[MMO] The WarCraft Movie

[Raemon777]

Not sure whether this properly goes in the Media forum or the Games forum, but the people I wanted to talk about it with are more reliably over here so....

I've been reading reviews for the past two weeks with grim determination, knowing that no matter how awful they were, I still *had* to see the movie. WarCraft was my first fandom. Connecting with people online, anticipating WarCraft III together was one of my formative experiences. I obsessed over the lore for the longest time, savoring every scrap of it, until eventually (in WoW) the amount of information I'd have to consume became too great.

I haven't actually played WoW in a while, but to honor my 12-year-old self I had to see this through.

Non-Spoiler-Review:

I enjoyed it. The reviews are basically all accurate - some of the acting isn't that great, and some is actively bad. They try to convey basically everything that happens chronologically in WarCraft I, and the movie buckles a bit under the strain.

But it opens and ends pretty strongly, and apart from a some where slow second-act beginning, I enjoyed it throughout. It's at least as good as string of cutscenes. Most importantly, they were clearly, earnestly trying to tell the WarCraft story, not dumb it down for the masses. They simplified some things to make it work as a movie but it hangs together well. It could have been a genuinely great movie if they had better actors, but as the B movie action-flick that it is, it's still enjoyable.

If you find yourself wanting to see the movie but worried that it's so awful that you shouldn't... I would go see it. (I wouldn't especially recommend dragging along people who aren't into WarCraft)


Now, in-depth spoilers (there are actual spoilers here - even if you know the plot, I recommend seeing the movie before reading. Seeing how they interpreted a few things was worth going in blind for.

Spoiler

Two things they changed, which I liked a lot:

1) Having Thrall be stillborn, and being brought back to life by Gul'Dan.

This was a good explanation for something that had kind of bugged me - how does Thrall end up green when he's raised independently with no Fel Magic? More importantly, I think it adds a some nice, subtle depth to both Thrall and Gul'Dan. Doesn't make Gul'Dan any less evil - but shows a bit of his shaman heritage, doing a bit of midwifery and that his powers *can* be used to do nice things on occasion.

2) And, at the end, having Llane tell Garona to kill him

I'm not sure what the latest canon-reason for this was, but ever since I read The Last Guardian (my favorite WarCraft novel), it hasn't made any sense to me for Garona to betray Llane. She's a good enough and strong enough person to never do it willingly. The reason given in this movie made sense, AND it doesn't even violate the hazy, confusing canon - the canon is hazy and confusing BECAUSE Lothar misinterprets what's happening and that's the only story they have to tell.

The Medivh Subplot

This was something that bothered me, but I'm genuinely unsure (from an artistic perspective) how they could have improved it. Medivh isn't well explained in the movie. There isn't enough background or foreshadowing for the "he's a demon!" revelation to make any sense. And yet... I don't know how I would have fit more into the movie.

They could have chosen to tell "The Last Guardian" story (i.e. Khadgar, Garona and Lothar unravelling the mystery of Medivh together). I think that could be done in roughly 2 hours - but it wouldn't leave any room for Durotan or any of the other orcs. The orcs were the best part of this movie, and I think it was crucial to have them be major characters.

The "Khadgar goes to visit the Kirin Tor" scene was pretty pointless - it didn't explain anything ("Light from darkness light what the fuck are you talking about?"). They could have revealed actual information there about Aegwynn or Sargeras, but the problem wasn't just that we didn't have the information - it was that the characters didn't have the screentime to really *earn* the information. (In "Last Guardian", Khadgar does a series of magical experiments that eventually allow him to see controlled visions from the past)

A Missed Opportunity

In that scene where Lothar is bothering the guard set to watch him, I was really hoping for the guard to "What!? Are you still touching me!" or otherwise highlighting the "click on a unit too many times" gag. (I think the optimal joke here would have been to have him start to say "Are you still..." and then abruptly turn into a sheep).

 

[PatrThom]

Seeing it Wed, whether I want to or not.
We'll see what happens.

--Patrick

 

[Frank]

I found it confoundingly boring to watch.

But I did laugh out loud that Jesse Custer and Tulip were the king and queen.

To anyone who doesn't know Warcraft they threw so God damn many random RPG generator names that Blizzard uses that it all just ended up word soup. I hear that the movie was slashed to pieces outside of Duncan Jones' control in order to be quicker paced, which from how bored I was watching it, might've been a good thing, but it did nothing for the coherence of the story.

 

[ScytheRexx]

It's kind of weird, but the new conspiracy theory on the block is that Hollywood actively wanted the movie to fail.

Rumors abound that not only did some people high up in the studio want the movie miscut till the pacing was destroyed, but also that even the marketing was mishandled on purpose to make sure it looked uninteresting (like the really shitty music choices).

Why? Because of China. Supposedly projections for China were already huge due to the heavy fanbase WarCraft has over there, and considering how much China has been gushing over the success of the movie over there (Even Jackie Chan commented on it as some big shift to a more respectable film scene in China). A Chinese firm even purchased Legendary, the studio behind the film, which supposedly a lot of people inside the studio are not happy about.

Do I believe the rumors? No, not really. I would hope Blizzard and Duncan Jones wouldn't have let it turn into a pissing match between a growing film market and the hollywood status quo, but sometimes I read some of the reviews and it just baffles me how angry some people got over this movie, so even if I don't think it's wide spread, I do think the China connection has a few film reviewers peeved so much that (with the combination of it being a game franchise) didn't ever want to really give it a chance.

 

[ScytheRexx]

Spoiler

Two things they changed, which I liked a lot:

1) Having Thrall be stillborn, and being brought back to life by Gul'Dan.

This was a good explanation for something that had kind of bugged me - how does Thrall end up green when he's raised independently with no Fel Magic? More importantly, I think it adds a some nice, subtle depth to both Thrall and Gul'Dan. Doesn't make Gul'Dan any less evil - but shows a bit of his shaman heritage, doing a bit of midwifery and that his powers *can* be used to do nice things on occasion.

2) And, at the end, having Llane tell Garona to kill him

I'm not sure what the latest canon-reason for this was, but ever since I read The Last Guardian (my favorite WarCraft novel), it hasn't made any sense to me for Garona to betray Llane. She's a good enough and strong enough person to never do it willingly. The reason given in this movie made sense, AND it doesn't even violate the hazy, confusing canon - the canon is hazy and confusing BECAUSE Lothar misinterprets what's happening and that's the only story they have to tell.

The Medivh Subplot

This was something that bothered me, but I'm genuinely unsure (from an artistic perspective) how they could have improved it. Medivh isn't well explained in the movie. There isn't enough background or foreshadowing for the "he's a demon!" revelation to make any sense. And yet... I don't know how I would have fit more into the movie.

They could have chosen to tell "The Last Guardian" story (i.e. Khadgar, Garona and Lothar unravelling the mystery of Medivh together). I think that could be done in roughly 2 hours - but it wouldn't leave any room for Durotan or any of the other orcs. The orcs were the best part of this movie, and I think it was crucial to have them be major characters.

The "Khadgar goes to visit the Kirin Tor" scene was pretty pointless - it didn't explain anything ("Light from darkness light what the fuck are you talking about?"). They could have revealed actual information there about Aegwynn or Sargeras, but the problem wasn't just that we didn't have the information - it was that the characters didn't have the screentime to really *earn* the information. (In "Last Guardian", Khadgar does a series of magical experiments that eventually allow him to see controlled visions from the past)

A Missed Opportunity

In that scene where Lothar is bothering the guard set to watch him, I was really hoping for the guard to "What!? Are you still touching me!" or otherwise highlighting the "click on a unit too many times" gag. (I think the optimal joke here would have been to have him start to say "Are you still..." and then abruptly turn into a sheep).

Spoiler

1) In the regular canon, both Durotan and Draka go through the same skin change as all the other orcs. It was caused by all the fel magic being utilized during the war with the Draenei (Even Drek'thar, for a time, was a warlock.), and Draka even noted while they were stationed at Hellfire Citadel that her brown skin was slowly peeling away to show green underneath (Rise of the Horde). Once you become green, you are physically changed forever, and thus any children you sire also inherit those traits. Thrall was green because his parents were both green. The only orcs that escaped this process in the regular canon is the Mag'har, who, at the time, suffered a strange reaction to fel magic called the Red Pox. The green orcs were so terrified of this sickness that they quarantined all that suffered it at the old village of the Frostwolves, which is now Garadar in Nagrand. This is the only reason in the main canon that brown orcs still exist at all. Of course, for the movie they wanted to make sure that Durotan and Draka were presented as "uncorrupted", thus they made the fel sickness a forced change rather then an ambient one, but since Thrall's entire look has always been green, they wrote up the whole stillborn and Gul'dan scene as a way to make sure he keeps his iconic coloring.

2) They actually do point this out in The Last Guardian. While Garona, Lothar, and Khadgar fight the possessed Medivh, she is grabbed by Medivh and he uses his magic to curse her so that she will kill those she cares most about. When Lothar and Khadgar finally get the killing blow on Medivh, they look for Garona and find her missing. Khadgar at some point during this also has a vision of Garona killing Llane with tears in her eyes, and it's revealed that Llane was the one she killed because of the curse, having sided back with Gul'dan against her will.

I can agree with some of the other things with Medivh and such, I honestly felt weird how much they were tip-toeing around Sargeras. The whole Alodi thing was weird too, since Alodi was supposed to be the First Guardian, and a man. The woman in the cube looked more like Aegwynn to me, but they never really go into depth with it.

Honestly, the thing that weirds me out the most is the implication that Medivh went realm-hopping in his youth and fell in love with a strong woman that he does not remember.

Why is that weird? Because it's implying that he jumped to Draenor at some point and knocked up an orc to sire Garona, allowing her to be half-human even before the portal was complete. In the main canon, she is half-draenei, the niece of Maarad, and has a sexual relationship with Medivh, conceiving her son Med'an. Out of all the changes you could hint in the movie you make her main canon lover and baby-daddy, her friggin father instead? What!?

 

[Ravenpoe]

Spoiler

1) In the regular canon, both Durotan and Draka go through the same skin change as all the other orcs. It was caused by all the fel magic being utilized during the war with the Draenei (Even Drek'thar, for a time, was a warlock.), and Draka even noted while they were stationed at Hellfire Citadel that her brown skin was slowly peeling away to show green underneath (Rise of the Horde). Once you become green, you are physically changed forever, and thus any children you sire also inherit those traits. Thrall was green because his parents were both green. The only orcs that escaped this process in the regular canon is the Mag'har, who, at the time, suffered a strange reaction to fel magic called the Red Pox. The green orcs were so terrified of this sickness that they quarantined all that suffered it at the old village of the Frostwolves, which is now Garadar in Nagrand. This is the only reason in the main canon that brown orcs still exist at all. Of course, for the movie they wanted to make sure that Durotan and Draka were presented as "uncorrupted", thus they made the fel sickness a forced change rather then an ambient one, but since Thrall's entire look has always been green, they wrote up the whole stillborn and Gul'dan scene as a way to make sure he keeps his iconic coloring.

2) They actually do point this out in The Last Guardian. While Garona, Lothar, and Khadgar fight the possessed Medivh, she is grabbed by Medivh and he uses his magic to curse her so that she will kill those she cares most about. When Lothar and Khadgar finally get the killing blow on Medivh, they look for Garona and find her missing. Khadgar at some point during this also has a vision of Garona killing Llane with tears in her eyes, and it's revealed that Llane was the one she killed because of the curse, having sided back with Gul'dan against her will.

I can agree with some of the other things with Medivh and such, I honestly felt weird how much they were tip-toeing around Sargeras. The whole Alodi thing was weird too, since Alodi was supposed to be the First Guardian, and a man. The woman in the cube looked more like Aegwynn to me, but they never really go into depth with it.

Honestly, the thing that weirds me out the most is the implication that Medivh went realm-hopping in his youth and fell in love with a strong woman that he does not remember.

Why is that weird? Because it's implying that he jumped to Draenor at some point and knocked up an orc to sire Garona, allowing her to be half-human even before the portal was complete. In the main canon, she is half-draenei, the niece of Maarad, and has a sexual relationship with Medivh, conceiving her son Med'an. Out of all the changes you could hint in the movie you make her main canon lover and baby-daddy, her friggin father instead? What!?

To be fair, Garona is only half Draenei because Blizzard forgot their timeline. She was always designed to be half human, but when they went back and filled in the story, realized that it simply wouldn't work, as there would have been no humans around for her to be born of. So then it became "Well, we always called her a half orc, we never said what the other half was..." and decided that the union of a draenei and an orc ends up looking like a green human.

 

[ScytheRexx]

To be fair, Garona is only half Draenei because Blizzard forgot their timeline. She was always designed to be half human, but when they went back and filled in the story, realized that it simply wouldn't work, as there would have been no humans around for her to be born of. So then it became "Well, we always called her a half orc, we never said what the other half was..." and decided that the union of a draenei and an orc ends up looking like a green human.

Oh I know all that, but it does not change the fact that as of her establishment for the last 7-8 years, she is half-draenei. She has appeared in comics and has draenic family that have now had large involvement in the game world (Maarad). They can't go back on that.

Again, my issue isn't even that they changed that, sure, they can, but making her lover her father is just weird.

 

[Raemon777]

I didn't realize the intended "Medivh was Garona's father" implication at the time I posted this. I'm kind of ambivalent about this, especially because they obviously just fucked up their own canon in the first place. Before this was pointed out, I had kind of liked a subtle thing about Garona: her hair is so massive, it could easily be concealing tiny half-draenei horns.

I'm generally fine with stories getting modified for different media, and by this point Blizzard has retconned their own stories often enough that I'm not attached to any particular version so long as the broad-strokes are intact. I think it was a good choice to have the Fel be more deliberate rather than ambient, and regardless I think it's more interesting for baby-Thrall to have been saved by Gul'Dan)

>They actually do point this out in The Last Guardian.

Huh, that was also not obvious to me. In this case I think it's *much* more interesting to be a decision characters made for reasons instead of the random side-effect of a curse. (Even if it was a deliberate curse to kill Llane and destablize the world, mind-control is a fairly cheap plot device and if there's a non-mind-magic option that makes sense I prefer it.

I'm confused about the "ruined it on purpose because China" rumor. Who was angry with who about what? (either in fact, or rumor?). What would deliberately sabotaging it have accomplished? (Not disbelieving or believing, just not sure what you meant)

>The whole Alodi thing was weird too, since Alodi was supposed to be the First Guardian, and a man.

Yeah, it seemed weird for that character to not be Aegwyn (she plays a similar role Last Guardian if I recall correctly), and the whole scene was vague enough that the change-from-canon didn't seem to help anything.

 

[ScytheRexx]

I'm confused about the "ruined it on purpose because China" rumor. Who was angry with who about what? (either in fact, or rumor?). What would deliberately sabotaging it have accomplished? (Not disbelieving or believing, just not sure what you meant)

This is the rundown.

China, especially in the last two years, has been heavily promoting themselves as a viable market for film, both for development and viewing. At first, this relationship with Hollywood was polite, since Hollywood wanted more butts in the seats, and so Hollywood made small concessions to the viewership of China, like the scene with Chinese actors in Iron Man 3, or the entire Hong Kong sequence of Transformers 4. The big thing is that Hollywood does not want the Chinese film industry as a whole to come over to the states. They want it to be a one way street.

However, while WarCraft was being finished up and we were rolling over into 2016, Legendary Pictures, the production company that made WarCraft, was purchased by a Chinese company, Dalian Wanda. This officially made Legendary, as far as Hollywood is concerned, a Chinese production company. As projections were being taken into account, including pre-sales, WarCraft looked like it was going to be huge in China. What does that mean? Well, I think Jackie Chan put it best.

“If we can make a film that earns 10 billion [$1.5 billion], then people from all over the world who study film will learn Chinese, instead of us learning English.”

He made that comment in regards to the WarCraft movie making nearly 100 million dollars in two days in China, and it really points out the growing feud between the growing Chinese film industry and Hollywood. So we have a Chinese owned production company, coming out with a movie that is showing strong projections in China, based on a popular franchise. It could have been the movie that "legitimized" the Chinese film industry in the United States rather then just a few foreign imports, and that terrified everyone in Hollywood, supposedly even some of the people in Legendary who are not happy with the Dalian Wanda purchase in the first place.

Suddenly some of the higher ups in Legendary postponed the release half a year even though it was done, chopped forty minutes from it. Those making the trailers seemed to half-ass it with rock music and the same few shots over and over again. Critics (some of which never even saw it) started to pan it. The movie, while not being the best, seemed to be getting incredible amounts of hate in the United States compared to anywhere else in the world.

Do I believe that it was intentionally sabotaged? I really can't say, I am not the type of jump into conspiracy theories, but considering it seems to be doing well everywhere EXCEPT the US, it seems a bit weird.

 

[Raemon777]

Ah, okay. Makes sense. (like you, I'd reserve judgement on what to make of it all, but it's an interesting take. I definitely did have a moment of "woah - that seems important" when I saw how well it was doing in China).

I was really glad when I heard it was doing so well overseas - it was good enough that I could see a sequel being truly good if they fixed some issues. (Later when I have more time I wanna brainstorm/fantasize about what movie would come next - I'm not sure Tides of Darkness really had enough character development to carry a movie but skipping it would leave a big gap)

While I'm doing Lore Catchup - What's the current canon (in game) on when/if Gul'Dan died? Originally it was a big deal that he died and left a skull behind. I know he's in Warlords of Draenor because that's in the past (I haven't played that expansion though). I seem to recall him showing up in normal-timeline WoW though. Was there a reason for that, or did I just imagine it?

 

[ScytheRexx]

While I'm doing Lore Catchup - What's the current canon (in game) on when/if Gul'Dan died? Originally it was a big deal that he died and left a skull behind. I know he's in Warlords of Draenor because that's in the past (I haven't played that expansion though). I seem to recall him showing up in normal-timeline WoW though. Was there a reason for that, or did I just imagine it?

Sure I can explain but be aware, it's a bit crazy. You seem to know most of what happens in the first war, so I will ignore that part. Gul'dan was the leader of the Horde using Blackhand as a puppet Warchief until sometime right before the sacking of Stormwind.

So in the canon timeline, Gul'dan was ousted by Orgrim Doomhammer as the leader of the Horde, after Orgrim murdered Blackhand. This didn't sit well with Gul'dan, obviously, and later on when the Horde were about to do the final siege on Lordaeron, Gul'dan took the clans loyal to him and left for the sea, using his magic to raise the Broken Isles and find the relic known as the Eye of Sargeras. His betrayal cost the Horde it's victory over Lordaeron, forcing them to retreat. Orgrim sent a force to pursue Gul'dan and kill him, but when they finally reached him, the demons that filled the Tomb of Sargeras had already slain him before he could reach the Eye. The force sent by Orgrim found his body, chopped off his head, and took his skull as a trophy for Orgrim, and at some point made it's way back to Draenor.

The latent magic in the skull would later become essential in closing the rift between Azeroth and Draenor, but would fall into the hands of the Burning Legion, who attempted to use the latent magic to corrupt Ashenvale. Illidan put a stop to that, consuming what remained of that magic to turn into his half-demon form. He still held onto the skull till his death at the Black Temple.

When Wrathion and Kairozdormu conspired to open up a passage to an alternate past, and send Garrosh through to Draenor to create the Iron Horde, this meant meeting alternate copies of past orc leaders, including Gul'dan back in his prime. The Iron Horde captured Gul'dan at the blood drinking ceremony, and used him and his shadow council as conduits to open the Red Portal, forever linking this alternate timeline of Draenor with our own. We release Gul'dan to close the portal, but such allows him to escape and once again continue his schemes. After the death of Garrosh, he supplants Grom Hellscream as leader of the Iron Horde, completing the blood drinking ritual and creating the Fel Orcs, with the intention of bringing his Burning Legion masters over from the Twisting Nether.

This is where it gets really sort of crazy. Supposedly, when a demon becomes a part of the Twisting Nether, which exists outside of space, they also exist in all points of space and time. Demons also never actually die, but instead are banished back to the Nether to regenerate their form. Gul'dan brings in Archimonde to defeat us, the same Archimonde from our own time, who was regenerating in the Nether since his defeat at the World Tree. We defeat and once again banish him back to the Nether, but he sends Gul'dan hurling into the Nether as punishment for his failure. This alternate Gul'dan, now at the disposal of the Legion, is given one last chance to redeem himself, and is sent to our main timeline to find Illidan (whose half-demon form means he can't die, his corpse was slowly regenerating, but was kept by Maiev in her den on the Broken Isles), retake his original versions power, and finish the job his original version attempted so long ago, opening the way for the Legion to invade. So it is this alternate timeline Gul'dan from WoD that we once again face in Legion, only now, he is in our time, and beefed up because he literally has the magical power of TWO Gul'dans. Killing him once and for all is the first step in stopping the Legion.

 

[GasBandit]

I used to think I knew some Warcraft Lore, because I'd played all 3 RTSes and WoW up through the burning legion expansion.

All this shit got me totally lost.

 

[PatrThom]

Saw it. In IMAX 3D.
Accidentally bought tickets online for a theater 90min away. Oh well. Their website needs to be better about telling you when you are switching to another theater in the chain. Hmph.
It's not a bad movie. As someone who only knows the RTS lore, I give it at least a solid 6.
1xMurloc
1xWilhelm
Clever display of maps and flyovers to make it look like campaign procession or camps chopping their way through the woods.
I also agree that the moment with the guard was a missed comedic opportunity. We never see his face, so they could've even used the same voice actor.
The movie does not wait. It rushes onward and does not care if you get left behind. But that's not horrible and is easily fixed with repeated viewings.
Anduin looks and acts like the spitting image of my brother-in-law, though skinnier. The resemblance was eerie.
I appreciated Medivh's delivery in the movie. It was very matter-of-fact, and what I would expect of someone who has to constantly deal with people who just don't understand what he does.
I would appreciate seeing the missing 40min, though probably not in a theater. The last 20min were a real struggle due to poor drink choices made prior to entering the theater.

--Patrick

 

[Raemon777]

>This is where it gets really sort of crazy.

Lol. Okay, so it sounds like I more or less had everything down *until* the Time Travel part, and at that point I think I'm probably fine with getting lost and confused.

One thing that threw me was that, in the opening trailer for Warlords of Draenor... it seemed "obvious" that Garrosh literally snapped Gul'Dan's neck. I haven't actually played WoD so when Gul'Dan showed up in Legion I was confused. (I guess orcs are hardy enough that you can do things to them that make neck-snapping sounds and everything's fine)

It's pretty amusing how heavily WoW is leaning into the "Time Travel is a a major plot point" thing (and not only that, but they've actually been setting that up since... since maybe even before WoW? When did Day of the Dragon come out? So while it's inherently ridiculous, I can't accuse them of shoehorning it in)

 

[Raemon777]

Also, wanted to say: ScytheRexx, I have a non-ironically deep appreciation for how reliably I can come back to this forum and post about WoW and know that you will be here and totally be able to answer my questions no matter how obscure.

I went to see the movie with a random WarCraft meetup in NYC, and was disappointed that there was nobody I could really discuss the movie with at the time - I was by far the most knowledgeable loremaster present. I wanted to argue and debate over specific changes the movie made, but all I could do was basically inform everyone else what those changes were.

WarCraft was... basically my first religion. It's no longer as important to me as it used to be (By now I'm like a Christian that show up for Christmas and that's about it), but still played a major role in my young life which has carried forward in various ways and is still culturally important to me. And it's meaningful to know I can come here and have people who are both knowledgeable and care about it in a similar way.

 

[ScytheRexx]

One thing that threw me was that, in the opening trailer for Warlords of Draenor... it seemed "obvious" that Garrosh literally snapped Gul'Dan's neck. I haven't actually played WoD so when Gul'Dan showed up in Legion I was confused. (I guess orcs are hardy enough that you can do things to them that make neck-snapping sounds and everything's fine)

I think you misinterpreted the motion and sound. Gul'dan was lamenting about what just happened, and Garrosh was just rubbing it in his face by quiping about times changing, and then pushed Gul'dan back down to the floor since he was no threat by that point. The sound you hear was Garrosh's metal boots shifting as he pushed him. You meet this Gul'dan literally in the first five minutes of WoD, as he is being used by the Iron Horde to power the Red Portal during the opening suicide mission. We are forced to release him to close the Red Portal and stop the Iron Horde from further invading Azeroth.

It's pretty amusing how heavily WoW is leaning into the "Time Travel is a a major plot point" thing (and not only that, but they've actually been setting that up since... since maybe even before WoW? When did Day of the Dragon come out? So while it's inherently ridiculous, I can't accuse them of shoehorning it in)

Day of the Dragon came out in 2001 and was the first to speak about the Bronze Dragons and their powers over time. They increased the influence of time altering properties of the Bronze Dragons in WoW with the full introduction of the Caverns of Time, but those focused on us retaining our timeline by preventing changes to it. It was actually one of the Thrall books (Twilight of the Aspects) that introduced full on multiverse theory. Thrall is attacked in the caverns of time by a mysterious assassin, that ended up being Aedelas Blackmoore from an alternate timeline. They end up falling into the time portals and Thrall experiences various points in time, and even other timelines that never existed (one where he is killed as a child and Blackmoore takes over the world, one where he is a loyal servant to Blackmoore, etc.), before finally shattering the false timeline and finding Nozdormu. Even after the false timeline was shattered, the Blackmoore from it still attempted to kill Thrall, until Thrall finally ended him once and for all.

You think that is a lot, but it gets even crazier with WoD. You see, even those alternate multiverses were not fully structured, they were almost like illusions. They were there, but they never truly existed in time. They would shatter and break once this was realized. It was the Bronze Dragon, Kairozdormu, who used us during the events of MoP to power a device of his own invention, the Visions of Time. He used the device to show glimpses into the past during the trial of Garrosh Hellscream, but slowly he was making it even more powerful for his own schemes backed by Wrathion. Once he and Wrathion activated their plans, Kairoz took Garrosh and fled through one of these time windows to Draenor, bringing in alternate versions of the heroes to cover his escape (Baine for instance fought a version of himself that killed Garrosh after the death of Caine, and was Warchief of the Horde), and the Visions of Time shattered into pieces.

Once entrenched in the alternate version of Draenor's past, Kairoz revealed to Garrosh that he had taken one of the shards from the Visions of Time, and that by having his shard and the shards on Azeroth, the timeline they were in couldn't shatter, and that by creating a new Dark Portal using the power of the shard, the two timelines would be forever linked. He followed through, and thus WoD came to exist with a permanent alternate Draenor.

 

[Ravenpoe]

I always thought WoW decided to lean so heavily on time travel because Blizzard realized they had killed off all of the characters that anyone cared about.

 

[Raemon777]

Totally... but it's still neat that they were setting up long *before* they killed off all their interesting characters.

 

[Dave]

I find it really hard to believe anyone liked this movie. People do, apparently, but I don't understand why.

 

[ScytheRexx]

I always thought WoW decided to lean so heavily on time travel because Blizzard realized they had killed off all of the characters that anyone cared about.

They came out and said specifically that the original idea of WoD was to have us return to an updated Outland, in which Garrosh had raised the spirits of the long dead chieftains to fight for him, specifically because they liked those characters and wanted to see them again.

During the planning stages they realized that just updating Outland might not work out, considering it didn't work out well for Cataclysm, and that people prefer new landmasses. This lead to them thinking about how Draenor might have looked before being corrupted by the orcs, and thus they wrote in a way to bring Draenor from it's hayday back into the main continuity using time fuckery.

I find it really hard to believe anyone liked this movie. People do, apparently, but I don't understand why.

Because it was entertaining to me as a person. Why does anyone like any movie?
There are some movies considered classics that I never really got into and don't understand why anyone likes it (Scarface), and other movies considered "low brow" that I absolutely love (Short Circuit 2). That is just how it goes.

 

[Raemon777]

Re: Warlords of Draenor

Up until Warlords of Draenor, most of the expansions had been firing off previously established Chekhov guns. Warlords is the only one that didn't feel like it had been foreshadowed in WarCraft III - and it felt like, rather than introduce majorly new plot points, it was mostly revisiting old ones in a new way.

Do we have a strong sense of what Blizzard's longterm plans are for WoW? The remaining "obvious" expansions I can imagine are:

Great Seas
Old Gods

There's a path where WoW gracefully ends, wrapping up the stories it set out to tell, and there's a path where they keep rehashing things to keep the game alive indefinitely. Do we have any sense of what their long term plans are?

 

[PatrThom]

I find it really hard to believe anyone liked this movie. People do, apparently, but I don't understand why.

I don't get it, either.
It did what it was supposed to do, but it wasn't even up to Avatar's level.

--Patrick