Rant VIII: The Reckoning

Tress

Tress

Cheesy1 said:
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I remember running into something similar when I was applying to schools for a teaching position. One position wanted a person who had a Master's degree, and was fluent in English, Spanish, AND Mandarin. All for a starting salary of $38,000 in the SF Bay Area, where $38k is just enough to be over the poverty line.

Anyone who has all that experience, a Master's, AND speaks those 3 languages fluently isn't going to settle for such a paltry salary.
 
strawman

strawman

Tress said:
Anyone who has all that experience, a Master's, AND speaks those 3 languages fluently isn't going to settle for such a paltry salary.
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It can be valuable if you can't find another position. Just sticking out such a terrible job for a year while you look for your next one 1) supports you, 2) helps you practice your skills, and 3) provides job history. The job history is the most important part - you're suddenly going to look a lot better than people just out of college or those working in unrelated fields. The new job doesn't need to know your previous salary.

On the other hand, it's a teaching position, and those are simply low paying jobs, so that market is chronically depressed (salary wise).

All that being said,

Enresshou said:
I've been seriously job hunting for six months now, will be defending my thesis in two months, and have nothing lined up.
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I understand this frustration. Just be aware that there are many, many businesses that won't make an offer more than 2-6 weeks down the road. The job market really opens up once you can say, "I can start in two weeks" because businesses are just weird that way.

I suppose we'll have to go out for that drink soon...
 
fade

fade

Staff member
Enresshou said:
Fuck each and every one of the following.
    • The company that did not list one particular area of experience as a requirement (even though I fit every other criteria perfectly), forced me to fill out a twelve-page application, then automatically declined me because I'd indicated I did not have that experience on the first page.
    • The colleague who volunteered to put me in contact with a hiring manager at a firm she'd worked at previously, then completely ceased responding.
    • The one company I received an interview with, who called to let me know at 10:30 PM that they wouldn't be hiring me. Because who needed to sleep that night anyways.
    • The fact that a company I would absolutely love to work for is looking for someone with my precise combination of areas of research expertise (not common), soft skills, presentation abilities and geographic network but--even though I applied three months ago, they've been trying to hire for the job for nine months, and another colleague provided the hiring manager with my resumé and a recommendation--I have heard absolutely nothing (aside from, "Please be patient, we'll contact you if we're interested in you." when I tried to follow up several weeks ago).
    • The fact that no matter how much money a company seems to make they cannot perform the common courtesy of sending out a form letter rejection.
    • The fact that my brother in law, who has always fucked around and had no plan for the future whatsoever, got hired with a six-figure salary (that he negotiated up another $20k) within three fucking days of putting his resume online for a job that he is not qualified for (and the company itself admitted this).
    • The fact that I've been seriously job hunting for six months now, will be defending my thesis in two months, and have nothing lined up.
    • And, finally, the fact that all of this is now EXTREMELY time-sensitive since my father was diagnosed with Lewy Body dementia and is rapidly declining, so I'd kinda like to move back closer to home (or at least have the money to visit more than once a year).
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You have a PhD, right? I used to ask my grad students who said they might go on to a PhD if they also wanted a job. It was half a joke, but it is a lot easier to get a job with a masters in a lot of STEM fields.
 
drawn_inward

drawn_inward

@Enresshou this probably doesn't help one iota, but as you may know there are loads of postdoc positions available that aren't publicly listed. Try not to get desperate and pick something that will erode all these skills and toolsets that you have built up in your PhD career. I have a handful of colleagues in Minnesota (Mayo Clinic) and U Mich (computational statistics/genetics depts) that I could contact if you want. I don't know where home is for you. All the best. Try to enjoy your defense! Congrats, sir!



@Squidleybits Stand up for yourself. Don't let them guilt-trip you into this.
 
Enresshou

Enresshou

fade said:
You have a PhD, right? I used to ask my grad students who said they might go on to a PhD if they also wanted a job. It was half a joke, but it is a lot easier to get a job with a masters in a lot of STEM fields.
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I'll be defending my thesis in ~2 months. Fortunately most of the positions I'd like to go into explicitly desire a PhD, but yeah; I've had that talk with many undergraduates interested in graduate school (I.e. just trying to make them aware of the current situation, not necessarily discouraging them from it).[DOUBLEPOST=1450197069,1450196930][/DOUBLEPOST]
drawn_inward said:
@Enresshou this probably doesn't help one iota, but as you may know there are loads of postdoc positions available that aren't publicly listed. Try not to get desperate and pick something that will erode all these skills and toolsets that you have built up in your PhD career. I have a handful of colleagues in Minnesota (Mayo Clinic) and U Mich (computational statistics/genetics depts) that I could contact if you want. I don't know where home is for you. All the best. Try to enjoy your defense! Congrats, sir!



@Squidleybits Stand up for yourself. Don't let them guilt-trip you into this.
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I really appreciate the offer (seriously), but I'm actively trying to avoid the post-doc route if at all possible. Primarily due to the fact "home" is the west coast and post docs would likely be a baby step above the poverty level in the bay area.

As far as skill sets go, I'm right there with you. I'll be staying in science in one form or another.
 
drawn_inward

drawn_inward

Enresshou said:
Primarily due to the fact "home" is the west coast and post docs would likely be a baby step above the poverty level in the bay area.
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No kidding. My wife's buddies are doing postdocs at Stanford and Berkley and living over an hour away to afford 1,500/month one-bedroom apt rent.
 
fade

fade

Staff member
Enresshou said:
I'll be defending my thesis in ~2 months. Fortunately most of the positions I'd like to go into explicitly desire a PhD, but yeah; I've had that talk with many undergraduates interested in graduate school (I.e. just trying to make them aware of the current situation, not necessarily discouraging them from it).[DOUBLEPOST=1450197069,1450196930][/DOUBLEPOST]

I really appreciate the offer (seriously), but I'm actively trying to avoid the post-doc route if at all possible. Primarily due to the fact "home" is the west coast and post docs would likely be a baby step above the poverty level in the bay area.

As far as skill sets go, I'm right there with you. I'll be staying in science in one form or another.
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My post-doc depressingly paid higher than my first faculty appointment. Hell, my graduate internship paid much higher than my first faculty position.
 
MindDetective

MindDetective

Enresshou said:
I'll be defending my thesis in ~2 months. Fortunately most of the positions I'd like to go into explicitly desire a PhD, but yeah; I've had that talk with many undergraduates interested in graduate school (I.e. just trying to make them aware of the current situation, not necessarily discouraging them from it).[DOUBLEPOST=1450197069,1450196930][/DOUBLEPOST]

I really appreciate the offer (seriously), but I'm actively trying to avoid the post-doc route if at all possible. Primarily due to the fact "home" is the west coast and post docs would likely be a baby step above the poverty level in the bay area.

As far as skill sets go, I'm right there with you. I'll be staying in science in one form or another.
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What is your specific area again?
 
PatrThom

PatrThom

Enresshou said:
A mixture of neuroanatomy and genetics of both psychiatric illnesses and chronic stress, with an eye towards understanding what genes stress regulates and how these may be linked to depression.
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I hope you don't mind answering the odd question or two from intelligent laypeople.

--Patrick
 
MindDetective

MindDetective

Enresshou said:
A mixture of neuroanatomy and genetics of both psychiatric illnesses and chronic stress, with an eye towards understanding what genes stress regulates and how these may be linked to depression.
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My university (southern oregon) is going to be posting a Health Psychology tenure track position soon, probably in January. Your neuro background is a plus, although you don't seem to be a "traditional" Health Psych specialty. I can keep you in the loop when I know more, if you are interested.
 
GasBandit

GasBandit

Staff member
PatrThom said:
I hope you don't mind answering the odd question or two from intelligent laypeople.

--Patrick
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Enresshou said:
I don't mind at all; I actually really enjoy teaching and scientific outreach, and--as neither of my parents have any scientific training--I get a lot of practice.
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Well, since you're so amenable to questions from laypeople....

You ever go to eat a pork sausage, and find it's got hairs growin' all over it?
 
Dave

Dave

Staff member
GasBandit said:
Well, since you're so amenable to questions from laypeople....

You ever go to eat a pork sausage, and find it's got hairs growin' all over it?
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And then realize that the hairy pork sausage was about 500 feet tall and from the Paleolithic era.
 
Dei

Dei

20 minutes before we have to leave for school:

"Mommy, are we going to decorate the tree more before I go to school?"

"I don't know, are you going to get ready for school before you go to school?" (She is still in pajamas and hasn't packed her lunch)

"WHAT DOES THAT HAVE TO DO WITH ANYTHING?!"

[emoji79] [emoji35] [emoji35]

I sure can't wait for her to be a teenager. It's going to be the happiest fun time of all times.
 
GasBandit

GasBandit

Staff member
Dei said:
20 minutes before we have to leave for school:

"Mommy, are we going to decorate the tree more before I go to school?"

"I don't know, are you going to get ready for school before you go to school?" (She is still in pajamas and hasn't packed her lunch)

"WHAT DOES THAT HAVE TO DO WITH ANYTHING?!"
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She is SO your daughter.
 
Dave

Dave

Staff member
Remember the trip I've been killing myself to be able to pay for? Well, cross one trip off the list. Zach had his week-long pass rejected. Turns out his battalion is going to be (finally) doing a live field exercise for a couple weeks at least. So no El Paso trip this January. We're still going to go, but it'll be closer to February or March. I have gigs in April so that takes care of that.

Kerri is upset, but I'm kinda glad in a perverse sort of way. I mean, it really, really sucks that we're not going to be able to see him so soon, but with the transmission going out & trying to find out how to pay the $600+ for the hotel was getting harder and harder. This gives us another month or two to save, which is what we'll need. So half rant?
 
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