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As usual, the Troll makes the most sense. And this is why actually debating the issue is useless and it will all end in :waah:, I tell you!A Troll said:
Right, but there's still a disconnect.Hoboninja said:
Where you find an analogy, others think you're just dramatizing. You won't get people to see eye-to-eye with you regarding fetus removal no matter how hard you try.
Z
zero
But he has a point. To place the debate as something between "pro-choice" and "anti-choice" fields is as intellectually dishonest as the "pro-life" versus "anti-life" labeling. (Perhaps even more, as many on the "pro-choice" field try to claim the moral high ground, claiming that "pro-life" is deliberately misleading, while being guilty of the same faults).
Just say it guys, I'm pro/against criminalization of forceful abortion. A few more worlds, but that's the price of honesty, right?
Just say it guys, I'm pro/against criminalization of forceful abortion. A few more worlds, but that's the price of honesty, right?
The point is the argument is... pointless if it's about pure right/wrong since one side views it as murder and loss of life and one doesn't. That's a gap to huge, to fundamental to allow for much moderation on. So arguing it, unless you can change someone mind on this issue is... pointless. We won't get anywhere but angry.
Z
zero
Actually, I see how the "forceful" can be seeing as carrying a negative connotation (heh, as if the "abortion" wasn't enough). Let's say... criminalization of induced abortion.zero said:
That is beyond a doubt true. In my case it's a more or less semantic issue that has caused one "pro-lifer" -- insert your preferred term inside the quotes -- to get rather personal with me, so I would prefer not to get more specific. I did just want to agree with zero's point though.zero said:
EDIT: redacted, came out sounding way more aggressive than I feel or am trying to convey
Boredboredboredbored.Everyone said:
I'm disappointed in you people. Sure, it's gotten a little warm at some points, but for the most part you've all been way to reasonable. I demand more vitriol! More anger! Dammit, the people who disagree with you are subhuman mutants bent on destroying your way of life!
I'm not going to happy until somehere here begins to foam at the mouth over this subject. You guys make my job waaaaaaay too hard around here. Dicks.
:sadness:A Troll said:
I'm sorry.
If it would make you feel better, you can go fuck yourself.
gotta pump out more blood from this thread.Good gracious, everyone.Espy said:
I
Iaculus
SAY IT AGAIN!
That's true for any and all moral debates. Abortion, divorce, embryonic stem cells, euthanasia, welfare, you name it. Heck, it can be extrapolated to almost any political discussion, as well.Espy said:
Obviously both extreme positions are flawed. Hey, I'd even say that, in this particular discussion, the extreme I stand farthest from - "anti-choice" or whatever - is the lesser evil of the two extremes. Rather "no abortion never at all even if it causes the death of the mother and the infant after forceful rape of a mentally retarded 10-year-old" than "abortion as a handy and convenient method of birth control that's cheaper and easier than the pill".
Doesn't mean I'm not all in favour of choice, or that we can't have a civil, interesting, discussion about it.
Or, you know, help the troll to have some fun.
Z
zero
No Troll...A Troll said:
YOU DISAPPOINT ME.
It is YOUR job to keep this conversation as less civil as possible, and let's face it... that's a fucking ABORTION thread! If you can't get THAT to derail, then what kind of troll are you?
Z
zero
agh...
Now, there, there big boy, why the long (and hairy) face?
You ARE a good troll, it just that you got a little overconfident here... I know, I know, abortion thread, easy target, but come on! You tried to troll BOTH fields at once! And didn't EVEN bothered to reply to a post to start with... I've seen you trolling, I know you can do much better.
You got better when replying to HoboNinja... picked a side, picked an hyperbolic post, added a bit of insult (perhaps a little mild... "HORRIBLE analogy"...), but I guess the moment had already passed by then.
Don't worry, I'm sure you'll do much better on next threads... I'll try to make a "OMG, OBAMA IS A MUSLIM" post one of this days...
Now, there, there big boy, why the long (and hairy) face?
You ARE a good troll, it just that you got a little overconfident here... I know, I know, abortion thread, easy target, but come on! You tried to troll BOTH fields at once! And didn't EVEN bothered to reply to a post to start with... I've seen you trolling, I know you can do much better.
You got better when replying to HoboNinja... picked a side, picked an hyperbolic post, added a bit of insult (perhaps a little mild... "HORRIBLE analogy"...), but I guess the moment had already passed by then.
Don't worry, I'm sure you'll do much better on next threads... I'll try to make a "OMG, OBAMA IS A MUSLIM" post one of this days...
M
Matt²
abortion is murder, plain and simple. It prevents a human life from being born.
MURDER.
MURDER.
I
Iaculus
Going by your logic, woudn't condoms and bill control pills also be murder?[/quote:fho1plpa]A Troll said:
:shock:
So it's true - every tax return you fill, another Inland revenue guy gets his suit.
Every sperm is sacred. You heathen.Calleja said:
I shall now exercise my pope powers to send a group of Spaniards to inquisite you. Bet you didn't expect that.
C
Chibibar
I am pro-choice (in case people haven't figure out) the two sisters I had before (since most of you won't know them) were forcefully taken advantage of, but even if their health wasn't at stake, would it be punishment to the mother as well?
Here is something that is weird (well if we remove the moral aspect)
If a woman was raped, abortion is ok.
If a woman's health was in danger (i.e. the mother can die from having a baby), abortion is ok
If a woman involved in incest, abortion is ok.
So..... abortion is "ok" with most people (well that is general term really) if the condition fits above. But isn't abortion itself (the act) is killing the fetus.
How is that different (the killing) if the woman just can't take care of the future child and have abortion?
Here is something that is weird (well if we remove the moral aspect)
If a woman was raped, abortion is ok.
If a woman's health was in danger (i.e. the mother can die from having a baby), abortion is ok
If a woman involved in incest, abortion is ok.
So..... abortion is "ok" with most people (well that is general term really) if the condition fits above. But isn't abortion itself (the act) is killing the fetus.
How is that different (the killing) if the woman just can't take care of the future child and have abortion?
S
SeraRelm
No you don't. You allude to your question in an attempt to inspire a search for said question, but you don't pose it.ElJuski said:
I find your claim both false and instigative.
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