So, for Martin Luthor King day.. how is this legal?

[Rubicon]

I never really understood the holiday, its a Federal holiday and most government stuff is closed today, as are a lot of schools. But not many employers close their businesses for today. In 2009 like only 33% of businesses gave employees off.

Then I got to wondering, how is that legal?

i.e. in my city, the entire school system is closed today, every last school in the district. From elementary all the way to high school. yet most businesses are open, including mine (thanks Vonage, love you too..) so what happens, if you have children? At my job, applying for a single day off is a friggin sport event, you need like two levels of consent plus applying 3 months in advance (no shit).. So doing it before hand can be impossible. Imagine having children, who have the day off from school but you are forced to go to work?

I dunno, it just seems fucking stupid to me, its a damn holiday. And yea, I definitely plan to ask about it at work, considering how light my pay check was in December thanks to the shit hours we got, a day off for a Federal holiday is not hard thing to ask for.

 

[Dave]

The problem you run into is that the federal government loves to have the day off and will take every opportunity to do so. Most businesses couldn't afford to work by the federal government's schedule. Fortunately, the federal government isn't hampered by anything even remotely resembling the need to act like a business with a bottom line so they can take off as much as they can.

So while I agree that it's weird, I see why businesses don't close. Same with Columbus Day and Veteran's Day.

 

[Chazwozel]

If your kids are at school, they're old enough to be able to stay home for the day. An 8 year old is not as helpless as you think.


Get a job that does give you off on MLK day? Wow, you bitch worse than a teenager working at a grocery store. BUT IT'S NOOOOTTT FAAAAIIIRRRRR!!!!!!

 

[Rubicon]

If your kids are at school, they're old enough to be able to stay home for the day. An 8 year old is not as helpless as you think.


Get a job that does give you off on MLK day?

You'd really leave say, a 5 year old (someone just starting gradeschool) at home alone? Even 8 is a bit young to leave unattended all day long..

 

[Chazwozel]

If your kids are at school, they're old enough to be able to stay home for the day. An 8 year old is not as helpless as you think.


Get a job that does give you off on MLK day?

You'd really leave say, a 5 year old (someone just starting gradeschool) at home alone? Even 8 is a bit young to leave unattended all day long..[/QUOTE]

A 5 year old isn't going to school. Even if they are Kindergarten is only a half a day, so you'd have to have arrangements long before bitching about a day off on MLK day. By age 8 I was riding the subway to school in NYC. Furthermore, you could request a half day at work. Six year olds can get themselves cereal, turn on the TV/Xbox. I know it's amazing to hear, but children are actual factual thinking human beings!

 

[General Specific]

The problem you run into is that the federal government loves to have the day off and will take every opportunity to do so. Most businesses couldn't afford to work by the federal government's schedule. Fortunately, the federal government isn't hampered by anything even remotely resembling the need to act like a business with a bottom line so they can take off as much as they can.

So while I agree that it's weird, I see why businesses don't close. Same with Columbus Day and Veteran's Day.

You want to really have your brain melt? I do tech support for the US Post Offices. We're outsourced, though, so despite the fact that ALL of the Post Offices are closed today, I still have to work a normal shift. There will be no call whatsoever today, but we have a full compliment here regardless. This is because though it is a Federal holiday, it is not a Company holiday. They can't just give us the day off, either, as that would be unfair to everyone who is not on our team, I guess.

 

[Charlie Don't Surf]

If your kids are at school, they're old enough to be able to stay home for the day. An 8 year old is not as helpless as you think.


Get a job that does give you off on MLK day?

You'd really leave say, a 5 year old (someone just starting gradeschool) at home alone? Even 8 is a bit young to leave unattended all day long..[/QUOTE]

A 5 year old isn't going to school.[/QUOTE]

I was in Kindergarden when I was 4.

 

[Dave]

If your kids are at school, they're old enough to be able to stay home for the day. An 8 year old is not as helpless as you think.


Get a job that does give you off on MLK day? Wow, you bitch worse than a teenager working at a grocery store. BUT IT'S NOOOOTTT FAAAAIIIRRRRR!!!!!!

12 years old is the accepted age where a child can stay home for an extended time alone. And even then if you do it for more than a few hours I would question your judgment.

 

[Rubicon]

If your kids are at school, they're old enough to be able to stay home for the day. An 8 year old is not as helpless as you think.


Get a job that does give you off on MLK day?

You'd really leave say, a 5 year old (someone just starting gradeschool) at home alone? Even 8 is a bit young to leave unattended all day long..[/QUOTE]

A 5 year old isn't going to school. Even if they are Kindergarten is only a half a day, so you'd have to have arrangements long before bitching about a day of on MLK day. By age 8 I was riding the subway to school in NYC.[/QUOTE]

Annoying troll is annoying

 

[Dave]

If your kids are at school, they're old enough to be able to stay home for the day. An 8 year old is not as helpless as you think.


Get a job that does give you off on MLK day?

You'd really leave say, a 5 year old (someone just starting gradeschool) at home alone? Even 8 is a bit young to leave unattended all day long..[/QUOTE]

A 5 year old isn't going to school. Even if they are Kindergarten is only a half a day, so you'd have to have arrangements long before bitching about a day of on MLK day. By age 8 I was riding the subway to school in NYC.[/QUOTE]

Annoying troll is annoying[/QUOTE]

Not necessarily. It depends on the child, the circumstances, etc. At 5 I was pretty much staying home by myself but I lived in a small town with snoopy neighbors so it was no big deal.

I will say that it's a bit different today than it was when Chaz and I were youngins. But he's speaking from his own experiences so it can't be discounted completely.

But I'll bet Chaz wouldn't leave his 5 year old home alone or allow his 8 year old to ride the subway alone...

 

[Chazwozel]

If your kids are at school, they're old enough to be able to stay home for the day. An 8 year old is not as helpless as you think.


Get a job that does give you off on MLK day? Wow, you bitch worse than a teenager working at a grocery store. BUT IT'S NOOOOTTT FAAAAIIIRRRRR!!!!!!

12 years old is the accepted age where a child can stay home for an extended time alone. And even then if you do it for more than a few hours I would question your judgment.[/QUOTE]

Fine. If you feel antsy about leaving your kid at home, here's what you do. Call up your kid's friend's mother from school. "Can Johnny play with Jimmy for the afternoon while I'm at work? I can pick him up at 3." Problem solved

 

[Chazwozel]

If your kids are at school, they're old enough to be able to stay home for the day. An 8 year old is not as helpless as you think.


Get a job that does give you off on MLK day?

You'd really leave say, a 5 year old (someone just starting gradeschool) at home alone? Even 8 is a bit young to leave unattended all day long..[/QUOTE]

A 5 year old isn't going to school. Even if they are Kindergarten is only a half a day, so you'd have to have arrangements long before bitching about a day of on MLK day. By age 8 I was riding the subway to school in NYC.[/QUOTE]

Annoying troll is annoying[/QUOTE]

Lazy piece of shit is lazy. Get back to work.

 

[Chippy]

If your kids are at school, they're old enough to be able to stay home for the day. An 8 year old is not as helpless as you think.


Get a job that does give you off on MLK day?

You'd really leave say, a 5 year old (someone just starting gradeschool) at home alone? Even 8 is a bit young to leave unattended all day long..[/QUOTE]

A 5 year old isn't going to school. Even if they are Kindergarten is only a half a day, so you'd have to have arrangements long before bitching about a day of on MLK day. By age 8 I was riding the subway to school in NYC.[/QUOTE]

Annoying troll is annoying[/QUOTE]

How is that in any way trolling?

 

[Chazwozel]

If your kids are at school, they're old enough to be able to stay home for the day. An 8 year old is not as helpless as you think.


Get a job that does give you off on MLK day?

You'd really leave say, a 5 year old (someone just starting gradeschool) at home alone? Even 8 is a bit young to leave unattended all day long..[/QUOTE]

A 5 year old isn't going to school. Even if they are Kindergarten is only a half a day, so you'd have to have arrangements long before bitching about a day of on MLK day. By age 8 I was riding the subway to school in NYC.[/QUOTE]

Annoying troll is annoying[/QUOTE]

Not necessarily. It depends on the child, the circumstances, etc. At 5 I was pretty much staying home by myself but I lived in a small town with snoopy neighbors so it was no big deal.

I will say that it's a bit different today than it was when Chaz and I were youngins. But he's speaking from his own experiences so it can't be discounted completely.

But I'll bet Chaz wouldn't leave his 5 year old home alone or allow his 8 year old to ride the subway alone...[/QUOTE]

Let's not derail too far here. The issue at hand is Mav bitching about not getting off from work today. I'll use my example. I suppose. My 5 year old goes to Kindergarten for 4 hours and my wife gets him at 1. Today he has off, so do I, but if I didn't, I'd set up a play date till 1 for him at a friends house. My point is that it's not your employers responsibility to make arrangements for you. If you want off, then call off. If you need the money then set something up.

 

[Dave]

He should learn to be like me. Work for 15 or 20 minutes a week and spend the rest of the time posting on here or in IRC.

 

[Allen who is Quiet]

If a working parent is really concerned about MLK day, if necessary, they'll probably make calls and make some childcare happen. Don't let the fact that they need to make parenting decisions stop companies from making revenue for a day.

 

[Chippy]

This is going to be an awesome thread.

 

[Rubicon]

How is that in any way trolling?

Because if someone honestly believes a 5 year old is of the age to stay alone in a home by themselves either A) should not be a parent or B) is trolling

He also thinks 5 year olds can't be in gradeschool, I was 5 when I was in kindergarten and there are 4 year olds in there as well, so it happens.

 

[Chazwozel]

If a working parent is really concerned about MLK day, if necessary, they'll probably make calls and make some childcare happen. Don't let the fact that they need to make parenting decisions stop companies from making revenue for a day.

It's really not that hard to do either. There are these magical people in your life called friends and family. At the worst you end up paying a babysitter 20 bucks and 3 ice cream bars from your fridge.

 

[Dave]

Yeah, at least in this case parents have some sort of warning. It's snow/bad weather days that really screw you up! Not to mention when little Johnny has a fever so he can't even go to day care (even though people still try). Kids and both parents working is a real challenge. That's one of the reasons why I worked multiple jobs and my wife stayed at home with the kids. We were as poor as shit but the kids had someone there all the time.

 

[Chazwozel]

How is that in any way trolling?

Because if someone honestly believes a 5 year old is of the age to stay alone in a home by themselves either A) should not be a parent or B) is trolling

He also thinks 5 year olds can't be in gradeschool, I was 5 when I was in kindergarten and there are 4 year olds in there as well, so it happens.

LoL I'd like you to quote where I said a 5 year old is of age to stay home alone. I said at 8 they're fine. Like I said before Kindergarten is a half day, so regardless, you'd have arrangements set up prior to the dreaded MLK day off they get. It's only 4 hours.

In all honesty, Mav my boy, my fucking 2 year old is more capable than you.

 

[Chippy]

How is that in any way trolling?

Because if someone honestly believes a 5 year old is of the age to stay alone in a home by themselves either A) should not be a parent or B) is trolling

He also thinks 5 year olds can't be in gradeschool, I was 5 when I was in kindergarten and there are 4 year olds in there as well, so it happens.

He mentioned Kindergarten. I think of trolling as trying to get a direct rise out of you. Instead, he's just disagreeing with you in a hurtful manner. And, let's be honest, that's the best way to disagree with someone.

 

[Dave]

If a working parent is really concerned about MLK day, if necessary, they'll probably make calls and make some childcare happen. Don't let the fact that they need to make parenting decisions stop companies from making revenue for a day.

It's really not that hard to do either. There are these magical people in your life called friends and family. At the worst you end up paying a babysitter 20 bucks and 3 ice cream bars from your fridge.[/QUOTE]

*bzzt* I'm calling you on this. Having friends and family around is nice, but not everyone has this. Childcare and both parents working is a very, very difficult subject as there's a fine line between being cool to your employees and being unfair to the single workers.

And for 8 hours? $20? Cheap bastard.

 

[Charlie Don't Surf]

It's legal because the Federal Government says it's legal, to answer the OP.

 

[Shakey]

I work at a bank. The federal reserve is closed today and I still have to work. Half of the stuff I usually do I can't because of that.

What would you do if the government forced all companies to be closed on federal holidays? No gas, no groceries, no tv, nothing.

Daycare is always an option for your kids. You have plenty of time to prepare for it.

 

[WolfOfOdin]

Dave's right. Though enforcement of that rule varies from state to state. In some, leaving a child under16 home alone is grounds for willful neglect and/or child endangerment.

 

[Allen who is Quiet]

If a working parent is really concerned about MLK day, if necessary, they'll probably make calls and make some childcare happen. Don't let the fact that they need to make parenting decisions stop companies from making revenue for a day.

It's really not that hard to do either. There are these magical people in your life called friends and family. At the worst you end up paying a babysitter 20 bucks and 3 ice cream bars from your fridge.[/QUOTE]

*bzzt* I'm calling you on this. Having friends and family around is nice, but not everyone has this. Childcare and both parents working is a very, very difficult subject as there's a fine line between being cool to your employees and being unfair to the single workers.[/QUOTE]

I was raised by a single parent, and even when there weren't friends and family around, there were daycare services in the area that I could get dropped off at.

 

[General Specific]

Hell, the team I used to work on was open on Christmas Day because we had sites around the world. So, I have worked on Christmas Day in the past, MLK day is nothing.

 

[Rubicon]

A 5 year old isn't going to school. Even if they are Kindergarten is only a half a day, so you'd have to have arrangements long before bitching about a day off on MLK day. By age 8 I was riding the subway to school in NYC. Furthermore, you could request a half day at work. Six year olds can get themselves cereal, turn on the TV/Xbox. I know it's amazing to hear, but children are actual factual thinking human beings!

You edited the post.

But you said a 5 year old was old enough to stay at home alone. And even IF you consider the post eidt, you're saying a 6 year old (a big one year difference..) is still old enough to be left at home alone.

Anyways, I'm not debating it, because either this is truly how you would parent a child or you are just trolling, and in either case I don't want to get into a flame war because I disprove of such barbaric parenting techniques.

/end thread (for me at least)

 

[Chazwozel]

If a working parent is really concerned about MLK day, if necessary, they'll probably make calls and make some childcare happen. Don't let the fact that they need to make parenting decisions stop companies from making revenue for a day.

It's really not that hard to do either. There are these magical people in your life called friends and family. At the worst you end up paying a babysitter 20 bucks and 3 ice cream bars from your fridge.[/QUOTE]

*bzzt* I'm calling you on this. Having friends and family around is nice, but not everyone has this. Childcare and both parents working is a very, very difficult subject as there's a fine line between being cool to your employees and being unfair to the single workers.

And for 8 hours? $20? Cheap bastard.[/QUOTE]

Well Dave wait a minute. Kindergarten is four hours. 1st through 5th is from what 8-2 or 3 in the afternoon? 6 or 7 hours. You'd have to be picking up your kids or have arrangements to have them picked up from school anyway (or after school program I suppose). This whole topic is impossible to discuss in generalities because everyone has their own schedule. My point is that it's your own responsibility to make arrangements, not your employers.

 

[Chazwozel]

A 5 year old isn't going to school. Even if they are Kindergarten is only a half a day, so you'd have to have arrangements long before bitching about a day off on MLK day. By age 8 I was riding the subway to school in NYC. Furthermore, you could request a half day at work. Six year olds can get themselves cereal, turn on the TV/Xbox. I know it's amazing to hear, but children are actual factual thinking human beings!

You edited the post.



But you said a 5 year old was old enough to stay at home alone. And even IF you consider the post eidt, you're saying a 6 year old (a big one year difference..) is still old enough to be left at home alone.

Anyways, I'm not debating it, because either this is truly how you would parent a child or you are just trolling, and in either case I don't want to get into a flame war because I disprove of such barbaric parenting techniques.

/end thread (for me at least)[/QUOTE]


One year makes a big difference, chief.

 

[Allen who is Quiet]

I don't want to get into a flame war because I disprove of such barbaric parenting techniques.

Great typo.

 

[Dave]

If a working parent is really concerned about MLK day, if necessary, they'll probably make calls and make some childcare happen. Don't let the fact that they need to make parenting decisions stop companies from making revenue for a day.

It's really not that hard to do either. There are these magical people in your life called friends and family. At the worst you end up paying a babysitter 20 bucks and 3 ice cream bars from your fridge.[/QUOTE]

*bzzt* I'm calling you on this. Having friends and family around is nice, but not everyone has this. Childcare and both parents working is a very, very difficult subject as there's a fine line between being cool to your employees and being unfair to the single workers.

And for 8 hours? $20? Cheap bastard.[/QUOTE]

Well Dave wait a minute. Kindergarten is four hours. 1st through 5th is from what 8-2 or 3 in the afternoon? 6 or 7 hours. You'd have to be picking up your kids or have arrangements to have them picked up from school anyway (or after school program I suppose). This whole topic is impossible to discuss in generalities because everyone has their own schedule. My point is that it's your own responsibility to make arrangements, not your employers.[/QUOTE]

We're not necessarily talking about picking them up from school but about getting them taken care of if there would be no school - like MLK Day.

When my kids were that young we had no friends or family that could watch them and we sure as hell couldn't afford daycare. So if the wife was sick we were basically screwed.

And here's an interesting site that lists the legal ages of kids by state.

 

[Chazwozel]

If a working parent is really concerned about MLK day, if necessary, they'll probably make calls and make some childcare happen. Don't let the fact that they need to make parenting decisions stop companies from making revenue for a day.

It's really not that hard to do either. There are these magical people in your life called friends and family. At the worst you end up paying a babysitter 20 bucks and 3 ice cream bars from your fridge.[/QUOTE]

*bzzt* I'm calling you on this. Having friends and family around is nice, but not everyone has this. Childcare and both parents working is a very, very difficult subject as there's a fine line between being cool to your employees and being unfair to the single workers.

And for 8 hours? $20? Cheap bastard.[/QUOTE]

Well Dave wait a minute. Kindergarten is four hours. 1st through 5th is from what 8-2 or 3 in the afternoon? 6 or 7 hours. You'd have to be picking up your kids or have arrangements to have them picked up from school anyway (or after school program I suppose). This whole topic is impossible to discuss in generalities because everyone has their own schedule. My point is that it's your own responsibility to make arrangements, not your employers.[/QUOTE]

We're not necessarily talking about picking them up from school but about getting them taken care of if there would be no school - like MLK Day.

When my kids were that young we had no friends or family that could watch them and we sure as hell couldn't afford daycare. So if the wife was sick we were basically screwed.

And here's an interesting site that lists the legal ages of kids by state.[/QUOTE]

Pennsylvania None

And a lot of those ages are 8 years old too. Looks like I'm not exactly Conan the Barbarian afterall...

 

[Dave]

I was shocked at how many of them are either "none" or "it's just a guideline more than an actual rule". Frightening, really.