[TV] FOX's Gotham coming soon.

Espy

Espy

Tress said:
It didn't look THAT bad. And yes, I'm being serious.
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It had a nice cinematic "look". But it looked like shit. Wait, sorry, WAR. It looked like WAR was coming or starting or something something WAR. It obviously has decent production values, I'll give them that. It also has decent WAR. And WAR WAR WAR. It's coming. Or it's here. WAR.
 
Covar

Covar

Before the Penguin...Oswald Cobblepot was a high ranking mobster with desires of high society and a fixation on birds.

2379724-batman-facepalm1.jpg
 
figmentPez

figmentPez

Staff member
Ivy Pepper...

They're renaming Pamela Isley to Ivy Pepper.

What in the name of Kanigher and Moldoff are they thinking?!

I'm just going to sit here and try to let this headache pass, while hoping that The Flash doesn't rename Eobard Thawne to Zoom Stryker.
 
filmfanatic

filmfanatic

figmentPez said:
Ivy Pepper...

They're renaming Pamela Isley to Ivy Pepper.

What in the name of Kanigher and Moldoff are they thinking?!

I'm just going to sit here and try to let this headache pass, while hoping that The Flash doesn't rename Eobard Thawne to Zoom Stryker.
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No, they just renamed him Eddie Thawne. At least they kept part of the name
 
Cog

Cog

Why? It's no different to any modern adaptation of a classic novel. Similar names, different circumstances. Who cares if batman ever appears? They just need to tell a good story.
 
ThatNickGuy

ThatNickGuy

Cog said:
Why? It's no different to any modern adaptation of a classic novel. Similar names, different circumstances. Who cares if batman ever appears? They just need to tell a good story.
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Because the whole point of having all these supervillains is for Batman to fight them. If the show was just Gotham Central, where Batman is already in the universe and it's the cops trying to do their job, then that would've made for a much more sensible premise.

It's the same problem Smallville had. Why bother having him fight all these supervillains and even team up with other heroes to the point of having a quasi-Justice League if you don't just put him in the costume? It's taking that conceit and actually making it worse by not having Batman in the show at all.
 
Cog

Cog

That's it? It's not comic book enough? The whole premise is ruined without batman? Why do you want it to be worse?
 
ThatNickGuy

ThatNickGuy

Cog said:
That's it? It's not comic book enough? The whole premise is ruined without batman? Why do you want it to be worse?
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Forget it. You seem to only ever post when you want to be antagonistic and start an argument (to say nothing of belittling people). Chris Sims said it better than I could. Go look at the link posted at the top of this page.
 
Cog

Cog

Well, this is something I like to talk about. I'm not insulting you. I like to know about this stuff. I want to know why this kind of thing are so important for so many people. Why people like you take this adaptations like some kind of insult. I feel like if I understand why things apparently irrelevant are so important (or at least important enough to provoque an angry reaction) for people like you, I could understand better other aspects of humanity.
 
Hailey Knight

Hailey Knight

Cog said:
That's it? It's not comic book enough? The whole premise is ruined without batman? Why do you want it to be worse?
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He didn't say he wants it to be worse. It's already a shitty idea. What he wants is for no one to watch it so it gets cancelled. That's he meant by wanting it to bomb.
 
AshburnerX

AshburnerX

ThatNickGuy said:
Because the whole point of having all these supervillains is for Batman to fight them. If the show was just Gotham Central, where Batman is already in the universe and it's the cops trying to do their job, then that would've made for a much more sensible premise.

It's the same problem Smallville had. Why bother having him fight all these supervillains and even team up with other heroes to the point of having a quasi-Justice League if you don't just put him in the costume? It's taking that conceit and actually making it worse by not having Batman in the show at all.
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The fundamental problem with Smallville is that it should have ended when he left Smallville. Up until the moment he leaves for Metropolis, it's okay that he's not in costume... stakes are smaller. But the moment he goes to Metropolis, things HAD to change and they didn't. That was the entire failing of the show.

And yeah... this should have been a Gotham Central show, but then that leaves one big problem: Batman. How long do you go before you show Batman? How often should he be on the show? What is his involvement with the cast of the show who aren't Gordon? The entire premise of the show is that he shouldn't be involved, but the average viewer is going to wonder why they aren't watching a bad ass Batman show instead.
 
ThatNickGuy

ThatNickGuy

AshburnerX said:
And yeah... this should have been a Gotham Central show, but then that leaves one big problem: Batman. How long do you go before you show Batman? How often should he be on the show? What is his involvement with the cast of the show who aren't Gordon? The entire premise of the show is that he shouldn't be involved, but the average viewer is going to wonder why they aren't watching a bad ass Batman show instead.
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Same way they dealt with him in the comics: barely even there. Most of his appearances were quick shots, like seeing part of his cape blow past or something. Not all, of course. He even had some very - very - brief speaking moments. But the comic's focus was like 99.9% on the cops.
 
AshburnerX

AshburnerX

Maybe I'm not giving the TV audience enough credit. Agents of SHIELD is doing fine and it's basically the same concept as Gotham Central... though it has the benefit of Disney being able to help prop up the show by releasing exclusive trailers and such.

Maybe the real issue here is that Gotham Central would only work if it had an expanded universe to play around in and DC won't be doing that until Justice League. That's basically the only reason I can see why they wouldn't do THAT show instead of this dreck.
 
Celt Z

Celt Z

I think the show could have potential in a way that Smallville wrote itself into a corner. By making Clark the main character, they could only do so much because we know at some point he's going to officially become Superman. By putting Bruce Wayne as a background character, we're not limited to focusing on his development (which was pretty well covered in Batman Begins, plus all the comics). I think it has to potential to show WHY Gotham needs a Batman. We see how "ordinary" cops would have to deal with extraordinary villains in a David v. Goliath scenario, which is also something Smallville could never do, because even inexperienced, Clark is still super powered. And since we're not focusing on Batman, they have a bit more room to play around with continuity, unlike SHIELD which still has to make sure they acknowledge the movie-verse (which is something I like about SHIELD, btw). In some ways, the stakes could be higher because none of these character incarnations have to saved because they're appearing in the movie-verse.

As I've stated before, I also have Batman-fatigue, so take my opinion with a grain of salt. I'm okay with not seeing Batman for a while. And truthfully, I'm not really invested in this show. If it succeeds or fails, at the moment, makes no difference to me. But I've been to a lot of sites that cover it, and the opinions on it range wildly from "I can't wait for it!!!" to "Why are they doing this?". Just from what I've read, this is my own take on it.
 
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figmentPez

figmentPez

Staff member
Celt Z said:
I think it had to potential to show WHY Gotham needs a Batman.
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It might be interesting if they did that, but my pessimistic side is worried that they'll just shove tweenage Bruce Wayne into the role of "Batman, but without the cape & cowl". If they didn't want to have Batman be a character, they shouldn't have put baby bats into the show at all.
 
Celt Z

Celt Z

figmentPez said:
It might be interesting if they did that, but my pessimistic side is worried that they'll just shove tweenage Bruce Wayne into the role of "Batman, but without the cape & cowl". If they didn't want to have Batman be a character, they shouldn't have put baby bats into the show at all.
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(Sorry, that should have been "has the potential". Coffee didn't kick in yet.)
Anyway, I think they have to put Bruce in there somewhere because Wayne Enterprises was such a big part of Gotham even before Bruce came of age. It would be pretty hard not to acknowledge that at all.
 
figmentPez

figmentPez

Staff member
Celt Z said:
(Sorry, that should have been "has the potential". Coffee didn't kick in yet.)
Anyway, I think they have to put Bruce in there somewhere because Wayne Enterprises was such a big part of Gotham even before Bruce came of age. It would be pretty hard not to acknowledge that at all.
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True, but they're making him part of the advertising. I think that's a sign that they're not going to just have him be part of the universe, but they're planning on having him be part of the plots. It's one thing to acknowledge that Wayne Enterprises is part of Gotham, but it will be something else if they have little Bruce Wayne as a recurring character. He should be focused on his education and training, harboring his desire for vengeance, not running Wayne Enterprises and having romances with Ivy Pepper.
 
Celt Z

Celt Z

That's just to get the Plebs' attention. ;)
Network shows can't survive on fanboy/fangirl numbers alone. They're not high enough to equal successful ratings. They have to draw in non-fans, too, and thus the (assumed) bate-and-switch with Little Brucie. I don't necessarily agree with it, but I understand why they do it.
 
Covar

Covar

A show about why Gotham needs Batman, is a show where the protagonists are ineffective and fail constantly. Which is terrible television.
 
Hailey Knight

Hailey Knight

Covar said:
A show about why Gotham needs Batman, is a show where the protagonists are ineffective and fail constantly. Which is terrible television.
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Attack on Titan is a compelling show and its protagonists fail in almost every episode. And even when they succeed, it's costly and comes with many of its own failures. But damn do they try.

This show isn't going to be good like that, but it can be done. It doesn't have to be the new Teen Titans.
 
AshburnerX

AshburnerX

The entire point of Gotham Central is that the city was terrible and could never be saved... in fact, it probably didn't DESERVE to be saved. But that didn't mean that it wasn't worth trying because the lives saved meant something to someone. It was very much about the small victories you could get when everyone was working against you, even your own people.

Gotham will not be that show, but it should have been.
 
Espy

Espy

I haven't clicked on your link but by your picture I'm guessing they have added Spiderman to the cast?!? Fantastic!
 
Espy

Espy

Just read it. Thats a pretty dick move. Not as bad as this though:
This is small change compared to the fact that the estate of Jack Kirby receives no share of the billions in dollars that Marvel/Disney makes from movies based on characters he co-created.
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Seriously??? Holy shit Marvel/Disney. Wow. How is the Kirby estate not suing the shit out of them?
 
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