[Movies] Captain America: Civil War (spoilers!)
- Thread starter evilmike
- Start date
I did say my Mother's Day present was 2 1/2 hours alone with Chris Evans. Was not disappointed.
Hey, since when are we listening to the opinions of the yutes?!
Some legit gripes about the movie. The whole collateral damage thing only really made sense in the case of Age of Ultron.
Without the heroes, all the other situations would have ended up MUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCH worse. Like, literally the nuclear holocaust of New York City or the elimination of EVERYBODY IN THE WORLD that Hydra doesn't like. The only leg they have to stand on is Sarkovia, which is directly the fault of Tony Stark and Bruce Banner.
Without the heroes, all the other situations would have ended up MUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCH worse. Like, literally the nuclear holocaust of New York City or the elimination of EVERYBODY IN THE WORLD that Hydra doesn't like. The only leg they have to stand on is Sarkovia, which is directly the fault of Tony Stark and Bruce Banner.
If you ever win an oscar, then you can be an OWILF too.I thought I was the only one for you
Don't worry, you're still my number one BILF <3
Edit: just saw what you did there... Have another <3
Except it never seemed apparent that the governments of the world knew about Ultron's origin as a pet project by Tony and Bruce. They all focused on the damage caused during the situation during the climax.
I agree that it's bullshit, but harping on these matters when there would be collateral damage no matter what seems like exactly the kind of thing for the U.S. government to do as a means of covering its ass. Ross did have a point about ignoring borders though. Having the U.N. and Avengers sign a document would make it okay for them to go wherever. Nonetheless, I think a lot of us are on Cap's side here, much like with the comics, though at least unlike the comics they didn't turn Tony into essentially a villain. Otherwise the dialogue would've been:
"Do you know where Thor and Bruce are?"
"Space."
"How do you know?"
"Thor lives there and in about 5 seconds a rocket is going to make Bruce live there too."
GasBandit
Staff member
My buddy's wife HATES Captain America so much. Like, even before Civil War. She says he's "just too pure and goodie goodie" so she was rooting for Iron Man. She has expressed similar views about Superman in the past. I'm not sure, but I think there's something deep in her psyche that is bent, but I'm kinda afraid to tug at that thread. Of course, this is the same woman who won't let her husband play video games (at least not without a lot of arguments, guilt tripping, and general pissyness), so no secret something's not quite right upstairs.
you are projecting a whole lot of weird misogyny and weird mental health armchair diagnoses onto this woman for not liking the same costumed superheroes as you, and I'm afraid to tug at that thread
If it were me, I wouldn't touch that, if only because odds are it's the friend who'd suffer for it.
I wonder, if Disney keeps Evans on for more Cap, if they'll do one of his other various costumes/names since he left his shield and the US behind.
Why do you think he's basing all of that on the first sentence? These are people he knows in real life; he's mentioned them often.[DOUBLEPOST=1462897740,1462897706][/DOUBLEPOST]
I'm pretty sure he's getting a new shield. He's in the vibranium world capital now.
Yeah I thought of that after posting. He could easily get a new shield made, but would he want to be Captain America at that point? Representing a country that's basically made him a traitor? He's had other names and at this point is just Steve Rogers, so changing the name could make for an interesting subplot.
GasBandit
Staff member
This is not an isolated incident, and I'm also not good at communicating things like the fervor in her voice and the gleam in her eye. I had to bite back a "Jeez, did a guy in a Captain America costume touch you inappropriately when you were little?" in the conversation. It was wayyyyy too emphatic an opinion to hold about the topic.
But yeah, she's fucking coo-coo for cocoa puffs for other reasons too, and I've gone into that in other threads.
Considering his next movies are Avengers 3 and 4, I don't think we have time for subplots like that. In Winter Soldier, he was made a criminal/traitor, but he stuck to being Captain America because he's not representing America's government, he's representing America's ideals.
Something I just thought of--we never get the public's perspective in this movie, only that of the world governments. At the end of The Avengers, we see how people feel about these superheroes, in Avengers 2 we see civilians being rescued, in Winter Soldier we see ordinary people inspired to resist because of Cap, but in Civil War we don't really know how the public feels, except that they believe Bucky was responsible for the explosion in Vienna. So we have no idea how public perception is over all this stuff and for all we know, they're not as critical of the Avengers as the governments are being, except for the two people in the movie we know to be pissed because their families died in that collateral damage.
Which would really make all this shit just a powerplay by the governments and not really representing the will of the people they represent. So, you know, like real life.
It's possible he could have some screen time in Black Panther since he's hiding out in Wakanda.
is this the place to start condemning and insulting people for strong opinions about superhero movies? have you read all the angry fan fiction in the DC thread?
it's also kinda shitty to throw around all these "crazy" perjoratives that kinda keep stigmatizing actual, real mental health concerns
now if you're a licensed psychiatrist and diagnosed her out of the DSM and set her up with a therapist, I retract everything above
GasBandit
Staff member
You're also coo-coo for cocoa puffs.
Civil War's opening weekend tops Batman vs Superman. Not a factoid I care about weighing for film's quality (it's going to make more money than Winter Soldier, which I still say is the stronger and more cohesive film), but at least puts that to rest. In any case, it'll likely be one of the top earners for the year, but we got a Star Wars movie coming out this December and I could see that being the year's biggest release.
Spider-man: Homecoming is going to be huge. Hopefully it's also a good movie. I'm not worried about performances, but I am a little bit about the main people making the movie. The writer is the guy behind Vacation and Cloudy with a Chance of Meatballs 2 (which isn't bad per se, but I didn't think it was as good as the first one). The director is pretty new as far as feature length films go. For some reason I thought Clown was directed by Eli Roth; now I'm curious to check it out and get a glimpse of this guy's style.
For the most part, Marvel has been good about picking who is doing each movie (Thor 2 aside; a Game of Thrones person was probably not the best person for that material) so they must have their reasons. For how long they've been wanting to get Spider-man back, they wouldn't just hand him over to people they thought would screw things up. Plus, pretty sure the Russo brothers will be overseeing. Hopefully it'll be good.
Spider-man: Homecoming is going to be huge. Hopefully it's also a good movie. I'm not worried about performances, but I am a little bit about the main people making the movie. The writer is the guy behind Vacation and Cloudy with a Chance of Meatballs 2 (which isn't bad per se, but I didn't think it was as good as the first one). The director is pretty new as far as feature length films go. For some reason I thought Clown was directed by Eli Roth; now I'm curious to check it out and get a glimpse of this guy's style.
For the most part, Marvel has been good about picking who is doing each movie (Thor 2 aside; a Game of Thrones person was probably not the best person for that material) so they must have their reasons. For how long they've been wanting to get Spider-man back, they wouldn't just hand him over to people they thought would screw things up. Plus, pretty sure the Russo brothers will be overseeing. Hopefully it'll be good.
The Russos have really been knocking it out of the park with Marvel, so I'm excited for anything they get their hands on at this point.
I'm glad to be hearing reviews where people appreciate the level of detail put into this movie. Each scene they give attention to the different characters, how they would be acting and speaking and so on, about their issues from other movies (like Tony explaining why he's not with Pepper right now; he said he'd quit, then he didn't). Before seeing it I was worried it'd be like X-Men where a lot of characters just end up standing in the background of shots, not really having a place or personality aside from when it's called on, but Civil War balances and makes use of. Like I said on page 1, the movie is so stuffed that it's easy to miss things.
Side-note, I know people going on about how the sunlight shines off of Chris Evans's muscles in the helicopter scene, but damn, his face when he's a pallbearer at Peggy's funeral. Goddamn.
Side-note, I know people going on about how the sunlight shines off of Chris Evans's muscles in the helicopter scene, but damn, his face when he's a pallbearer at Peggy's funeral. Goddamn.
Emotions were portrayed pretty well through silence in this movie. Steve's face at Peggy's funeral, and Tony's as he watches the video of Bucky killing his parents.
In fact, that whole scene with Tony out for Bucky's blood is just amazing. Downey killed it.
In fact, that whole scene with Tony out for Bucky's blood is just amazing. Downey killed it.
LOL, "misogyny".
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
(There's a disturbing trend for privileged SJWs to throw the label of "misogyny" onto any stupid shit--"There's no whipped cream on my latte! The barista was male! Misogyny!", which dilutes the power of the word, which in turn harms women who are victims of real misogyny. But that's a whole different rant.)
Criticizing a woman for controlling behavior towards her spouse is most definitely not misogyny. If a man said he hated the characters seen as the ultimate symbols of good in their respective universes because they were "too good", and also micromanaged and dictated his wife's participation in hobbies/interests, he'd be considered "not right upstairs". Controlling behavior is not okay, no matter the gender, and coupling that with a disdain for "good" could set off a few alarm bells.
It's also normal in English for someone to use "crazy" or "not right in the head" to casually comment on someone's actions, while not intending to literally make a medical diagnosis. People have beliefs/behaviors/etc. that don't fall under a mental health diagnosis. Not every usage of "crazy" refers to a mental health issue. People say I'm crazy because I like to drive my Subaru around orange cones in a field as fast as I can. And maybe I'm wrong--I'll defer to our resident mental health experts--but I seriously doubt "RallyCross Driver" has a listing in the DSM. So accusing Gas of trying to medically diagnose this woman when he is obviously making a casual comment on her behaviors is either dishonest or ignorant, depending on your motive for accusing him of it.
GasBandit
Staff member
Everybody's gotta try it once. To get it out of their system. Give it the ol' college try before they give up and join the legions of "STFU Charlie." Even I did.You're crazy for trying to discuss rationally with Charlie
Yeah, well, referring to me as crazy (or criticizing anything I do or say) makes you a misogynist. So there!You're crazy for trying to discuss rationally with Charlie
This used to be a nice thread.
I miss when we could have discussion threads without playing "Who's More Offensive."
Dave
Staff member
All your posts are so much better with a Slappy voice.
GasBandit
Staff member
I don't remember that time
internalized misogyny is the worst kind 
Today children we are going to practise the THINK process regarding online commentary. Before you post something, reread it and ask yourself:
Is it True?
Is it Helpful?
Is it Inspiring?
Is it Necessary?
Is it Kind?
Some people believe you only need one of these to post a comment, but most people seem to prefer 2-3 of these to be true for their comments, and rarely you'll find someone who doesn't post unless all conditions are met.
Let's process a recent post through this filter:
Well, here we run into a problem, because some people's definition differ. The dictionary says a misogynist is one who hates, holds in contempt, or has an ingrained prejudice against all women. Others believe any slight to any specific woman is misogyny regardless of their general behavior towards women as a whole. We can't tell one way or the other, and have to give the poster the benefit of the doubt that they believe what they're saying to be true, despite their lack of psychiatry degree or intimate knowledge of the person they are speaking of. To the poster, this may be true, but likely to the audience it is not.
Is it helpful?
No, this comment doesn't produce any sort of information one can positively act on, isn't a service, or improves the life of another.
Is it inspiring?
No, quite the opposite.
Is it necessary?
There is nothing about this discussion that suggest this comment is required, so no.
Is it kind?
It isn't kind, and isn't even meant or written kindly.
So this post is, at best, a level one THINK comment - and that only in the poster's mind. Considering their audience this is likely less than level one. Some people feel this is ok, but I would caution anyone who doesn't follow at least 2 or 3 of the criteria that they are liable to be viewed as rude, inconsiderate, or intentionally mean. This may be ok for some, but it generally drives others away and results in a crushing sense of loneliness as others abandon them.
Is it True?
Is it Helpful?
Is it Inspiring?
Is it Necessary?
Is it Kind?
Some people believe you only need one of these to post a comment, but most people seem to prefer 2-3 of these to be true for their comments, and rarely you'll find someone who doesn't post unless all conditions are met.
Let's process a recent post through this filter:
Is it true?internalized misogyny is the worst kind
Well, here we run into a problem, because some people's definition differ. The dictionary says a misogynist is one who hates, holds in contempt, or has an ingrained prejudice against all women. Others believe any slight to any specific woman is misogyny regardless of their general behavior towards women as a whole. We can't tell one way or the other, and have to give the poster the benefit of the doubt that they believe what they're saying to be true, despite their lack of psychiatry degree or intimate knowledge of the person they are speaking of. To the poster, this may be true, but likely to the audience it is not.
Is it helpful?
No, this comment doesn't produce any sort of information one can positively act on, isn't a service, or improves the life of another.
Is it inspiring?
No, quite the opposite.
Is it necessary?
There is nothing about this discussion that suggest this comment is required, so no.
Is it kind?
It isn't kind, and isn't even meant or written kindly.
So this post is, at best, a level one THINK comment - and that only in the poster's mind. Considering their audience this is likely less than level one. Some people feel this is ok, but I would caution anyone who doesn't follow at least 2 or 3 of the criteria that they are liable to be viewed as rude, inconsiderate, or intentionally mean. This may be ok for some, but it generally drives others away and results in a crushing sense of loneliness as others abandon them.
So where do you guys think Marvel will go from here? A couple of threads I thought need pulling:
Spider-Man's solo movie is called Homecoming, which was also one of the codewords that brainwashed The Winter Soldier. Think that's a coincidence or they have something planned?
Cap, Bucky, and others are now in Wakanda. Will they play a role in Black Panther's solo movie? Heck, where do they go from here with Panther since he basically got his origin in this movie?
Who else hopes that, in order to bring them all back together, someone - hopefully Cap - will shout "AVENGERS ASSEMBLE!" finally. After that tease at the end of Age of Ultron. I imagine that will be part of the story for the first part of Infinity War.
Spider-Man's solo movie is called Homecoming, which was also one of the codewords that brainwashed The Winter Soldier. Think that's a coincidence or they have something planned?
Cap, Bucky, and others are now in Wakanda. Will they play a role in Black Panther's solo movie? Heck, where do they go from here with Panther since he basically got his origin in this movie?
Who else hopes that, in order to bring them all back together, someone - hopefully Cap - will shout "AVENGERS ASSEMBLE!" finally. After that tease at the end of Age of Ultron. I imagine that will be part of the story for the first part of Infinity War.
I'm of the opinion that the code words relate only to Bucky. Interestingly, the Russian phrase for homecoming tends more towards "return to homeland" - so rather than a familial, comfortable return to loved ones, it's more a patriotic return to a nation. This analysis is interesting:
http://kryptaria.tumblr.com/post/144068680650/winter-soldier-reprogramming-definitive-version
http://kryptaria.tumblr.com/post/144068680650/winter-soldier-reprogramming-definitive-version
I think (or even hope) that Cap and Bucky don't have a role in the Black Panther movie, or are just very minor supporting roles at best. Otherwise they'd steal the spotlight from T'Challa. Ulysses Klaw's already been introduced in the MCU, so I wouldn't be surprised if he's the antagonist. My guess is that the basic premise will be that Klaw's going after more of the Vibranium, and T'Challa will have to stop him.
And surely everyone's going to come back for the fight against Thanos (barring any deaths along the way). If Cap does shout "Avengers assemble" somewhere along the line, I'd hope it's in the final conflict, when everything seems lost, and he utters an inspiring rally cry that drives his allies forward for one last push. Man, I can imagine that scene.
Also, it wouldn't surprise me if Infinity War 1 and 2 have mostly different sets of protagonists, due to the superhero bloat in the MCU right now. So, for example, part 1 involves the more "grounded" heroes, like Cap and Iron Man and the rest of the human Avengers. Part 2 is when things get kicked up a notch, which would then require a more cosmic force to fight against Thanos. This is where the Guardians of the Galaxy, Dr. Strange, and the Asgardians get involved.