[News] The USA Police State will never satisfy its lust for beating, gassing, and imprisoning minorities
- Thread starter Charlie Don't Surf
- Start date
Possibly, and obviously I know there are people who don't want to live detached, but also, housing prices were going through the roof everywhere (you guys crashed, you are an exception) and mostly, it's only those able to support a MASSIVE mortgage, or those who already had "some money" who can actually afford non-apartment living. Most of Canada's big cities are obvious candidates for exactly this. You have 3 choices:
- Live in an apartment/condo - usually at least reasonably close to the city's downtown, but perhaps not, but still semi-reasonable to start out in even buying
- Live in a suburb at least 30 years old to be reasonably close - expect your crappiest house to start at $500,000 or more. (link)
- Live REALLY far out, an hour or more, but actually get something resembling affordable.
And you could afford it, because you sold your old 1200sqft house for $150k. Now those same houses are going for 50-60k.
--Patrick
I am rather loathe to agree with Charlie here but one could argue the distance certainly matters if it was important enough for the police to lie about it this long. If it doesn't matter and what you say is correct, then it still looks bad and doesn't help public perception.
Anyone ever hear of a Tueller Drill? It's training for police officers to give them an idea of how much time they have before someone could stab/strike them as they pull their weapon.
So... yeah. Wilson really didn't have any reasonable reason to believe Brown could have harmed him, unless he thought Brown had a gun. But that's never been stated or mentioned and no weapon or weapon object was ever found. His story was always that Brown was charging at him. I really don't see how he can get beyond this.
So the minimum distance you can ever reasonable expect to fire on someone coming at you and live is about 20 feet. Any closer and they will always hit you. Even taking into account that Wilson was likely poorly trained, he still killed Brown at 7.4 times the distance that Brown could have EVER hurt him without a gun. That means he started pulling his gun on Brown ether before he did anything to Wilson (in which case it's straight up murder) or while Brown was AT MINIMUM 168 feet away (or 8.4 times the distance Brown could have reasonably harmed him at), which is far beyond any reasonable distance at which Wilson could have feared for his life. Not only that, he fired multiple times and hit Brown at that distance, which suggests he's ether a fucking crack shot or he took his time to aim.
So... yeah. Wilson really didn't have any reasonable reason to believe Brown could have harmed him, unless he thought Brown had a gun. But that's never been stated or mentioned and no weapon or weapon object was ever found. His story was always that Brown was charging at him. I really don't see how he can get beyond this.
The measurement is the distance from the car, not the distance from the cop. 140 feet is nearly impossible with an automatic pistol.
Ahh... that would explain the distance a bit. Hitting someone once at 148 feet is possible but unlikely. More than once would be almost impossible.
Well sure, Charlie, but none of that changes that he was black..
lil help for any of y'all that don't wanna read the article
But not cops apparently.
Just one quick point, Wilson hasn't lied at all since he hasn't said ANYTHING at all
also, I would believe the shooting was justified if it were proven that Michael Brown could shoot a Scorpion "get over here" spear out of his palms
also, I would believe the shooting was justified if it were proven that Michael Brown could shoot a Scorpion "get over here" spear out of his palms
that's a reference to the fact that Brown was shot more than once at the distance of 148 feet, on his knees, with his palms facing Officer Wilson. This is enough to make him fear for his life. If Officer Wilson brought his gun to a black church, he could mow down an entire congregation at communion using the same rules of engagement.
I didn't mean to word it that way, let me try again - he was shot on his knees, showing the officer open, empty hands after fleeing and being chased for 148 feet
You know, Wilson may have had some trouble believing Brown's submission was genuine given the struggle they had only a little earlier.
Presumably in a church there would be less ambiguity as to the intent behind the gesture, and Wilson would not feel threatened in a black church even though the interior of such a building would very likely have an effigy of a crucified white man hanging from the wall.
Context means everything.
Disclosure: I know next to nothing about this case (aside from lots of opinions and yelling in the media), but I do support due process 100%.
--Patrick
I'm fairly certain police don't get to pick and choose if they believe a surrender is genuine. If the suspect says he gives up, the police officer simply tells them to assume the position on the ground and then approaches to apprehend them. If they are non-complaint, they officer is to call for back-up until he has enough officers to force the issue.
The only time they get to fire their weapons is if the suspect is approaching them (and within a certain distance) or someone else. If the evidence suggests the suspect was on their knees when they were shot, the defense needs to give a good excuse as to why Brown was still a threat.
It feels like years ago police didn't fire off their weapons at the drop of a hat, but I don't know if that's because today officers aren't as well-trained or if it's just another "times are more televised" aspect.
GasBandit
Staff member
I think it's the latter. We also are actually experiencing less natural disasters (especially hurricanes), and less "mass shootings," but you hear about each one a whole lot more now.
You can only fill up so much airtime with "fuck Obama," or "fuck the GOP," before the audience gets bored.
GasBandit
Staff member
"It bleeds, it leads" is not new to the current political cycle. But there's a lot more resources available for it as time and technology progresses.You can only fill up so much airtime with "fuck Obama," or "fuck the GOP," before the audience gets bored.
The 24 hour news cycle may be the single worst thing man has ever inflicted on itself. We used to have to wait for bad news from the next town over... then we had to wait until the next day for the newspaper. Then radio was invented and we could hear it everyday and the really important stuff instantly or at least really fast! Even TV followed this rule for a good long time... but then some asshole invented CNN and now it's 24/7 news, instantly. The internet and internet smart phones have just made it worst.
That's the trade off: now we know when something bad is happening and we can safely avoid it. But we can't avoid knowing about it in the first place now and it's causing fucking mental problems.
I don't think you have to have an anti-police bias to have serious doubt about how justified this shooting was. I am concerned that the officer's version of events does not make sense -- a wounded unarmed man, fleeing from a police officer, suddenly turns around and charges. That seems to fly in the face of basic logic. I am also concerned about how a the Ferguson police force did not follow their standard procedures, and may have actually violated Missouri law, by not properly generating the Incident Report and Use of Force Report. (PINAC) Is this because they are trying to match the officer's account to the collected evidence?
I have not been reassured by the leaks from the grand jury proceedings that support the officer because the Justice Department has characterized those links as “irresponsible and highly troubling” and said, “There seems to be an inappropriate effort to influence public opinion about this case.” (LATimes) It does not help that the pathologist the information in the leaks is attributed to has said that she was mis-quoted and suggesting that the hand wound proves that Michael Brown was struggling with the officers does not accurately reflect her reasoning(Washington Post). Furthermore, some information that has leaked that does not support the officer's version of events. Namely, the video obtained by the AP that shows witnesses to the shooting exclaiming that "he had his hands in the air". (I do not think the recent observation about the distance between officer's SUV and Brown's body provides any new insight on the case.)
Ultimately, the evidence is going to have to convincing to alleviate my concerns. (And, unfortunately, the grand jury announcement, which is imminent, isn't going to provide any evidence.)
It's a tragedy that another person has died because of the blatant lies by the NRA and others that owning a gun makes you safer:
http://www.cnn.com/2014/11/23/us/ferguson-woman-kills-herself/
http://www.cnn.com/2014/11/23/us/ferguson-woman-kills-herself/
That's not death by gun. That's death by stupidity.
The article doesn't say what kind of gun it is, but it's actually really difficult to make a gun accidentally go off if you're transporting it correctly. Now if you're waving a gun around in a car like a toy while it's chambered and ready to fire, well...
GasBandit
Staff member
Actually, the NRA was founded on the principles of advancing gun competency, and clearly this woman was stupidly incompetent. That's Darwin Award nomination criteria, right there. You don't "wave a gun" jokingly or otherwise at the driver of a moving vehicle, particularly one you're inside of.
Maybe if this woman had taken some NRA firearm safety courses, she'd still be alive.
But stupid people do stupid things. I mean, after all, look at the post I quoted.
edit - Hah, Poe beat me to the punch.
If you think the NRA's main goal is gun safety and education, you're as naive as you think I am