[Movies] Avengers

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I never really got pulled into it.
I weep for you Charlie. If, at the end of The Avengers, I was not jumping out of my seat, I would have felt like part of me was dead. Not being able to enjoy a great movie you really missed out. I've yet to come across anyone who didn't enjoy the movie. I've seen it twice (kind of). Three fourths of the way through the my first viewing the projection bulb burnt out. The manager came in and told the crowd the movie was over and they would give refunds or tickets to a later showing. I got a later showing and it was just as great the second time. A few of my buddies and I are going to catch it again this week.

Now I understood where you were coming from with Transformers. I don't agree but I understood. But there was not much more Joss could have done with this movie. From beginning to end it was fantastic. And for a couple of critics to indicate we are an "obedient audience" like we are some mindless sheep I would counter with "them being pretentious douches who say they didn't like it just to be different". Seriously, the fan and critic ratings have been stellar.
 
I liked the movie well enough, except it had the same problem that the spider man sequels had - too many stories to tell in one movie. Spiderman vs Sandman should have been an entire, separate movie from Spiderman vs Venom. I liked the individual movies as-much-if-n0t-better than the denouement "Avengers" because it's hard as hell to cram everybody's story in a 2 hour and change movie. There was so much I felt was touched on then dropped... glossed over... or just plain skipped for the sake of brevity.

But I still liked it. I think it was probably as good an Avengers movie as it is possible to make - and that's not a slight on Avengers, just an expression of the temporal limitations of the medium.
This. It was fun. There was no way to tell a story that would properly involve all the characters in the time they had. Let their individual movies do that. Avengers was big splosiony fun that was charming and witty instead of rage inducingly stupid like other big splosiony movies (Transformers).
 
You see Charlie, your opinion doesn't matter unless you agree with everyone else. It's so sad that you can't enjoy awesome movies. Something about you must be wrong or broken. I really do feel badly for you, especially since it seems like there are some movies that you can enjoy, just not the right ones.
 
I also like posting critics' reviews on here just to get everyone to call them "pretentious". Here is my favorite professional movie contrarian Armond White. I am not posting this since I agree with him 100% (I waaay don't), but since his review is really hilarious tihs time: http://nypress.com/pavlovs-franchise/

Previous Marvel Comics superhero movies such as Iron Man, Hulk, Captain America and Thor were like roughly cut puzzle pieces that looked odd and unfinished by themselves—pretend movies derived from already established brands. Most of them, particularly Jon Favreau’s dung-colored Iron Man, were poorly directed.


Now, fitted together in Marvel’s The Avengers, the superhero tales still don’t quite cohere; instead, each superhero’s traits and powers have been simultaneously inflated and streamlined (Scarlett Johannson’s Black Widow, barely a cameo in last year’sIron Man 2, is almost a character here) with the sole intent to overwhelm, not merely entertain. That’s why a corporate brand is part of the title.

A live-action version of the comic book series about “The Earth’s Mightiest Heroes,” Marvel’s The Avengers is promoted as the ultimate Comic-Con—the franchise of franchises, the movie contemporary audiences have been trained to anticipate and genuflect to.

This whopping sales campaign manipulates immature, undeveloped adolescent taste into the mistaken notion of cultural fulfillment. The Avengers is neither good nor important, yet the more it consummates Marvel Comics’ current strategy to secure the adolescent comic book/graphic novel/video game market, the more it illustrates Hollywood’s shameless insufficiencies.

To discuss The Avengers as a story—or even a thrill ride—is delusional. Best to tally some of the actors’ deceits—which parallel the media’s complicit self-deception—as they trivialize the emotional satisfaction that is supposed to come from modernizing myth and legend.

The Captain America role traps Chris Evans, who was a great tease as the Human Torch, in an uninteresting anachronism, now a truly faded idea of American Exceptionalism. The same holds for the Halloween freakazoids Thor (Chris Hemsworth) and Bruce Banner/The Hulk (a CGIed Mark Ruffalo).

As villainous Loki, Tom Hiddleston, who was so moving in Spielberg’s War Horse and Terence Davies’ The Deep Blue Sea, comes closest to giving a performance. He suggests the intense young aspirant Peter O’Toole, though without the glorious voice and no story details to frame his petulance, just a pretext for the superheroes to fight his plan for world domination.

The film’s only probable hero is zillionaire gadgeteer Tony Stark, who Robert Downey has finally learned to make his own using hipster witticisms that lend this basically unhip movie erratic self-satire.

Only a capitalist icon with Stark’s endless resources makes sense to an audience of semi-illiterate consumers catered to by the leisure industries and discouraged from an interest in characterization, theme or ideas. That’s why Sam Jackson’s Nick Fury can simply watch action from the sidelines (occasionally firing off a gunshot or an epithet), pretending to be a leader in his ghetto eye patch. (Insert convenient Obama comment here.)

Director Joss Whedon brings TV squalor (Buffy the Vampire Slayer) to this, his second big screen superhero outing. Whedon doesn’t have Zack Snyder’s personal style, the élan that at least made Watchmen and Sucker Punch thoroughly idiosyncratic and fitfully compelling. Whedon directs impersonally, which is to say he manages the proceedings as one runs a fast-food joint.

This analogy ought to appall the very fast-food patrons who flock to The Avengers, yet cannot accept that an artistic enterprise should be more than ground patties of optional substance. Like Whedon, they can’t tell the difference between art and conviction-less product.

This proves the brainwashing that has happened to pop audiences in the generations since comic books and TV stole their imaginations from cinema and literature. Much of this tragedy has to do with the impact of TV (Whedon’s background), which has destroyed popular understanding of narrative complexity.

Each superhero should represent overcoming some social difficulty; now they’re just gimmicks. Whedon simply makes the action go on and on. He has no sense of dramatic build or rising to a climax. He overloads the spectator with one climax after another (imitating Michael Bay angles, particularly the same skyscraper-devouring turbine f/x from the last Transformers flick).

Unlike the lyrical teen fantasy Chronicle or Neveldine/Taylor’s daring Ghost Rider: Spirit of Vengeance, which addressed life, death and morality, Marvel’s The Avengers has little to say other than “Buy me!” Millions of mentally hijacked moviegoers will respond like Pavlov’s dog, barking “Wow!”
 

GasBandit

Staff member
You see Charlie, your opinion doesn't matter unless you agree with everyone else. It's so sad that you can't enjoy awesome movies. Something about you must be wrong or broken. I really do feel badly for you, especially since it seems like there are some movies that you can enjoy, just not the right ones.
Eh, I can see what he's trying to convey, and he's of course welcome to his opinion. I just wanted to point out that if teasers to ongoing plot continuity are irksome, then comic books must not be very entertaining either, because I have yet to see a comic book that didn't end with some kind of "OR IS IT?" type teaser ending to set up a future arc.
 
You see Charlie, your opinion doesn't matter unless you agree with everyone else. It's so sad that you can't enjoy awesome movies. Something about you must be wrong or broken. I really do feel badly for you, especially since it seems like there are some movies that you can enjoy, just not the right ones.

Hey Charlie, I feel bad for you son. You got 99 problems, but The Avengers was fun.
 

ElJuski

Staff member
There are plenty of franchises that are corporate machines. I honestly think you're just picking a bone with The Avengers because you know there are way too many fanboys going nuts about it. But I think The Avengers succeeded in being a big-budget event film in ways that the last big one--Avatar--reeked and failed. It's got got quality entertainment brought on by a talented director and affable acting. Shit, I won't buy it on DVD but it sure was fun to watch in the theater.

And wait, aren't you the guy that loved Transformers 2? And excited for Battleship? This whole "blatant corporate sausage-mill" thing is just a smokescreen.
 
You know what my biggest issue with Avengers was?

I cannot for the life of me get past the fact that Captain America and Thor look like idiots in crappy halloween costumes.

Still managed to enjoy the heck out of the movie but damn they look stupid when they are standing around.
 
I thought Transformers 3 was decent. The 3D in it was streets ahead of Avengers.

Also, the ending action sequence/climax is almost an identical set up as Avengers and surpasses it in every way.
 
You know what my biggest issue with Avengers was?

I cannot for the life of me get past the fact that Captain America and Thor look like idiots in crappy halloween costumes.

Still managed to enjoy the heck out of the movie but damn they look stupid when they are standing around.
I think Cap's outfit in his own film was far superior, ditto Thor. The helmet on Chris Evans made his face look a little pudgier than it should have.
 
I haven't seen the cap movie but I have seen pics and the suit in it did look WAY better. It just looked very... TV. Same with Loki and Thor.
Don't worry though people! I still liked it! Don't kill me!
 
I think the biggest problem was the helmet. Then the back being a solid colour of blue.

I feel bad for Chris Evans putting so much work into getting buff because you couldn't tell by the costume.

 
I think the biggest problem was the helmet. Then the back being a solid colour of blue.

I feel bad for Chris Evans putting so much work into getting buff because you couldn't tell by the costume.

You could tell at the beginning of the movie when he's with the punching bags.
 
The helmet is bad and the material of the suit is bad. It just looks cheap and not like a 200 mil movie. It looks like if Cap made a guest appearance on Buffy.
 
I suspect the punching bags scenes were filmed a looong time ago. Parts of it, after all, were included at the end of his movie. It may have been in his contract that he didn't have to stay beefed up for the filming as the costume would have mitigated any loss in body tone.
 
For everyone saying Caps uniform looks cheap.....well what do you expect? The government isn't exactly pouring money into uniforms, everything goes to the lowest bidder.
 

Cajungal

Staff member
I didn't even notice to be honest. Looking closely at it, I kind of agree, but all superheroes look silly when you put them next to a screaming civilian in jeans and a button-up.
 
I also like posting critics' reviews on here just to get everyone to call them "pretentious".
My only complaint with some of these reviewers is the distinct feeling that the movie never had a chance. Hell, the NY Times review even comments on the failure of the genre as a whole (in the reviewers eyes) rather than discussing the movie on its own merits. Just as some reviewers are rabid fanboys who give two thumbs up to certain genres/subjects, there are critics who seem to have made up their minds before the film even started. I think the NYT review falls into the latter category. And I think that's both highly unprofessional and worthless as a review.
 
Im sad John Carter didn't do better in the box office.
Me too. I loved that movie.

I'm sure Charlie and his monocle crew thought it sucked because of the corporations or some shit though.

My only complaint with some of these reviewers is the distinct feeling that the movie never had a chance. Hell, the NY Times review even comments on the failure of the genre as a whole (in the reviewers eyes) rather than discussing the movie on its own merits. Just as some reviewers are rabid fanboys who give two thumbs up to certain genres/subjects, there are critics who seem to have made up their minds before the film even started. I think the NYT review falls into the latter category. And I think that's both highly unprofessional and worthless as a review.
This. It feels like they have a problem with its identity, not its quality.
 

GasBandit

Staff member
Well, there WAS some rather unfortunate seam placement on cap's outfit. Maybe that's what it was... CA and Thor's outfits looked less comfortable than Iron Man's armor. Like the old Star Trek TNG uniforms that would constantly ride up every time you lifted your arms, leading to the invention of the "picard maneuver" shirt pull.

picard_maneuver.gif
 
Patrick Stewart makes it look so natural and authoratative. "I'm here, I'm the captain, someone give me a report."
 
AO Scott's review is kind of bizarre.

Sure, the Hulk's moments of actual character development and defining scenes are more interesting intellectually than the battle scenes...but wasn't it kind of blatantly obvious that they were supposed to be?

And the pro-authoritarian complaint is...odd. I'm not clear on why he thought their motivations were vague.

Avenging the death of a friend and kicking the shit out of aliens who are blowing up New York seems fairly straight-forward as motivations to me. That they split up at the end I thought made it crystal clear that it's really all that was, it was just enough to plant the germ of an idea that they really could be something bigger.

At least the VV review made sense. The reviewer doesn't like popcorn flicks but needed to get paid so they wrote something longer than a sentence. Fair enough.
 
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