[Rant] The hardest thing to explain to ESL/EFL students.

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J

JCM

GasBandit said:
At this point, I think we continue to use it merely because our cultural dominance coupled with a strange measurement system continues to irritate the rest of the world :troll:
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True story.

No matter whatever system a country uses, TVs and Monitors will always be sold according to inches.
 
tegid

tegid

I came in here not knowing that ESL means English as a Second Language and expecting something related to Sign Language instead. Still, I wasn't disappointed because SO FU**ING TRUE.

Re: Changing vs not changing units, in some cases the change IS necessary. Nasa, for instance, collaborates with scientists from all over the world, and the conversions can be a problem. You don't do science or advanced technology in imperial, come on.[DOUBLEPOST=1353917063][/DOUBLEPOST]
blotsfan said:
Considering people interact with 0 mph a lot more than they interact with Absolute 0, I don't get your point.
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We're talking about Celsius, where 0 is the freezing point of water, not Kelvin where 0 is Absolute 0, so I don't get YOUR point.
 
Ravenpoe

Ravenpoe

tegid said:
I came in here not knowing that ESL means English as a Second Language and expecting something related to Sign Language instead. Still, I wasn't disappointed because SO FU**ING TRUE.

Re: Changing vs not changing units, in some cases the change IS necessary. Nasa, for instance, collaborates with scientists from all over the world, and the conversions can be a problem. You don't do science or advanced technology in imperial, come on.[DOUBLEPOST=1353917063][/DOUBLEPOST]

We're talking about Celsius, where 0 is the freezing point of water, not Kelvin where 0 is Absolute 0, so I don't get YOUR point.
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Science in America always uses the metric system. It's the everyday stuff that's done in imperial.
 
Azurephoenix

Azurephoenix

I do structural steel and concrete design at my job.

Imperial jobs are a GOD DAMN NIGHTMARE. Converting stuff back and forth between Metric and Imperial equivalents, trying to compile Imperial and Metric maps together, fighting with suppliers over hard to find Imperial doohickeys. Worse yet is trying to do gas plant upgrades on old Imperial facilities with new Metric drawings.... ARGH!

Metric jobs are so easy it's not even funny.
 
strawman

strawman

Until the SI comes up with shoe sizes, clothing sizes, and bra sizes that work worldwide, I don't think we need to worry about whether the imperial system is worth replacing.
 
fade

fade

Staff member
I still say I'll use SI for everything but temperature. For one, I've got a mental map to what the F scale feels like, and it would be difficult to replace that scale. And second, there's really nothing less arbitrary about C than F. Alcohol or water, take your pick. I mean, you could make all kinds of subjective arguments for both. C because we deal with water everyday, so tacking the endpoints to water's boiling and freezing makes sense. F because 100 is a number everyone psychologically identifies as large, and 100 is pretty hot to a human. To be clear, I don't think F is "better" than C. They're both arbitrary.
 
strawman

strawman

fade said:
They're both arbitrary.
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All measurement systems are arbitrary. The advantages SI has over most other systems, specifically imperial, are

- they follow the SI prefix system
- they are (arbitrarily) related to each other in "reasonable" ways


The imperial system has a few advantages of its own though:

- Most measurements are human scale, or readily converted into human scale (the only thing SI has that is human scale is the meter - about one arm's span, whereas you can find an approximate foot, yard, and inch on the human body)
- Measurements include factors other than 2 and 5, which most of the time makes it easier to divide a measurement into equal parts easily without decimal points
 
sixpackshaker

sixpackshaker

I was of the generation that tried to switch to the metric system in the mid 70's in grade school. So I am completely confused, because the metric system did not catch on, and they did not do as good of a job teaching us the imperial system.
 
Jax

Jax

fade said:
I still say I'll use SI for everything but temperature. For one, I've got a mental map to what the F scale feels like, and it would be difficult to replace that scale. And second, there's really nothing less arbitrary about C than F. Alcohol or water, take your pick. I mean, you could make all kinds of subjective arguments for both. C because we deal with water everyday, so tacking the endpoints to water's boiling and freezing makes sense. F because 100 is a number everyone psychologically identifies as large, and 100 is pretty hot to a human. To be clear, I don't think F is "better" than C. They're both arbitrary.
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I have no idea how F works, and so I don't have any idea what it is based on. Can anyone explain (very briefly) how F came to exist? So far I've only seen the posts that people feel it's hot at 100F...
 
sixpackshaker

sixpackshaker

Jax said:
I have no idea how F works, and so I don't have any idea what it is based on. Can anyone explain (very briefly) how F came to exist? So far I've only seen the posts that people feel it's hot at 100F...
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teh wiki said:
According to an article Fahrenheit wrote in 1724, he based his scale on three reference points of temperature.[7] In his initial scale (which is not the final Fahrenheit scale), the zero point is determined by placing the thermometer in brine: he used a mixture of ice, water, and ammonium chloride, a salt, at a 1:1:1 ratio. This is a frigorific mixture which stabilizes its temperature automatically: that stable temperature was defined as 0 °F (−17.78 °C). The second point, at 32 degrees, was a mixture of ice and water without the ammonium chloride at a 1:1 ratio. The third point, 96 degrees, was approximately the human body temperature, then called "blood-heat"
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Neon Pirate

Neon Pirate

Officer_Charon said:
Shhh.... no, it's PERFECTLY okay to drive 100mph... or 160.9344 kph, if you prefer
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sixpackshaker said:
Because I'd rather face a hit to my insurance than lose my job because I'd do some time for not stopping.

And my car isn't really that fast...
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My last one was. Didn't really worry about patrol cars, the pursuit vehicle didn't stand much of a chance. My concern was their radio and friends. Sadly, a gigantic Silverado (huge pickup for those unfamiliar) crushed my precious M3 into a bridge. The bridge and the truck won. My Jeep won't take me that fast, though if I need to get away (rare that I get into anything fun enough to require that kind of dramatic exit anymore) it will take me through places that patrol cars can't get to (or back out of). Did get to test drive a brand new M5 that a friend just bought and believe me 100MPH was not fast. In that car 100 was barely getting started. I did go fast in it. Perfectly, unflinchingly level and smooth while pulling a u turn at 100 MPH. Damn I wish I could afford one of those! Fortunate enough to get to drive it though. Was drooling over it, no idea it was his, when he handed me the keys to the new M5 and said if that if I did anything to it be sure it comes back totaled because he didn't want a Carfax history on it. Damn I miss going that fast!

OC...thanks for converting that to metric!

Shaker you do realize that the Officer was kind enough to give you a permission slip? Print. Keep copies in all vehicles.
 
fade

fade

Staff member
stienman said:
All measurement systems are arbitrary. The advantages SI has over most other systems, specifically imperial, are

- they follow the SI prefix system
- they are (arbitrarily) related to each other in "reasonable" ways


The imperial system has a few advantages of its own though:

- Most measurements are human scale, or readily converted into human scale (the only thing SI has that is human scale is the meter - about one arm's span, whereas you can find an approximate foot, yard, and inch on the human body)
- Measurements include factors other than 2 and 5, which most of the time makes it easier to divide a measurement into equal parts easily without decimal points
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To be clear, I was specifically talking about the temperature scales.
 
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