Fans don't go to movies because of who paid for it, they go because of who's in it. You can always get someone else to write the cheques, but a lot of fans may stay away and/or organize a boycott if Gal isn't back.
[Movies] The DC Cinematic Universe - The David Zazlav Dumpster Fire.
But the people writing the cheques are the people in charge, and if these scandals have shown us anything, they have a real problem being told no
They'll just recast the role, and make the claim that super-hero movies are falling out of favor with the public when it fails because WW spends the whole movie in a series of bathing suits and lingerie, except for that one set piece action scene at the climax of the film.
A few of those people who were in charge last month aren't anymore because of those scandals. We're starting to see actual consequences.
But that's another thread.
Here's the first review of Justice League that I've seen: Not even Wonder Woman can save 'Justice League'
Nothing surprising there. At least it has Wonder Woman. After her movie, I'm sure they learned how to use her best-
Christ, DC, you've done ONE THING right cinematically in YEARS, and you fuck that up? You guys don't deserve Wonder Woman, and you don't deserve a DCCU.
Fuck fuckity fuck-fuck.
Christ, DC, you've done ONE THING right cinematically in YEARS, and you fuck that up? You guys don't deserve Wonder Woman, and you don't deserve a DCCU.
Dave
Staff member
http://www.metacritic.com/movie/justice-league/critic-reviews
Metacritic has 41 reviews and an overall score of 49. Not good.[DOUBLEPOST=1510808121,1510808008][/DOUBLEPOST]I also read one that said you can really tell where Whedon had his rewrites in. Everything is all brooding and grimdark, then someone pops up with a quip or funny line and it just seems out of place and falls flat.
Metacritic has 41 reviews and an overall score of 49. Not good.[DOUBLEPOST=1510808121,1510808008][/DOUBLEPOST]I also read one that said you can really tell where Whedon had his rewrites in. Everything is all brooding and grimdark, then someone pops up with a quip or funny line and it just seems out of place and falls flat.
That was something I wondered about this morning. Snyder + Whedon, each appealing to the audience they know, essentially a moving trying to please everyone and possibly pleasing no one.
Tomatometer not up on their site yet, but the See It/Skip It video reveals 43%.
It's probably good that RT has their own show now, if only so they can explain how their own site's score works to the people who think it's like a school test grade. That said, 43/100 saying it's good isn't as strong as 51/100 saying it's good, vs 57/100 saying it's bad, but reviews on either side seem like people aren't really sure how to feel.
I thought I might be seeing it tonight, but my wife has pointed out that will be inconvenient for dinner stuff, so I guess I'm not.
It's probably good that RT has their own show now, if only so they can explain how their own site's score works to the people who think it's like a school test grade. That said, 43/100 saying it's good isn't as strong as 51/100 saying it's good, vs 57/100 saying it's bad, but reviews on either side seem like people aren't really sure how to feel.
I thought I might be seeing it tonight, but my wife has pointed out that will be inconvenient for dinner stuff, so I guess I'm not.
"If Dawn of Justice was a cauldron of boiling gorilla piss, then Justice League is the same thing, but the gorilla piss is now just room temperature. It's every bit as gross and unpleasant and you shouldn't go near it or touch it, but at least it won't at least physically injure you."
Bob sums it up by saying it's better than BvS, not as good as Man of Steel, definitely not as good as Wonder Woman, about the same overall as Suicide Squad.
Bob sums it up by saying it's better than BvS, not as good as Man of Steel, definitely not as good as Wonder Woman, about the same overall as Suicide Squad.
And seeing as I walked away from Man of Steel before they ever left Krypton, that makes this a solid No Fucking Way.
I thought they've already said they've gotten rid of Ratner.
Yes, I read that as well.
"The DCEU! Now 16% better than Dawn of Justice!"
So I pulled a comment off Reddit that I posted earlier regarding how I think the DC universe should have been handled:
I thought MoS was a really good cinematic universe opener, but there should have been a stand alone Batman movie and a sequel to MoS before BvS. The MoS sequel could have fleshed out Lex Luthor way better. The stand alone Batman movie would have explained how the Joker broke Batman. BvS could have then set up the Wonderwoman movie like it currently does, and focus more on the death of Superman. Then a separate Flash movie. Maybe a separate Aquaman movie. THEN a Justice League movie.
Edit: I forgot about Suicide Squad. You know what. If the pacing wasnt' all fucked up, Suicide Squad would be a great forerunner to Wonder Woman - with the introduction of Gods and mystical elements to the DC universe. AND it could also bridge the BvS and standalone Batman movie. Hell, a standalone Batman movie would have made fleshing out the Joker in Suicide Squad not necessary, perhaps avoiding the current disappointment of such little screen time avoided. I feel like Suicide Squad could have acted as a loose sequel to a Batman movie and really help bring in the 'Gods' aspect of the DC universe. It's really hard to mix Sci Fi (Superman) with mythology (Wonder Woman, Aquaman) with modern grit (Batman, Flash, Cyborg), but Suicide Squad could have been that bridge.
Yes, Nick, I know you hated MoS
, but I still think it was a pretty decent Superman flick.
I thought MoS was a really good cinematic universe opener, but there should have been a stand alone Batman movie and a sequel to MoS before BvS. The MoS sequel could have fleshed out Lex Luthor way better. The stand alone Batman movie would have explained how the Joker broke Batman. BvS could have then set up the Wonderwoman movie like it currently does, and focus more on the death of Superman. Then a separate Flash movie. Maybe a separate Aquaman movie. THEN a Justice League movie.
Edit: I forgot about Suicide Squad. You know what. If the pacing wasnt' all fucked up, Suicide Squad would be a great forerunner to Wonder Woman - with the introduction of Gods and mystical elements to the DC universe. AND it could also bridge the BvS and standalone Batman movie. Hell, a standalone Batman movie would have made fleshing out the Joker in Suicide Squad not necessary, perhaps avoiding the current disappointment of such little screen time avoided. I feel like Suicide Squad could have acted as a loose sequel to a Batman movie and really help bring in the 'Gods' aspect of the DC universe. It's really hard to mix Sci Fi (Superman) with mythology (Wonder Woman, Aquaman) with modern grit (Batman, Flash, Cyborg), but Suicide Squad could have been that bridge.
Yes, Nick, I know you hated MoS
, but I still think it was a pretty decent Superman flick.I'm still going to Justice League, I've decided. People I know who hated BvS are giving it a passing grade. I'm willing to give it a chance.
Uh actually, that would make it 59% higher. You confused percentages with percentage points. Boy, I really hope somebody gets fired for that blunder.
I didn't think it was a bad movie, honestly. Great casting choices, great acting, great action and special effects.Yes, Nick, I know you hated MoS
I just think it's a terrible SUPERMAN movie.[DOUBLEPOST=1510889666,1510889633][/DOUBLEPOST]
Meh. I wasn't taking it that seriously.
What came to mind after reading Nick's first book: "now THIS is a guy who knows his math!"
I...don't understand what you're referencing here.
You're a writer; no one should expect you to understand percentagesI...don't understand what you're referencing here.
.I think I've asked you this before, but would you say the final act makes it a bad Superman movie? Cause I think the first and second acts tie in pretty closely with what Superman's all about - Hope. The final act I can definitely agree is less Superman and more action.
Oh now I remember - the trucker scene put you off.
I think I kinda handwaved magic'd it as "Clark Kent is still a young man and not sure of who he really is yet." I can agree that it was not a Superman thing to do, but didn't Clark also abuse his power in a diner at some point in the Christopher Reeves movies? I can't really remember.
Last edited:
I'm pretty sure he knocked a redneck into a pinball machine.
And then snapped his neck.
It was a long time ago. I might not be remembering it right.
Supergirl does Superman better than MoS did. By far!
Oh, that reminds. @ThatNickGuy, I'm curious about something. Apart from Smallville, is there any other Superman story where Clark is friends with Lex Luthor and is blind to Lex's evil?
Their friendship is mentioned in Supergirl's second season, and it struck me that the show was combining all of the past live action Supermans into one version. He has Tom Welling Supes' past, Dean Cain Supes' present, Christopher Reeves Supes' personality and mannerisms and Henry Caville Supes' physique. The show's creators clearly love Superman.
Oh, that reminds. @ThatNickGuy, I'm curious about something. Apart from Smallville, is there any other Superman story where Clark is friends with Lex Luthor and is blind to Lex's evil?
Their friendship is mentioned in Supergirl's second season, and it struck me that the show was combining all of the past live action Supermans into one version. He has Tom Welling Supes' past, Dean Cain Supes' present, Christopher Reeves Supes' personality and mannerisms and Henry Caville Supes' physique. The show's creators clearly love Superman.
GasBandit
Staff member
Injustice, kinda. Superman and Lex are friends, but Superman is a cruel tyrant and Lex is secretly in league with the resistance trying to overthrow him.
That's definitely not the Supes in Supergirl.
GasBandit
Staff member
I really liked reading Injustice. It's an alternate universe what-if scenario, where the Joker tricks Superman into killing Lois, who was pregnant with his child. It pushes him over the edge, and he decides the only acceptable way to ensure order going forward is for him to rule Earth with an iron fist and the penalty for all crime (including not obeying his new regime) is death.
Batman don't play that shit, and sets up a resistance. Then there's a big DC civil war with "heroes" and "villains" on both sides. And it's got OH so many memeworthy quotes.
There's a few issues where it gets kinda dumb, but it comes back around to being good again after that.
That is oh so very grimdark!
Although I'm really mostly looking to confirm my impression that Supergirl is drawing directly from all the TV and movie Supermans. They clearly weren't drawing on Injustice Supes.
. . . And I realize that I left out Brandon Routh Supes from my list. Meh.
. . . Also, I'm really curious to see what the Adam West to Christian Bale ratio will be if Supergirl does more than just allude to that guy.
It's a precedence dating back to the Silver Age, believe it or not. But Silver Age canon was so loose, it's debatable whether it was ever "official." I think the idea was introduced in an issue of Superboy, which were adventures with Clark in Smallville (or with the Legion of Superheroes) before he became Superman. He and Lex were best friends, similar in some ways to their dynamic in the show, Smallville. It also explained why Lex hates Superboy/man: he blames him for losing his hair. True story. I think it was from Kryptonite poisoning, but I'm not as sure about that.
After Crisis, that part of canon was tossed and Lex became the billionaire philanthropist (instead of a scientist/criminal mastermind) that's largely stuck with the character. But Geoff Johns reintroduced their Smallville friendship during his run. I don't think many writers did much with it. Neither did he, really.
Mark Waid's Birthright, which was a modern rewriting of Superman's origin (and a great one) also used it. Lex lost his hair in a fire that destroyed his home in Smallville and blamed Clark for ruining his invention at the time. So he cut Clark out of his life and acted like he'd forgotten him when they reunited in Metropolis.
Last edited: