Basically this. @SpecialKO, if your excuse for people doing unethical things is that unethical things happen all the time and are rarely punished, so it's not a big deal... then you've missed the point entirely.
The Zoe Quinn sex-for-reviews scandal
- Thread starter GasBandit
- Start date
Ye gods, I'm not a big fan of the idea of trigger warnings and all that SJW stuff, but reading the ex-bf's blog is like reliving the last year of my marriage. *shudder*
Edit: Not looking for any particular support on this, but it does reaffirm that not only is infidelity one of the worst things you can do to someone you care about, but gaslighting about it is going to be a major cause of psychological breakdown in the person. DON'T DO IT. Have the balls/ovaries to tell the truth about your mess.
Second Edit: STOP HUGGING ME FUCKERS!
Edit: Not looking for any particular support on this, but it does reaffirm that not only is infidelity one of the worst things you can do to someone you care about, but gaslighting about it is going to be a major cause of psychological breakdown in the person. DON'T DO IT. Have the balls/ovaries to tell the truth about your mess.
Second Edit: STOP HUGGING ME FUCKERS!
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When you declare those unethical things THE WORST THING EVER and THE REASON WHY GAMING JOURNALISM IS AWFUL, explicitly ignoring the much greater unethical things contributing to the situation at hand (gaming journalism's incestuous relationship with the actual industry), then you're involved in pushing the agenda that this matters more than everything else.
The video posted in this thread (which I will remind you is titled "The Zoe Quinn Sex For Reviews Scandal", despite that being complete conjecture based on pretty much nothing), and the other video currently posted on Reddit and being represented as accurate summaries of the situation are entirely driven by the desire to use Zoe's personal life as an example of the insidious march of social justice and feminism in gaming journalism, which is then represented as why gaming journalism sucks now.
If this thread had been titled, "Zoe Quinn abuses social media and DCMA takedowns to silence critics", that would at least have been talking about actual problems that is different from the way it is being framed everywhere else.
You mean that thing I talk about every other fucking time the industry makes a joke of itself? I can forgive you for not knowing, but pointing out the fucking insidious and unethical nature of the industry at every opportunity is kind of my thing. It's why I stopped being part of the industry. Once you get blacklisted by a few companies because you won't play ball on reviews, the only thing you CAN do is point out how fucking sick the whole thing is.
Regardless, you are using the Gaza Defense here and badly I might add. Pointing out that there are other, greater injustices in the industry doesn't mean that her ethical breach is any less severe or widespread. Is this the worst thing that's ever happened in GARME JURNALIZM? No, but it happened during one of the most important battles we've faced yet as an industry and, like it or not, she was one of the bigger names... and because of her actions the fight for inclusivity is diminished. This was a time when we needed more positive female icons to lead that fight, not for one to seemingly show that all the fears of the fucking reddit retards were (seemingly) justified. What the hell was she thinking?
Oh, and FUCK those assholes that are posting nude photos of her, sending her death threats, giving out her address, or just generally increasing the chances that she will be harmed. I may detest the ethics of this woman, but anyone who would hurt her over this needs fucking help. I shouldn't even NEED to say that.
GasBandit
Staff member
You get the fist whether you like it or not.
Which individual breach are you referring to? Her social media bullying or her sex life? Only one of them is used in the title of thread and as a way of framing the discussion, and only one of them has something resembling actual proof.
I'd say the fight for inclusivity was diminished a lot more by people using her sex life to attack journalists writing about the game industry's relationship with women and feminism.
I don't believe you and I disagree on that.[DOUBLEPOST=1408569938,1408569802][/DOUBLEPOST]
GasBandit
Staff member
It probably wouldn't have blown up so big if there hadn't been such a conspiracy to squelch it. I didn't even hear about it until news of the reddit moderators deleting tens of thousands of comment posts spilled over into imgur. You'd think if anybody knew about the Streisand effect, it'd be social-media savvy indie devs/gaming journalists.
Just found this out, but I don't think you can complain about people posting your nude photos everywhere...
...when you have them on a !@#%^ing pay site for people to buy. What you really should be complaining about is that people pirated them and didn't pay for them.
For research purposes (obviously NSFW): http://www.brokendollz.com/dollz/doll_join_profile.php?iddoll=73
Stay away @Jay! Don't need any of your misogny here!
...when you have them on a !@#%^ing pay site for people to buy. What you really should be complaining about is that people pirated them and didn't pay for them.
For research purposes (obviously NSFW): http://www.brokendollz.com/dollz/doll_join_profile.php?iddoll=73
Stay away @Jay! Don't need any of your misogny here!
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GasBandit
Staff member
She does manufacture her own victimhood in a number of ways.
On the other hand, the leaking of paid nudes sort of seems to cross over into the "which crime is it if a prostitute agrees to have sex with you for money and then you skip out on the bill" philosophical territory.
From her Blog (Tumblr?) http://ohdeargodbees.tumblr.com/post/95188657119/once-again-i-will-not-negotiate-with-terrorists
If I had a body worth doing porn for and was a public figure, uhhh, I still wouldn't do porn.
If people would pay to see me naked, I'd do it. Best I can do right now though is a subscription service where I promise to keep my clothes on.
Where can I donate???
I have no skin in this game. I didn't know anything about Quinn before yesterday, and I don't read online gaming rags. So, my thoughts:
- I don't think this is quite the Watergate-level scandal some people are trying to make it out to be. There doesn't seem to be as much payola as was originally implied. If she was indeed fucking her way into indie game success, that should be noted and slightly newsworthy, but at the moment, it appears that if such was her intent, she's not doing a great job of it.
- People have always slept their way to the middle--they almost never make it to the top that way. More girls than guys, maybe, but it's not a female-only tactic.
- If she cheated with 5 guys (burger and fries), that makes her a pretty crappy person, but there are no shortage of those in the world. What's it got to do with me?
- If she wants to slut around, more power to her. I've done my fair share of it myself. Ideally, she should get into some kind of swinging or open relationship where that's accepted and expected, rather than breaking some poor dude's heart.
- I could care less about other people's personal/sexual problems, and don't really think it's appropriate to air such dirty laundry.
- She's kind of a public figure. Unfortunately, these kinds of things happen and are expected when you make yourself a public figure. The world loves watching a train wreck.
- Her nudie pics aren't too hard on the eyes.
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Why does every fucking stupid knuckle-dragging man feel like they have to comment on her looks? No one on earth fucking gives a shit if you think she's attractive or not. Oh god, the conversation can't continue until everyone knows if I'd fuck her or not, better jump in with my hot take.
That being said I agree with pretty much everything @SpecialKO and @Espy said , sorry I'm on your side, please don't reconsider your beliefs now
also lol at "not being a big fan of trigger warnings"
That being said I agree with pretty much everything @SpecialKO and @Espy said , sorry I'm on your side, please don't reconsider your beliefs now
also lol at "not being a big fan of trigger warnings"
I can't believe I have to defend such a shitty person BUT... the fact that she' selling nude images of herself has no real baring on my opinion that she has shown a surprising lack of ethics. Yes, taken with everything else she's done so far it's just more fuel on the fire that is the Zoey Quinn brand and her obvious need to be at the center of attention, but selling naked pictures of yourself is neither illegal, immoral, or unethical. It's just not important and has no relation to her actions to advance herself in the industry.
If anything, it's probably some empowering, pro-feminism angle. She wants to own her body, so she's setting the terms on which people may see it. It's only when taken with every other horrible thing she's done that it seems remotely skeezy. If she hadn't done the rest of it, (rational) people wouldn't be using it to attack her.
If anything, it's probably some empowering, pro-feminism angle. She wants to own her body, so she's setting the terms on which people may see it. It's only when taken with every other horrible thing she's done that it seems remotely skeezy. If she hadn't done the rest of it, (rational) people wouldn't be using it to attack her.
c'mon charlie. Tell us how you really feel.
So, Charlie's the troll in this thread for commenting on the subject at hand, but you, admittedly having no interest in this topic, come in to complain that he posted in it?Another thread, another Charlie going...
The topic at hand holds no interest. I'm just tired of thread after thread becoming a Charlie outhouse.
I don't really feel this is news. So she used sex to get better reviews--it doesn't feel any different than EA and its ilk paying IGN and the rest for good reviews. Reviewers can get fired for not going along with that. EA's shitty treatment of what are essentially its temp employees was more relevant years ago and still is today. I don't trust big site reviews for big games--they're always going to get a 9 or so regardless of how shitty they are. Breaking it down like this for a smaller title, it's just a continuation of the same problem. If she had paid for the reviews, it'd be the same issue, so it doesn't matter.
New thread title: Gaming journalism continues exactly as it has been for the last several years.
Charlie's a bit like Zoe Quinn (to keep things topical) or any other random narcissistic attention whore that you could think of. The less he's the center of attention, and the less his opinion gets to frame the moral structure of the conversation, the louder he gets and the more shit he flings.
He's a special snowflake, and hasn't really learned yet that the world really doesn't revolve around him. It's a bit funny and sad at the same time.
Well, he's right that persons' opinions on her looks are irrelevant and throwing it into the issue is the kind of crap I see in Youtube comments when I make the mistake of scrolling down from the video because I'm a fucking idiot sometimes. I haven't clicked any of the links though, so I didn't see it happening.c'mon charlie. Tell us how you really feel.
Except she didn't. That was some baseless nonsense from that video Jay posted.
I totally agree that her looks are irrelevant to the 'scandal', sure. I can't speak to Youtube comments, since I adblock-plus the fuck out of those. They're not irrelevant to the side-conversation of her having made professional n00dz. And they're not really irrelevant to idle side-chatter.
I don't really get the impression that Youtube comments were what CDS was referring to, though, since his vitriol came immediately after I mentioned that her pics weren't too hard on the eyes, and as far as I know, I'm the only one who made any kind of value judgement on them in this thread. But just like any petulant child, CDS doesn't get to have his way, just because he can be louder and more obnoxious than the rest of us.
I personally couldn't give two flying fucks about what topic of interest is going to get Charlie's panties in a wad on any particular day, and I'm certainly not going to allow his whining (potential or real) censor my speech or opinions.