Export thread

So, the time has come to upgrade my rig. It still runs most games pretty well, but higher end games cause it to struggle on max settings, and I'm not a member of the PC gaming master race to run things on medium.

Here's my current specs:

Intel Cure2 Duo E8400 3.00GHZ
8GB DDR2-800 PC6400
nVidia GeForce GTX570
Asus P5N-D Nvidia nForce 750i SLI Chipset w/7.1 Sound, Gb LAN, S-ATA Raid, USB 2.0, IEEE-1394, Dual PCI-E

Now, obviously, that older cpu is holding me back, but replacing that is going to mean replacing the motherboard too. And if I'm going to do that, should I just upgrade the whole system? Give me your advice. I have a budget of about $1000.

You can build a mean goddamn computer for $1000.

GasBandit said:

You can build a mean goddamn computer for $1000.

Click to expand...

I realize that, I should have said that's my max budget, I'm always looking for ways to get more for less. There's no real need to build a new pc though, as I already have a great case and peripherals.

Here's the specs on the really nice computer my friend bought me when mine died back in December.

CPU:
Intel Core i5-4670 Haswell 3.4GHz LGA 1150 84W Quad-Core Desktop Processor Intel HD Graphics BX80646I54670 $219
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116898

MOBO:
ASUS Z87-K LGA 1150 Intel Z87 HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard with UEFI BIOS $117
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131983

HDD (SSD really):
Kingston HyperX 3K SH103S3/120G 2.5" 120GB SATA III MLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD) (Stand-Alone Drive) $99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820239045
(Seriously, this SSD is great. From power button to logged in in 7 seconds, and 4 of those seconds is bios POSTing)

Case:
NZXT H2 H2-001-BK Black Steel / Plastic Classic Silent ATX Mid Tower Chassis $99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811146072
(That case is awesome. Even after I installed a conventional platter drive in it later, I still can't tell by listening in the quiet room whether it is on or not)

RAM:
G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model F3-12800CL9D-8GBRL $79
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231314

GPU:
GIGABYTE GV-R927XOC-4GD Radeon R9 270X 4GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 3.0 HDCP Ready Video Card $299
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125476
(Price has gone up 90 bucks on this, was 209... you might want to look at an alternative)

PSU:
CORSAIR CXM series CX600M 600W ATX12V v2.3 SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Modular Active PFC Power Supply $79
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139048
(Only 600w? But what can I say, it handles whatever I throw at it)


Grand total before shipping: $991

I've yet to find a game that goes under 60fps on highest settings in this rig. The GPU is a bit... quirky... though. Maybe you'd want to look at a GeForce GTX 770 for $339.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125463


XX

There have been some improvements, of course, but the most budget-affecting decision is going to be...how much do you plan to reuse?

--Patrick

PatrThom said:

There have been some improvements, of course, but the most budget-affecting decision is going to be...how much do you plan to reuse?

--Patrick

Click to expand...

I'll be reusing the case, drives, and power supply, and I have my own copy of windows 7 to use. I might get another harddrive, since my 500gb media drive and 225gb ssd are running out of room.

If it helps your decision at all, word is just coming out that the next generation of motherboard chipsets should drop some time in June/July.

--Patrick

Hey @PatrThom - what do you think about these specs in a laptop? I'd go desktop but I don't have a good place to set up a "permanent" table. I have not been paying attention to hardware much and I can treat myself this via a work-purchase program.

It's an Acer Aspire V3-772G-9460:

Windows 8 - 64-bit version
Intel® Core™ i7-4702MQ processor (2.2GHz/3.2GHz w/ Turbo Boost)
12GB DDR3L memory
1TB hard drive
120GB solid state drive
17.3" Full HD+ widescreen CineCrystal™ LCD display (1920 x 1080)
NVIDIA® GeForce® GTX 760M w/ 2GB GDDR5 VRAM
Mobile Intel® HM86 Express chipset
Blu-ray Disc™/DVD±RW DL
high definition audio
Dolby® Advanced Audio® v4 audio
USB 3.0 - card reader
2.5-hour battery

I rarely use a laptop without plugging it in, so the predicted 2.5 hour battery doesn't really concern me.

(Sorry to hijack the thread but I didn't want to really start a new one - I'd be upgrading to this from a Core i3 Dual Core 2.27 w/6GB Memory).

I caution strongly where Acer is concerned. When I worked in retail, the Acers were not the bottom-of-the-barrel most-returned computers only because Packard Bell still existed at the time. It may work out well for you, but I've got a lifelong bias against their QC.

Packard Bell still exists today, it is just a subsidiary of Acer. It's also where Gateway and eMachines ended up once they ceased being independent entities.

--Patrick

PatrThom said:

Packard Bell still exists today, it is just a subsidiary of Acer. It's also where Gateway and eMachines ended up once they ceased being independent entities.

--Patrick

Click to expand...

This is not an improvement.

PatrThom said:

If it helps your decision at all, word is just coming out that the next generation of motherboard chipsets should drop some time in June/July.

--Patrick

Click to expand...

I'm not falling into that trap again. If I decide to wait for the next thing to come out, I'll wait forever.

Ravenpoe said:

I'm not falling into that trap again. If I decide to wait for the next thing to come out, I'll wait forever.

Click to expand...

The trick is, when the next thing comes out, the previous thing experiences a price drop. It's sort of like a sine wave of measuring price vs performance. So yes, the "new thing" comes out every year. But that's when last year's thing gets cheap.

In related news, I just bought a 27 inch viewsonic monitor for $240. 20 or even 10-year-ago me would be blown away by that. Why is it so cheap? Because it's 1920x1080... and the new standard in 27+ inch monitors is 2560x1440.

Ravenpoe said:

I'm not falling into that trap again. If I decide to wait for the next thing to come out, I'll wait forever.

Click to expand...

I'm not saying you need to wait (I only learned about the 9x-series chipsets just today), I'm just letting you know how far away you are from the next generation, the next technological rest stop, as it were, in order to determine whether it will have any influence on your planned progression.

To that end, it looks like you are probably OK for now sticking with the 570 GPU, so really the only things you will need to replace are the CPU, MLB, and RAM. Right now, $1G can buy you an awful lot of that. You will probably want an ATX-sized board based on the Z87 chipset and with 4xRAM slots. There are plenty of boards out there that fit the bill, including some pretty exotic solutions like the Sabertooth from ASUS with its armor plating. I have no personal experience with this generation of MLBs, but I would recommend that whichever one you choose be based on UEFI rather than BIOS. BIOS-based boards will limit your future expandability/peripherals.

For the CPU, get the i5-4670K. It's $100 cheaper than the 4770K and only 100MHz slower. Plus you can overclock it and then the speed difference might as well not even be there.

As for RAM, get 2 sticks totalling either 8GB or 16GB of DDR3-1600 RAM, whichever is half the max your motherboard will support.

Those three components should revitalize your system well enough, but if you still MUST have a new GPU, look at the GTX 760 as a reasonably-priced upgrade from the 570. Then sell your 570.

GasBandit said:

the new standard in 27+ inch monitors is 2560x1440.

Click to expand...

If by "new" you mean "since 2009."

--Patrick

ncts_dodge_man said:

Hey @PatrThom - what do you think about these specs in a laptop?

Click to expand...

The specs look good. If GPU/CPU were ranked like cards, you'd be holding either J/Q or Q/K.
Only recommendation if you plan to use that for gaming would be to enter setup and disable hyperthreading, if it gives you that option.

--Patrick

PatrThom said:

If by "new" you mean "since 2009."

--Patrick

Click to expand...

Yeah, Last time I had to buy a monitor was 2007, when I got a 22" monitor for about the same price I just got a 27", so that is pretty much what I meant.

PatrThom said:

I'm not saying you need to wait (I only learned about the 9x-series chipsets just today), I'm just letting you know how far away you are from the next generation, the next technological rest stop, as it were, in order to determine whether it will have any influence on your planned progression.

To that end, it looks like you are probably OK for now sticking with the 570 GPU, so really the only things you will need to replace are the CPU, MLB, and RAM. Right now, $1G can buy you an awful lot of that. You will probably want an ATX-sized board based on the Z87 chipset and with 4xRAM slots. There are plenty of boards out there that fit the bill, including some pretty exotic solutions like the Sabertooth from ASUS with its armor plating. I have no personal experience with this generation of MLBs, but I would recommend that whichever one you choose be based on UEFI rather than BIOS. BIOS-based boards will limit your future expandability/peripherals.

For the CPU, get the i5-4670K. It's $100 cheaper than the 4770K and only 100MHz slower. Plus you can overclock it and then the speed difference might as well not even be there.

As for RAM, get 2 sticks totalling either 8GB or 16GB of DDR3-1600 RAM, whichever is half the max your motherboard will support.

Those three components should revitalize your system well enough, but if you still MUST have a new GPU, look at the GTX 760 as a reasonably-priced upgrade from the 570. Then sell your 570.

If by "new" you mean "since 2009."

--Patrick

Click to expand...

I really don't think I need a mobo with armor plating. I'll wait for someone to take that information and condense it down into examples and suggestions, because it's all greek to me. I didn't even know BIOS was on its way out.

That's one of the more interesting ways that one vendor has decided to differentiate their product from the rest, sure. I haven't really sifted through models for my own knowledge AND I won't have the time to do it in the next few days, so I figured I'd just hit the high points.

--Patrick

PatrThom said:

The specs look good. If GPU/CPU were ranked like cards, you'd be holding either J/Q or Q/K.
Only recommendation if you plan to use that for gaming would be to enter setup and disable hyperthreading, if it gives you that option.

--Patrick

Click to expand...

I will once I get it. I get to place the order next week.

Alright, mostly paging @PatrThom here, but I'm looking at this as an upgrade from my current rig, and wondering what people think of it.

Amazon product

Amazon product

Amazon product

Thoughts? Anything blaringly wrong with this combo? Is there something else that could be switched out for a huge performance increase at the same or lesser cost?

As far as the processor, you have options to go a little cooler (4570S) or a little faster (4670), just don't know how the pricing would look for you.
The motherboard should be capable, but note that it is limited to only one graphics card (the second graphics slot is actually only a x4 slot even though it is physically the size of an x16 slot) and it has a couple less USB ports than other options. Also, the ad names it as a "mATX" board, but then the product dimensions list it as 11in, which means it is not mATX, rather it is full size regular ATX, if that matters to you (and your case).

--Patrick

PatrThom said:

As far as the processor, you have options to go a little cooler (4570S) or a little faster (4670), just don't know how the pricing would look for you.
The motherboard should be capable, but note that it is limited to only one graphics card (the second graphics slot is actually only a x4 slot even though it is physically the size of an x16 slot) and it has a couple less USB ports than other options. Also, the ad names it as a "mATX" board, but then the product dimensions list it as 11in, which means it is not mATX, rather it is full size regular ATX, if that matters to you (and your case).

--Patrick

Click to expand...

I noticed the discrepancy of the mATX, but I'm putting it inside a full size tower, so that shouldn't be a problem.

There's very little difference in pricing cost between the cpu I listed, and the 4670, so I may bump it up for the faster option. The cooler option isn't a big concern, big whirring fans never bothered me in the slightest.

I think I'll still look around for mobo options, though. The option for a second video card is nice, even though I likely won't use it. And I've felt the squeeze before of not having enough ports.

If you're looking at keeping open the possibility of multiple graphics cards, you will want a board based on z87 or H87.

--Patrick

Ok, so... what about this one?

Amazon product

*newegg has it much cheaper, but I can't embed a link to there as easily*

It's more pricey than the ones I was looking at, but I have wiggle room in the budget, and since I hate upgrading mobos, I'd rather not have to do it again for as long as possible.

I have historically recommended the ASRock ExtremeX series, don't see any reason to change with that board. The feature list looks ridiculous.

--Patrick

Ok, possibly (but probably not) my last question... I need a new case. Since I'm more or less having to take everything out to replace the motherboard anyway, now is a good opportunity to switch out my case, because I fucking HATE it. It's impossible to get to any of the drive bays without disassembling everything, it's a pain in the ass to work in... I could use a recommendation on a quality full atx case that offers ease of use in mounting and removing drives, as well as any tinkering that I may need to do. Of course, good fan layout and cooling is important as well, doesn't look like complete shit, and bonus points if it comes with the fans already included, because I'm defined by my laziness.

Corsair's Obsidian series looks pretty good, and there are some Bitfenix cases that look attractive (like the Ghost). I will be honest and say that I've been looking for good cases that are for Mini-ITX and Micro-ATX boards, so I'm not that current on cases that hold a full-sized ATX board.

--Patrick

Remember when I said the last question was my last question? I lied.

With my new mobo on its way, I'm curious if I will have to reinstall my OS after installation. I'm running Windows 7 home premium

I'm guessing no one knows? I've tried googling it, and answers are split... some say yes, some say no.

Ravenpoe said:

I'm guessing no one knows? I've tried googling it, and answers are split... some say yes, some say no.

Click to expand...

In windows 7, I'm not sure, I've not tried it myself, personally. If it was XP, I'd say probably. It comes down to issues with changing a bootable hard drive to a different controller. In the past, it made it not boot correctly (though still read just fine otherwise). Sometimes you could get by if your new and old motherboard had the same model HD controller, or if you did a repair install from installation media. But "some say yes, some no" is actually probably a pretty accurate sampling of how often it goes one way or the other.

There's also the authentication issue. You're going to have to reauthenticate your copy of Windows, and if you used an OEM version, it will probably fail what with the new MLB.

--Patrick

So, I got my new computer put together! Well, I say new, but really only the case, motherboard, ram and cpu are new, everything else was from my old pc.

Got it all assembled, ready to get it set up, and when I hit the power button... nothing. The fans start to spin for half a second and then it dies.

.....

Well fuck.

Time...to TROUBLESHOOT!
(rolls up sleeves)

-Did you plug in the extra power connector(s) to the video card?
-Did you plug in the fans (especially the one for the CPU)?
-Did you plug in the extra 4- or 8-pin motherboard connector for the CPU power?

Otherwise it's minimal system time, where you unplug everything that you don't need from the outside of the computer AND also everything from the motherboard that you don't need (hard drives, extra cards, etc) and see if you can at least get to a BIOS screen.

--Patrick

Found the problem! Had to clear the cmos and update the bios, now it boots up just fine.

Well, it manages to post and let me into the bios config, at least. Windows naturally kinda freaks the fuck out and refuses to boot, but I'm hoping running a repair installation will fix that, otherwise it'll be time to reinstall the os.

But now my dvd drives aren't working... they won't even open. Time for more troubleshooting.

Ravenpoe said:

Had to clear the cmos and update the bios,

Click to expand...

Ah. Might be that the processor was too new for the BIOS to recognize.

--Patrick

So, everything is working now, except: my two dvd-rw drives, and the third harddrive I had installed. I think the issue may be a power problem, as sometimes the dvd drives work, but most times they act like they have no powe to them. Perhaps the new motherboard draws more power than my previous one, and my 650watt power supply can't keep up.

Ravenpoe said:

So, everything is working now, except: my two dvd-rw drives, and the third harddrive I had installed. I think the issue may be a power problem, as sometimes the dvd drives work, but most times they act like they have no powe to them. Perhaps the new motherboard draws more power than my previous one, and my 650watt power supply can't keep up.

Click to expand...

I'd say 650w should be plenty for most rigs unless you have an ungodly monster of a video card.

ok, only dvd drives aren't working now, when previously they were. No idea why

Could be the power connectors aren't seated fully, could also be you have too many devices on a single power rail from the PSU (if it's the kind with multiple rails), but I'm guessing that you have them set to IDE mode in the BIOS when they should be set to ACPI instead (assuming they're all SATA).

--Patrick

The eject button should work if they have power, regardless of any data considerations.

GasBandit said:

The eject button should work if they have power, regardless of any data considerations.

Click to expand...

They don't, hence why I think it's a power problem.

If they are the kind that have both Molex [ O O O O ] and SATA [---------------] power connections on the back, please make sure you are not using both. Use one or the other, but not both.

--Patrick

PatrThom said:

If they are the kind that have both Molex [ O O O O ] and SATA [---------------] power connections on the back, please make sure you are not using both. Use one or the other, but not both.

--Patrick

Click to expand...

Just sata. I think the problem may be that most of my peripherals are all plugged into the same group of wires coming from the power supply. This case is -tall-, and only one of them would reach up there. I'll pick up an extension and try plugging them into the other.