[Movies] Talk about the last movie you saw 2: Electric Threadaloo
- Thread starter Dave
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The more I think about it, the more convinced I am that Anakin was stronger than Obi-Wan, and that Obi-Wan's conversation wasn't merely a way to convince Anakin to discontinue his path to the dark side. I think Obi-Wan knew it was pointless, and the entire purpose of the conversation was to get Anakin angry so that Obi-Wan had a reasonable chance to overtake him. In the same way Palpatine used Anakin's emotions to twist his sense of justice and right to suit Palpatine's needs, Obi-Wan used Anakin's emotions to weaken him.
That he left him half alive, however, was a reflection of Obi-Wan's emotional involvement, and a mistake on his part.
It did present a very nice tautology, though. If Anakin truly had control of his emotions, he would have taken Obi-Wan down - but he wouldn't have gone against Obi-Wan in the first place, nor chased after Padme, nor been seduced by Palpatine.
Obi-Wan was essentially saying, "If what you are saying is true, and you aren't being controlled by your feelings, strike me down. If you can't, then that is proof that you are failing to keep your emotions under your own control."
After meditating for years and figuring out how to transcend life and become a force ghost, Obi-Wan was once more ready to play the same game with Darth Vader. "Strike me down and I'll become more powerful than you can ever imagine." Meanwhile having a very concrete purpose in providing distraction to allow Luke and others to get away. If Darth Vader had suppressed his emotions at seeing his old master and his son, and had simply captured them - which he could have done had he not been blinded by his desires to show his power to his old master, continuing their duel that he failed last time to win - the series would have ended then and there.
That he left him half alive, however, was a reflection of Obi-Wan's emotional involvement, and a mistake on his part.
It did present a very nice tautology, though. If Anakin truly had control of his emotions, he would have taken Obi-Wan down - but he wouldn't have gone against Obi-Wan in the first place, nor chased after Padme, nor been seduced by Palpatine.
Obi-Wan was essentially saying, "If what you are saying is true, and you aren't being controlled by your feelings, strike me down. If you can't, then that is proof that you are failing to keep your emotions under your own control."
After meditating for years and figuring out how to transcend life and become a force ghost, Obi-Wan was once more ready to play the same game with Darth Vader. "Strike me down and I'll become more powerful than you can ever imagine." Meanwhile having a very concrete purpose in providing distraction to allow Luke and others to get away. If Darth Vader had suppressed his emotions at seeing his old master and his son, and had simply captured them - which he could have done had he not been blinded by his desires to show his power to his old master, continuing their duel that he failed last time to win - the series would have ended then and there.
That's true, too. The intensely focused Sith always out-perform, like Vader or even Maul and Ventress is Clone Wars. Still, though, unfocused rage would give some kind of power, though I suppose against a truly focused opponent, like Rey, you'd fail like he did.
Good point. At first I was thinking, "Oh, yeah. Obi-Wan won the fight with Darth Maul through anger" but then I remembered that he hung from the edge of the shaft for a moment, gathered his thoughts and calmed himself before calling the
Sheer anger does not make Dark Side users more powerful if they can't focus it. That is Ren's problem, he has lots of anger, but can't focus it well. Hate is much more effective because it is easier to focus your hate onto someone/thing. Palpatine even says, "Let the hate flow through you!" to Luke. He does mention anger, but primarily wants Luke to use his hatred to lure him to the Dark Side. We see this in Darth Maul in episode 1 as well. When he is with Palpatine, he is calm and under control. When dueling, he is very aggressive, but focused on his target(s). Ren, meanwhile, when speaking with Snoke, is shouting and constantly losing his composure. He still needs training to get himself under control and make it so he can focus his anger and hatred.
Rey, on the other hand, is drawing from the Light Side and is able to focus it when she calms herself down. This gives her the edge in the duel. We see her take a breath and focus herself and is then able to tap into the Force much better.
Rey, on the other hand, is drawing from the Light Side and is able to focus it when she calms herself down. This gives her the edge in the duel. We see her take a breath and focus herself and is then able to tap into the Force much better.
We don't see Rey start to actively attempt to use her force powers until after Kylo tries to read her mind. It's clearly shown that this backfires on him, and once he's in her mind and starts seeing her memories, she starts seeing his as well, throwing him off focus by telling him his greatest fear. When I first watched the movie, I assumed that her jump in force ability after this was because she had absorbed some of his knowledge during this.
I dunno, sheer anger did Luke pretty good in that moment of lost control when he stomps Vader into the dirt. Luke's anger toward his father possibly corrupting his only other family, succumbing to the lure of Darkness himself, and abandoning Luke in the middle of nowhere with relatives because his own anger and hate had driven him to the path of Vader. I'm sure you could argue that all that stems from hate, but I don't know. Luke primarily believes there's good in Vader still, he just loses sight of it for a moment.
Again, being out of control won't win a fight, but I can't agree that it doesn't give some power in the moment.
Again, being out of control won't win a fight, but I can't agree that it doesn't give some power in the moment.
Well, Luke was also focused on keeping Vader and the Emperor away from Leia. He doesn't go berserk until Vader says "Give yourself to the Dark Side. It is the only way you can save your friends. Yes, your thoughts betray you. Your feelings for them are strong. Especially for... sister. So, you have a twin sister. Your feelings have now betrayed her, too. Obi-Wan was wise to hide her from me. Now his failure is complete. If you will not turn to the Dark Side... then perhaps she will..." at which point Luke ignites his saber and goes to fucking town on Vader. So yes, it was anger, but it was focused on protecting Leia from being turned to the Dark Side.
Return of the Jedi is a much better movie than a lot of Star Wars fans give it credit for.
Cajungal
Staff member
As for why Rey can quickly do all these amazing things--especially Jedi mind-tricking someone--I just figured that it has to do with the force being connected to all life and time and space. When balance or change is needed, the force help it along by working through a person with potential. Isn't that possible?
I like the movies, but I'm not deep into the lore and books and stuff, but that's how I resolved it personally.
I like the movies, but I'm not deep into the lore and books and stuff, but that's how I resolved it personally.
Cajungal
Staff member
I knew that would be the first reply!
GasBandit
Staff member
He's had more experience with it than anyone else in that movie besides his wife
GasBandit
Staff member
Luke was in the movie?!!
Dude, did you leave five minutes before the end credits rolled again? We talked about this, man.Luke was in the movie?!!
Guys
Guys
Her Midichlorian count is probably super high, that's all.
Guys
Her Midichlorian count is probably super high, that's all.
Short version: Finn's squad was made up of four guys. I presume one of them dies off-screen. Zero dies in the battle on Jakku, the one who leaves a bloody streak down Finn's helmet. So after that, it's just Finn and Nines. Their squad, as with other squads, had been taught by Phasma to leave the weak behind, but Finn gave a damn when he saw Zero die. Nines being the last one, is pretty pissed when he finds Finn at Moz Kadan's.
From the side story, every Stromtrooper in the First Order had a nickname based off their serial number, given to them by their squadmates, except Finn. None of them ever gave him a nickname. So when Poe is the first one to give him a nickname, it's a sign of comradery that's been withheld from him until then.
So he's not TR-8R?
Officially, he's FN-2199. Unofficially, he's Nines.So he's not TR-8R?
But he'll always be TR-8R in our hearts.
Really I couldn't see the dynamic play out more because all the troopers look the same, and couldn't tell one squad apart from another unless I were more invested in the lore than just half a dozen movies' worth. It was obvious that his face was marked as a cinematic device so that we could keep track of this one specific trooper pretty much for that exact reason.
--Patrick
I typically only keep track of what's in the movies too, but this story has been getting spread around. And considering Disney wiped most of the EU from canon, it's one of the few non-movie stories that's even relevant anymore.
Since they stated that EU wasn't canon, they have stated that all the current stuff (comics, cartoons, books) are canon. They are building their own coherent universe and got rid of lots of what I will call "sub-par" stories and inconsistencies. Plus, they didn't want anyone to have a "they have to be here at this time for this thing" moments. And Chewie is alive.
Is Skippy the Jedi Droid still canon?
It's officially become "the EU isn't canon except when we say it is and only how we say so" after they brought the planet Malachor into main universe in Rebels. It would seem that Disney sees the potential of the Old Republic and is slowly bringing in elements to test the waters for new content.
Not to mention that the early designs of Kylo had him as an "inquisitor" hunting down ancient sith relics, and wearing Revan's mask.
Watched Mad Max: Fury Road again. I thought Bowielee said we were supposed to hate this movie now, but I still loved it. Weird. If anything, I keep finding new things to appreciate.
Yeah, it was every bit as good as I've heard. It was stunning and amazing and yet managed to give each character logical reasons for them to act as they did. The ending fight was so brutal.