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YouTube continues to get more and more terrible

#1

Dave

Dave

@GasBandit is going to feel this one directly.



#2

Denbrought

Denbrought

Shit, this might also affect my brother (45k~ subs, but infrequent and short-ish videos, so he might not meet the time threshold).

Edit: Disregard that, I just contacted him and he's sitting at around 56k hours/year. I suck at estimating that sort of thing apparently.


#3

strawman

strawman

Huh. I wonder if they're rolling out the notice gradually, I haven't received it yet. My channel has 55 subscribers and only 125 hours of watch time last year.

Not that I was getting enough money to matter. My estimated revenue for 2017 was just over $3.

Man I haven't looked at my channel stats in a long time. Clearly I'm never going to be a youtube star!


#4

GasBandit

GasBandit

Dave said:
@GasBandit is going to feel this one directly.
Click to expand...
Uh, actually I meet that criteria. I have 4000 subscribers and, through no fault of my own, I still pull in 1200 hours a month in viewing time of my videos (almost entirely comprised of my Space Engineers tutorials). My share of the revenue usually comes out to about 10 bucks a month on a normal slow month, but whenever Space Engineers goes on sale it gets bumped back up to 30 bucks a month for a month or two.[DOUBLEPOST=1516205153,1516204960][/DOUBLEPOST]And to think, all this got started because I got so frustrated watching you fail to play Space Engineers that I had to make some tutorials.


#5

ThatNickGuy

ThatNickGuy

Welp, guess I won't bother with that YouTube series idea I had.


#6

PatrThom

PatrThom

ThatNickGuy said:
Welp, guess I won't bother with that YouTube series idea I had.
Click to expand...
Also now is not a good time to get into Bitcoin or other cryptocurrencies.

I tellya, Nick. Ya sit on the fence for 20min just to see what's going on and by then it's too late.

--Patrick


#7

Hailey Knight

Hailey Knight

A channel would need higher numbers than the new monetization requirements in order to be all that profitable, so a new creator would still have had to build it up. Gas has 4000 subs and it's $10 a month? So 1000 subs might be $2.50. I'm guessing all the little channels added together mean a lot of cost for YouTube, even if not much for the creators.

A lot of YouTube people I watch seem to be making their money on Patreon or similar sites, from fans who understand YouTube isn't paying the bills so much.


#8

Ravenpoe

Ravenpoe

PatrThom said:
Also now is not a good time to get into Bitcoin or other cryptocurrencies.

I tellya, Nick. Ya sit on the fence for 20min just to see what's going on and by then it's too late.

--Patrick
Click to expand...
Let me tell you about my beanie baby fortune...


#9

GasBandit

GasBandit

Zero Esc said:
A channel would need higher numbers than the new monetization requirements in order to be all that profitable, so a new creator would still have had to build it up. Gas has 4000 subs and it's $10 a month? So 1000 subs might be $2.50. I'm guessing all the little channels added together mean a lot of cost for YouTube, even if not much for the creators.

A lot of YouTube people I watch seem to be making their money on Patreon or similar sites, from fans who understand YouTube isn't paying the bills so much.
Click to expand...
Yeah, subs don't directly translate into revenue, views do. If your subscribers aren't viewing your new content (or watching your old content over and over), they're not making you money. Each view is 3 or so potential ad impressions. Impressions don't pay that much, fractions of a cent. However, an ad click might get you a buck or two. I find that about 10,000 views translates into about 25 bucks in my pocket.

Which makes it irritating that youtube wants all their metrics to default to hours instead of views. Probably to combat the "watch 10 seconds and close it" thing that everybody does, because that usually only gets 1 ad impression.

The odd thing is my channel basically has not felt any impact of the youtube changes. I've basically been in this $10 a month but $30 when SE goes on sale pattern for years. Not even the fiasco where "any video with an F bomb gets demonetized" started happening, because those videos get, at best, a couple hundred views over their entire lifetime, whereas the SE tutorials get 500-2000 views a month each, depending on the particular video.

But yeah, a lot of the "moderately big" youtube people like TFS or Brentalfloss (and of course Jim Sterling, for different reasons) have switched their primary monetization to patreon instead of youtube itself. If youtube was my job instead of an occasional hobby (and I still had any interest in making videos about Space Engineers :p), I might have done the same.


#10

strawman

strawman

ThatNickGuy said:
Welp, guess I won't bother with that YouTube series idea I had.
Click to expand...
You should anyway. Don’t do it for the money, do it for yourself.


#11

GasBandit

GasBandit

stienman said:
You should anyway. Don’t do it for the money, do it for yourself.
Click to expand...
Wouldn't hurt to simultaneously launch and link a Patreon, though. It's all about building momentum. You do the first one, you generate some interest. You do the second, the people who liked the first come back, and start sharing it, and you get more views. You do the third, and it starts to snowball. As long as you are consistent in creating new content on a weekly-ish schedule, people will start chipping in a couple bucks in patreon because they want to see more - and honestly, that's faster money than youtube'd have given you even at its most generous.


#12

Denbrought

Denbrought

Worth echoing that Patreon can is hard to grow without the consistent release schedule and very involved fanbase. I think my brother brings in about $2/mo from it, most of it probably due to the hobby/infrequent issue.


#13

jwhouk

jwhouk

Example: Doug DeMuro. He does his reviews of cars on a regular basis, and he draws in crowds and views. Until about a year ago, I had NFC as to who he was.


#14

Hailey Knight

Hailey Knight

It would work out for Nick since he's only planning to do older stuff, could record an amount to buffer so there would definitely be a video each week.


#15

strawman

strawman

Zero Esc said:
It would work out for Nick since he's only planning to do older stuff, could record an amount to buffer so there would definitely be a video each week.
Click to expand...
Not only that, but the type of work he'd do is somewhat timeless, so there's a long tail effect that a lot of these flash in the pan producers don't experience since a lot of their content is topical.


#16

Hailey Knight

Hailey Knight

stienman said:
Not only that, but the type of work he'd do is somewhat timeless, so there's a long tail effect that a lot of these flash in the pan producers don't experience since a lot of their content is topical.
Click to expand...
Yeah, if I was making a comic channel, it'd be all new stuff, which is what everyone else is doing, and none of it would matter later. Nick's makes sense in the long run.


#17

ThatNickGuy

ThatNickGuy

Zero Esc said:
It would work out for Nick since he's only planning to do older stuff, could record an amount to buffer so there would definitely be a video each week.
Click to expand...
If I were to do it, I'd prefer quality over quantity, anyway. Maybe more like once a month.

And I thought it might be good to do a video on a relevant topic, like discussing a comic related to whatever latest movie at the time.


#18

GasBandit

GasBandit

I don't want to be a downer or anything, but once a month is not going to monetize well in either scenario.

It comes down to, if you're not willing to play "the game" of how money is made in youtube, then you just have to get used to the idea that you're doing it simply for your own amusement and not expect any money.

"The game" means:

A video at least once a week
Every video between 3 and 10 minutes long, NOT A MINUTE LONGER.
Every video fully produced with visual aids and possibly music/sfx where appropriate, not just a video of you talking to a camera (unless your tits have suddenly gotten a lot better than I remember them being).
Cross promoting every video on other social media platforms, like appropriate subreddits and facebook groups.
Shamelessly plugging your patreon at the end of every video, with a link in the description.

If you'd rather just put out content when you feel like it, of whatever length it happens to be, with only as much production effort as you can easily spare without getting frustrated, it might be better to adjust your expectations, and make sure you're getting personal creative fulfillment out of what you're doing. There won't be money, and building a viewerbase will be difficult and discouraging.

I mean, really, that's the story with 90% of my videos. I just got lucky and hit a perfect storm, making a series of videos for a niche video game that had an incredibly sharp learning curve and no tutorials/guides of its own to speak of, then I plugged it like crazy on reddit and steam. To this day, those 10 tutorials (and really, just the first 5 if we get right down to it) are where ALL the money on my channel comes from. ALL of it. Every other video I've released in the past 5 years has done NOTHING. A couple hundred views at best, maybe a couple cents of revenue.

Everything I've read about making money on youtube says you have to treat it like a job, and you have to be a fanatic about it, or you get burned out. I'm not saying don't make your series, I'm just saying if you're gonna treat it like a side hobby, make sure you enjoy it as a hobby. Look at it like making a model airplane. The process should be the fun.


#19

strawman

strawman

That's what I'm suggesting - don't do it for the money/fame/etc. Do it because you enjoy it.


#20

PatrThom

PatrThom

eOllEe5.jpg

The meme that wouldn't die.

--Patrick


#21

Hailey Knight

Hailey Knight

PatrThom said:
View attachment 26547
The meme that wouldn't die.

--Patrick
Click to expand...
It's just too useful.


#22

Gared

Gared

Honestly, speaking solely as a viewer, YouTube became useless to me the instant they took away my control of what video came on next unless I paid them for the right to choose my own playlist. I spent hours and hours and hours on YouTube over 2016-2017, streaming Grateful Dead concerts or Lawrence Welk reruns to watch while high, or playing soothing music at night to drown out the public brawls and drunken screaming outside, or watching the Primitive Technology dude, watching train journeys from the engineer's pov, hell, y'all know what all was available. But now, since I have no control over what comes on after my chosen video? Nope. Not when YouTube keeps looping the same 4 episodes of LW; or changes from Grateful Dead to EDM; or plays two hours of sleep sounds, followed by 2 hours of train horns, then 2 hours of thunderstorms, and then 2 hours of traffic noise.

I have no problem paying for services. I'd have to say that, on any vid longer than 30 minutes, I'd be perfectly happy watching up to 2.5 minutes of ads at the beginning, uninterruptible (on a free service). I don't have a problem with a general subscription model either - depending on the price point. $10 a month is a bit much for me just for YouTube - being about what I pay for either Netflix or Hulu Plus (ad free version) - but if they included Google Music, removed all of the ads from YouTube, and threw in a Google app to play DVDs and Blurays from my computer to my TV? Sold. As it is though, I just can't see myself willingly contributing to YouTube's financial coffers, and that means reduced funds for people like Gas, and less opportunity for people like Nick, and it sucks.


#23

fade

fade

The fact that ads are now on every video infringes on my use case for YouTube: short, informative videos. When I have to wait for a 30 second ad to watch a 1-5 minute video, I'll seek elsewhere. Video doesn't add enough value for me.


#24

GasBandit

GasBandit

Gared said:
they took away my control of what video came on next unless I paid them for the right to choose my own playlist.
Click to expand...
Wait, what? When did that happen? I mean, I can still make all the playlists I want... though it could be that's because I'm a partner? Is everyone else also unable to create/edit playlists?[DOUBLEPOST=1516291149,1516291061][/DOUBLEPOST]
fade said:
The fact that ads are now on every video infringes on my use case for YouTube: short, informative videos. When I have to wait for a 30 second ad to watch a 1-5 minute video, I'll seek elsewhere. Video doesn't add enough value for me.
Click to expand...
Well, far be it for me to stick up for youtube or anything, but, most of these ads let you skip after 5 seconds, and failing that, browser plugins like uBlock origin (or AdNauseam, which I myself use, I know, hypocrisy :p) block youtube ads as well so the video starts playing immediately.


#25

strawman

strawman

You have to sign in to make playlists, so you do need a youtube account. Is that the issue?


#26

fade

fade

GasBandit said:
Wait, what? When did that happen? I mean, I can still make all the playlists I want... though it could be that's because I'm a partner? Is everyone else also unable to create/edit playlists?[DOUBLEPOST=1516291149,1516291061][/DOUBLEPOST]
Well, far be it for me to stick up for youtube or anything, but, most of these ads let you skip after 5 seconds, and failing that, browser plugins like uBlock origin (or AdNauseam, which I myself use, I know, hypocrisy :p) block youtube ads as well so the video starts playing immediately.
Click to expand...
On the phone app? A good 75% of my YouTube use is on my phone where I'm quickly checking how to do something.


#27

GasBandit

GasBandit

fade said:
On the phone app? A good 75% of my YouTube use is on my phone where I'm quickly checking how to do something.
Click to expand...
Well there's your problem right there.


Bleh. YDI.


#28

Gared

Gared

Nope, I have an account and I'm never not logged into it on all of my Android devices, which is all of my devices. And my desktop. The only option I've ever had since YouTube Red was launched was an "Up Next" video, Autoplay slider, and a drop down menu that allows me the options of "Not Interested" and "Add to Watch Later." That's it. It doesn't matter which browser I use, whether I have adblockers installed and/or running, if I turn my anti-virus off, nothing. There is no more playlist option for me.


#29

GasBandit

GasBandit

Gared said:
Nope, I have an account and I'm never not logged into it on all of my Android devices, which is all of my devices. And my desktop. The only option I've ever had since YouTube Red was launched was an "Up Next" video, Autoplay slider, and a drop down menu that allows me the options of "Not Interested" and "Add to Watch Later." That's it. It doesn't matter which browser I use, whether I have adblockers installed and/or running, if I turn my anti-virus off, nothing. There is no more playlist option for me.
Click to expand...
So when you click "add to..", there isn't a "create playlist" at the bottom of the pulldown, below the "watch later?" bit?


#30

Bubble181

Bubble181

Gared said:
Nope, I have an account and I'm never not logged into it on all of my Android devices, which is all of my devices. And my desktop. The only option I've ever had since YouTube Red was launched was an "Up Next" video, Autoplay slider, and a drop down menu that allows me the options of "Not Interested" and "Add to Watch Later." That's it. It doesn't matter which browser I use, whether I have adblockers installed and/or running, if I turn my anti-virus off, nothing. There is no more playlist option for me.
Click to expand...
Underneath a video, next ot the thumbs up and down, is a share button. Next to that is a button that looks like a list with a + on it. This is to add it to your favorites or your channel...But also allows you to add it to an existing playlist or make a new one.

It isn't where it used to be, admittedly, but the option's there.


#31

Denbrought

Denbrought

That's bizarre. All of my google accounts (work, home private, public) allow me to create and curate playlists. Hell, Favorites is now a playlist.


#32

Gared

Gared

Bubble181 said:
Underneath a video, next ot the thumbs up and down, is a share button. Next to that is a button that looks like a list with a + on it. This is to add it to your favorites or your channel...But also allows you to add it to an existing playlist or make a new one.

It isn't where it used to be, admittedly, but the option's there.
Click to expand...
Well, thank god for that. I thought I'd gone insane. Though I still don't have the ability to save anything, because apparently my "channel" has been deactivated and I need to create a new one.


#33

fade

fade

GasBandit said:
Well there's your problem right there.


Bleh. YDI.
Click to expand...
Well, I'm sure as hell not lugging my desktop to the side of my car to appease the PC elite.


#34

GasBandit

GasBandit

fade said:
Well, I'm sure as hell not lugging my desktop to the side of my car to appease the PC elite.
Click to expand...
It's too bad your legs are broken and your memory doesn't last more than 6 seconds. My condolences.

Kidding aside, yeah, youtube's mobile app is horrendous. It's even worse for content creators. I can't look at analytics or manage any of my videos or anything from the mobile app. It's utter shit.

People who continue to use it are obviously masochists, the infuriating lack of control must tickle their pleasure centers.


#35

PatrThom

PatrThom

stienman said:
You have to sign in to make playlists, so you do need a youtube account. Is that the issue?
Click to expand...
Yes. You can no longer use YouTube the way you used to ("Anonymously") unless you now sign in to allow Google to "tailor the experience" (i.e., build a profile of your proclivities).

--Patrick


#36

fade

fade

GasBandit said:
It's too bad your legs are broken and your memory doesn't last more than 6 seconds. My condolences.

Kidding aside, yeah, youtube's mobile app is horrendous. It's even worse for content creators. I can't look at analytics or manage any of my videos or anything from the mobile app. It's utter shit.

People who continue to use it are obviously masochists, the infuriating lack of control must tickle their pleasure centers.
Click to expand...
You get bitter when you're hungry. Have a Snickers™.
This unskippable Forum Ad brought to you by YouTube Marketing™.


#37

Bubble181

Bubble181

GasBandit said:
People who continue to use it are obviously masochists, the infuriating lack of control must tickle their pleasure centers.
Click to expand...
I just want to be able to stream whole cds or symphonies while driving or waiting or in the shower, is that too much to ask?


#38

GasBandit

GasBandit

Bubble181 said:
I just want to be able to stream whole cds or symphonies while driving or waiting or in the shower, is that too much to ask?
Click to expand...
MP3s. What you want are MP3s.


#39

strawman

strawman

The youtube app works fine for my use. I can add videos to a playlist (usually from my subscriptions), then start the playlist and change the playback speed to 2x.

Queue up 60 minutes of video, start the treadmill, and do my 30 minutes of exercise while catching up on my subscriptions.

Can't get rid of ads on mobile, though.


#40

Gared

Gared

PatrThom said:
Yes. You can no longer use YouTube the way you used to ("Anonymously") unless you now sign in to allow Google to "tailor the experience" (i.e., build a profile of your proclivities).

--Patrick
Click to expand...
Yes, I suspect that the root issue for me here is that YouTube has decided that my proclivities and theirs are incompatible.

Edit: Link is NSFW


#41

fade

fade

GasBandit said:
MP3s. What you want are MP3s.
Click to expand...
a71188e21bbcebdc726cf8eea3b6130f--justice-league-doom-superman.jpg


#42

GasBandit

GasBandit

fade said:
View attachment 26548
Click to expand...
Sez you. That is exactly what I do with my MP3s. Stick em on the phone. Phone stereo has bluetooth (and an aux jack I don't use). You can get waterproof bluetooth speakers for the shower. Waiting? Headphones. If your phone's default mp3 player sucks, get Phonograph, it's good enough and lets you build playlists pretty easily.


#43

Bubble181

Bubble181

So, get more hardware, somehow get my phone's memory up to snuff, prepare mp3 lists in advance...by ripping YouTube videos, I guess, and keep them around, as well as playlist files? Yeah, that's easier than just taking someone else's playlist on YouTube and getting the whole CD or whatever in one go.


#44

GasBandit

GasBandit

Bubble181 said:
So, get more hardware, somehow get my phone's memory up to snuff, prepare mp3 lists in advance...by ripping YouTube videos, I guess, and keep them around, as well as playlist files? Yeah, that's easier than just taking someone else's playlist on YouTube and getting the whole CD or whatever in one go.
Click to expand...
Thing is, I've found, youtube videos and playlists (especially of music) that you don't manage yourself (and even some you do) have a tendency to vanish at random. My favorites list is chock full of "this video is no longer available" markers.

But once you've got that MP3, you've got it forever (as long as you remember to keep backups in case of catastrophe, naturally). Build yourself a collection over time, and you'll always have what you like, on hand. No internet connection necessary.

And if you're complaining about the cost of bluetooth speakers, I have no sympathy. They're 20 bucks.

Also, also, I refuse to believe your phone can't play MP3s. Phones could do that before there were smartphones.

Also also also, the compression on youtube makes music SUCK. Seriously, it's so bad. It may be a good place to discover music, but the difference between youtube and even a 192kbit MP3, much less a 320kbit one, will bring tears to your eyes. So no, do NOT record your MP3s off youtube. That's a sucker move.


#45

Bubble181

Bubble181

You're right, we all have legal means of acquiring thousands of songs :-P
I used to have quite a big CD and mp3 collection, really. But my tastes are fickle and ever changing. One day I'll listen to the Moana soundtrack, the next 6 months I might not. I'm not buying, ripping, storing, indexing thousands of music files for the rare moment I want to listen to them.
Insert "ain't nobody got time for that" gif here.


#46

GasBandit

GasBandit

Bubble181 said:
You're right, we all have legal means of acquiring thousands of songs :-P
I used to have quite a big CD and mp3 collection, really. But my tastes are fickle and ever changing. One day I'll listen to the Moana soundtrack, the next 6 months I might not. I'm not buying, ripping, storing, indexing thousands of music files for the rare moment I want to listen to them.
Insert "ain't nobody got time for that" gif here.
Click to expand...
Then just get one of the umpteen bazillion streaming apps that cater to your tastes instead of whining that youtube isn't the thing you want it to be, because it was never supposed to be.

Youtube as a music service is terrible. Always has been, always will be.

"I just want my cat to be a dog, is that so much to ask?" - Bubble


#47

Bubble181

Bubble181

You show me a free legal way for me to listen to whatever holds my fancy at a moment wherever I go. I'll wait.


#48

GasBandit

GasBandit

Bubble181 said:
You show me a free legal way for me to listen to whatever holds my fancy at a moment wherever I go. I'll wait.
Click to expand...
I've given you reasonable alternatives. You keep on waiting for the moon on a platter, bud. I'll just refer back to your original post -

Bubble181 said:
I just want to be able to stream whole cds or symphonies while driving or waiting or in the shower, is that too much to ask?
Click to expand...
Yes. Unless you're willing to put forth some effort.


#49

PatrThom

PatrThom

Bubble181 said:
You show me a free legal way for me to listen to whatever holds my fancy at a moment wherever I go. I'll wait.
Click to expand...
Your choice is either to subscribe to a streaming service (“eat out”) or purchase and rip your own content (“pack your lunch”).

—Patrick


#50

Dave

Dave

Bubble181 said:
You show me a free legal way for me to listen to whatever holds my fancy at a moment wherever I go. I'll wait.
Click to expand...
Plex server link directly into your computer. That's how I listen to my own music wherever I go. Wait over.


#51

GasBandit

GasBandit

Dave said:
Plex server link directly into your computer. That's how I listen to my own music wherever I go. Wait over.
Click to expand...
That would require him to get copies of the music he wants, though, and then we're back to "but that's haaaaaaaard."


#52

Bubble181

Bubble181

I have hundreds of CDs, and I converted them all to mp3 maybe 10 uiteraard zo, so in horrible quality. I spent ages filing them all, noting artist and album and genres. I don't even have optical media in my pc anymore.


#53

GasBandit

GasBandit

Bubble181 said:
I have hundreds of CDs, and I converted them all to mp3 maybe 10 uiteraard zo, so in horrible quality. I spent ages filing them all, noting artist and album and genres. I don't even have optical media in my pc anymore.
Click to expand...
Well, if you don't want to get a USB cd drive (which are generally also 20 bucks) and spend the time to re-rip your collection at a decent bitrate (and I can understand the time issue might be a dealbreaker), there are actually companies these days that do exactly this as a service. I don't know how to find one in Belgium, but they're all over, here in the states.


#54

Gruebeard

Gruebeard

Bubble181 said:
I have hundreds of CDs, and I converted them all to mp3 maybe 10 uiteraard zo, so in horrible quality. I spent ages filing them all, noting artist and album and genres. I don't even have optical media in my pc anymore.
Click to expand...
After doing so, I figured Canada's copyright laws were such that I could justifiably make my personal copy by duplicating someone else's.

I'm not entirely sure my "from vinyl" copies of old Rush albums quite qualifies, but I justify those as coming from my mom's collection.


#55

PatrThom

PatrThom

Gruebeard said:
After doing so, I figured Canada's copyright laws were such that I could justifiably make my personal copy by duplicating someone else's.

I'm not entirely sure my "from vinyl" copies of old Rush albums quite qualifies, but I justify those as coming from my mom's collection.
Click to expand...
I did the same thing with a CD-ROM game. I still have the original CD, which means I’m still authorized to install and use a copy of the game, I just did it from someone else’s CD.

—Patrick


#56

bhamv3

bhamv3

fade said:
The fact that ads are now on every video infringes on my use case for YouTube: short, informative videos. When I have to wait for a 30 second ad to watch a 1-5 minute video, I'll seek elsewhere. Video doesn't add enough value for me.
Click to expand...
Out of curiosity, what alternative sources of informative videos are there other than Youtube? Not being snarky, I genuinely don't know.


#57

fade

fade

bhamv3 said:
Out of curiosity, what alternative sources of informative videos are there other than Youtube? Not being snarky, I genuinely don't know.
Click to expand...
I don't know but I was saying video doesn't add that much value to me. There are non video sources.


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