a Trump vs Clinton United States Presidential Election in 2016

Who do you vote into the office of USA President?


  • Total voters
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B

BErt

I'm asking this sincerely, because I don't know...if enough electors vote elsewhere to where neither Clinton or Trump get the required amount, does it still go to congress to decide? if so, I think that's what we want. I hope that's what we want? I really don't know anymore...
 
I'm asking this sincerely, because I don't know...if enough electors vote elsewhere to where neither Clinton or Trump get the required amount, does it still go to congress to decide? if so, I think that's what we want. I hope that's what we want? I really don't know anymore...
I don't know what we want anymore either, but if neither Trump nor Clinton get the required number of votes, then yes, it goes to Congress to make a decision.

What this also means is that it would not take an inordinate number of electors to turn it toward Congress.

I don't fucking know anymore; I just know Trump is a total shit-show. I'll take Pence over this, or Cruz, or Romney. Sincerely.
 
B

BErt

I don't know what we want anymore either, but if neither Trump nor Clinton get the required number of votes, then yes, it goes to Congress to make a decision.

What this also means is that it would not take an inordinate number of electors to turn it toward Congress.

I don't fucking know anymore; I just know Trump is a total shit-show. I'll take Pence over this, or Cruz, or Romney. Sincerely.

I still don't want to say I'd take Pence just based on his past, but gun to my head I probably do, yeah. :/
 
I still don't want to say I'd take Pence just based on his past, but gun to my head I probably do, yeah. :/
It feels like we're at that point. Trump was elected just a month and two days ago, not even taken the position yet, and the shitpile's size is staggering. He's trying to undermine the functions and security of the U.S. because there are ways it can benefit him and he knows he can get away with it.
 

Zappit

Staff member
We really need the EC to intervene and block Trump. This is the EXACT reason this part of the process was put in place.

Yes, he'll probably try to sue everybody. Yes, he'll throw an epic Twitter shit-fit. It might even lead to violence. But the prospect of four years of Trump is too terrifying not to take that risk. The damage he and the Billionaires' Club can and will inflict upon the masses will be far, far worse.
 

Dave

Staff member
My brother still says Trump has done more for the country already than "Obummer" did in the last 8 years.
 
I boggles my mind how Obama saves millions of jobs and gets shit on for the automaker bailout, and yet Trump saves 750 (Oh, wait, 1100, right...) and he is already doing so much more for the middle class then Obama (regardless of the fact that 2/3rds of the workers are still losing their jobs to Mexico). All the while he basically shows his true colors by pointing out himself that the "lock her up" chant was great for the election, but that he does not care now. He never cared, why do people think he will start caring? The only reason he even did the whole Carrier thing is because Pence started the process.
 

GasBandit

Staff member
I boggles my mind how Obama saves millions of jobs and gets shit on for the automaker bailout, and yet Trump saves 750 (Oh, wait, 1100, right...)
Speaking as someone who opposed the bailout, it's because you're comparing a not-uncommon tax break of $7 million to an $80 billion cash bailout "loan" that didn't pay back $9 billion (we're just supposed to be grateful it wasn't the $24 billion gap that was expected) that further reinforces the concept of privatized profit with nationalized risk while not addressing the root causes of the crisis in the first place.

Really, though, I do think Trump and Co are trying to take too much credit/make too much hay for the Carrier thing.
 
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Okay, I want to highlight something here that I don't think is getting nearly enough attention.

Trump told Chris Matthews that the reason he only needs a once-weekly intelligence briefing is because "I don't need to hear the same thing in the same words every day." He also said that "if something changes, they can call me."

He thinks the intelligence briefing, for the President of the United States, is the exact same, every day.

He literally thinks that nothing changes on a daily basis for the duration of a Presidency.

The level of ignorance of world affairs that takes is staggering. The fact that no one in his entire operation has managed to get him to understand that the ENTIRE POINT OF A DAILY INTELLIGENCE BRIEFING IS BECAUSE THINGS ARE CONSTANTLY CHANGING is bewildering.

I mean, he's allegedly an international businessman. Does he believe that ALSO remains static?

WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK?
 
I'm asking this sincerely, because I don't know...if enough electors vote elsewhere to where neither Clinton or Trump get the required amount, does it still go to congress to decide? if so, I think that's what we want. I hope that's what we want? I really don't know anymore...
It goes to the House of Representatives to choose the President, but they are only allowed to choose from the top three winners in the electoral college. There are only two people that have any electoral votes, Clinton and Trump, and the republican controlled house will choose Trump. There's simply no way they will choose Clinton, and they cannot choose someone that didn't place in the top three in electoral votes.

About the only chance of something other than a Trump presidency is either
1) Enough faithless trump electors vote Clinton or
2) Clinton directs her electors to choose a different republican, and if there exist enough faithless trump electors who choose that same republican.

And 1 is unlikely, 2 is only slightly more likely, but still very far fetched.

But who knows. It's the 11th, and the electors have just over a week to be influenced.
 
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/dec/11/intelligence-agencies-cia-donald-trump-russia

Carle, the retired CIA officer, said Trump’s temperament had played into Russia’s hands and put the president-elect on a collision course with the CIA.
He said: “Look, in my professional assessment as an intelligence officer, Trump has a reflexive, defensive, monumentally narcissistic personality, for whom the facts and national interest are irrelevant, and the only thing that counts is whatever gives personal advantage and directs attention to himself.
“He is about the juiciest intelligence target an intelligence office could imagine. He groans with vulnerabilities. He will only work with individuals or entities that agree with him and build him up, and he is a shockingly easy intelligence ‘target’ to manipulate.”
Were Trump an intelligence officer himself, Carle said, “he would be removed and possibly charged with having accepted the clandestine support of a hostile power to the harm of the United States”.
 
This has the ultimate effect of helping Clinton, though. The "broken" voting machines sometimes need to have a ballot passed through more than once to register correctly, but sometimes the vote count has to be adjusted... for some unexplained reason.

So what happens is they run one ballot through multiple times.

Leading to one ballot counting for many votes.

Clinton leads heavily in Detroit, so this means that Clinton's vote counts are inflated and can't be recounted when this type of "error" occurs, leaving her with a vote count that perhaps might be inflated.

Which leads to situations like this:



This, of course, is a trump elector so like so many other first hand reports of recount issues it may be worthwhile taking it with a grain of salt.

Still, the voting machines are very old. We use the same machines here in my area, and I have had a ballot spit back out and have to be reinserted, but I always assumed that such ballots weren't counted until accepted.

Stories of people opening the machine and passing through ballots again (even going so far as to accuse precinct officials of taking voting machines out of the building for dozens of minutes and bringing them back without explanation) do suggest that there are significant issues with the way we deal with voting.

What I'd like to see, and what Jill Stein says she's trying to do, is essentially call for a complete audit of the election. If nothing is wrong, great.

But obviously there are several things wrong, and even if the outcome doesn't change, we need to look closely at the process and outcome to understand where the issues are so we can try to fix them.
 

Zappit

Staff member
This really is Russia's puppet government, isn't it? This is terrifying.

It's a longshot, but we might end up with Clinton in the White House because this is just fucking insanity.
 
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