The American way is dead? Buy a truck and get a gun!!

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crono1224

Japan has extremely strict gun laws and what not, I don't think they have huge problems with gun violence.

You would to ban all guns need extremely strict gun laws, maybe a felony just to have one. But that brings in problems with off-duty police officers carrying them, maybe military personal, and if they are allowed say the forget their ids.

Its just a big mess, but your story of the rush hour thing is moot, she could have fled, and the diner thing may have been to if no one in there was carrying, and i'm not sure on the number of people do in relation to total population but i am sure its possible that no one in there then would have had a gun :D
 
tegid

tegid

Well, I don't know how it is in other countries, but in Spain we have strict gun regulations and there aren't, by far, as man crimes related to guns. You say the black market's a bitch, and it is, but in part that's because your loose regulations and many people having weapons allow some of them to end up in the black market, I guess.
 
Covar

Covar

:rofl: I love this thread.

crono1224: I don't like guns and think they should be banned. All they cause is increased violence.
crimsonSoul: I disagree with your asumption **links to statistics on gun violance**
crono1224: Your statistics don't help my view so I'm going to say they're meaningless and continue stating that guns just cause violence.

*repeat*

:popcorn:

seriously crono1224 you might as well claim that President Obama's been saving jobs in this economy with his stimulus plans, or that God exists. none of these things can be proven with evidence.
 
Denbrought

Denbrought

Covar said:
:rofl: I love this thread.

crono1224: I don't like guns and think they should be banned. All they cause is increased violence.
crimsonSoul: I disagree with your asumption **links to statistics on gun violance**
crono1224: Your statistics don't help my view so I'm going to say they're meaningless and continue stating that guns just cause violence.

*repeat*

:popcorn:

seriously crono1224 you might as well claim that President Obama's been saving jobs in this economy with his stimulus plans, or that God exists. none of these things can be proven with evidence.
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If there was such a thing as a troll textbook, I'm sure this would be in the example section. Very good work.
 
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crono1224

I have been owned, cause clearly statistics are never able to applied specifically to one side or the other :(. But alas, he has gotten me good with the fact that statistics can't be refuted.
 
Covar

Covar

:waah:

The thing is you are not refuting the statistics. You offer nothing in your argument other that your dislike of the statistics offered. How about information of your own? perhaps some studies showing that guns increase the rate of violence of a region when introduced? Or perhaps even that murder rates are even or higher among gun owners than non gun owners. That would go ways towards helping your argument and give you a leg to stand on.

nah, to much work.
 
@Li3n

@Li3n

If you ban guns gun crime does go down... just ask the british... over there knife crime is where it's at...
 
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crono1224

http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/glance/tab ... taltab.htm

All those crimes can be reduced to 0 without weapons. There I just posted a stupid statistic that in reality would never happen, but because it has numbers and its shiny it makes my point. Are you done trying to be intelligent and acting like statistics can't be bent to different things.
 
tegid

tegid

@Li3n said:
If you ban guns gun crime does go down... just ask the british... over there knife crime is where it's at...
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It's more or less like that here in Spain too. Probably most of Europe.

I don't need any more statistics than that.
 
CrimsonSoul

CrimsonSoul

crono1224 said:
http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/glance/tables/firearmnonfataltab.htm

All those crimes can be reduced to 0 without weapons. There I just posted a stupid statistic that in reality would never happen, but because it has numbers and its shiny it makes my point. Are you done trying to be intelligent and acting like statistics can't be bent to different things.
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So... of all violent crimes, in 2005 firearms were 9 percent....you just blew my mind
 
figmentPez

figmentPez

Staff member
tegid said:
Surely you understand that a violent crime with a firearm is worse than one without a weapon?
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Not necessarily. Just because a violent crime is perpetrated without any sort of weapon does not mean it is inherently better than one involving a gun.
 
figmentPez

figmentPez

Staff member
tegid said:
Well then, I'll just add some magic word :p

tegid said:
Surely you understand that a violent crime with a firearm is probably worse than one without a weapon?
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Yes, I imagine a fistfight is preferrable to a gunfight. However, I'm not convinced that a hit-and-run is probably better than a convenience store hold-up.
 
figmentPez

figmentPez

Staff member
tegid said:
Well then... usually should be fine. :humph:
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I understand that violent crime with a gun is different than violent crime without a gun, but even that implies that it's possible to make it so that violent crime occurs without guns, and that's just absurd.
 
CrimsonSoul

CrimsonSoul

oh, I agree, Tegid. but 9 percent isn't a big number if it were closer to 20% I would be more in line to agree but when the percentage is below 10% it makes you wonder what the other 90% consist of. such as this statistic from the same site "In 2006, about 68% of all murders, 42% of all robberies, and 22% of all aggravated assaults that were reported to the police were committed with a firearm." now that is a staggering number. On the other hand if these people walked into a store and saw 3, 4, 5, or more people with firearms, or suspected that they may have firearms don't you think that somehow prevents the crimes before they are even committed.
 
tegid

tegid

Of course I do. It's obvious. But if the criminal doesn't have a firearm either the situation is far less dangerous, isn't it? And, like I said, in the cases I know strict gun regulation makes guns much harder to get for criminals too.

Of course, the same laws won't work on different cultures, and yours has the gun owning right pretty much in the core, doesn't it? So I'm not saying you should completely forbid firearms, but maybe get progressively stricter regulations. I mean, for chrissake... AK47?!

Also, the statistic you brought in speaks in my favor, I guess.
 
CrimsonSoul

CrimsonSoul

They do, you needed the help :) I'm on the side of the road that takes an all or nothing stance on the subject like wire-tapping for "suspected" terrorist without a warrent that supposedly have the same rights as citizens. Either everyone has equal rights or no one does, that was the point of the constitution.
With that in mind I believe either ban all firearms or ban none of them. Want to ban all assault rifles, fine ban them for all civilians and police (I leave military out of this). Why does this make sense because if they are illegal no one will have them right, and we don't want police running to a store holdup with powerful assault rifles when the badguy only ahs a gun or a knife, that's absurd! Complete gun control is impossible in any area. I'm sure in Europe there are gun crimes and they a have very strict gun laws there but they don't allow their law abiding citizens to own one so they are left defensless in a situation where the badguy has a gun and they are left with knives or fist. I say even the playing field, the badguys want to hold me up with a weapon they are goign to have one pointed right back at their center mass.
 
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crono1224

First of all that is non-fatal crimes, so you gotta add in homicides committed with them. But regardless the number is still 9%. I don't see how it's completely shrugable, while it is low its not 0 :D.

I was merely making the point that numbers can support lots of things, such as you can see 9% as being low, and someone else can see it as being high. There isn't really a refrence point, and history is probably not the greatest arguement cause society changes and I tend to think that has a possible effect on crime.
 
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crono1224

Espy said:
crono1224 said:
Cat said:
We should get rid of cars so the roads will be safe for our kids.
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:p cause we don't need transportation :D
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Hey, you can have transportation without cars and you would save many lives.
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True, I just assumed he was applying it to all forms, since not just cars kill people :p

Though I assume he was just kidding anywho.
 
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The Mike

So basically you can get a bargain on your "rob a bank today kit" that sound fun for everybody
 
CrimsonSoul

CrimsonSoul

The Mike said:
So basically you can get a bargain on your "rob a bank today kit" that sound fun for everybody
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You know felons are not allowed to own a handgun right, and everyone goes through a FBI background check on every purchase whether it's their first for 500th. So I doubt someone would just get a AK and decide to rob a bank if they have committed no crimes their entire life.
 
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The Mike

I just though about it, I get an AK and a good run away vehicle, and I've never committed a crime in my life.

(downloading stuff doesn't count)
 
SpecialKO

SpecialKO

The Mike said:
I just though about it, I get an AK and a good run away vehicle, and I've never committed a crime in my life.

(downloading stuff doesn't count)
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I think we should all be glad that the RIAA doesn't usually take their shit back by armed force.
 
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