Gas Bandit's Political Thread V: The Vampire Likes Bats

Canadians pay 50% of their income tax rate on capital gains income. So if I pay 43% income tax, I pay 21.5% on capital gains.

Americans pay 15% on capital gains (or 0% on capital gains for the lowest two income tax brackets)

Technically it's that 50% of our capital gain is subject to taxation but the math works out the same so who cares? ;) . Also, I'm from Alberta so my maximum capital gains tax would be 19.5%.

Still, if that 39% number Stienman was tossing around is correct... that's a pretty huge jump from 15%.
 
Technically it's that 50% of our capital gain is subject to taxation but the math works out the same so who cares? ;) . Also, I'm from Alberta so my maximum capital gains tax would be 19.5%.

Still, if that 39% number Stienman was tossing around is correct... that's a pretty huge jump from 15%.
It's not. The max is 28% on long term investments, set back in 1986 - which was increased from the 20% rate set back in 1981. (Increased during a recession by that ultra-liberal Ronald Reagan).

15 % is what it's at now and is due to expire with the Bush tax cuts which will mean:
  • After 2012, dividends will be taxed at the taxpayer's ordinary income tax rate, regardless of his or her tax bracket.
  • After 2012, the long-term capital gains tax rate will be 20% (10% for taxpayers in the 15% tax bracket).
  • After 2012, the qualified five-year 18% capital gains rate (8% for taxpayers in the 15% tax bracket) will be reinstated.
 

GasBandit

Staff member
First of all, why are you conflating business expenditures into personal tax rates? How does increasing the personal tax rate affect productivity? It doesn't. How does increasing the personal tax rate impact business investment? It doesn't. Secondly, why is Norway the most productive country in the world and have those kinds of tax rates? Or Switzerland? Or Singapore?
Because a great many "small" businesses are not incorporated, and thus all their finances are done under their owner's personal taxes. As for the other countries, none of them even have an economy the size of that of Texas, let alone the US.


Thirdly, you are aware that real spending growth has actually declined year over year since 2009, right? In fact total federal outlays for Obama's first budgetary year (2010) were actually lower than 2009 and has continued to be outpaced by inflation ever since.
If that is so, it is not because spending has been curbed, it's because inflation has been running away.

You can argue that spending is too high, for sure, but you can't argue that it's the fault of the current government.
Oh, no, not at all. It's certainly a major shortcoming that I also blasted the Bush administration for as well. And I am under absolutely no illusions that republicans would make any meaningful budget cuts. Reference the Robert Higgs quote in my signature.
 
Thirdly, you are aware that real spending growth has actually declined year over year since 2009, right?
What exactly do you mean here? That in "real dollars" that spending was growing by 10% a year, then 9%, then 5%? Thus it's still increasing in real dollars, but not growing as fast? Or that spending in "real dollars" has declined year-on-year, it just looks like it's increasing because of inflation? The 2nd is fine. The 1st scares the hell out of me as a "spending cut" because it isn't, but is sometimes touted as such.
 
What exactly do you mean here? That in "real dollars" that spending was growing by 10% a year, then 9%, then 5%? Thus it's still increasing in real dollars, but not growing as fast? Or that spending in "real dollars" has declined year-on-year, it just looks like it's increasing because of inflation? The 2nd is fine. The 1st scares the hell out of me as a "spending cut" because it isn't, but is sometimes touted as such.
Real dollars as defined as by the net between actual growth minus inflation, basically the difference between real and nominal value.[DOUBLEPOST=1354671714][/DOUBLEPOST]
Because a great many "small" businesses are not incorporated, and thus all their finances are done under their owner's personal taxes. As for the other countries, none of them even have an economy the size of that of Texas, let alone the US.

If that is so, it is not because spending has been curbed, it's because inflation has been running away.

Oh, no, not at all. It's certainly a major shortcoming that I also blasted the Bush administration for as well. And I am under absolutely no illusions that republicans would make any meaningful budget cuts. Reference the Robert Higgs quote in my signature.
I turned off sigs in the Great Sig War of 2009.
 
Adam, I know what real dollars are. Read your original statement. You are still ambiguous. You said "real spending growth has declined" which I'm asking for clarification on. Do you mean that "real dollar spending" has declined (even if current dollars are growing), or that "real dollar spending" is still growing, but the percentage growth in real dollars is less?
 
Adam, I know what real dollars are. Read your original statement. You are still ambiguous. You said "real spending growth has declined" which I'm asking for clarification on. Do you mean that "real dollar spending" has declined (even if current dollars are growing), or that "real dollar spending" is still growing, but the percentage growth in real dollars is less?
Ah, I getcha. Real spending has declined.
 
it is not for the people to justify to the government why it needs to take less of their money, it is for the government to justify to the people why it needs to take what it does at all. The default ownership of income is not the government, it isn't that the government "lets you keep" some of your money. It's that we, as citizens of the nation, acknowledge that government is necessary and we agree to pay taxes to cover government expenses.
Cannot agree with this enough. Governments are supposed to do the stuff that nobody wants to do but everybody needs done. It's like health insurance for infrastructure and services: We pay taxes, and as a result our Society, our (country/city/State/province) doesn't get sick. The trouble comes when the people in government start putting their own welfare ahead of that of their constituents...many seem to have taken a semi-feudal attitude towards their job (arranging earmarks, contracts, e. g.) and have lost sight of the bigger picture.

Tangentally related, I came here to post the following controversial video. It has little to nothing to do with the preceding, I just felt motivated to make the above comments after catching up. Some of the video is a bit hyperbolic, but it's still quite informataining.



--Patrick
 

GasBandit

Staff member

GasBandit

Staff member
... that's not what that footage says. That's what the fark politico (and the LGF operative blogger) say, but what they're construing from the actual footage they quote is quite a stretch.

And it still doesn't explain the tent.
 
Utah business owner fires two employees who supported Obama, in reaction to new Healthcare costs.

His first statement about it?

"Love it. We had to let two employees go to cover new Obongocare [sic] costs and increased taxes," Lee wrote. "Found two Obongo supporters and gave them the news yesterday. They wanted the idiot in the Whitehouse [sic], they reap the benefits."
He later tries to play it off, saying it was tongue in cheek and that the two employees weren't his top performers... but really? Asshole fired two employees for political beliefs and then makes a racist joke about how they deserved it.

Is there a reason why your political beliefs aren't protected by law?
 
Wow. Welcome to the new dark ages.

He said that in the past couple of years he has had to cut costs as his business has slowed. But he said his accountant recently told him that the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act, also known as Obamacare, had raised his company’s taxes and operating costs. Asked to detail those costs, Lee deferred to his accountant, who could not be reached for comment. Obamacare mandates that only businesses with more than 50 employees be required to insure full-time employees or face penalties.
I love when people make shit up to support their crazy, even with the evidence right in front of them contradicting what they say.
 

Necronic

Staff member
Utah business owner fires two employees who supported Obama, in reaction to new Healthcare costs.

His first statement about it?

He later tries to play it off, saying it was tongue in cheek and that the two employees weren't his top performers... but really? Asshole fired two employees for political beliefs and then makes a racist joke about how they deserved it.

Is there a reason why your political beliefs aren't protected by law?
I have a very hard time believing that this will not hurt his business. To be perfectly honest I would not be surprised if the city/etc simply eliminated his contract for violating a required terms of conduct for using that phrase. Political affiliations are one thing, but having a city use a group (specifically for criminal matters) that uses oppenly racist terms is quite another.
 
I like how all the news centers are saying that if Clinton runs in 2016 it'll be a landslide.

Can't wait for the actual GoP talk in 2016.
 

GasBandit

Staff member
I swear that if Clinton had won, Ryan would be saying Obama would have fixed the fiscal situation. I think he's just going to oppose any Democrat in office.
But wouldn't it have made more sense to claim that if his own party's nominee won, it would have fixed etc? Rather than ... well, I guess this probably gets more headlines.
 
But wouldn't it have made more sense to claim that if his own party's nominee won, it would have fixed etc? Rather than ... well, I guess this probably gets more headlines.
Too bad Paul Ryan is now forever stained as Mitt's Vice presidential flop. Well not -too bad- but that's the way it is none-the-less.
 
But wouldn't it have made more sense to claim that if his own party's nominee won, it would have fixed etc? Rather than ... well, I guess this probably gets more headlines.
Well, yes, that is true too. Maybe "Romney and I would have fixed this" is just such an obvious statement for him to make that he doesn't think it needs to be said?
 

GasBandit

Staff member
Except now she has the Sec. State experience under her belt.
I don't think the layperson really cares about cabinet experience. Hell, I bet the majority of people on the street, if confronted without preparation, couldn't tell you what the state department does.
 
I don't think the layperson really cares about cabinet experience. Hell, I bet the majority of people on the street, if confronted without preparation, could tell you what the state department does.
It saddens me when I mention the State Department or Sec. of State and get that glazed over look. It's only one of the most important parts of the government!
 
Hilary won't run. She doesn't have the health and that leaves the Democrats without an obvious choice to run. I think 2016 is going to be an interesting election... neither side has someone to push yet (unless Chris Christie runs) and they need to start doing it withing the next 2 years.
 
I don't think the layperson really cares about cabinet experience. Hell, I bet the majority of people on the street, if confronted without preparation, couldn't tell you what the state department does.
Yeah, but to the layperson, she's no longer the wife Bill cheated on. She's been in the mainstream media news alot. Regardless of whether they know what she's been doing exactly.
 
I don't even think she's going to run. It's also very possible she's not going to have the health to run in 2016.
The 4 words that are the touch of death for politicians: "Doesn't she look tired?"

+geek points if you get where the quote is from.
 
Hilary won't run. She doesn't have the health and that leaves the Democrats without an obvious choice to run. I think 2016 is going to be an interesting election... neither side has someone to push yet (unless Chris Christie runs) and they need to start doing it withing the next 2 years.
At this rate, Christie is going to run as his own party. Not Independent, either. Just a party called Chris Fuckin'-Christie.
 
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