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On another board I saw a post about a hypothetical situation where the world's electrical infrastructure suddenly collapsed. The question was, what would happen if electricity was suddenly gone from today's society?

Most responses were...um...stupid. "I think I might live a couple of weeks without this power, but will miss it soon after that." or "Just think about all the automated doors that wont [sic] open anymore..."

Here was my response.

Let me use my prognosticating power and tell you what would happen if the electrical infrastructure collapsed with no way to EVER repair it. Let's assume that this is worldwide and not simply a United States thing.

1. The economies of the world would collapse. More than anything these days, all commerce is done through computers. Banking, stocks trading, etc. A large number of people no longer use cash for anything, but instead use debit cards. This would be a thing of the past. Without the backing of the government, the world currencies would collapse and people would need to barter for goods/services.
2. After the obligatory few days/hours when generators ran out of fuel, people would start to die. First would be the easy pickings or those who were in the wrong place at the wrong time - those on life support, those stuck in elevators, etc. After that would come the starvation. With no electricity, gas stations would no longer be able to pump fuel. The transportation infrastructure would basically become a wasteland. Nobody could drive. And that means no produce/food would be able to be imported or exported. If it wasn't made or grown in your own back yard you would not have access to it. Those in the cities would be hardest hit. In the country, families would band together with weapons to repel scavengers.
3. All communications would break down totally and completely. Without electricity, we wouldn't even be able to have shortwave radios or the telegraph. We'd be back to writing letters and handling our governing through the pony express.
4. Governments would dissolve. Yes, there would be some governments who could survive, but most would not. Armed citizens would carve out their own individual fiefdoms and the strongest would be the survivors. Who would listen to the centralized government when they were so far away? More immediate and pressing survival instincts would kick in. In the US I can see several states seceding from the union with no one able to stop them. Texas comes immediately to mind. In fact, most borders would become very elastic.
5. Most societies would revert back to a male-dominated culture as women would be forced back into the home to raise families. I know this one sounds like conjecture, but I guarantee it would happen.
6. One GOOD thing that would happen would be that those who survived would be in good shape. Couch potatoes will not survive. If you can't work, you won't eat. Cancer rates would plummet due to the lack of processed foods.

In short, a massive failure of the world's electrical infrastructure would spell an end to society as we know it. We'd be forced back to the PRE-dark ages. I say pre dark ages because we'd have to re-learn how to do things which back then they already knew how to do to survive. Like which plants in the wild could be eaten, how to build houses which could withstand winter cold, which natural cures work for common ailments which would kill us. Things like typhoid, simple infections, etc. We know how to cure them, but without the knowledge of how to make these things (can YOU make penicillin?) they would slowly cease to be available. Hell, diabetics would be screwed!

So in closing...

PLEASE DON'T TAKE AWAY OUR POWER!!

Couch potatoes make for good eatin'.

GasBandit said:

Couch potatoes make for good eatin'.

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Couch *Po-tay-toes!* Boil 'em, mash 'em, stick 'em in a stew...
Added at: 22:22
World Population figures would like fall beneath 3 Billion with in a decade, and continue to drop, until we are back at 1850's figures. (i.e. 1 Billion)

GasBandit said:

Couch potatoes make for good eatin'.

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To be honest, I was actually expecting you to come here with a wide grin and a plan to make this a reality. What with all the talk you have about the US breaking up and all... I figured Dave's hypothetical scenario would have been right up your alley.

It would suck for people that didn't grow up in the country and dont know how to clean an animal! I would moving my and my family in with my dad on his 40 acres and we would be eating dear and rabbit from his woods and fish from his lake.

Yeah Dave, that sounds about right.

You're thinking of shego, North

CrimsonSoul said:

It would suck for people that didn't grow up in the country and dont know how to clean an animal! I would moving my and my family in with my dad on his 40 acres and we would be eating dear and rabbit from his woods and fish from his lake.

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I do hope you mean 'deer', Crim. Unless you are talking about eatin' the young'uns, seeing how they would be the first to starve anyway...

You know that many gas pumps (or at least older models) can be opened up and operated manually, right? Not to mention that it's fairly simple to make an old fashioned pump and just siphon the gas that way. Sure, the Gas would run out but it's not exactly hard to make gas once you know how. Hell, they used to throw away gasoline back in the days before the internal combustion engine because no one knew what to use it for... it was just a byproduct of making kerosene. Anywhere with oil is going to exploit it.

Transportation would still be a problem initially, but what you'd eventually see is a re-emergence of rail. Electric engines would be scrapped and older steam powered models would once again be put into service. This would restore a lot of infrastructure in the country, allowing cattle/pigs/chickens and dry goods to once again be shipped around the country. Expect to see dams and bridges removed to allow river shipping as well. Horses will once again become a necessity and anyone with a breeding stock of them is going to become rich overnight.

Food would only become a problem after a week or two and only in certain areas of the country, but it will last until the rails and rivers are full of traders again. The Midwest and coastal/river areas will manage the best because they already have local food supplies to exploit, but expect the populations of many towns to ether die off or move on once it becomes apparent that growing/hunting food would be impossible there. There will once again become huge swaths of the country that are uninhabited.

Currency will once again become barter, though expect things like batteries and bullets to be used essentially like money is now. Anything lightweight, small, and with inherent value will be useful as currency for the same reasons we initially created currency. Expect base metals to be used for coins again. Paper money will die out until civilization can once again get it's shit together.

Crime will of course rise, especially in the first few months. However, it will once again be pushed to the frontier once vigilante posses (who will likely be the only law in the area) begin roaming communities and stamping out troublemakers. This isn't to say it will be FAIR law, but anyone who can enforce obedience essentially counts as the law in the area, whether they be just or unjust. Communities without such people will wither and die as they slowly consume themselves in an orgy of violence. Law was established for a reason and it's survived for as long as it has because you simply can't exist as a community without accountability.

Millions will die in the first year as people who've never had to/are unable/unwilling to fend for themselves die in the new world. Anyone in a large city is basically going to be dead if they don't get the hell out of Dodge.

Basically, the world is going to look a lot more like the American West before the invention of the telegraph, and considering some places in the world are STILL like that, it's hardly insurmountable. It'll be hard, but not as hard as some people like to imagine it would be. It's not like nukes went off and ruined huge areas or anything.

That's an optimistic view there, Ash.

The Amish will rejoice! They will survive.

I do believe that many people will die without electricity. Diabetic, cancer patient on treatment, life support, anything that require constant medication will die since such medication will not be available. The tougher one will survive.

Books will be a commodity since e-books and internet is not longer available. A lot of people might commit suicide since "their world" is gone and cannot cope (like the big crash in the market)

There will be ban of vigilantes govern an area. The strong will rule the weak.

I think the military and the police would become fairly dangerous to the civilians of the new world until some sort of order is established.

Gryfter said:

That's an optimistic view there, Ash.

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It's only a limited scenario, hence why it's so optimistic. A nuclear apocalypse would be far worse because of weather changes, radiation, and because large supplies of resources are suddenly becoming tainted or destroyed. A situation without electricity is pretty much the best you could hope for, as far as world changing events go.

Frankie Williamson said:

I think the military and the police would become fairly dangerous to the civilians of the new world until some sort of order is established.

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They already have plans to seize large stores and other stockpiles in the event of something of this magnitude. Control of the Supply chain is crucial to the long term survival of an institution. The only question would be who shows up to support the government, who stays with their family to help them survive, who runs off with military grade hardware, and how loyal the soldiers still are after a week or two of fighting off hungry locals.

North_Ranger said:

To be honest, I was actually expecting you to come here with a wide grin and a plan to make this a reality. What with all the talk you have about the US breaking up and all... I figured Dave's hypothetical scenario would have been right up your alley.

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Well, this scenario is just that - hypothetical. I can't imagine what quirk of physics would cause ALL ELECTRICITY EVERYWHAAR to suddenly stop working. The collapse I more often talk about is political/economic in nature, and doesn't require science fiction. And I don't NEED to "plan" to make it a reality, all my fellow Americans are doing the heavy lifting for that already

I'm just sharpening my silverware and picking out the best spices that will bring out the flavor in my neighbors. I'm thinking of a rub, a mixture of salt, black pepper, garlic powder, onion powder, thyme, paprika, and cayenne powder. Zesty.

GasBandit said:

I'm just sharpening my silverware and picking out the best spices that will bring out the flavor in my neighbors. I'm thinking of a rub, a mixture of salt, black pepper, garlic powder, onion powder, thyme, paprika, and cayenne powder. Zesty.

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Cannibals report that human tastes pretty close to pork... so that would be the starting place for any recipes.

In reply to the emergence of rail. Good thing I'm a certified loco
Price engineer!

WTF autocorrect locomotive engineer

CrimsonSoul said:

WTF autocorrect locomotive engineer

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That's too bad, your first post was much better. "Good thing I'm certified loco!" had me guffawing.

You can't say that processed foods are the primary cause of cancer, so you can't make the conclusion that cancer rates would increase or decrease. I guess rates of cancer might decrease due overall mortality rates increasing (you can't get cancer when you're 80, when you're dead at 60).

I'd guess within a decade or two of the initial shock of an electricity less society, things would look a lot like the early 1800's before Edison and Tesla came along.
Added at: 20:02

AshburnerX said:

Currency will once again become barter, though expect things like batteries and bullets to be used essentially like money is now. Anything lightweight, small, and with inherent value will be useful as currency for the same reasons we initially created currency. Expect base metals to be used for coins again. Paper money will die out until civilization can once again get it's shit together.

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Uh, no it won't. Societies have used currency since before Rome existed; since like 7th century China.

Mathias said:

Uh, no it won't. Societies have used currency since before Rome existed; since like 7th century China.

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I didn't say it would die out entirely, only that paper money would be gone for awhile. It would eventually come back once there was a strong, unified government. However, currency only works when there is ether a central power verifying and enforcing it's value or when it is inherently valuable. Paper and coins made of cheap, common metals aren't exactly useful if what everyone wants is food, bullets, and medicine.

I think I shall remain on this beautiful island. There are coconuts and mangoes fresh off the tree right up the street. I know where there are a few orange trees and papayas, too. My son's kindergarten teacher has a ranch, so we could get eggs and her husband is a veterinarian...so we'd have someone with better than first aid knowledge in the group. Also, lots of fish. I could break into the local library (around the corner from my house) for a book on indigenous plants. Just need a fresh water source and I think we could do ok.

This thread is masturbation for this guy:



Also, the flow of electrons across a potential is not going to magically stop happening anytime EVER, so this thread is pretty much the exact definition of masturbation.

You might as well jerk off to: gravity is going to stop; how's that put a damper on your day?

I guess that's why it's hypothetical and not "zOMG TEH END OF TEH WORLDZ!"

Wasabi Poptart said:

I guess that's why it's hypothetical and not "zOMG TEH END OF TEH WORLDZ!"

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How's it hypothetical if it has like 0 probability of ever occurring? Nuclear War - sure I can buy that. Hell, I can even bite with a fucking zombie apocalypse occurring before trying to rationalize what I'd do or what would happen in a situation where electricity stops working.

The thing I love reading about are the mouth-breathers who relish this sort of shit, when the reality is they'd be the first to go in any crisis station.

What If a wide scale electromagnetic pulse was generated by some government agency outside of a nuclear blast? Also 30 minutes ago half of my city lost power so I'm chilling at my moms with my kids till it's back om

I know I'd be doomed in any no-electricity situation. After Hurricane Ike in 2008 just a single day without air-conditioning was enough to leave me in bad shape, over-heated to the point of minor hallucinations. If there hadn't been a cool front the next day, I'm not sure what we've had done. My overall health is much better now, but I sleep breathing from an oxygen concentrator, and I'm really sensitive to changes in my diet. I might not die as quickly now, but I'd still be useless until I did.

CrimsonSoul said:

What If a wide scale electromagnetic pulse was generated by some government agency outside of a nuclear blast? Also 30 minutes ago half of my city lost power so I'm chilling at my moms with my kids till it's back om

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/facepalm. Electricity is a function of a fundamental physical force. You can't just make it go away. We know how to make electricity. EM pulse happens --> what's broken get's fixed. Life goes on. Tralala. And an EM pulse would have no outstanding effect on wires or the mechanical processes that make electricity. The bulk of electrical power is made from spinning turbines via heat making steam; water flow, or wind, The only power plant that could massively suffer from a fundamental failure in electricity production is possible a solar plant because of damage to the photovoltaic cells would stop them from doing their thing.

How about if Evil Dr. Porkchop uses his disintegration ray to destroy 98% of the worlds power generating stations and transmission lines?

It would be like the longest camping trip ever. Also I'd try to figure out what citrus fruits grow in sodak... don't want to die of dysentery.

Aliens arrive and constantly bombard the Earth with EMPs to keep our technological growth stunted.

Dr. Evil ransoms the world's energy sources for ....one MILLION dollars!

The electricity was clearly stolen by V.I.L.E villain Maggie Net.

Capture her and you are on your way to finding the elusive Carmen Sandiago.

I agree with Mathias. I know too many farmers that were able to convert old windmills to generate electricity before power lines were brought out to them to believe we would be completely without power for very long. Having no power would have to be combined with some other horrible disaster to have a huge effect.

A fungus that feeds on aluminum power lines!

A global army of squirrels!

Wasabi Poptart said:

A global army of squirrels!

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North ranger!

I'll get the irradiated pea soup ready...

Okay, maybe we can change this to a worldwide economic collapse. Eventually for most places the electricity would run out anyway.

Mathias said:

/facepalm. Electricity is a function of a fundamental physical force. You can't just make it go away. We know how to make electricity. EM pulse happens --> what's broken get's fixed. Life goes on. Tralala. And an EM pulse would have no outstanding effect on wires or the mechanical processes that make electricity. The bulk of electrical power is made from spinning turbines via heat making steam; water flow, or wind, The only power plant that could massively suffer from a fundamental failure in electricity production is possible a solar plant because of damage to the photovoltaic cells would stop them from doing their thing.

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This. I always hate how on movies EMPs are like magical anti-electric device things. They might disrupt something or erase magnetic media. IF you had a strong enough blast with a short enough duration, you could overload circuitry, maybe burn things out. But it's not going to affect things like car solenoids (which I think was what they had to replace in War of the Worlds if I recall correctly), which are designed for massive current flow--that's more or less their purpose of existence. Even given a worse case scenario, nothing is permanent. You can always repair afterwards. If you have some constant monotonically oscillating EM "P" strong enough to continue the damage, then your body will possibly be cooked anyway

This is making me think of the plot to Escape from L.A.

Sweet! I can get an eye patch!

But without the EMP disaster you wouldnt get the jessica alba dark angel. Who wants to lose that? science be damned!

A wizard did it.

Heh. I didn't even think in the realm of science fiction. I was thinking of possible nuclear war (the kind we actually survive more or less) and lost electricity after the generators are out of fuel. Then what?

Then we all get psychic intelligent dogs who help us sniff out the womens we will eventually eat.

Ahem.

http://www.amazon.com/Dies-Fire-S-M-Stirling/dp/0451459792

Well worth a read, IMHO

I have never seen such an even spread of reviews for anything before. One through five stars have almost the same amount of votes.

As with most fiction, you have to suspend your disbelief for it to work truly effectively, but I rather enjoyed it, and if examples portrayed in the novel seem to be more extreme or larger-than-life than should be necessary, I took them as object lessons, rather than direct issues.

Dave said:

Okay, maybe we can change this to a worldwide economic collapse. Eventually for most places the electricity would run out anyway.

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Oh, ok. Well, NOW we're back in old familiar territory.


... why does that NEVER WORK...

You have to put something else in there with the image. Like a period or something.

Electricity is magic!

Frankie Williamson said:

Then we all get psychic intelligent dogs who help us sniff out the womens we will eventually eat.

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Sorry, sweetie. You're already offering yourself up as Canadian bacon. You'll be the first to be chowed.