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President Barack Obama: We tortured some folks

Dec 9, 2014#1

Charlie Don't Surf

Hey so you remember how the CIA tortured people a lot, and it turned out this did nothing but inflict cruelty onto other human beings with no benefits whatsoever?!???

This looks like a really cool presentation, but I haven't gone through it all yet:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/special/national/cia-interrogation-report/key-findings/

Also, source for the thread title, a sentence that will always make me laugh and smh

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/obama-we-tortured-some-folks-after-911/

More fun tweets:

Also, if you think most of the stuff in the report(s) isn't "torture", get the fuck out of this thread and go back to Candyland and play in the goddamn gumdrop forests

Dec 9, 2014#2

Terrik

But it's OK though, because Obama went on the Colbert Report and everyone had a few good laughs.

Dec 9, 2014#3

Charlie Don't Surf

Terrik said:
But it's OK though, because Obama went on the Colbert Report and everyone had a few good laughs.

This was an impressively calculated move, I'll admit.

Dec 9, 2014#4

GasBandit

Naked and hypothermic is definitely unacceptable. Charges need to be brought for that, certainly. I have less antipathy for psychological methods (the sensory deprivation, the gaslighting, etc) but clearly there was not enough oversight on the process, or what there was failed to maintain acceptable standards.

Dec 9, 2014#5

Charlie Don't Surf

None of these people went to prison, and none of them are going to ever go to prison (unless they film a police officer, but I digress).

Dec 9, 2014#6

GasBandit

He thought better of what he posted and self-deleted.

Dec 9, 2014#7

tegid

It's an interesting point though. People answer with 'hey, why are you not complaining equally about other people who do bad shit'? and I understand it's because they feel attacked, be it directly themselves or through people they admire and love or through their values. This is not due to this deleted post specifically, it just stirred me to post a thought that I already had from the police indictments discussions.

The sadness outrage for the actions of people who are clear terrorists or criminals is obvious. We can comment on it, we can rant, we can shout about it. But there is an extra outrage to be had when you feel people who are supposed to be protecting you, people who you are supposed to trust, are abusing that trust, using it to hurt others. Another example of this are the cases of child abuse by catholic priests in many places.
There's another component too: there's a different outrage, or expression of outrage, when the people doing bad deeds are supposed to be held accountable to you. For one, the outrage is useful in a sense, because you are supposed to be able to control future actions of these people who you feel are doing wrong. This is also related to outrage directed to the system, if it is not doing what it should to control the actions of public servants to align with your values (applicable here and in the other thread). In this sense, for instance, I feel a different kind of anger at the cases of police abuse that there may be in the US or here in Spain, because shit, they are supposed to answer to me in a way!

Dec 9, 2014#8

Krisken

Sickening. Just deplorable. I didn't like it 10 years ago, and I certainly don't like it now. I have no words strong enough to describe my disappointment in our government.

Dec 9, 2014#9

Covar

Try "vote third party."

Dec 9, 2014#10

GasBandit

Covar said:
Try "vote third party."

Or, as I like to call it, the November Routine.

Dec 9, 2014#11

Krisken

Covar said:
Try "vote third party."

Closest I come to agreeing with a third party is Green. Sorry man, not joining the Libertarian illusion

Dec 9, 2014#12

Mathias

Krisken said:
Closest I come to agreeing with a third party is Green. Sorry man, not joining the Libertarian illusion

I voted for Jill Stein last election... Meh, I should have just written in Mickey Mouse.

Also, while I agree with your stance on the topic at large, Chuckles, I don't think Dianne Feinstein is one to talk about fair and just, considering she's one of the biggest money grabbing, sleazy politicians out there.

Dec 9, 2014#13

GasBandit

Mathias said:
Also, while I agree with your stance on the topic at large, Chuckles, I don't think Dianne Feinstein is one to talk about fair and just, considering she's one of the biggest money grabbing, sleazy politicians out there.

Indeed. Make no mistake, this wasn't about any kind of moral obligation or sense of justice, this was a lame duck trashing the hotel before checkout.

Dec 9, 2014#14

Hailey Knight

No one who did any of this will be held accountable.

Dec 10, 2014#15

Charlie Don't Surf

I'm not championing Feinstein on purpose, just because she did it for a typical politician sleazy reason doesn't make the facts any less damning.

Dec 10, 2014#16

DarkAudit

Charlie Don't Surf said:
I'm not championing Feinstein on purpose, just because she did it for a typical politician sleazy reason doesn't make the facts any less damning.

Feinstein deserves no championing. She may not go so far as condoning torture, but when it comes to your privacy, the Constitution may as well be a bog roll.

Dec 10, 2014#17

Tress

Sorry about Feinstein, y'all. She is oddly popular here in CA, and to my memory no one has ever come close to unseating her. We try, but she's going to be there until she retires or gets another position.

Dec 10, 2014#18

Dave

Zero Esc said:
No one who did any of this will be held accountable.

Are you kidding? Someone is already in jail for this!

http://www.vox.com/xpress/2014/12/9/7361667/senate-torture-report-kiriakou

The guy who was the whistleblower is currently in jail.

Dec 10, 2014#19

Dave

The number of people - for some reason mostly republican - saying that all was justified because we got attacked is too damned high.

Dec 10, 2014#20

Hailey Knight

Dave said:
Are you kidding? Someone is already in jail for this!

http://www.vox.com/xpress/2014/12/9/7361667/senate-torture-report-kiriakou

The guy who was the whistleblower is currently in jail.

Dec 10, 2014#21

bhamv3

"You don't even get good information that way. After a point, victims admit to anything to make the pain stop."

Dec 10, 2014#22

Mathias

Dave said:
The number of people - for some reason mostly republican - saying that all was justified because we got attacked is too damned high.

9/11 is the Repub default for why every horrific thing their fringe members say is ok.

Dec 10, 2014#23

Dave

Mathias said:
9/11 is the Repub default for why every horrific thing their fringe members say is ok.

I was listening to a talk show today on NPR about the whole thing. It was amazing to me how many called up saying that we hadn't gone far enough or that they deserved it because terrorists! They didn't have the brainpower to critically think about the fact that some of those people were picked up because of bad intel brought about by torture and had done NOTHING! You know who they blamed? "The democrats for releasing the report and putting American lives in danger."

Dec 10, 2014#24

Hailey Knight

Fucking shits pissed more that they got caught, unable to comprehend something's wrong.

Dec 11, 2014#25

Eriol

A lot of statements of republicans defending the program here:
Torture report ‘full of crap,’ says Dick Cheney, as CIA steps up campaign to discredit Senate investigation

Good reporting, on that the article just repeats what each says, and little more, though the believability of all involved pretty much goes under the bus.

Dec 11, 2014#26

Dave

So Cheney totally admits to war crimes and Nuremberg-like offenses while at the same time implicating the former President.

It just went from interesting to incredible. I'd like to think that heads would roll but I know better.

Dec 11, 2014#27

Ravenpoe

When I think of human rights and ethics, I think of Dick Cheney.

Dec 11, 2014#28

GasBandit

Dick Cheney is General Ross incarnate.

Dec 11, 2014#29

sixpackshaker

GasBandit said:
Dick Cheney is General Ross incarnate.

I thought Ross had "some" morals.

Dec 11, 2014#30

Chad Sexington

John Brennan basically said, "You're goddamn right I ordered the code red!"

Dec 11, 2014#31

GasBandit

Chad Sexington said:
John Brennan basically said, "You're goddamn right I ordered the code red!"

Dec 11, 2014#32

Chad Sexington

GasBandit said:
?

Dec 11, 2014#33

sixpackshaker

Thanks Obama.

Dec 12, 2014#34

ThatNickGuy

GasBandit said:
Dick Cheney is General Ross incarnate.

So wait, then who fills in the Hulk role there? Or were you not talking "Thunderbolt" Ross?"

Dec 12, 2014#35

GasBandit

ThatNickGuy said:
So wait, then who fills in the Hulk role there? Or were you not talking "Thunderbolt" Ross?"

No, you have it exactly right.

Dec 12, 2014#36

CynicismKills

Tress said:
Sorry about Feinstein, y'all. She is oddly popular here in CA, and to my memory no one has ever come close to unseating her. We try, but she's going to be there until she retires or gets another position.

CA is kind of fucked when it comes to who we elect. Hell, here in Murrieta the mayor got another term even though he got busted for driving drunk and rear-ending a car (which sent some high school girls to the hospital).

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