Cloned fetuses subject to stem-cell research.
Rape Victim? Is because you dressed ungodly
- Thread starter Green_Lantern
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I
Iaculus
At gunpoint.
I didn't read the article, but reading (yesterday, I think) the title of this thread made me think how much of these kinds of ideas are trying to say rapists are innocents and how much really mean to scare parents and young girls so they don't dress up in certain ways? That is: Do the people that generate these messages really believe in them, or they are telling bogeyman stories to have people do certain things?
Green_Lantern
Staff member
I think the article itself explain this issue, blaming the victim is a way to deal with the fear of rape, essencially the thinking goes like this "The rape happened because of this. If I do this and don't do that I am safe", since this is a much happier though than "I can't really do much to avoid a rape attack" people prefer to think the former.
Of course, there is the... people, who do use these things to justify other points of views.
S
Steven Soderburgin
I'm tempted to make a big post about the rape culture and how the ideas in the pamphlet fit into a larger culture which attempts to minimize the horrors of rape in subtle and insidious ways but I'm not sure how well that would go over.
For what it's worth, I would be interested in that discussion.
For what it's worth, I would be interested in that discussion.[/QUOTE]
As would I, but as has been made clear in the homosexuality thread, I am a giant nerd.
For what it's worth, I would be interested in that discussion.[/QUOTE]
As would I, but as has been made clear in the homosexuality thread, I am a giant nerd.[/QUOTE]
You have my axe!
Hehe, sorry.
I'd be interested in reading such an article as well.
C
Chazwozel
I think the article itself explain this issue, blaming the victim is a way to deal with the fear of rape, essencially the thinking goes like this "The rape happened because of this. If I do this and don't do that I am safe", since this is a much happier though than "I can't really do much to avoid a rape attack" people prefer to think the former.
Of course, there is the... people, who do use these things to justify other points of views.[/QUOTE]
Funny enough, that's pretty much how religion deals with all issues that are completely out of a person's control.
Green_Lantern
Staff member
Really? I am shocked! SHOCKED I tell you.
S
Steven Soderburgin
Okay, so I'm going to post a couple things about rape culture, including some recent examples of what it looks like. It's a term that has been circulating in feminism for a while now.
Here is a definition from the book "Transforming a Rape Culture"
Another example from Washington City Paper's "The Sexist" blog, regarding the reaction Hofstra University student who accused 5 men of tying her up and gang-raping her, and then recanting her accusation, admitting that she had consented:
In an example that is relevant to some recent events, last summer, a woman accused football player Ben Roethlisberger of raping her at a Lake Tahoe resort. Now, the case was dropped due to an affidavit from a woman who knew the alleged victim in which she swore that the woman was not traumatized or unhappy about the incident, and no claims of rape were heard when she spoke of it until she filed the lawsuit.
That's not the important part. What's important is that ESPN employees were told not to cover the story
Another example: the recent report that the Washington, D.C. police department refused to provide a rape kit to a woman who was too drunk/drugged to remember what happened, and because she did not know the last name of the person she suspected, despite being in severe physical pain and missing her panty liner. Her suspicion that she was raped was not taken seriously, and as a result, she will never know if she was raped and if she was, she will never see her day in court.
It's important to note that being blackout drunk does not excuse rape. Rape is still rape even if a person is blacked out. In most states, a person who is intoxicated cannot give legal consent for sex.
There are many, many other examples and lots of other issues that are part of this. I haven't even touched on things like the vast under-reporting of female-to-male rape, of the way prison rape is perceived and talked about in our society, etc. It's a large idea.
It's also important to note that many prominent feminist figures disagree with the notion of a rape culture, arguing that rape is one part of a much larger and much more entrenched culture of violence, particularly violence against women.
So, uh, yeah, that's my big post. Hopefully, this gives folks plenty to chew on.
Here is a definition from the book "Transforming a Rape Culture"
So what does that mean? The pamphlet that this thread is originally about is a good example: women should not be sexual, should not desire sex, and should hide and be ashamed of their sexuality because if they don't, then men will not be able to control themselves. This victim blaming is a part of the rape culture, because there are many people who entertain the thought that women who are raped are responsible for it because they either dressed immodestly, or they were drinking, or they have had sex with their rapist before. The rapist is just a man who couldn't control himself, so he is excused while the woman is demonized for bringing this horror upon herself.
Another example from Washington City Paper's "The Sexist" blog, regarding the reaction Hofstra University student who accused 5 men of tying her up and gang-raping her, and then recanting her accusation, admitting that she had consented:
Here is one reaction to that incident from Men's News Daily:
Notice that not only does he shame her for lying about being raped - which is fine, because she should never have done that - but he also shames her for consenting to have sex with these five men in the first place. In comments posted on blogs and news editorials, she is not characterized as a liar, but rather as a whore. The five men aren't shamed at all. Why? Because it's okay for men to have sexual encounters with 5 other people but not for women?
In an example that is relevant to some recent events, last summer, a woman accused football player Ben Roethlisberger of raping her at a Lake Tahoe resort. Now, the case was dropped due to an affidavit from a woman who knew the alleged victim in which she swore that the woman was not traumatized or unhappy about the incident, and no claims of rape were heard when she spoke of it until she filed the lawsuit.
That's not the important part. What's important is that ESPN employees were told not to cover the story
No matter their reasons for not covering the story (a decision that was later reversed), the fact that they chose not to cover it despite it being a rather important story about a prominent sports figure is disturbing. It's clear that ESPN was perfectly willing to minimize and suppress reporting that a major sports figure had allegedly raped a woman. One could infer that they were excusing the alleged behavior - a rape of a young woman - because he is a big enough star.
Another example: the recent report that the Washington, D.C. police department refused to provide a rape kit to a woman who was too drunk/drugged to remember what happened, and because she did not know the last name of the person she suspected, despite being in severe physical pain and missing her panty liner. Her suspicion that she was raped was not taken seriously, and as a result, she will never know if she was raped and if she was, she will never see her day in court.
It's important to note that being blackout drunk does not excuse rape. Rape is still rape even if a person is blacked out. In most states, a person who is intoxicated cannot give legal consent for sex.
There are many, many other examples and lots of other issues that are part of this. I haven't even touched on things like the vast under-reporting of female-to-male rape, of the way prison rape is perceived and talked about in our society, etc. It's a large idea.
It's also important to note that many prominent feminist figures disagree with the notion of a rape culture, arguing that rape is one part of a much larger and much more entrenched culture of violence, particularly violence against women.
So, uh, yeah, that's my big post. Hopefully, this gives folks plenty to chew on.
This reminds me of a fight I had with a friend a few years back. I was dating a girl in college, and she volunteered to become a Rape Prevention Counselor at her school. Basically they trained students to give workshops about respecting women's rights, how to avoid dangerous situations ("don't let strangers make your drinks," and so on), and informed women of various services and support that they might need.
Anyway, my buddy asks what she's been up to. I tell him that my girlfriend gives workshops as a Rape Prevention Counselor. Before I can explain, he cuts me off by saying "So, she teaches women how to dress properly? Or tells sluts how to keep their legs closed?" I just stood there with my jaw dropped. I immediately told him to go fuck himself and threatened to beat his ass, and he backed off. That was the first time I really realized some people, even those who may seem otherwise open-minded and intelligent, have some really fucked up ideas about sex and rape.
Anyway, my buddy asks what she's been up to. I tell him that my girlfriend gives workshops as a Rape Prevention Counselor. Before I can explain, he cuts me off by saying "So, she teaches women how to dress properly? Or tells sluts how to keep their legs closed?" I just stood there with my jaw dropped. I immediately told him to go fuck himself and threatened to beat his ass, and he backed off. That was the first time I really realized some people, even those who may seem otherwise open-minded and intelligent, have some really fucked up ideas about sex and rape.
I think the article itself explain this issue, blaming the victim is a way to deal with the fear of rape, essencially the thinking goes like this "The rape happened because of this. If I do this and don't do that I am safe", since this is a much happier though than "I can't really do much to avoid a rape attack" people prefer to think the former.
Of course, there is the... people, who do use these things to justify other points of views.[/QUOTE]
Funny enough, that's pretty much how religion deals with all issues that are completely out of a person's control.[/QUOTE]
This is one of the aspects of religiuon that I always thought were bullshit. But, of course, there's plenty of people who generate these kinds of messages inside the catholic church, for example that do really believe in them. and people who use them to manipulate others into doing what they think is right, even if they don't actually believe what they are saying.
And people who don't believe those ideas and use them for personal objectives.
This kind of distinctions are one topic I always like to reflect upon, even if it's very hard to get to some satisfying answer.
C
Chazwozel
I think the article itself explain this issue, blaming the victim is a way to deal with the fear of rape, essencially the thinking goes like this "The rape happened because of this. If I do this and don't do that I am safe", since this is a much happier though than "I can't really do much to avoid a rape attack" people prefer to think the former.
Of course, there is the... people, who do use these things to justify other points of views.[/QUOTE]
Funny enough, that's pretty much how religion deals with all issues that are completely out of a person's control.[/QUOTE]
This is one of the aspects of religiuon that I always thought were bullshit. But, of course, there's plenty of people who generate these kinds of messages inside the catholic church, for example that do really believe in them. and people who use them to manipulate others into doing what they think is right, even if they don't actually believe what they are saying.
And people who don't believe those ideas and use them for personal objectives.
This kind of distinctions are one topic I always like to reflect upon, even if it's very hard to get to some satisfying answer.[/QUOTE]
Most religions are pretty much there as a way for human beings to cope with the ultimate things that are out of our control: fate and death.
---------- Post added at 10:38 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:38 AM ----------
No you didn't.
No you didn't.[/QUOTE]
I believe the exact phrase was "Go fuck yourself. You say shit like that one more time I will beat your ass."
But hey, since you were there why don't you tell me what I actually said. Go right ahead.
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