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Who's faster, Superman or Flash?

Mar 23, 2011#1

strawman

Apparently DC Comics shut down their forum due to vitriolic ad hominem attacks flying around a thread where fans were vigorously debating the life and death topic mentioned in this thread's title.

Enough of that, though, who's really faster?

Mar 23, 2011#2

sixpackshaker

Golden Age, Silver Age, or Bronze Age Flash?

Mar 23, 2011#3

PatrThom

If we're going to debate this seriously (and what subject deserves it more, really?), we will have to establish some prerequisites:
-Which Flash?
-Which Superman?
-Does the method matter? (Running v. flying)
-Can one of them really go faster than the other? (Both have gone fast enough to break the time barrier at some point)
-Can we discuss this civilly?
-Will the trolls from the other forum come here to continue their mayhem?
-Which trolls will lock the thread faster? Ours or theirs?

--Patrick

Mar 23, 2011#4

MindDetective

Flash. I offer no support for my claim whatsoever.

Mar 23, 2011#5

Allen who is Quiet

Faster at what?

Mar 23, 2011#6

Jiarn

Which would I like to be faster? Flash. Why? Cause that's the only thing the poor guy has going for him.
Which is most likely to be right? Superman Why? Cause he's DC's God.

Mar 23, 2011#7

figmentPez

First Lady Puffinstuff said:
Enough of that, though, who's really faster?

The Flash is faster, just by a hair.
The Superman-Flash Races
The article covers the 6 races (that were finished to some degree) between the Flash and Superman that have taken place in DC Comics. Of those six, two finished in ties and four finished with the Flash winning (Wally West took two, Barry Allen and Jay Garrick each took one).

An interesting comment in the article:

Note: in this post-Crisis on Infinite Earths story, the two of them are only able to hit about four times the speed of sound. In the earlier races, both Superman and Barry could easily exceed the speed of light. In recent years, Wally has regained near-light speed, and Superman seems to be able to keep up with him. Apparently, Superman’s speed is defined to be just about as fast as the Flash.

Admittedly, a Flash fan-site is a biased source of information, but it's been said by multiple DC writers that the Flash has, potentially, the most power of any DC hero. If Superman were every bit as fast as the Flash, then the speed-force wouldn't have any edge over Kryptonian physiology.

Mar 23, 2011#8

Fun Size

Allen who is Quiet said:
Faster at what?

Only Lois Lane knows for sure.

Mar 23, 2011#9

Shakey

PatrThom said:
-Will the trolls from the other forum come here to continue their mayhem?

Let them come. I have a feeling our mods have gotten a bit bored lately.

Mar 23, 2011#10

strawman

Fun Size said:
Only Lois Lane knows for sure.

Wait, did she date the flash too?!

Mar 23, 2011#11

Jiarn

figmentPez said:
The Flash is faster, just by a hair.
The Superman-Flash Races
The article covers the 6 races (that were finished to some degree) between the Flash and Superman that have taken place in DC Comics. Of those six, two finished in ties and four finished with the Flash winning (Wally West took two, Barry Allen and Jay Garrick each took one).

An interesting comment in the article:

Admittedly, a Flash fan-site is a biased source of information, but it's been said by multiple DC writers that the Flash has, potentially, the most power of any DC hero. If Superman were every bit as fast as the Flash, then the speed-force wouldn't have any edge over Kryptonian physiology.

Not to mention it took speed-force to contain Superboy-Prime, when nothingelse could. Granted he did escape, it did contain him for a while.

Mar 23, 2011#12

Silver Jelly

I've always thought the Flash has to be faster because that's what defines his character. As I see him, he isn't just fast. He is "faster". But, of course, when ansquering these kinds of questions, I decide to ignore all in-universe facts and give a metatextual opinion, wich is probably not that interesting in comic book terms,

Mar 23, 2011#13

Jiarn

Where's JCM at? He always liked these....

Mar 23, 2011#14

sixpackshaker

Is Reverse-Flash the slowest creature in the universe?

Mar 23, 2011#15

AshburnerX

figmentPez said:
Admittedly, a Flash fan-site is a biased source of information, but it's been said by multiple DC writers that the Flash has, potentially, the most power of any DC hero. If Superman were every bit as fast as the Flash, then the speed-force wouldn't have any edge over Kryptonian physiology.

Let me put it this way... in the DCAU, the Flash was able to do this...

... where as Superman, Hawkgirl, Wonder Woman, Green Lantern, Batman, and the Martian Manhunter combined couldn't due crap. The Flash may not be as versatile or durable as Superman, nor can he fly (as well anyway), but the Flash can do the few things he can do better than anyone else. He's simply limited in that he can't really use the full range of his speed without it utterly destroying the area around him, not to mention he risks things like accidental time travel or becoming one with the Speed Force if he does.

TL;DR - Flash is faster, by far. He's simply unable to use the full range of his speed 99% of the time.

Mar 23, 2011#16

Allen who is Quiet

I think if Lex were a part of the Flash's rogue gallery, he wouldn't have gotten away with stealing 40 cakes.

Mar 23, 2011#17

Gusto

Allen who is Quiet said:
I think if Lex were a part of the Flash's rogue gallery, he wouldn't have gotten away with stealing 40 cakes.

That would be awful.

Mar 23, 2011#18

Tress

I would laugh that such a silly thread got out of hand on a comic forum, but then again we've had a forum meltdown over steak. Not to mention the proper way to wipe one's own ass.

Based on my incredibly limited knowledge of DC comics, I would say the Flash is the fastest.

Mar 23, 2011#19

figmentPez

sixpackshaker said:
Is Reverse-Flash the slowest creature in the universe?

You mean Professor Zoom?

Nah, he's just as fast as the Flash is. Bizarro Flash is fast as well (though one version is so fat he can't run, so he flies, comics make no sense.)

Mar 23, 2011#20

sixpackshaker

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reverse-Flash

There are 3 and Zoom was one.

Mar 23, 2011#21

HCGLNS

The Flash is faster, because Superman is too much of a sissy to ever use the full extent of his powers.

Superman is all like "I must control myself, I am a titan among cardboard men. I dare not use all of my powers, for it may scatter them to the wind."

While the Flash is all like "I'm the Flash! I'm the FLASH! Suck my dick Super bitch! I'm the Mother Fucking FLASH!!!"

Mar 23, 2011#22

ThatNickGuy

Pfft. That's easy. The answer is:

Mar 23, 2011#23

Krisken

The best bit of that video was Batman helping to pull him back. I bet he made all the difference, too.

Mar 23, 2011#24

AshburnerX

ThatNickGuy said:
Pfft. That's easy. The answer is:...

Mar 23, 2011#25

Chibibar

AshburnerX said:
Let me put it this way... in the DCAU, the Flash was able to do this...

... where as Superman, Hawkgirl, Wonder Woman, Green Lantern, Batman, and the Martian Manhunter combined couldn't due crap. The Flash may not be as versatile or durable as Superman, nor can he fly (as well anyway), but the Flash can do the few things he can do better than anyone else. He's simply limited in that he can't really use the full range of his speed without it utterly destroying the area around him, not to mention he risks things like accidental time travel or becoming one with the Speed Force if he does.

TL;DR - Flash is faster, by far. He's simply unable to use the full range of his speed 99% of the time.

I have to agree with this. Flash main power is speed. It would make sense that if speed is his main power, that he should be the fastest.

Mar 23, 2011#26

ThatNickGuy

Pretty much what the Chibster said. Why have a guy called the "Fastest Man Alive" if someone else can beat him in a race. I love Superman and all, but Flash is in my top 5, as well.

Before he could tap into the Speed Force? Maybe. Now? Pfft, screw it. The Man of Steel'd be eating his dust.

Mar 23, 2011#27

HCGLNS

Batman is the fastest.

/thread

Mar 23, 2011#28

Made Ya Blush

Flash nuf said.

Mar 23, 2011#29

Mathias

Considering Flash's name suggests his only single super-power, he damn well better deliver and be faster than Superman. And considering that nothing can go faster than 99.99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 to the infinity % of the speed of light, I'd say that's the limit to Flash's ability.

And really? The Speed Force? Just say that he approached the speed of light, and almost transitioned into a being of pure energy. What a bunch of retarded writers. Speed Force, lol!
Added at: 18:33

Krisken said:
The best bit of that video was Batman helping to pull him back. I bet he made all the difference, too.

Haha! I thought the same thing. It's like a little kid helping his dad to "lift" a heavy object.

Mar 23, 2011#30

North_Ranger

Flash.

Just because.

Mar 23, 2011#31

ThatNickGuy

I like the Speed Force.

They explained it kinda in the comics (I think; don't have it in front of me to double check). Basically, it's a realm where all energy from speed, used and potential, is gathered. The Flash is able to tap into that. There was a supervillain named Savitar that was able to tap into it with greater ability. He was able to steal speed from items and lend speed to objects and people.

It led to some fun stories, to be honest. Though writers over the years since it was introduced have gotten lazy and pretty much relied on it. To be honest, I always liked the more scientific explanation, where he had to eat a LOT just to keep up with his fast metabolism.
Added at: 17:52

HCGLNS said:
Batman is the fastest.

/thread

I...wait, hang on...

Mar 23, 2011#32

Baerdog

HCGLNS said:
Batman is the fastest.

/thread

But only with preparation.

Mar 23, 2011#33

phil

AshburnerX said:
Let me put it this way... in the DCAU, the Flash was able to do this...

... where as Superman, Hawkgirl, Wonder Woman, Green Lantern, Batman, and the Martian Manhunter combined couldn't due crap. The Flash may not be as versatile or durable as Superman, nor can he fly (as well anyway), but the Flash can do the few things he can do better than anyone else. He's simply limited in that he can't really use the full range of his speed without it utterly destroying the area around him, not to mention he risks things like accidental time travel or becoming one with the Speed Force if he does.

TL;DR - Flash is faster, by far. He's simply unable to use the full range of his speed 99% of the time.

What I love about that clip is when Hawkgirl tries to pull him out of that portal, and then GL grabs her to anchor her and then of course Martian Manhunter, effing superman AND wonderwoman (all of whom have super strength) all grab on too........THEN Batman because...you know, why the hell not? And of course it's not until Batman joins in that they actually make any progress.

Mar 23, 2011#34

Calleja

The Flash is FUCKING FAST:

That being said, in a less "the writer MUST have fucked that up" way:

So there.

Mar 23, 2011#35

Adammon

figmentPez said:
You mean Professor Zoom?

Nah, he's just as fast as the Flash is. Bizarro Flash is fast as well (though one version is so fat he can't run, so he flies, comics make no sense.)

Point of order! Zoom (The new Zoom) exists outside of the time stream, acting more like a rock thrown across a pool, skipping across our dimension. He's not super fast, he just exists outside of time making speed inconsequential.

Mar 23, 2011#36

LittleSin

The Flash is in my top five superheroes, ranking at number 2. The Flash will win. Always. I'm not even going to justify is cuz...fuck all ye all, The Flash is the shit.

Mar 23, 2011#37

ThatNickGuy

LittleSin said:
The Flash is in my top five superheroes, ranking at number 2. The Flash will win. Always. I'm not even going to justify is cuz...fuck all ye all, The Flash is the shit.

Outta curiosity: who's #1?

Mar 23, 2011#38

LittleSin

ThatNickGuy said:
Outta curiosity: who's #1?

Green Lantern, Hal Jordan.

Mar 23, 2011#39

figmentPez

LittleSin said:
Green Lantern, Hal Jordan.

The lady has good taste.

Mar 23, 2011#40

Gusto

Fliggity Flash.

Mar 23, 2011#41

CynicismKills

http://i.imgur.com/sF8WT.jpg

Don't have the source, unfortunately. But damn, that's awesome.

Mar 23, 2011#42

LittleSin

CynicismKills said:
http://i.imgur.com/sF8WT.jpg

Don't have the source, unfortunately. But damn, that's awesome.

It's from Flash Rebirth.

Mar 23, 2011#43

Calleja

CynicismKills said:
http://i.imgur.com/sF8WT.jpg

Don't have the source, unfortunately. But damn, that's awesome.

I POSTED THAT WHOLE PAGE IN THIS VERY THREAD DAMMIT!! DAMN YOU ALL FOR NOT NOTICING!!!

Mar 23, 2011#44

LittleSin

I noticed.

I didn't comment because, well, how much more can you add to awesome?

Mar 23, 2011#45

Allen who is Quiet

Notice what?

Mar 23, 2011#46

CynicismKills

Stuff isn't always loading for me for some reason, didn't see it.

Mar 24, 2011#47

Adammon

Flash is my #1 fave. I've probably read every Wally West Flash comic about three times. From his millionaire days to his Porcupine Man persona, all the way to his alternate future self coming back all scarred to shit claiming to be the real Wally West. To BitTorrent I go!

Mar 24, 2011#48

fade

I always loved the Flash. He's probably my 2nd favorite character (behind the Hulk). Wally was my favorite. No. Scratch that. DCAU's Wally/Barry mash-up (yes, I know they called him wally later on, but he has barry elements, too) is my favorite.

Mar 24, 2011#49

sixpackshaker

Baerdog said:
But only with preparation.

If Batman is always so prepared.... why do people call Superman the boyscout?

Mar 24, 2011#50

AshburnerX

sixpackshaker said:
If Batman is always so prepared.... why do people call Superman the boyscout?

Because Batman was never a scout... because his parents were dead!

Mar 27, 2011#51

Zappit

This is EXACTLY why multiverses DON'T work. Which Flash? Which Superman? Which Earth? I can buy the argument on different characters (for Flash) but that multiverse makes everything a mess.

And then DC went Anti-Monitor on their forums.

Mar 27, 2011#52

figmentPez

Zappit said:
This is EXACTLY why multiverses DON'T work. Which Flash? Which Superman? Which Earth? I can buy the argument on different characters (for Flash) but that multiverse makes everything a mess.

Huh? I don't see why this is an argument against a multiverse. So what if the Superman from universe #31 is faster than the Flash from universe #412? How does making the question more complex somehow ruin the entire DC universe?

Heck, if there are an infinite number of alternate universes in DC comics, then in at least one of them Superman tapped into the speed force. Heck, in at least one of those the Flash is still faster because that Superman went so fast he got stuck in time (as almost happened to... the Flash? Max Mercury? I can't remember, they combined their own speed with Johnny Quick's mathematical speed formula). In another world the question is completely moot, because Superman and the Flash are the same person.

Who is faster? Whoever the story needs to be, and there are a lot of stories to be told.

Mar 27, 2011#53

Hailey Knight

fade said:
I always loved the Flash. He's probably my 2nd favorite character (behind the Hulk). Wally was my favorite. No. Scratch that. DCAU's Wally/Barry mash-up (yes, I know they called him wally later on, but he has barry elements, too) is my favorite.

The DCAU is what I consider the canon for DC.

Mar 27, 2011#54

LittleSin

figmentPez said:
Huh? I don't see why this is an argument against a multiverse. So what if the Superman from universe #31 is faster than the Flash from universe #412? How does making the question more complex somehow ruin the entire DC universe?

Heck, if there are an infinite number of alternate universes in DC comics, then in at least one of them Superman tapped into the speed force. Heck, in at least one of those the Flash is still faster because that Superman went so fast he got stuck in time (as almost happened to... the Flash? Max Mercury? I can't remember, they combined their own speed with Johnny Quick's mathematical speed formula). In another world the question is completely moot, because Superman and the Flash are the same person.

Who is faster? Whoever the story needs to be, and there are a lot of stories to be told.

Pst...there's only 52 universes. So, there isn't even that many multiverses to get up set over.

Also, your post is number 52! Cool, right?!

Mar 27, 2011#55

Gusto

52 is my lucky number. I am absolutely serious.

Mar 27, 2011#56

fade

You know what I loved about the Flash? He and Spidey were like the only two characters in all of comics who seemed to absolutely love and revel in their superpowers.

P.S. I will put my fingers in my ears and go lalalalalala in you point at any post mid-90s wangsty spidey stories.

Mar 27, 2011#57

Hailey Knight

fade said:
P.S. I will put my fingers in my ears and go lalalalalala in you point at any post mid-90s wangsty spidey stories.

You wouldn't like them anyway.

Because they were absolute shit. I hated that fucking Clone Saga.

Mar 27, 2011#58

LordRendar

AshburnerX said:
Because Batman was never a scout... because his parents were dead!

/snip

im embarassed to admit it,but that made me do a spittake...

Mar 27, 2011#59

ThatNickGuy

At the Clone Saga was leagues better than Spidey making a deal with the devil in exchange for his marriage.

Mar 27, 2011#60

AshburnerX

escushion said:
The DCAU is what I consider the canon for DC.

Parts of the DCAU are considered canon for the mainstream DC universe. For instance, all of the events of Batman Beyond (including Return of the Joker) are considered canon for the new Batman Beyond comic.

Mar 27, 2011#61

figmentPez

LittleSin said:
Pst...there's only 52 universes. So, there isn't even that many multiverses to get up set over.

Also, your post is number 52! Cool, right?!

Really? There were numbered ones up in the thousands in the past. I haven't kept up on the current multiverse. I assumed that when they brought the concept back that they'd gone whole hog.
Added at: 15:04

fade said:
You know what I loved about the Flash? He and Spidey were like the only two characters in all of comics who seemed to absolutely love and revel in their superpowers.

Which is why "Flash and Substance" is my favorite episode of Justice League Unlimited. I like superheroes enjoying being super and being nice about it.

Mar 27, 2011#62

Hailey Knight

ThatNickGuy said:
At the Clone Saga was leagues better than Spidey making a deal with the devil in exchange for his marriage.

Yeah, things never got better apparently. The Clone Saga made me quit Spidey comics; and nothing I've heard tells me I made a bad choice.

Mar 27, 2011#63

figmentPez

The recent relaunch of the Flash #1 is free to read online, and unlike some other free first issues I've seen (Velocity #1), the text is actually legible. It's a good read, really tempts me to start reading regularly.

Mar 27, 2011#64

checkeredhat

escushion said:
Yeah, things never got better apparently. The Clone Saga made me quit Spidey comics; and nothing I've heard tells me I made a bad choice.

I also stopped reading Spidey after the Clone saga. But I picked it back up again around when JMS started writing, and although I didn't read his entire run, most of what I read was cool. I think the Amazing Spider-Man story from Civil War was probably the best part, until... well.... *shudders*

And that's when I gave it up again.
Added at: 05:00

Calleja said:
So there.

That's just all kinds of awesome, I have to admit.

And knowing next to nothing about Flash or the DC Universe in general, I think the Flash would HAVE to be faster than Superman. It just makes sense.

Mar 27, 2011#65

SpecialKO

checkeredhat said:
I also stopped reading Spidey after the Clone saga. But I picked it back up again around when JMS started writing, and although I didn't read his entire run, most of what I read was cool. I think the Amazing Spider-Man story from Civil War was probably the best part, until... well.... *shudders*

And that's when I gave it up again.

JMS' run on Spidey was the best any Spidey title had been in literally decades...and then that happened.

My favorite Flash bit, from Grant Morrison's JLA run a while back.

Mar 28, 2011#66

@Li3n

checkeredhat said:
That's just all kinds of awesome, I have to admit.

And knowing next to nothing about Flash or the DC Universe in general, I think the Flash would HAVE to be faster than Superman. It just makes sense.

You'd think that... but for the longest time DC didn't... because Supes had to be the best at everything ever, and then the universe had to end to bring his powers back to non-silly levels...

SpecialKO said:
My favorite Flash bit, from Grant Morrison's JLA run a while back.

I still like this better:

http://www.hyperborea.org/flash/images/quasar5.gif

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