Bombbombbomb BombBombIran

[ThatNickGuy]

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/s/afp/090927/world/iran_defence_military_missile

So...I'm starting to feel a little concered about the situation. Iran seems more viable a threat than Korea to fire off legitimate missles. Admittedly, the article mentions that the missles are short-range, in distance within "Israel, most Arab states, parts of Europe (including Turkey)".

 

[Shegokigo]

I seriously don't get the logic behind "I threaten you America, I will use a big missle!" when they MUST realize that if they even sneeze hard, we'd drop thousands soldiers in their country for the next 10 years.

 

[AshburnerX]

I seriously don't get the logic behind "I threaten you America, I will use a big missle!" when they MUST realize that if they even sneeze hard, we'd drop thousands soldiers in their country for the next 10 years.

They're doing it because they know we are stretched thin at the moment and that public opinion of us in the Middle East isn't great (to say the least). It's mainly about pacifying the hardliners in their own and other countries by looking like they could actually DO something to Israel in a fight... never mind that Israel fought off like 3-4 countries combined armies and WON the last time they had a large scale conflict.

 

[Shegokigo]

They realize that if America were in any real danger, we'd be all over them don't they? Stretched thin or not?

Then again, I am inclined to believe they're all hot air and talking out their ass about doing any real action.

 

[SpecialKO]

I somehow doubt that other countries in the region are all "friendly" with this. Lebanon, Egypt, and Saudi Arabia in particular can't be happy, and given Qatar's relationship with the US Military, they're probably not too thrilled either.

 

[Iaculus]

So, think the Israeli Air Force's back from bombing the site into dust yet?

 

[AshburnerX]

So, think the Israeli Air Force's back from bombing the site into dust yet?

Basically this. Israel is the only Airforce in the area that could possibly fight us and we're their closet ally. No one else has anything close to threatening us or anyone.

 

[Iaculus]

So, think the Israeli Air Force's back from bombing the site into dust yet?

Basically this. Israel is the only Airforce in the area that could possibly fight us and we're their closet ally. No one else has anything close to threatening us or anyone.[/QUOTE]

Hey, who says it's anything to do with the States?

Israel gets... antsy about having nukes pointed at it.

 

[ThatNickGuy]

To quote Robin Williams, "We'll bomb you back to the Stone Age" and Iran will think, "Ooh! Upgrade!"

 

[Rob King]

...never mind that Israel fought off like 3-4 countries combined armies and WON the last time they had a large scale conflict.

And also pay no attention to the fact that a few 'incidents' before that they fought three foreign nations and won in only six days.

 

[Covar]

I really don't get where people are getting these "stretched thin" comments.

 

[AshburnerX]

I really don't get where people are getting these "stretched thin" comments.

We're stretched thin because we don't want to pull anyone else away from other important assignments, like protecting Japan, South Korea, and Israel. We pull people from those places and we'll have some real serious problems.

 

[Rob King]

We're stretched thin because we don't want to pull anyone else away from other important assignments, like protecting Japan, South Korea, and Israel. We pull people from those places and we'll have some real serious problems.

Is Japan really still at risk? I mean, I can buy it being a great location to have some troops, just in case shit goes down in the region. I mean, China is right there, and it's a little farther from the North Korean reach than South Korea. But I can't imagine anyone gunning for Japan right now.

But I'm not from the area, so I don't know. I do know that the Japanese don't have a full army, just a "Japan Defense Force," but I figured that would be up to the task of Defending Japan. You know, just based on the nomenclature.

 

[ThatNickGuy]

Is Japan really still at risk?

Man, everyone always forgets about Godzilla.

 

[Dave]

To quote Robin Williams, "We'll bomb you back to the Stone Age" and Iran will think, "Ooh! Upgrade!"

You have no idea about what modern day Iran is like, do you? Granted, their government is wacky, but the people and industry are more like us than you realize.

There are a lot of places in the south of the United States that are more backwards than Iran.

---------- Post added at 08:25 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:24 AM ----------

Add in the fact that when we were threatened we rose up. Look at the numbers of people who enlisted after 9/11. We'd still be seeing those numbers had we kept the war on the terrorists and not Bush's private Iraqi vendetta.

 

[fade]

I loved when The Daily Show did a "Jaywalking" bit in Tehran (supposedly), and everyone there knew more US politics than most of the people in your average healthcare Town Hall, and knew more pop culture than I did. Yet Joe Sixpack thinks of Iran as some backwater camel town. (Of course, they handpicked just like Leno does. But it was clear it was an average city)

 

[Covar]

To quote Robin Williams, "We'll bomb you back to the Stone Age" and Iran will think, "Ooh! Upgrade!"

You have no idea about what modern day Iran is like, do you? Granted, their government is wacky, but the people and industry are more like us than you realize.

There are a lot of places in the south of the United States that are more backwards than Iran.

---------- Post added at 08:25 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:24 AM ----------

Add in the fact that when we were threatened we rose up. Look at the numbers of people who enlisted after 9/11. We'd still be seeing those numbers had we kept the war on the terrorists and not Bush's private Iraqi vendetta.[/QUOTE]

Recruiting numbers have actually Spiked this past year. We've been told that the Army has actually been meeting their quota and turning people away. Not sure what the levels are as I don't keep up with that stuff, but it's certainly not the "PLEASE JOIN THE MILITARY" situation that it was a couple of years ago.

/me hopes those numbers drop back down in a couple of years so he can be offered a large resigning bonus.

 

[AshburnerX]

We're stretched thin because we don't want to pull anyone else away from other important assignments, like protecting Japan, South Korea, and Israel. We pull people from those places and we'll have some real serious problems.

Is Japan really still at risk? I mean, I can buy it being a great location to have some troops, just in case shit goes down in the region. I mean, China is right there, and it's a little farther from the North Korean reach than South Korea. But I can't imagine anyone gunning for Japan right now.

But I'm not from the area, so I don't know. I do know that the Japanese don't have a full army, just a "Japan Defense Force," but I figured that would be up to the task of Defending Japan. You know, just based on the nomenclature.[/QUOTE]

North Korea has been routinely launching test missiles into the Sea of Japan. They are very close to having enough range to hit Japan and their relationship with North Korea is anything BUT friendly (Even South Korea and Japan barely get along). As for the Japanese Self Defense Force... it's mainly a joke. They have excellent hand to hand programs, but their modern military training and equipment leaves a lot to be desired. They also have a fairly antiquated Air Force and Navy. If China or North Korea actually tried something, they would have a serious problem without US or South Korean intervention.

Recruiting numbers have actually Spiked this past year. We've been told that the Army has actually been meeting their quota and turning people away. Not sure what the levels are as I don't keep up with that stuff, but it's certainly not the "PLEASE JOIN THE MILITARY" situation that it was a couple of years ago.

/me hopes those numbers drop back down in a couple of years so he can be offered a large resigning bonus.

Recruiting always goes up during Recessions, as people who would formerly take low tier service jobs instead are forced into military service to find work. However, I'm sure the recent surge in Patriotism is probably helping too.

 

[strawman]

I seriously don't get the logic behind "I threaten you America, I will use a big missle!" when they MUST realize that if they even sneeze hard, we'd drop thousands soldiers in their country for the next 10 years.

First, it's a completely different culture, so unless you have studied and lived with them for years you probably are not going to get their logic.

Second, it's no different than the tit-for-tat that USA and China have been doing for years. They knock down a satellite with ground based missiles? Guess what we did a month or so later. Every country has to 'keep up with the jones' militarily and very publicly, or risk getting attacked.

I think the part Iran is playing at right now is the "nervously crazy people that might explode a nuke in an important country if someone tries to hurt us" and for the most part it's working. They haven't been attacked by their enemies yet.

They don't have the military to follow up on a nuclear assault, though, so the only reason they are gearing up the way they are is to prevent others from thinking they are easy prey.

-Adam

 

[Rob King]

I think the part Iran is playing at right now is the "nervously crazy people that might explode a nuke in an important country if someone tries to hurt us" and for the most part it's working. They haven't been attacked by their enemies yet.

They don't have the military to follow up on a nuclear assault, though, so the only reason they are gearing up the way they are is to prevent others from thinking they are easy prey.

-Adam

Pretty much this. It's less about convincing the world that they could win a fight, and more about letting everyone know that even if you bested them in war, you won't come out unscathed.

For most, that's enough. Nobody is going to risk a nuclear attack. Not from Iran, or Fraggle Rock.

 

[rabbitgod]

I think the part Iran is playing at right now is the "nervously crazy people that might explode a nuke in an important country if someone tries to hurt us" and for the most part it's working. They haven't been attacked by their enemies yet.

They don't have the military to follow up on a nuclear assault, though, so the only reason they are gearing up the way they are is to prevent others from thinking they are easy prey.

-Adam

Pretty much this. It's less about convincing the world that they could win a fight, and more about letting everyone know that even if you bested them in war, you won't come out unscathed.

For most, that's enough. Nobody is going to risk a nuclear attack. Not from Iran, or Fraggle Rock.[/QUOTE]

Well, only if we stop that fundamentalist Doozer agenda.

 

[Mutiny]

Not from Iran, or Fraggle Rock.

Did someone call for my avatar?

 

[Chazwozel]

I seriously don't get the logic behind "I threaten you America, I will use a big missle!" when they MUST realize that if they even sneeze hard, we'd drop thousands soldiers in their country for the next 10 years.

Haha, that's exactly what happened with North Korea. They did there little missile tests, meanwhile the U.S. launches ballistic missiles in a 'test' to within a couple of yards of accuracy. I actually laughed when that happened, it's a nice reminder to these fuckwit dictators.

 

[Iaculus]

I seriously don't get the logic behind "I threaten you America, I will use a big missle!" when they MUST realize that if they even sneeze hard, we'd drop thousands soldiers in their country for the next 10 years.

Haha, that's exactly what happened with North Korea. They did there little missile tests, meanwhile the U.S. launches ballistic missiles in a 'test' to within a couple of yards of accuracy. I actually laughed when that happened, it's a nice reminder to these fuckwit dictators.[/QUOTE]

The issue, though, is that with enough nukes, accuracy becomes irrelevant. It's like a country-sized dead-man switch; "fuck with us and we end the world". It doesn't matter if other countries can do it as well, just so long as one crazy with the proper motivation has his hand on the button.

Now, I'm not saying most of these countries are there or anywhere near, but that's the threat we should be genuinely scared of - someone who doesn't care that they get blown up/martyred so long as they take their foes with them. Luckily, most leaders so far have had a sense of self-preservation, but again, it only takes one.

 

[fade]

A couple of yards? I'm surprised. They may have actually nerfed the accuracy for the demonstration. I'd expect a few centimeters or less. Even against a target acquired after launch. I can't say much, but suffice it to say you'd be surprised how oxymoronically accurate a statistically fuzzy targeting algorithm is.

 

[AshburnerX]

A couple of yards? I'm surprised. They may have actually nerfed the accuracy for the demonstration. I'd expect a few centimeters or less. Even against a target acquired after launch. I can't say much, but suffice it to say you'd be surprised how oxymoronically accurate a statistically fuzzy targeting algorithm is.

Th old saying was "With the V-2 was first introduced, you could generally pick which city block they would hit. These days, you can pick which window of the building you want to hit." That was 5-10 years ago... I imagine it's even better now.

 

[Iaculus]

A couple of yards? I'm surprised. They may have actually nerfed the accuracy for the demonstration. I'd expect a few centimeters or less. Even against a target acquired after launch. I can't say much, but suffice it to say you'd be surprised how oxymoronically accurate a statistically fuzzy targeting algorithm is.

Th old saying was "With the V-2 was first introduced, you could generally pick which city block they would hit. These days, you can pick which window of the building you want to hit." That was 5-10 years ago... I imagine it's even better now.[/QUOTE]

Well yes. I mean, there's all those stories from folks in Iraq about Tomahawks slowing down to turn round street corners, and that's just cool.

 

[Rob King]

A couple of yards? I'm surprised. They may have actually nerfed the accuracy for the demonstration. I'd expect a few centimeters or less. Even against a target acquired after launch. I can't say much, but suffice it to say you'd be surprised how oxymoronically accurate a statistically fuzzy targeting algorithm is.

Th old saying was "With the V-2 was first introduced, you could generally pick which city block they would hit. These days, you can pick which window of the building you want to hit." That was 5-10 years ago... I imagine it's even better now.[/QUOTE]

Well yes. I mean, there's all those stories from folks in Iraq about Tomahawks slowing down to turn round street corners, and that's just cool.[/QUOTE]

Because missiles always hit their targets horizontally, you know.

 

[Iaculus]

A couple of yards? I'm surprised. They may have actually nerfed the accuracy for the demonstration. I'd expect a few centimeters or less. Even against a target acquired after launch. I can't say much, but suffice it to say you'd be surprised how oxymoronically accurate a statistically fuzzy targeting algorithm is.

Th old saying was "With the V-2 was first introduced, you could generally pick which city block they would hit. These days, you can pick which window of the building you want to hit." That was 5-10 years ago... I imagine it's even better now.[/QUOTE]

Well yes. I mean, there's all those stories from folks in Iraq about Tomahawks slowing down to turn round street corners, and that's just cool.[/QUOTE]

Because missiles always hit their targets horizontally, you know.[/QUOTE]

Hey, I know guided missiles exist, but there's a difference between wiggling a little to get to your target and following a freakin' road map at supersonic speeds. Especially in your average Iraqi town.

 

[AshburnerX]

You'd be surprised at what you can do with a Nikita.

 

[Rob King]

Hey, I know guided missiles exist, but there's a difference between wiggling a little to get to your target and following a freakin' road map at supersonic speeds. Especially in your average Iraqi town.

I suppose. But I certainly wouldn't dismiss the possibility that they are freaky accurate. I'd bet on it, actually.

 

[Hylian]

 

[Iaculus]

Hey, I know guided missiles exist, but there's a difference between wiggling a little to get to your target and following a freakin' road map at supersonic speeds. Especially in your average Iraqi town.

I suppose. But I certainly wouldn't dismiss the possibility that they are freaky accurate. I'd bet on it, actually.[/QUOTE]

Dude, I know they are. That's why I mentioned the Tomahawk example - because those things are awesome.

 

[strawman]

Keep in mind that cruise missiles don't need to hit their target - they just need to get within 50 feet and explode. The explosives do the rest.

-Adam

 

[Rob King]

Hey, I know guided missiles exist, but there's a difference between wiggling a little to get to your target and following a freakin' road map at supersonic speeds. Especially in your average Iraqi town.

I suppose. But I certainly wouldn't dismiss the possibility that they are freaky accurate. I'd bet on it, actually.[/QUOTE]

Dude, I know they are. That's why I mentioned the Tomahawk example - because those things are awesome.[/QUOTE]

I see I see. Sorry about that. It sounded like your position was that they are inaccurate.

Carry on then.