[Brazelton] Fidel Castro

PatrThom

PatrThom

A very very long while. They were predicting his death back in the 90's.
I wonder if he ever got his Stroh's Light?

(still don't know if that's actually George Carlin doing the VO)

--Patrick
 
Bubble181

Bubble181

blotsfan said:
And nothing of value was lost.
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A man whose influence on the international politics of the 20th century can hardly be overstated, leader of what probably has to be called the most successful communist country ever (admittedly, this isn't saying much), one of the most influential anti-imperialists - a movement that was weak in the '90s but is having a revival right now,.....

I'm not a fan, and he's done plenty of crap, but "nothing of value" is a bit harsh, no?
 
mikerc

mikerc

*Sees a new Brazleton thread* Nooo, damn it 2016! Why do you keep doing thi...oh. Wait. Him? Castro? I retract my damning of 2016 on this occasion.
 
Dei

Dei

Bubble181 said:
A man whose influence on the international politics of the 20th century can hardly be overstated, leader of what probably has to be called the most successful communist country ever (admittedly, this isn't saying much), one of the most influential anti-imperialists - a movement that was weak in the '90s but is having a revival right now,.....

I'm not a fan, and he's done plenty of crap, but "nothing of value" is a bit harsh, no?
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Here, allow me to show you how our president-elect feels about it.



Such tact, much wow.
 
Dave

Dave

Staff member
I thought the right loved a "strong leader" regardless of how brutal and totalitarian his tactics are. I mean, Putin is their new best buddy.
 
Bubble181

Bubble181

Dave said:
I thought the right loved a "strong leader" regardless of how brutal and totalitarian his tactics are. I mean, Putin is their new best buddy.
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Only when it's *their* leader.

This isn't the Political subforum and I don't necessarily want to derail a Brazelton, but...Yeah. Like I said, not a big fan - but compared to a whole lot of other leaders the West doesn't or didn't have a problem with, Castro was relatively benign. With the emphasis strongly on "relatively", to be sure.
 
Tress

Tress

Dave said:
I thought the right loved a "strong leader" regardless of how brutal and totalitarian his tactics are. I mean, Putin is their new best buddy.
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Being a Communist disqualifies anyone from praise on the right. Also, his brutality and human rights violations are bad enough for anyone.

I don't think I've ever heard an intelligent person actually praise Castro. I thought he was universally condemned (in the US, anyway). Aside from stupid wannabe "rebels" in college, of course.
 
Eriol

Eriol

Interesting reactions out of Canada: Fidel Castro dies. Justin Trudeau issues statement. Much hilarity ensues. #TrudeauEulogies
This below is from our illustrious PM:
“It is with deep sorrow that I learned today of the death of Cuba’s longest serving President.
“Fidel Castro was a larger than life leader who served his people for almost half a century. A legendary revolutionary and orator, Mr. Castro made significant improvements to the education and healthcare of his island nation.
“While a controversial figure, both Mr. Castro’s supporters and detractors recognized his tremendous dedication and love for the Cuban people who had a deep and lasting affection for “el Comandante”.
“I know my father was very proud to call him a friend and I had the opportunity to meet Fidel when my father passed away. It was also a real honour to meet his three sons and his brother President Raúl Castro during my recent visit to Cuba.
“On behalf of all Canadians, Sophie and I offer our deepest condolences to the family, friends and many, many supporters of Mr. Castro. We join the people of Cuba today in mourning the loss of this remarkable leader.”
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I has inspired "parodies"
Though not universally liked by his compatriots, Mr. Ceausescu was a leader in urban design and affordable housing' #trudeaueulogies
— Cam Vidler (@camvidler) November 26, 2016

“While a controversial figure, even detractors recognize Pol Pot encouraged renewed contact between city and countryside.” #trudeaueulogies
— Andrew Coyne (@acoyne) November 26, 2016

“While a controversial figure, General Tojo brought America into World War II and ultimately helped shorten the war.” #trudeaueulogies
— Andrew Coyne (@acoyne) November 26, 2016

#trudeaueulogies “Today we say goodbye to Mr. Mussolini, the former Italian prime minister best known for his competent train-management.”
— J.J. McCullough (@JJ_McCullough) November 26, 2016

#trudeaueulogies "While Emperor Nero was controversial, his dedication to song and writing poetry signaled a Roman artistic renaissance." https://t.co/67oGEgZgDi
— Jason Hickman (@jasonhickman) November 26, 2016
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Let's just say not everybody in Canada agrees with our Prime Minister (me included).

In other news, dancing in the streets in Little Havana (aka Miami) - 'This is like a carnival'; Cuban exiles in Miami celebrate Fidel Castro's death
 
Dave

Dave

Staff member
Hopefully Fidel's brother is more open, which I think he's already proven. I think if we work with Cuba like Obama has wanted to do that we can do a lot to help its people.
 
Eriol

Eriol

stienman said:
Oh, it's too late for that, he already said, "On behalf of all Canadians" so you're on the line now.
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Be careful. Under that standard, if Trump uses "On behalf of all Americans..." you (and many others here) will be on a similar hook![DOUBLEPOST=1480190962,1480190820][/DOUBLEPOST]
Dave said:
Hopefully Fidel's brother is more open, which I think he's already proven. I think if we work with Cuba like Obama has wanted to do that we can do a lot to help its people.
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I think that's crap. Just look at China. Increased standard of living perhaps (though along with CHOKING levels of pollution), but also more brutal repression, Tibet will be China's FOREVER now due to shipping in of people (they outnumber native Tibetans now, similar to the Russia/Crimea situation, and eastern Ukraine), and increased freedom? How's that working out for the people of China?


Basically: I wouldn't bet on it.
 
Dave

Dave

Staff member
Won't know until we try, though will we? I mean, the stuff we've been trying hasn't helped at all. Maybe it's time to try something different.
 
Eriol

Eriol

Dave said:
Won't know until we try, though will we? I mean, the stuff we've been trying hasn't helped at all. Maybe it's time to try something different.
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Sure it hasn't Dave, but that doesn't mean "Well, what we've been doing hasn't worked, so let's try something we know doesn't work next!" That makes even less sense IMO.
 
Krisken

Krisken

Dave said:
Hopefully Fidel's brother is more open, which I think he's already proven. I think if we work with Cuba like Obama has wanted to do that we can do a lot to help its people.
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Wait, who do you think is going to work with him?!?
 
Dave

Dave

Staff member
Krisken said:
Wait, who do you think is going to work with him?!?
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Well, the US is already starting to relax restrictions. Under Castro II, Electric Boogaloo, things have been steadily improving. They've loosened the noose, so to speak. It's not anywhere near where we would like it to be and Obama and Raul sparred on this back in March. But Raul is nearing the end of his tenure as well and while not exactly pro-democratic, the future of Cuba is in the hands of more progressive people. I think that actively working with them to alleviate some of the economic pain would help them along and make it better for their people.
 
Krisken

Krisken

Dave said:
Well, the US is already starting to relax restrictions. Under Castro II, Electric Boogaloo, things have been steadily improving. They've loosened the noose, so to speak. It's not anywhere near where we would like it to be and Obama and Raul sparred on this back in March. But Raul is nearing the end of his tenure as well and while not exactly pro-democratic, the future of Cuba is in the hands of more progressive people. I think that actively working with them to alleviate some of the economic pain would help them along and make it better for their people.
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I mean, I hope the tensions stay relaxed and whatnot, but I feel like this current political climate is like a Bizarro world of "Lets do EVERYTHING opposite of the last administration". We will see though.
 
strawman

strawman

sixpackshaker said:
wut?

Besides opening up Vietnam, the rest have been under the GOP watch.
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North Korea? Cuba?

Dave said:
...while not exactly pro-democratic...
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:rofl:

Are you even listening to yourself?

From the Human Rights Watch:

The Cuban government continues to repress dissent and discourage public criticism. It now relies less on long-term prison sentences to punish its critics, but short-term arbitrary arrests of human rights defenders, independent journalists, and others have increased dramatically in recent years. Other repressive tactics employed by the government include beatings, public acts of shaming, and the termination of employment.
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If that's "not exactly pro-democratic" then I suspect you're going to be VERY happy with a Trump presidency!

:facepalm:[DOUBLEPOST=1480216850,1480216643][/DOUBLEPOST]
sixpackshaker said:
wut?

Besides opening up Vietnam, the rest have been under the GOP watch.
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Although I admit that Hillary was pulling away from this during the election, but I have a hard time determining if it was merely to get votes, or if she really was pushing back on the Obama administration's recent overtures towards North Korea.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/10/us/politics/hillary-clinton-north-korea.html?_r=0
 
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