals to be intelligent.

I'm laughing like a damned loon here. Thanks, man![/QUOTE]

well, i just missed my bus refreshing the site to see if you had added that to the title rotation yet...

please do.[/QUOTE]

Seconded. please do it!

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