Kirk Cameron on Darwin

[Chazwozel]

You know, while I agree that people shouldn't have blind faith in science, on a realistic level, what choice do most people have? Even the scientifically literate layperson can have a hard time slogging through some science papers. What hope beyond blind faith does the average schmoe have? It's easy to say the research and proofs are out there and available, but without the tools to be able to decipher and critically analzye such papers, they may as well be the Voynich manuscript.

Well... you don't exactly need to know the breakdown of a car engine to trust the mechanic when he tells you that you need a new head gasket. Scientists are sort of similar in that retrospect.[/quote]

So, you're basically saying that you have to have faith that the mechanic is telling you the truth.
-edited for snark-[/QUOTE]


It's either that or learn how to replace a head gasket...

 

[ZenMonkey]

However, when you go from "preaching and taking a bit of my time" to "abuse books/science", "intimidate people", "hurt people" or "kill people", you're overdoing the whole "ends justify the means" thing.

I'm not defending them one bit, I'm saying that I think it's really sad they are coming at it from this direction. It's sneaky, underhanded and thats just the tip of the iceberg.
See, I'm saying they don't NEED to do this. If they want to show God's love to people, do it. Don't be sneaky about it.

Yeah, I think we're in agreement here.

Any person or group who comes at you with a lie right off the bat should be dismissed without a second thought, unless that second thought is pure intellectual curiosity. Meaning that even if you were, say, leaning towards becoming a Christian, I would desperately hope you wouldn't do it through swallowing Kirk Cameron's runny bullshit.

Also, Chaz, I like your analogy here. To some extent, I am responsible for learning the basic care of my car and understanding how and why it runs, but there's a point where you turn it over to the mechanic. You do understand that there's a mechanism at work, however, and that there is a human person who understands it better than you and it's okay to let that person work on it. It's not just blind faith. You educate yourself first.

 

[AshburnerX]

Wow... I'm late to the part but just wow it's almost as bad as that movie the Id'ers put forward a while ago name "no intelligience allowed" starring Ben Stein

I think anyone wanting to consolidate evolution and religion should check out David Sloan Wilsons "Darwins Cathedral" or "Evolution For Everyone" amazing books that made me hungry to learn more.

You know... for a smart guy, Ben Stein does an awful lot of really stupid things.

 

[North_Ranger]

That's what good popular science is for. Again, I bring up Stephen J. Gould because there's just no better introduction for the layperson into the application of evolutionary theory, but there are plenty of awesome popular science writers like Jared Diamond and Michael Shermer. They make you want to read more about the actual science behind what they talk about, or at least that was my experience.

And Espy, I still have to disagree with you about the "good motive." Their motive isn't "let's get people on our side," it's "let's trick people who want to think critically into believing what we do." That is not a good motive. That is carnival shystering, both in motive and in method.

We aren't actually disagree on whether or not their motive is good then. We are disagree on their motive. I say their motive is less insidious than you, but their actions are the trickery.

In the end though, it amounts to the same so we can just agree that if you see them give 'em a kick in the nuts from Espy and ZenMonkey.[/QUOTE]

Oy, watch it, you bed-breaking nicotine addict toddler! I promoted the idea of kinetic force to the genitalia first in this thread.

 

[Math242]

he should shut up

 

[Covar]

Trust a Mechanic? :bush:

 

[Covar]

My mechanic told me my flux capacitor is out of whack...

heh, that reminds me of when I was in AIT, we got one of our fellow students to ask the instructor where the Flux Capaciter was on the LMTV. Made even more funny when he told her not to worry about it since the LMTV's can't get up to 88mph.

 

[sixpackshaker]

You know... for a smart guy, Ben Stein does an awful lot of really stupid things.

Well, he got his start working for Nixon. It is pretty much up hill from there.

 

[ZenMonkey]

You know... for a smart guy, Ben Stein does an awful lot of really stupid things.

Yeah, when did he go totally fucknuts, with "Expelled" and shilling that totally shady credit report site? I used to respect him a lot and now he's just this sad, deluded old man.

 

[Chazwozel]

You know... for a smart guy, Ben Stein does an awful lot of really stupid things.

Yeah, when did he go totally fucknuts, with "Expelled" and shilling that totally shady credit report site? I used to respect him a lot and now he's just this sad, deluded old man.[/QUOTE]

He came to my university in 2003 when I was a junior to host a forum. Man oh man, what a load of bullshit that was.


Still got his autograph though.

"For Matt, Be cool & stay in school." - Ben Stein

Jackass.