[Movies] Avengers

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Norris

Norris

ThatNickGuy said:
As far as Ultron and Ant-Man are concerned, imagine this: have Ultron be his server robot or something in the Ant-Man movie. He does something towards the end to protect Ant-Man, but does it in such a horrifying way that Pym shuts him down. Credits roll. We return to Ultron...booting back up. Boom, Avengers 2 (or 3).
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I'm not sure that going from Thanos to Ultron would necessarily work in a movie series. Seems like a giant scaling back of threat, like trying to go from Darkseid to Prometheus. Never know though.

@Li3n said:
Tony's personality is all wrong for feeling guilty about Ultron... i mean you might as well have him slap Pepper for how much sense it would make...
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You've seen the first movie, right? The bulk of it is him feeling disillusioned with his life because his technology being used to hurt innocent people, the very people it was being used to save. He felt so responsible for these atrocities that he built an experimental suit of power armor and handled them personally.

Let us now imagine that he helped to create an android, one meant to protect the world should The Avengers ever fall or become brainwashed. He imprinted that android with his own brain patterns because when it comes down to it, there's no one else he completely trusts to protect the world. When that android comes online, it's all brilliance with no conscience. All narcissism with no humbling first hand experiences. It embarks on Tony's mission from the first movie but on steroids - disarm and pacify the entire populace of Earth. And because of Tony, it might be able to do it.

I'm betting he'd feel guilty as sin, and it would be completely in character.

@Li3n said:
He was all wrong for the role because he looked like a big, buff bodybuilder instead of a fat looking guy who's stronger then a sumo wrestler...
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There are some things that work great on the comic book page but not the silver screen and that is almost undeniably one of them.
 
ThatNickGuy

ThatNickGuy

Norris said:
I'm not sure that going from Thanos to Ultron would necessarily work in a movie series. Seems like a giant scaling back of threat, like trying to go from Darkseid to Prometheus. Never know though.
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While Thanos might be a universe-sized threat (only with the Infinity Gauntlet), Ultron has been a world-wide threat many times.
 
Norris

Norris

ThatNickGuy said:
While Thanos might be a universe-sized threat (only with the Infinity Gauntlet), Ultron has been a world-wide threat many times.
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I'm well aware of that. However, like you said, universe sized threat. If Thanos wipes half the universe from existence Infinity Gauntlet style, a killer robot just won't seem like as big a threat afterwards.
 
ScytheRexx

ScytheRexx

Bowielee said:
No, sparky, previous page. The post you obviously skipped.
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Okay, then you may need to point out which one I skipped, as your "last post" before the one you quoted was this...

Little late there, tex. For some reason I was mixing it up with Cap not being a founding member.
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I apologize if I can't read your mind about the post in question. Did you mean the one saying "I don't think Tony would work"?

Let us now imagine that he helped to create an android, one meant to protect the world should The Avengers ever fall or become brainwashed. He imprinted that android with his own brain patterns because when it comes down to it, there's no one else he completely trusts to protect the world. When that android comes online, it's all brilliance with no conscience. All narcissism with no humbling first hand experiences. It embarks on Tony's mission from the first movie but on steroids - disarm and pacify the entire populace of Earth. And because of Tony, it might be able to do it.
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Pretty much exactly what happened in Next Avengers. Tony made Ultron as a warrior for peace, but in the end Ultron came to the conclusion that the only way to bring peace was to either enslave or eliminate humanity.

P.S I think Ultron would be a good character to introduce in an Iron Man movie, and then have him play the "Loki" roll in the next Avengers. He is the main villain, but you still have Thanos kind of casting his shadow over the whole thing. Thanos would be saved for a third movie, to even out an Avengers "Trilogy".
 
Shegokigo

Shegokigo

Does it matter that Wasp and Ant Man were founding members but not part of the movie series?

Nick Fury, Hawkeye and Black Widow weren't founding members but now they're part of the movie series.

They barely managed to give all their on screen characters some serious screen time, add two more characters to the series and it's going to be a cluster fuck.
 
ThatNickGuy

ThatNickGuy

Could potentially be a remodel of the War Machine suit. Given his affiliation with the military, it's not an entirely out-there idea.
 
ScytheRexx

ScytheRexx

Shegokigo said:
They barely managed to give all their on screen characters some serious screen time, add two more characters to the series and it's going to be a cluster fuck.
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Very true.

There is one way I can see them involving Hank Pym, and that would be bringing him into an Iron Man movie as a new hire for Stark Industries, mostly because of his knowledge on artificial intelligence. He helps in building the first "Ultron", all the while working with his insects and his matter altering technology on the side. His girlfriend often visit, and while Tony keeping flirting with her, she stays true to Hank. Ultron very quickly in the movie becomes aware and kills Hank Pym, going out on a mission to enslave the world to bring the "peace" Hank desired.

Iron Man is forced to fight him, but being of similar tech as the armor, he can't overtake his robotic abilities. Suddenly Ultron shuts down, and a tiny spec comes from his "ear". The spec turns out to be Janet as she grows to her normal size, as she had taken what was left of Hank's tech to "avenge" him. Tony is impressed and asks if she wants to join the team, leading to her saying she would think about it.

Then in the next Avengers movie, she can take over for Hawkeye's spot on the team when she learns Ultron had somehow reactivated, since Hawkeye I consider to be rather flexible when it comes to being there. No one would miss him as much as the other members, and it would be nice to have another female character rather then just BW.
 
Bowielee

Bowielee

ScytheRexx said:
Okay, then you may need to point out which one I skipped, as your "last post" before the one you quoted was this...



I apologize if I can't read your mind about the post in question. Did you mean the one saying "I don't think Tony would work"?



Pretty much exactly what happened in Next Avengers. Tony made Ultron as a warrior for peace, but in the end Ultron came to the conclusion that the only way to bring peace was to either enslave or eliminate humanity.

P.S I think Ultron would be a good character to introduce in an Iron Man movie, and then have him play the "Loki" roll in the next Avengers. He is the main villain, but you still have Thanos kind of casting his shadow over the whole thing. Thanos would be saved for a third movie, to even out an Avengers "Trilogy".
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I didn't say Tony wouldn't work at all, I just said he wouldn't work as well. Mostly because he's so egotistical that he wouldn't let his utter failure humble him the way it does Hank. But for the purposes of the movie series, I could see alternate introductions but just AI gone crazy removes what makes Ultron an interesting character in the first place.
 
Bowielee

Bowielee

ThatNickGuy said:
While Thanos might be a universe-sized threat (only with the Infinity Gauntlet), Ultron has been a world-wide threat many times.
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Most major villains have been world-wide threats many times (otherwise they'd be pretty shitty villains).

For the record, Thanos is a universe sized threat even without the infinity gems.
I'm pretty sure they're going to go with the Infinity Gauntlet storyline for the next movie seeing as they already introduced the mind gem and Thanos himself.
 
ScytheRexx

ScytheRexx

ThatNickGuy said:
No offence, Sythe, but I would hate that and so would a great deal of other fans. You don't just kill off Ant Man.
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I am just coming up with an idea. I like Ant Man too, but I have to admit, he has always been a rather unpopular character, and so it's either bring him in and shuffle him out somehow (as they can't develop too many Avengers), or don't bring him at all. I would rather he get some screen time and then be killed creating something important then just treated like he never existed, which is pretty much the direction they are going right now.
 
ElJuski

ElJuski

Staff member
I just like it when funny looking dudes punch other funny looking dudes and say funny things while its all going on and I spend ten dollars on it and am happy.
 
@Li3n

@Li3n

Norris said:
You've seen the first movie, right? The bulk of it is him feeling disillusioned with his life because his technology being used to hurt innocent people, the very people it was being used to save. He felt so responsible for these atrocities that he built an experimental suit of power armor and handled them personally.

Let us now imagine that he helped to create an android, one meant to protect the world should The Avengers ever fall or become brainwashed. He imprinted that android with his own brain patterns because when it comes down to it, there's no one else he completely trusts to protect the world. When that android comes online, it's all brilliance with no conscience. All narcissism with no humbling first hand experiences. It embarks on Tony's mission from the first movie but on steroids - disarm and pacify the entire populace of Earth. And because of Tony, it might be able to do it.

I'm betting he'd feel guilty as sin, and it would be completely in character.
Click to expand...
When it comes to Tony i wouldn't use the word guilty, more like responsible...

And he'd be all "Oh guyz, i kinda made this bad robot that now wants to eradicate humanity, oops... let's kick it's ass"... sure, he'd be all guilty inside, but as you pointed out that manifests as him building and awesome suit to beat up bad guys with...

Also, if he had Tony's brain Ultron would totally make witty quips all the time... and that's not very Ultron. Leave that for an IM film where the armour goes sentient... someone doing that right i'd like to see.


Norris said:
There are some things that work great on the comic book page but not the silver screen and that is almost undeniably one of them.
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Right, like the Cosmic C.... oh wait.

He doesn't even have to be as fat as a sumo wrestler, just look at those world's strongest man guys, they're way more rounded then a body builder like Arnold that is all about how he looks...

The problem would be actually getting a good actor that fits physically... and have him get a bit fat.

Bowielee said:
Michael Clark Duncan as the Kingpin was the best part of Daredevil. He was perfectly cast.
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Never said he wasn't the best part of that film... just that he wasn't the Kingpin... but some alt universe version that was never fat as a kid...
 
@Li3n

@Li3n

ScytheRexx said:
I am just coming up with an idea. I like Ant Man too, but I have to admit, he has always been a rather unpopular character, and so it's either bring him in and shuffle him out somehow (as they can't develop too many Avengers), or don't bring him at all. I would rather he get some screen time and then be killed creating something important then just treated like he never existed, which is pretty much the direction they are going right now.
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Aren't they making an Ant-Man film?

Frank said:
Iron Man 3 already has like 15 villains in it and is going to be strange.

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I though Osborn was still with Sony...

I'm guessing they don't include the suit in that though...

But i guess this means no Mandarin... :(
 
ScytheRexx

ScytheRexx

@Li3n said:
Aren't they making an Ant-Man film?
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Who knows. It has been rather dead in the water. Edgar Wright has been working on the script for years, and it was supposed to be made before the Avengers movie, but was constantly put on hold because the character "isn't one of their biggest properties" (their words, not mine). Rumors are it's finally getting the Greenlight this year, but I have heard that all before.

Just to give you an idea of how they treat the character, a scene in Thor was supposed to have his named dropped by Dr. Selvig in regards to talking with a friend who has experience with SHIELD, but they wrote his name out of the script for the scene during production.
 
tegid

tegid

ThatNickGuy said:
Could potentially be a remodel of the War Machine suit. Given his affiliation with the military, it's not an entirely out-there idea.
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Heh... I read this and I was all like, wait, someone posted a very similar sentence in Newsarama's Facebook page! I checked and it was you :p

Anyway, I don't think that's war machine, the guy in the suit doesn't match... It may have something to do with the Detroit Steel recently shown in the comics, or it may be a different thing altogether.
 
@Li3n

@Li3n

Hailey Knight

Hailey Knight

CynicismKills said:
http://maskofreason.wordpress.com/2012/05/23/very-good-writing-why-loki-won-in-the-avengers/


I dunno if this guy is just reading into it way too much and giving Whedon more credit than needed, but if this is really what Loki's plan was, holy shit.

Also, spoilers in the link etcetc
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I'm half wanting to call BS, and have to pull the "he's insane now" card, but then, the kind of head-spinning planning there is pretty much how he operated in Thor, enough that he managed to confuse both the other characters and the audience, but it all made sense when you took the time to piece it out.
 
ScytheRexx

ScytheRexx

That story does not really work for me.

If he was just trying to get back to Asgard, why not just feign a change of heart when his brother came to claim him half way through the movie? Why not use that "good will" that came from that supposed redemption to walk into the vault, grab the gauntlet and the cube (which obviously will be put in the vault when he hands it over to Odin), and go "haha got you again, cya suckers!" as he teleports out to Thanos? Then Thanos has everything he wants and gets to keep his Chitari army.

Having him go through with the whole destruction of Earth and killing thousands of people is not going to win over Odin, if anything, it will mean he is going to try and make sure that Loki never gets anywhere near the vault. I don't see a Xanato's Gambit, I see an Occam's Razor.
 
bhamv3

bhamv3

Maybe Iron Man interrupted Thor before Loki could submit to being brought back.

Maybe Loki thought Thor and Odin would be suspicious if he didn't put up a fight.

Maybe Loki, being a fan of pomp and circumstance, wanted the chance to wreak some havoc before he went back to Asgard.

I'm not saying it's a perfect theory, but the plot holes don't appear to be fatal.
 
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