The Zoe Quinn sex-for-reviews scandal
- Thread starter GasBandit
- Start date
I don't get it.
This is why I hate this whole thing now. There are some of us that didn't give a shit that Zoe is a woman, and actually did care about all the unethical journalism bullshit, censorship, and politics that swarmed the beginning of this whole thing. We fucking yelled for the assholes giving out addresses and sending threats to stop being fucking retards.
I can't talk about it anymore though, because the minute I try I get called a sexist bigot with a agenda of preventing "inclusiveness", and then get lumped into jokes about rape and murder. Like I personally sent Zoe death threats, or support those that do.
But that's what you get when the whole thing is co-opted by the worst slime on both sides of the fence that now just want to sling poop at each other all day.
I can't talk about it anymore though, because the minute I try I get called a sexist bigot with a agenda of preventing "inclusiveness", and then get lumped into jokes about rape and murder. Like I personally sent Zoe death threats, or support those that do.
But that's what you get when the whole thing is co-opted by the worst slime on both sides of the fence that now just want to sling poop at each other all day.
GasBandit
Staff member
The punchline is all gamergate supporters aren't just disgusting trolls. That's just some of them. The rest are actual rapists and murderers. Th-bump tish! Right? Riiight?
Not doing it to jump on Charlie, I try to fight misinformation wherever it rears its head.
--Patrick
That's really the problem in a nutshell. Any kind of actual, legitimate criticism is immediately lost and forgotten because of the assholes who ruined it for everyone else. I still think the controversy over "unethical" journalism is on shaky grounds at best, but it does hold some merit. But that part of the discussion no longer matters because that's not what GamerGate is synonymous with now.
but. you're. completely. wrong. on. this.
and it's not an insult, dumping on her, it's just objective, non-biased facts, I thought that was what the logical gamergaters wanted all along?!?!?
and I don't know how "this person is not a special treatment celebrity" means "I have no sympathy for her abuse"[DOUBLEPOST=1414107509,1414107374][/DOUBLEPOST]
Lovely
I also continue to not see why everyone is blaming both sides
figmentPez
Staff member
Because you've failed to see that there aren't two "sides". It's a complex issue that has a multitude of viewpoints, and the scummiest people involved have tried to make it a polarized issue where people have to choose sides.
Chris Kluwe wrote a long, angry thing as he is wont to do about the same time as Felicia Day's pretty timid statement, and he pointed out that he didn't get the same level/degree of harassment at all.
Felicia Day posts about being afraid of being Doxxed by GamerGate. Gets Doxxed by "gaimerg8".
Chris Kluwe calls them every pejorative possible on twitter, writes tract against them. Nothing happens.
But it's about journalism and ethics, not terrorizing women, you see.
Hardly. All I said was that you don't have to be a media darling to be a celebrity.
--Patrick
This is great. Spoiled for size.
Have you guys not been paying attention to the two or three jokes (including that comic posted just now by ThatNickGuy) mocking the "ethics" debate as just a veiled women hating misogyny? Have you been on tumblr in the last month and seen the shit-storms of people calling men even thinking of supporting the idea that someone like Zoe Quinn can actually do unethical things as a "women hating cis white male trying to hold out inclusiveness in gaming and tear down the female developers."? Honestly, I feel like there is a lot of confirmation bias going on because you either already chose one side of the debate, or never actually took part it in, and instead just read lengthy articles on it, which themselves are heavily leading for one side (usually not on the "anti-journalism" side of the fence, considering most are journalists)
There are whole groups of women that support GamerGate, they even formed a twitter tag to stop those on the other side of the fence from trying to use their vaginas as a scape goat for unethical behavior in journalism and an automatic "discarder" for any kind of rational debate. I have seen those women get harrassed like hell too by the so called SJWs.
Hell, I don't even consider myself a GamerGater, but I want rational debate about the issues that don't boil down to the fact the person in the debate has a vagina, YEAH! / BOO!
In the end I don't care where it goes by this point. There is no winning on either side because debate has become meaningless. It's going to spiral out into memes like the one above and sooner or later will hopefully die out with neither "side" getting any strength in the industry, because none of them deserve it.
Yeah, that's a hard one to defend. I don't agree with what she said, but I don't think she should be threatened with rape or murder for saying it.Slightly off topic but I have found some of the recent twitter postings by Anita Sarkeesian to be worthy of some objection.
There is certainly a problem when you have forty school shootings in a year, but is blaming men really the right direction to go with it?
When someone makes that kind of threat do you think they are trying to "win" the debate, convince someone to their position or even force someone to leave the arena?
Because it seems like it should be blatantly obvious to even the most dimwitted person that this kind of abuse achieves NOTHING. It only undermines the person using that tactic.
So is it just from people who have so much rage that they can't control themselves or is it people trying to provoke an angry response?
Which kind of makes sense since nice friendly comments often don't get much attention on twitter.
Because it seems like it should be blatantly obvious to even the most dimwitted person that this kind of abuse achieves NOTHING. It only undermines the person using that tactic.
So is it just from people who have so much rage that they can't control themselves or is it people trying to provoke an angry response?
Which kind of makes sense since nice friendly comments often don't get much attention on twitter.
He who yells the loudest...
As I said in the other thread too, I agree 100%
I don't think that's blaming men, per se, but rather blaming how society tells men they (we) should behave (because feminism is not about saying men are bad, it's about sexism, gender roles, etc)Slightly off topic but I have found some of the recent twitter postings by Anita Sarkeesian to be worthy of some objection.
There is certainly a problem when you have forty school shootings in a year, but is blaming men really the right direction to go with it?
Not saying I agree one way or the other
School shootings ARE a mostly male problem... this is because school age women tend to get their vengeance socially or psychologically, tormenting their targets until they psychologically breakdown or kill themselves. It's one of the many, many reasons why the suicide and mental illness rate for teenagers is so high in the US. This isn't to say that it's equivalent... it's not. School shootings tend to harm people not involved in the situation at all, something social vengeance does not. However, it would probably be more appropriate to say that American culture encourages people to redress perceived wrongs decisively and openly (even if that method is horrifying) than to single out the male side of the equation.
also the patriarchy makes women compete over male attention, Beyonce brought a lil attention to this in her visual album / On The Run tour / ?I think it was VMA performance
You see, what gets me about this kind of thing is that it's taking a problem and turning it into a male problem. The focus is on the "toxic masculinity".Slightly off topic but I have found some of the recent twitter postings by Anita Sarkeesian to be worthy of some objection.
There is certainly a problem when you have forty school shootings in a year, but is blaming men really the right direction to go with it?
40 school shootings are bad. (And incidentally, that '40 school shooting a year' stat is problematic at best) But on the flip side, women kill their kids about 100 times a year. But we don't hear about "the matriarchy", or how that "toxic feminism" is connected with those killings, or how it's "not a coincidence" that it's always women doing the killing. But then again, certain facts don't fit into this person's bullshit femitumblrism agenda.
I have to disagree with you there. Pop culture at large may not be aware of the problem, but the mental health community is very much aware of this. Munchhausen syndrome is a very real thing, but here's where you're making a false equivalency, women killing children has nothing to do with female role perception, whereas the ideal of a gun toting American male who gets his revenge through violence is very much an accepted male standard archetype.
If you want to look at something equivalent, Ashburner gives some good examples of actually equivalent issues.
Boys shooting at schools at comparatively low levels: Male societal problem.
Women killing children at much higher levels*: Not a female societal problem.
Got it.
*Which, incidentally, is not the definition of Munchausen Syndrome. Or even Munchausen By Proxy, which is what I figure you were kind of desperately grasping at.
It was an example, not an exhaustive list.
You're comparing apples to oranges. Women killing children(and physical violence in general) is the OPPOSITE of our societal expectation of women, whereas we idolize men who seek violent revenge, see just about every action hero ever.
I'm not saying it's not a societal problem, I'm saying it has nothing to do with male/female role perception, which is what the original post is addressing.
BTW, A cursory search found that filicide rates between men and women are roughly equivalent.
https://news.brown.edu/articles/2014/02/filicide
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...pP8xwGlmgCAcFkw5w&sig2=4qWrxjWETsBYTBS3krkHSA
https://news.brown.edu/articles/2014/02/filicide
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...pP8xwGlmgCAcFkw5w&sig2=4qWrxjWETsBYTBS3krkHSA
Then you're getting far more out of that tweet than I did. Just saw blanket misandry disguising itself as enlightened feminism.
What....what are you even trying to...
MISANDRY MISANDRY MISANDRY
Ah, you poked holes in my cherry picked data. Good. Now let me pick holes in yours: School shootings have stated at roughly the same levels since the 1970's. They're not on the rise. Toxic masculinity and gamer culture, and all of the societal changes that have occurred over the last 40 years seems to have had little effect on this statistic. As I said, sarkawhatever is pushing misandry in the guise of social justice. decades of violent "misogynistic" video games have done nothing to nudge the school shooting trend upward.[DOUBLEPOST=1414255760,1414255727][/DOUBLEPOST]
I bet those words taste bitter in your mouth
