Health care bill stands

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Dave

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On NPR they were interviewing a person who was against the healthcare bill. They were a small business owner and decried the fact that they were going to have to pay more for their employee's coverage. Then when they were asked how much their premiums had gone up in the last year they said 5%...when in years past before the bill the rises were 20-50%.
 
Saying you are going to move to Canada - or any other industrialized "first-world" country - because of the government run health care is just plain stupid. You realize all of those places already have it, right? That's like moving to Mexico because too many people in your neighborhood speak Spanish.
Found this...
 

Necronic

Staff member
It's cool man I looked at my post and I could tell it was confusing.

Also, after reading that paper I linked (well, skimming it, its 70 pages long), I am TOTALLY going to move to Canada. There's like ZERO downside....well, I would have to stop makin Canada jokes.
 
There is no way Canada has 45% atheists. Are the counting moose?
The Canadian Ipsos Reid poll released September 12, 2011 entitled "Canadians Split On Whether Religion Does More Harm in the World than Good," sampled 1,129 Canadian adults and came up 30% who do not believe in a god. Interestingly, the same poll found that 33% of respondents who identified themselves as Catholics and 28% Protestants said they didn't believe in a god.
 
I understand that. A lot of religion is a culture. I don't know what my views on God will necessarily be my whole life, but I can't imagine not considering myself Jewish.
 
Oh yeah, and while that first chart is ALL SPENDING per capita, we ALSO SPEND MORE PUBLIC MONEY on healthcare per capita than most socialist countries.

HOW IS THIS TRUE?

HOW DO WE SPEND MORE PUBLIC FUNDS ON HEALTHCARE PER CAPITA THAN UNIVERSAL HEALTHCARE SYSTEMS?

HOW?

This is why I want to move to Canada (whose per capita public funding of healthcare is ~60% of what america's is per capita), meaning that if we were to, overnight, switch to their system (identically, obviously a thought experiment), OUR TAXES WOULD GO DOWN.

It may seem like a tautology for many americans, but not everything the government does, it does badly. The free market model isn't copy-paste-able in every situation. There's a combination of several factors at work.
For example, national obligatory official IDs mean the government actually knows who lives where and how many of every group there are. National census data in Europe are about 10x more accurate than in the US. This also means preventive campaigns are more useful - the belgian government can send a mail or a letter to every woman between 45 and 55 with no trouble at all; in the US, that's an invasion of privacy. Crap like that.
Also, the acceptance of more government meddling means more obligatory prevention. If I don't go to the dentist's ofice once every 18 months, they don't pay me when I go there for caveties or whatever later on. As long as I *do* go in for a check-up, it's basically free (somewhere around $10 after rebate :p). Same for optician. Starting at a certain age, same for colon inspection/mammography. Same for a host of other things. Early capture -> lower risk -> lower costs and more effectiveness.
Also, maximum tariffs for many "standard" procedures, means doctors can't just fleece their patients/insurance companies/... In the US, there's littel to no reason for a doctor to ask less money than more.
 
Saying you are going to move to Canada - or any other industrialized "first-world" country - because of the government run health care is just plain stupid. You realize all of those places already have it, right? That's like moving to Mexico because too many people in your neighborhood speak Spanish.
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--Patrick (& Kris)
 
You know what pisses me off more than anything else?
graphs
HOW IS THIS TRUE?

HOW ARE WE SPENDING MORE BUT GETTING NO IMPROVEMENTS?
ARE YOU A COMMUNIST OR WHAT???

(I'm sure you already know, but the common hypotheses (which makes a lot of sense, maybe it's even fact, I don't know) is that prevention drives the costs down for the same survival rate.)

Every contry has their philias and phobias, and you have this big socialismphobia which drags you down a lot, really (in the sense that the population will allow political solutions that are less efficient and involve more government meddling as long as they don't seem SOCIALISM).
 
Every contry [sic] has their philias and phobias, and you have this big socialismphobia which drags you down a lot
Dude, don't even get (most of) us started on this whole you're-either-a-patriot-or-you-hate-America thing that got (re)started a decade or so ago.

--Patrick
 
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