Co-parenting with my ex.

Shawn

Shawn

I've made some posts elsewhere so I'm sure there are a few that know a part of my situation.
As of January I'm able to see my 7-year-old daughter every other Saturday and Sunday for 7 hours each day. This was interrupted for a few months due to COVID but I spoke to my daughter a few times a week via facetime to keep in contact. Recently we started up my visits again.
When I see her we play boardgames & dolls & legos & Video games, watch movies, and bake/cook together. She says she has a good time. We'd go out and do more away from the house, but COVID complicates that.
My problem is that I worry I'm not connecting with her. My ex alienated her from me all last year (I got to see her once a month for like 2 hours) and manipulated her into referring to my ex's boyfriend as "dad" within a month or two of my daughter meeting him.
During my visits my daughter rarely calls me dad (she usually refers to me by my first name), and I never hear her say she loves me (not even "I love you too" when I say it to her). I feel like she purposely withholds saying these things because she doesn't feel like she's allowed to say them.
Honestly I don't even feel like a dad anymore. I just kinda feel like "the cool uncle" or something. I would love to ask my daughter if she loves me, but that doesn't seem appropriate to ask. Nor does making her call me dad instead of by my first name.
I'm going to be asking for more time to be negotiated by my lawyers. Sadly my job doesn't give me a lot of freedom during the week since I work overnights. But I'd like to get overnights on my weekends as well as phone calls during the week.

Advice wise I'd just like to know what I can do. Is there anything I can do to connect with her better. Anyway we can discuss my concerns about her being alienated with me without putting her into a awkward situation or laying any blame on anyone (including her mother). I know this stuff takes time, but its always hard to tell if things are progressing positively instead of negatively when things are slow going either way.
There was one positive thing during my last visit. While playing Animal Crossing with me she did call me dad. She also told me that my animal crossing "me" was her "me's" dad too. That made me feel better.
Just seeing if anyone here has any suggestions or thoughts on the subject.
 
Celt Z

Celt Z

I'm so sorry, especially that shitty behavior your ex is exhibiting. That's pretty much rule #1 of how NOT to act when you divorce and share kids. The best I can advise is 1) keep doing what your doing and make as much time with her as possible. As she gets older and more independent, she will be able to parse your dedication and your ex's manipulation. It's frustrating, but you need to play the long game. And 2) ask her about her interests. Let her talk about her favorite shows, activities, toys, books, etc. It will help you plan how to spend your time. I could never give a damn about cars and automotives, but the way it lights up my son, I've made a point to learn and give him as many resources as I can to nuture his interest. If there's anything she's always going to need, it's stability and someone she knows will support her and her interests.
 
PatrThom

PatrThom

First bit of advice: Remember that no matter what labels you give each other or which are given to you by others, you are still father and daughter and this can never be changed.

Next, in English, "Dad" does not always mean "Father." It is usually a term used to denote the male figure who positively influenced you the most while growing up. If she is calling someone else "Dad," then this may mainly be because you only spend 7hrs/week with her. FWIW my son has been calling me and his mother by our first names since he was 2. He refers to us as "my dad/my mom" to other people, but not to us directly.

I hear a lot about how YOU are unhappy with the situation and how much it makes YOU uncomfortable when she does not refer to YOU as "Dad." Again, see advice #1, but it makes me concerned that I do not hear anything about how it makes HER feel when you insist that she call you "Dad." The priority here, I think, is that she should feel comfortable around you and look forward to seeing you & spending time with you, and not focus on which label she uses to describe you/ask for your attention. At this point in my writing, @Celt Z has snuck in a post, and she is giving the same advice I was about to here--support her, allow her to feel comfortable around you, allow her to trust you, and allow her to open up to you, and you will be doing all the things a dad does, title or no title. DO NOT set up a situation where she feels like you and her mother are playing tug-of-war for her affections, for her approval, or whatever. That will just make her feel like she is a sports trophy to be passed back and forth. Do not make her feel like a trophy.

If anything, I'm actually somewhat encouraged that it doesn't sound like she is taking advantage of the situation to milk you for favors and such ("a REAL Dad would buy me a pony!"), which I assume means she has a good head on her shoulders and a great chance to figure out how things stand for herself, later.

--Patrick
 
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Shawn

Shawn

PatrThom said:
First bit of advice: Remember that no matter what labels you give each other or which are given to you by others, you are still father and daughter and this can never be changed.

Next, in English, "Dad" does not always mean "Father." It is usually a term used to denote the male figure who positively influenced you the most while growing up. If she is calling someone else "Dad," then this may mainly be because you only spend 7hrs/week with her.

I hear a lot about how YOU are unhappy with the situation and how much it makes YOU uncomfortable when she does not refer to YOU as "Dad." Again, see advice #1, but it makes me concerned that I do not hear anything about how it makes HER feel when you insist that she call you "Dad." The priority here, I think, is that she should feel comfortable around you and look forward to seeing you & spending time with you, and not focus on which label she uses to describe you/ask for your attention. At this point in my writing, @Celt Z has snuck in a post, and she is giving the same advice I was about to here--support her, allow her to feel comfortable around you, allow her to trust you, and allow her to open up to you, and you will be doing all the things a dad does, title or no title. DO NOT set up a situation where she feels like you and her mother are playing tug-of-war for her affections, for her approval, or whatever. That will just make her feel like she is a sports trophy to be passed back and forth. Do not make her feel like a trophy.

If anything, I'm actually somewhat encouraged that it doesn't sound like she is taking advantage of the situation to milk you for favors and such ("a REAL Dad would buy me a pony!"), which I assume means she has a good head on her shoulders and a great chance to figure out how things stand for herself, later.

--Patrick
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I'm definitely not insisting that she call me dad. It's just something that she did all the time and that stopped when the new guy came in. I know the manipulations my ex uses. She used them on my step kids when I first became involved with her too. This is just rinse-and-repeat for my ex.
I'm sorry if I didn't give the impression that I care about my daughter's feelings more than my own. I do. And for the reasons you've already mentioned I do not stoop to the tactics of her mother. I have never suggested to my daughter that her mother is purposely keeping us apart as much as possible, nor do I say anything bad about her at all. If anything I'm very supportive of her caring very much about her mother, and even the boyfriend; A while back my daughter once even asked me if it was okay to have two dads. I told her she can love as many people as she wants.
I want to be able to spend a lot more time with my daughter. There will be no additional time until the courts open up again probably. My ex isn't going to give me anything until she's risking being chewed out by a judge. My current amount of time with her is based on a step-program meant to gradually give me more time with my daughter to ensure she doesn't get overwhelmed. The weekend schedule I have with her is currently step 3. We were supposed to discuss step 4, and on, in June and begin implementing step 4 (likely to include overnights) as of July 1st. We could easily decide these things without a lawyer so long as they is written confirmation, but currently my ex won't even allow me a single facetime call with my daughter once a week. Everything I get I'm going to have to fight for, she has made that very clear.
 
Shawn

Shawn

Celt Z said:
I'm so sorry, especially that shitty behavior your ex is exhibiting. That's pretty much rule #1 of how NOT to act when you divorce and share kids. The best I can advise is 1) keep doing what your doing and make as much time with her as possible. As she gets older and more independent, she will be able to parse your dedication and your ex's manipulation. It's frustrating, but you need to play the long game. And 2) ask her about her interests. Let her talk about her favorite shows, activities, toys, books, etc. It will help you plan how to spend your time. I could never give a damn about cars and automotives, but the way it lights up my son, I've made a point to learn and give him as many resources as I can to nuture his interest. If there's anything she's always going to need, it's stability and someone she knows will support her and her interests.
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She expressed an interest in me watching the Twilight movies with her. I've never be interested and never owned the films preceding this conversation.
So I bought the films and we've attempted to sit down to watch the third and fourth films (her favorites). We only stopped because she got bored and wanted to play some Animal Crossing. But yes. I want to encourage her to tell me what she enjoys and I'll find ways to share them with her if she wants me to.
 
Shawn

Shawn

The last few weekends went well. We never did fully get through any of the Twlight movies (I think I've seen about half each of three of the films) but the time has been spent well. A few visits past she's watching this Youtube channel at my place called Cookie Swirl C (some of you parents with younger kids may know of her). It's a show where the youtuber unboxes and plays with various little kid toys (huge market for that kind of stuff on youtube). In one of the episodes she was particularly fascinated with a dispenser toy that drops vending machine capsules filled with doll parts so you can piece together your own creations. I picked up one for her and we had a lot of fun doing that together. There's also been a lot of Minecraft together and Untitled Goose Game. I recently picked up Slime Rancher with my daughter in mind, so maybe she will like that too. I was also pleased that she sat down to watch Spirited Away with me and absolutely loved it. She came back this weekend and wanted to share Kiki's Delivery Service with me because she watched it with her mother recently after her interest in Spirited Away.

Progress wise I feel the connection between us is getting stronger. But I still only see her every other weekend so there's not a lot of time together to cement it I feel. She still, for some reason, withholds saying things like "I love you" to me (even in response when I say it to her). I'm not pushing her to say it or even mentioning it. If she wants to say it she will say it. She still gives me hugs and snuggles up to me during movies, so I believe she does love me. My best guess is she is still confused over everything. But when she does finally say it again I'll probably tear the hell up.
 
Shawn

Shawn

Somehow managed to negotiate an overnight with my daughter every other weekend. It's a strong step.
 
Shawn

Shawn

Biting my finger nails right now.
Due to the difficult degree of guests at work over the weekends upper management have pretty much nixed my every other Saturday night off. This means I've had to message my ex and ask for a different overnight during the week.
I honestly do not expect my ex to be accommodating.
 
Shawn

Shawn

Things have been moving forward. I'm seeing Hailey every Sunday for about 7 hours. Had to give up my overnights for now due to work constraints. But my ex has been surprisingly reasonable with my visit schedule. Even giving me a two-hour dinner with Hailey every other week (my first dinner with her was last Friday). The last two Sundays have been pretty chill, but we did get to go to the LA zoo the first Sunday. The zoo is currently on a phase 1 reopening and so they are only operating at 20% capacity. I'm looking for some other things that we can do on Sundays. I might even see if Sarah will let me have her for a few extra hours with me so we don't have to rush her home.
Divorce may also finally be pushing forward. Heard from my lawyer that Sarah finally has turned in her financial declaration last week, despite it being due last March.
 

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Shawn

Shawn

A dinner with Hailey tonight. I asked her if she was excited for an upcoming overnight we have scheduled for when she is on Thanksgiving Break and she said yes. I asked her if she wanted to do two overnights in a row with me and her eyes lit up. Which is frustrating because I earlier asked my ex if it would be possible to do two nights overnight instead of one since it was Hailey's Thanksgiving Break. She told me "Hailey only wants to do one overnight" and left it at that. This is an ongoing problem such as with my request for some vacation time with Hailey: "Hailey has concerns about a week with you that she would like addressed before we agree to anything" she replied.

My ex needs control over my visits. If her need for that control cannot be justified she will guide my daughter's answers to manipulate for that control.
 
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Dave

Dave

Staff member
I removed the picture. Don't want you to get into trouble. The other two don't really show her so it's cool.
 
Shawn

Shawn

It's just kind of a fun thing, but my daughter is really into watching theme park ride POVs on Youtube with me. I'm hoping she will enjoy theme park histories and ride mechanics just as I do. Tonight I blew her mind when I told her there was a Frozen ride in Epcot. After watching the POV I mentioned that the ride used to be completely different and called the MAELSTROM, blowing her mind twice over. A little victory but I love it. I'd love to get her to Disneyland soon when it reopens. She hasn't been since she was a little baby so she has no memory of any of it. She's super excited though.
 
Dei

Dei

IMO, they did a half ass job on the Frozen ride. When you compare it to the atmosphere of Haunted Mansion or The Little Mermaid you can see it.
 
Celt Z

Celt Z

The ride did feel kinda short. I wouldn't say bad, but they really could have expanded into more of the movie. But Li'l Z and I liked it okay (only because we caught it when the line wasn't too long).

But we started watching the Youtube videos of rides from Disney and Universal a few months back, and it really is fun. I was excited someone had recorded Universal's Dueling Dragons, which doesn't exist anymore and was a great coaster. And the Jaws ride, because I never got to go on it! :(
 
Dei

Dei

Celt Z said:
The ride did feel kinda short. I wouldn't say bad, but they really could have expanded into more of the movie. But Li'l Z and I liked it okay (only because we caught it when the line wasn't too long).

But we started watching the Youtube videos of rides from Disney and Universal a few months back, and it really is fun. I was excited someone had recorded Universal's Dueling Dragons, which doesn't exist anymore and was a great coaster. And the Jaws ride, because I never got to go on it! :(
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I think my biggest issue is that most of it was just people singing while standing in a big blank space and you stare at it. When you go on things like The Little Mermaid, you are in the scene and going through it (Under the Sea), and it has way more immersion and fun. The Frozen ride feels like something that they were just trying to rush out ASAP before the hype died down.
 
Shawn

Shawn

Dei said:
I think my biggest issue is that most of it was just people singing while standing in a big blank space and you stare at it. When you go on things like The Little Mermaid, you are in the scene and going through it (Under the Sea), and it has way more immersion and fun. The Frozen ride feels like something that they were just trying to rush out ASAP before the hype died down.
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I mean when you remodel a ride like they did with Frozen Ever After you have to work with what you got. MAELSTROM was a pretty short ride already.

And the Jaws ride, because I never got to go on it! :(
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That one was a very impressive ride for it's time.
 
Dei

Dei

Shawn said:
I mean when you remodel a ride like they did with Frozen Ever After you have to work with what you got. MAELSTROM was a pretty short ride already.


That one was a very impressive ride for it's time.
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Maelstrom was far more detailed.
 
Celt Z

Celt Z

Shawn said:
That one was a very impressive ride for it's time.
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I had heard. And I love Jaws. I read the book. I watch the movie every summer. I live near the river the actual event that the book is based on. Heck, I've been to Martha's Vineyard with sharks nearby! So when Mr. Z and I got to go to Universal in 2005 for my first time, I was so upset the ride was closed that day for repairs. It was what I was looking forward to more than anything. And by the time I finally got down there again, they has closed it permanently. :cry:
Honestly, looking at the videos online, it looks like it was so fun. Mr. Z told me how it freaked him out when he rode it in '93.
 
Shawn

Shawn

Celt Z said:
I had heard. And I love Jaws. I read the book. I watch the movie every summer. I live near the river the actual event that the book is based on. Heck, I've been to Martha's Vineyard with sharks nearby! So when Mr. Z and I got to go to Universal in 2005 for my first time, I was so upset the ride was closed that day for repairs. It was what I was looking forward to more than anything. And by the time I finally got down there again, they has closed it permanently. :cry:
Honestly, looking at the videos online, it looks like it was so fun. Mr. Z told me how it freaked him out when he rode it in '93.
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Rides based on movies have a choice to make when they go into creation. 1) Is it just a ride with no interaction needed from the riders or 2) does it put the riders in as their own characters.
Option 2 can get clever but most of the time you get some weird awkward explanation as to why you're even there (IE: "So thank you for volunteering to becoming minions via our new minion making machine! or "We're letting you completely inexperienced individuals test out our new time machines!").
Jaws had the perfect set up because you are exactly what you are: tourists. Nothing complicated for the story just "we're taking you on a tour of the area where the legendary shark attack took place and will never ever happen again". The other ride that does it just fine at Universal is Jurassic World. Basically the same setup.
 
Celt Z

Celt Z

Agreed. Li'l Z has never seen Jurassic-anything and he went bananas last year when he tried it. I think it helps that at the heart of the two rides are unchanging truths: sharks and dinosaurs are always awe-inspiring and terrifying. I also think that the new King Kong ride does this well, too.
 
Shawn

Shawn

This is what it looks like talking to my ex via our Talking Parents app. Should I be frustrated with her as much as I am?

-Christmas-
Me: Let's show Hailey we can work together and get her gifts that go with each other. I hear you are getting her an American Girl doll. Is that the case? I can get her some accessories for it.
Her: Get her whatever you want.

-Recent Illness-
Her: Hailey has a fever. I'm getting her tested.
Me: Let's cancel my dinner with her tonight then. Can I talk with her on the phone for a few minutes today? Let me know when you get the results of the test.
Her: (responding 8 hours later). Covid Negative Flu Positive. She's asleep.

-Upcoming Sunday overnight. But still dealing with illness-
Me: How is Hailey feeling? Are we still okay with the overnight tomorrow? I have children's tylenol on hand if she's still feeling a little under the weather. But if you want to give her another day recovery at home we could do Monday overnight instead.
Her: Can't do Monday. We have plans for Tuesday.

Honestly at this point I have no idea if I'm seeing Hailey today. I guess I'll just show up for the drop off and find out.
 
Shawn

Shawn

The positive upside of the hotel closing for six weeks is that my weekends are available to me again. I'll only be seeing Hailey once every other weekend with the schedule, but at least it will be an overnight.

Still my thoughts are a little depressing lately.
I hate not being able to trust someone with such an impact on my life such as Sarah, after years of being manipulated and gaslighted by my her. The last half of the year has had its moments of frustrations with her but for the most part she seems willing to work with me. It is, however, no where near perfect, as she continues to undermine me, make me feel like I'm borrowing Hailey rather than co-parenting, and absolutely making it harder to see Hailey than it ever has to be. For some reason she has been delaying our divorce final judgment as well. We've been at this for two years now and she takes each step at a snail's pace.
She still scares me. Despite her nice and friendly mannerisms at times during drop-offs/pick-ups I am still incredibly paranoid of her true intentions.
If I did not have a good lawyer protecting my interests right now I have no doubt in my mind that Sarah would still have me seeing Hailey no more than 2 hours a month as she did our first year separated.
 
Shawn

Shawn

Several areas of the city received an emergency alert regarding stay-at-home orders. My ex wants to use that as a reason to postpone visits until further notice. While there isn't anything posted regarding this most recent order the city's stance on visitation is that the stay-at-home orders do not supersede the visitation orders, but the health of the child and family should be factored in so it's kind of a case-by-case scenario that the parents should decide amongst themselves.
My current situation is that the hotel is closed and I work by myself in a locked up office with no close contact with anyone. I isolate at home the rest of the time and only venture out for groceries. My roommates work in TV/Movies where they are usually either working from home or on set where they wear masks, isolate, and get tested 3 times a week with results in less than a day. The rest of the time they isolate from home.
What's also bad timing is that my first full week with Hailey is coming up at the end of the month. I've already taken the time off of work for it.

I do not doubt for one second that Sarah is jumping on this as another excuse to keep me from seeing Hailey. However that doesn't mean it's not a valid excuse.
What does everyone suggest?
 
Celt Z

Celt Z

Go back in time, get a better ex-wife.

Joking aside, there's very little you can do that you haven't done already. You're taking all the precautions you can without giving up your job or being homeless. The only thing, and this is marginal, is that you can't 100% vouch for your roommates, as they are grow adults with lives outside of the home as well. That being said, and given her history, you know your ex will do anything and everything she still can to twist the knife because you got free from her manipulative marriage. I would say, stay on top of your Covid testing, and maybe consult your lawyer to enforce your shared custody. It's hard given the situation with the pandemic. We've been extremely careful with Li'l Z this entire time, and even I would pause a little if I were in your living situation. It's not that you or your roommates are playing fast and loose with the restrictions, it just ups the possibility of something happening that's out of anyone's control.
 
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