Civil Forfieture. WTF.

Eriol

Eriol

I agree this is reprehensible, but so is almost anything where the cost to fight it exceeds the cost to "settle" with the aggressor (see patent trolls). That it is the "government" makes it 1,000,000 times worse in this case.
 
sixpackshaker

sixpackshaker

Louisiana is likely the worst state for forfieture. I have a friend that is black, who buys and sells sports/concert tickets for a living. When ever he has to travel to buy tickets he gets stopped in LA multiple times coming and going. Luckily he is savvy enough not to get all that cash taken. A black man with $7,000 cash if very suspicious on Interstate 10.
 
PatrThom

PatrThom

Oh, is this the first time some of you have heard of this, @Necronic ?

Texas has made the headlines repeatedly for this issue, stealing large sums of cash, cars, etc. from "suspicious" people that happen to go through specific towns.
It is reprehensible and should be stopped, but until the civil forfeiture laws are reformed, just avoid going through Texas. Simple, right?

--Patrick
 
Covar

Covar

sixpackshaker said:
Louisiana is likely the worst state for forfieture. I have a friend that is black, who buys and sells sports/concert tickets for a living. When ever he has to travel to buy tickets he gets stopped in LA multiple times coming and going. Luckily he is savvy enough not to get all that cash taken. A black man with $7,000 cash if very suspicious on Interstate 10.
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might make him look like a scalper.
 
sixpackshaker

sixpackshaker

Scalping is legal if you do it online. But it is difficult to get out of a traffic stop on a major highway with a large amount of cash.
 
Necronic

Necronic

Staff member
PatrThom said:
Oh, is this the first time some of you have heard of this, @Necronic ?

Texas has made the headlines repeatedly for this issue, stealing large sums of cash, cars, etc. from "suspicious" people that happen to go through specific towns.
It is reprehensible and should be stopped, but until the civil forfeiture laws are reformed, just avoid going through Texas. Simple, right?

--Patrick
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Honestly, I live in Texas and I have never heard of this. This could be because I am white and have enough money to fight it though.
 
Dave

Dave

Staff member
Yeah, this is an absolute bullshit process and is routinely derided by everyone save the law enforcement individuals who defend it. But you'll also notice nobody is doing anything about it other than yelling.

I think it'll take a Congressman or other politician having their money taken to get anything done.
 
Dave

Dave

Staff member
You have no option. If you say no they take it anyway.

Your best bet is to tell them no when they want to search your car in the first place.
 
Covar

Covar

Dave said:
Your best bet is to tell them no when they want to search your car in the first place.
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Always the best response.[DOUBLEPOST=1376502320,1376502286][/DOUBLEPOST]
Tress said:
They do everything they can to bury you in court, most likely using fabricated evidence and false testimony, and take your stuff anyway.
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Channeling LeQuack there much?
 
Ravenpoe

Ravenpoe

Dave said:
You have no option. If you say no they take it anyway.

Your best bet is to tell them no when they want to search your car in the first place.
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I always do this. On the rare occasion that I have to drive through Georgia, I -always- get stopped by highway patrol. I assume it's for my Florida plates. They always give the same song and dance, about how they need to search the car, and if I say no then they'll call out police dogs to find probable cause, or call for backup, or blah blah blah. I always say whatever they have to do, they're not searching my car, and then I'm on my way.
 
Tress

Tress

Covar said:
Channeling LeQuack there much?
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I wasn't talking about the police in general, I was talking about the particular department mentioned in the story. But if you want to defend their glorious and noble mission to rob random people of their valuables, be my guest.
 
sixpackshaker

sixpackshaker

Necronic said:
Honestly, I live in Texas and I have never heard of this. This could be because I am white and have enough money to fight it though.
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I've heard of it through friends that travel through LA, and when the owner of the Pappas restaurant chain had several thousand dollars taken from him when driving through LA. That dang sure hit the news.
 
Ravenpoe

Ravenpoe

Necronic said:
Huh, I always assumed that saying no to a search WAS probably cause.
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As far as I know, no. They might tell you that (I don't think there's a law against cops lying to you as long as they aren't flat out misinforming you of your rights) but you still have the full right to refuse a search without a warrant. The times it's happened to me, I've heard all kinds of threats about how bad it will be and how much of my time it will take if I refuse a search, but none of them have ever come to pass. Once they realize I'm not saying yes, they're done with me.
 
sixpackshaker

sixpackshaker

sixpackshaker said:
Well, you will be better protected in the long-run. It may cost you an hour on the side of the road, waiting for a JP to pass out a warrant to search.
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also if it is a dirty cop, by time they call into HQ to wake up a JP, other units will arrive. Even dirty cops have a hard time harassing you if there are other cops there.
 
evilmike

evilmike

stienman said:
I wonder if a minimum would help. No civil seizure for amounts totaling less than $200,000. Honestly if a criminal enterprise isn't generating hundreds of thousands of dollars, it's not worth much law enforcement time, and those people with that much in assets would likely have at least the knowledge and ability to fight back.

Seizure of smaller amounts could still occur, but only through criminal court proceedings, not civil, and the burden of proof would be on the police that the smaller seizures are valid.
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That wouldn't have stopped them from going after the Motel Caswell. The government tried to seize the motel because a limited number of drug arrests had been made there over the last 15 years. There was never any connection to the business itself and the owner had taken steps to work with the police to keep crime in the area down. Fortunately, a judge put a stop to the seizure, but only after a 4 year legal battle. (via BBJ)
 
PatrThom

PatrThom

Now I know how @Thread Necromancer must feel.

This (admittedly inflammatory) video has been making the rounds lately.

I know there's that whole "State Sovereignty" thing, but it seems like this is the sort of thing that would get automatically caught and swatted rather than needing a hue and cry to get noticed. I mean, when someone suddenly shows up to work with a lot of new, expensive things, questions get asked. If a city/county/whatever suddenly starts throwing around a lot of cash, you'd think it would raise the eyebrows of people further up the chain.

--Patrick
 
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HCGLNS

HCGLNS

Bottom end of the article where police used a city ordinance that declared public displays of homosexuality to be a nuisance allowing officer's to seize the property of men who looked at them funny.
 
Officer_Charon

Officer_Charon

Huh. I learn more and more about my fellow forumites every day.

I can't recall the last time I've told someone that I'd drop the charges on them if they signed over their cash and belongings.

BECAUSE IT DOESN'T FUCKING HAPPEN WITH ME.

This might, MIGHT be some DA-level shit, but I have not heard of anything of it's like happening around me. Now, admittedly, I am not the most OBSERVANT individual out there (cue some astute Halforumer producing a half-dozen example of civil forfeiture following police activity in Chatham County, GA).

I'm not going to sit here and say it doesn't happen, because obviously it does. But I dare any one of you to point your fingers at me and suggest that I would impugn my honor with something like that.
 
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Ravenpoe

Ravenpoe

Officer_Charon said:
Huh. I learn more and more about my fellow forumites every day.

I can't recall the last time I've told someone that I'd drop the charges on them if they signed over their cash and belongings.

BECAUSE IT DOESN'T FUCKING HAPPEN WITH ME.

This might, MIGHT be some DA-level shit, but I have not heard of anything of it's like happening around me. Now, admittedly, I am not the most OBSERVANT individual out there (cue some astute Halforumer producing a half-dozen example of civil forfeiture following police activity in Chatham County, GA).

I'm not going to sit here and say it doesn't happen, because obviously it does. But I dare any one of you to point your fingers at me and suggest that I would impugn my honor with something like that.
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I don't think anyone would. I can't speak for Necronic, but I assume he only posted your name because he was curious what your take on it was. Also, this thread is a year old.
 
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