Grant Morrison's Mind Blowing Killing Joke Revelation

GasBandit

Staff member
I still absolutely loathe the fact that they reversed Barbara's crippling in the New 52.
Yeah, I can see the validness of your opinion here, but on the other hand, in a world where limbs are retconned back on even without a reboot and graves can't seem to keep their bodies still EVER, why is it fair that Barbara Gordon's spine has to be the only plot device without a reset switch when the entire universe is rebooted?
 

figmentPez

Staff member
Yeah, I can see the validness of your opinion here, but on the other hand, in a world where limbs are retconned back on even without a reboot and graves can't seem to keep their bodies still EVER, why is it fair that Barbara Gordon's spine has to be the only plot device without a reset switch when the entire universe is rebooted?
Because Oracle is a damn good character. Does there need to be another reason?
 
And Barbara Gordon's Batgirl has to never even get a shot in the new universe because Oracle is a good character?
There's also the fact that she was the only mainstream comic character outside of Prof X that was handicapped and unlike the Prof, she was still an awesome character despite her handicap without the benefit of any super powers.
 

figmentPez

Staff member
And Barbara Gordon's Batgirl has to never even get a shot in the new universe because Oracle is a good character?
There are so many things wrong with the new universe, that I can't even begin to list the number of better ways they could have simplified continuity without having to wipe out lots of great things in DC comics at the same time. This is the problem with DC reboots, they throw the baby out with the bathwater.
 
There are so many things wrong with the new universe, that I can't even begin to list the number of better ways they could have simplified continuity without having to wipe out lots of great things in DC comics at the same time. This is the problem with DC reboots, they throw the baby out with the bathwater.
To be fair, the other reboots have never been as much of a clean break as this one. Some tried to unify worlds and sort out problematic contradictory origin stories (see: Donna Troi and Power Girl). However, they never just completely flushed the existing continuity, just altered it.

This new reboot is just horrible in that it wipes away most everything from the past. I'm hoping eventually they do some sort of return to the traditional universe ala Heroes Reborn, but I may just end up being disappointed on that front.

I'm still also pissed in the WAY that it was done. This whole time travel thing is lazy and makes no sense seeing as there are entire groups of entities in the DC universe that are supposed to stop things like this, such as Rip Hunter and the Linear Men. There's no way they would have let this happen. Also, altering timelines is par for the course in the established universe and it's never had this huge of a consequence. That mostly lies on the horrible shoulders of what a lazy, slapped together affair that flashpoint was.

Addendum: Also, as I've said before, it speaks volumes to how bad the circumstances around the reboot are when I'm more willing to accept:

1) Superboy Prime punching on the walls of reality so hard that it alters them

2) A giant, evolved Mr. Mind becoming an interdimentional moth that eats reality who is stopped by a hail mary pass from a repurposed Skeets.

3) Hal Jordan as Parallax destroying the universe and restarting it with a new big bang

All that unbelievably over the top stuff is more believable than Flash going back and stopping his mommy from getting killed.
 
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figmentPez

Staff member
To be fair, the other reboots have never been as much of a clean break as this one. Some tried to unify worlds and sort out problematic contradictory origin stories (see: Donna Troi and Power Girl). However, they never just completely flushed the existing continuity, just altered it.
True, but even in altering existing continuity, they've had problems like nearly erasing Clark Kent & Lois Lane's history together, and rushing them together as a couple, instead of having them spend a while in the bizarre love triangle of Clark, Lois and Superman.
 
as a Dc outsider, it sounds like the problem DC fans have with the reboot is that its an actual reboot and not just a retcon. which sounds backwards to me. but I guess there are certain things that even in a reboot should stay the same. i mean in a language i understand; having Spider-man in love with MJ instead of Gwen at the start is one thing. Having Uncle Ben live would be another.[DOUBLEPOST=1377349761,1377349719][/DOUBLEPOST]no real point to that post just me thinkin "aloud".
 
And Barbara Gordon's Batgirl has to never even get a shot in the new universe because Oracle is a good character?
We already had a great Batgirl in Stephanie Brown and it wasn't until she became Batgirl that the comic became worth reading again. Seriously. They did so many pure fun things in the comic while she was Batgirl that it actually became a must buy for me.
 
3) Hal Jordan as Parallax destroying the universe and restarting it with a new big bang
Honestly, I still think this idea (idea, concept, etc, the execution of it was less than perfect but the idea was great) still stands as fantastic. Hell, a reboot for a comic line sounds brilliant given the ridiculous continuities, etc, that evolve over decades but it seems to me that DC hasn't handled this idea very well. At least that seems to be the consensus.
 
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