Anyone who argues against these points is just flat out willfully ignorant and, as I said, a part of the problem.
[News] The USA Police State will never satisfy its lust for beating, gassing, and imprisoning minorities
- Thread starter Charlie Don't Surf
- Start date
GasBandit
Staff member
You didn't answer the question. I answered yours, "When have the police ever been helpful," now answer mine - are you saying that you think society would be better off with no police?
Only a Sith deals in absolutes...
My wife had a car keel over on her in the middle of no-whereville Texas and a policeman was able to radio in to get her help. My mother had a flat in Dallas and two policemen changed the tire for her. I have a friend that is a cop, he takes meals to some shut ins 2 days a week on his lunch break.
Am I part of the problem?
Stealing children's shoes?! For fuck's sake
When the so called good cops start taking down the bad cops, then I will be all ears. Until then, I will continue to fear the police. Would we be better off without police? No, that's insane, but we need serious reforms and not just lip service. The punishment for some of these crimes committed against innocent civilians, under color of law, is death. In many cases, they deserve exactly that. But nobody ever does jack shit about the largest organized crime ''family'' on Earth, the police.
Here is my question to police apologists. Have you ever been yanked from your vehicle while parked in the driveway/parking lot of your place of business and had a 300 lb police officer throw you on the ground and stand on you for 15 minutes or so because you ''fit the description?'' The description was 3 armed black men... I'm not black and I am just one guy. Also, not armed. Additionally, they were looking for a red nissan pickup that was stolen from the driveway/parking lot of my place of business, where about 14 other red nissan pickups were parked, all 1995 models with chrome bumpers and trim, since that was the model our delivery service used.
So, I was parked in the exact same spot that the vehicle was stolen from, literally the exact spot, about 4 hours after the incident occurred (just got to work, 8am) in a parking lot filled with the exact same model truck. How anyone can imagine that someone would steal a vehicle and then just hang out for a few hours at the scene of the crime is... You know what? I don't have the words. You gotta be fucking kidding me with this shit.
I don't care what the law says, I don't care about your pointless rebuttal, I don't care about the endless excuses from police supporters and I certainly don't want to hear about how I had to have done SOMETHING to deserve this treatment. Nobody should ever have to go through that, not ever. Not me, not you, not anyone. And they never even charged me, that was just a brief incident, but it was horrible, I was in agonizing pain and there was absolutely nothing I could do about it. I was 100% a victim, a new sensation for me. So, yeah, after a few incidents like this (I spent about 20 years driving for a living, I have seen some asshole cops, believe me) I have a hard time believing that there are all these ''good cops'' running around.
In case you wanted to verify this incident, you can check the Hillsborough county police records or whatever, the truck was stolen from employee Keith Craft while working for Gem Foods Inc at 202 N. Rome in Tampa, FL this was about 1994 or so. Hope that helps verify all the lies that I'm telling, because surely this didn't really happen to an innocent civilian minding his own business, no way, nuh-uh.
One more thing: I have to admit that Florida is notorious for not only insane cops but insane people in general and once I moved away I never had another problem like that, so take all that shit with a grain of salt, but it doesn't change the fact that these people are terrorizing innocents on a daily basis and that is just plain wrong.
Ok, Continue making excuses now.
Here is my question to police apologists. Have you ever been yanked from your vehicle while parked in the driveway/parking lot of your place of business and had a 300 lb police officer throw you on the ground and stand on you for 15 minutes or so because you ''fit the description?'' The description was 3 armed black men... I'm not black and I am just one guy. Also, not armed. Additionally, they were looking for a red nissan pickup that was stolen from the driveway/parking lot of my place of business, where about 14 other red nissan pickups were parked, all 1995 models with chrome bumpers and trim, since that was the model our delivery service used.
So, I was parked in the exact same spot that the vehicle was stolen from, literally the exact spot, about 4 hours after the incident occurred (just got to work, 8am) in a parking lot filled with the exact same model truck. How anyone can imagine that someone would steal a vehicle and then just hang out for a few hours at the scene of the crime is... You know what? I don't have the words. You gotta be fucking kidding me with this shit.
I don't care what the law says, I don't care about your pointless rebuttal, I don't care about the endless excuses from police supporters and I certainly don't want to hear about how I had to have done SOMETHING to deserve this treatment. Nobody should ever have to go through that, not ever. Not me, not you, not anyone. And they never even charged me, that was just a brief incident, but it was horrible, I was in agonizing pain and there was absolutely nothing I could do about it. I was 100% a victim, a new sensation for me. So, yeah, after a few incidents like this (I spent about 20 years driving for a living, I have seen some asshole cops, believe me) I have a hard time believing that there are all these ''good cops'' running around.
In case you wanted to verify this incident, you can check the Hillsborough county police records or whatever, the truck was stolen from employee Keith Craft while working for Gem Foods Inc at 202 N. Rome in Tampa, FL this was about 1994 or so. Hope that helps verify all the lies that I'm telling, because surely this didn't really happen to an innocent civilian minding his own business, no way, nuh-uh.
One more thing: I have to admit that Florida is notorious for not only insane cops but insane people in general and once I moved away I never had another problem like that, so take all that shit with a grain of salt, but it doesn't change the fact that these people are terrorizing innocents on a daily basis and that is just plain wrong.
Ok, Continue making excuses now.
I think maybe you're having a different conversation somewhere, and your text is shifting through a wormhole and somehow ending up on this forum, because literally no one is saying any of that.
This thread is about bad things happening to minorities in the news, not ancient history.
I am thinking that the PTSD from your specific anecdote is coloring your opinions of law enforcement.
I am not saying that I think what happened to you is acceptable, but I do think that your abduction*/extrapolation of how "the majority" of law enforcement views their responsibilities may have been influenced by your experience.
--Patrick
*not like "kidnapping," but like "deduction," only in reverse.
GasBandit
Staff member
The term, you philistine, is "shitlord."
Saying "all cops are evil because I've been harassed/attacked/maltreated by some" is exactly as valid as saying "all black men are evil because I've been robbed/attacked/maltreated by some". It's literally the exact same thing.
There are most assuredly bad cops around. They definitely need more oversight and a good weeding out of bad elements.
There are lots of ways in which the (US) police force (not saying it doesn't happen elsewhere, but there are huge differences in the sort of problems with police in Mexico vs the USA vs some parts of Europe - just different, not necessarily better or worse, not this discussion) misbehaves and could do better. Saying we'd be better off without them is nuts.
And yes, I remember MisterSteve too - the only guy ever capable of making LeQuack seem reasonable about the police
There are most assuredly bad cops around. They definitely need more oversight and a good weeding out of bad elements.
There are lots of ways in which the (US) police force (not saying it doesn't happen elsewhere, but there are huge differences in the sort of problems with police in Mexico vs the USA vs some parts of Europe - just different, not necessarily better or worse, not this discussion) misbehaves and could do better. Saying we'd be better off without them is nuts.
And yes, I remember MisterSteve too - the only guy ever capable of making LeQuack seem reasonable about the police
Oh. Well, if you say so, I'll have to change my stance and agree.
I think you're all missing the point completely.
Nobody, not anybody on this planet, should be able to hurt you, physically hurt you, even in the relatively minor way they hurt me ( it really was pretty minor compared to the OMGWTF kind of things I have seen on YouTube ) with impunity. You cannot lay your hands on people without just cause and not have to answer to anyone for it. The police are literally above the law and it literally requires the hand of God to bring them to justice. In Iceland the police killed their first person ever and they held a national day of mourning. In China, when the police kill unarmed innocent civilians, they are put to death. That seems fair to me. No other developed nation's police force kills ONE THOUSAND PEOPLE ANNUALLY. No other nation on Earth, at any point in the entire history of mankind, has had the incarceration rate of the United States, currently hovering around 25% of the entire world's prison population. Not even the Siberian Gulag has ever had that rate of incarceration. Even Obama, possibly the most useless piece of trash to ever hold the office (and that is really saying something, considering his predecessors over the years) has come out against the insane prison incentivization scheme in this country.
But people keep making excuses, since they apparently can't use Google to conduct this type of research for themselves and find out the truth about the extraordinarily racist and predatory policies of every police department in the land. Or maybe spend a few days watching the thousands (THOUSANDS!!) of police brutality videos on YouTube. I have to admit, I was too much of a pussy to watch for very long, I literally could not stand to see the things they did to these people. I saw one where two fat cops held a guy down while a third fat cop jumped up and down on his chest and I couldn't watch anymore. I saw a video where a high speed chase ended in a crash that ejected the driver of the fleeing vehicle. The police immediately ran to where his unconscious body was lying in the ditch (he looked dead to me) and started beating the shit out of him. I mean they were just wailing on this poor guy after he was thrown from a vehicle doing well above the posted speed limit. The dude was completely motionless, because he just sailed 40 feet through the air and bounced a few times like a rag doll and they just piled on and beat the holy living shit out of his unconscious, unmoving body. What. The. Fuck.
Police brutality videos, don't come back in this thread arguing your pointless bullshit until you watch all 266,000 videos.
So, keep arguing amongst yourselves, since I know from experience that no amount of facts can ever change anybody's mind, ever, ever, ever, and I also know that not only did you not bother to click any of the above links or otherwise conduct any actual research of your own, I bet you never even entertained the idea that you might actually be wrong about any of the information being disseminated here in this thread. Yes, I am aware that all this debate is pointless, because just like politics, religion and the Unified Field Theory, everyone has their own biased opinion and that bias sometimes requires decades to overcome. But maybe, just maybe, in a few years, maybe decades, you might come back around to this topic and decide that there might actually be some truth to all this police state nonsense.
Remember, the next innocent person to get shot in the face could be you. Or your mother. Maybe they will just kill your dog, though, and then let you off with a warning.
Don't read this part, it is very boring:
From the ''Owning up to past mistakes'' department....
Here are a few things that I was wrong about and changed my mind later.
I originally believed the MSM narrative that Trayvon Martin was a good boy and wouldn't never hurt nobody and George Zimmerman was a remorseless rampaging killer.
I originally believed the MSM narrative that Michael Brown was a good boy and wouldn't never hurt nobody and Darren Wilson was a remorseless rampaging killer.
I originally believed the MSM narrative that _________ was a good boy and wouldn't never hurt nobody and ____________ was a remorseless rampaging killer.
Fill in the blanks. What can I say, they fooled me a few times with the endless media barrage and I fell for it because, lo and behold, I was clearly biased against the police because of all the times they have harassed me and beat the shit out of me for no reason. But after conducting some in depth research and actually paying attention to the forensic information in these cases, it's not hard to find the truth. In fact, it pretty much leaps out at you. Yeah, sometimes the cops put bullets into actual bad guys that totally had it coming.
So, if I can admit that I was wrong, then so can you. Don't be a pussy, admit to yourself that you might actually be wrong about something, even if you don't admit it out loud to anyone else, and for the love of God, conduct some research of your own. That's why you have the ability to read in the first place.
Nobody, not anybody on this planet, should be able to hurt you, physically hurt you, even in the relatively minor way they hurt me ( it really was pretty minor compared to the OMGWTF kind of things I have seen on YouTube ) with impunity. You cannot lay your hands on people without just cause and not have to answer to anyone for it. The police are literally above the law and it literally requires the hand of God to bring them to justice. In Iceland the police killed their first person ever and they held a national day of mourning. In China, when the police kill unarmed innocent civilians, they are put to death. That seems fair to me. No other developed nation's police force kills ONE THOUSAND PEOPLE ANNUALLY. No other nation on Earth, at any point in the entire history of mankind, has had the incarceration rate of the United States, currently hovering around 25% of the entire world's prison population. Not even the Siberian Gulag has ever had that rate of incarceration. Even Obama, possibly the most useless piece of trash to ever hold the office (and that is really saying something, considering his predecessors over the years) has come out against the insane prison incentivization scheme in this country.
But people keep making excuses, since they apparently can't use Google to conduct this type of research for themselves and find out the truth about the extraordinarily racist and predatory policies of every police department in the land. Or maybe spend a few days watching the thousands (THOUSANDS!!) of police brutality videos on YouTube. I have to admit, I was too much of a pussy to watch for very long, I literally could not stand to see the things they did to these people. I saw one where two fat cops held a guy down while a third fat cop jumped up and down on his chest and I couldn't watch anymore. I saw a video where a high speed chase ended in a crash that ejected the driver of the fleeing vehicle. The police immediately ran to where his unconscious body was lying in the ditch (he looked dead to me) and started beating the shit out of him. I mean they were just wailing on this poor guy after he was thrown from a vehicle doing well above the posted speed limit. The dude was completely motionless, because he just sailed 40 feet through the air and bounced a few times like a rag doll and they just piled on and beat the holy living shit out of his unconscious, unmoving body. What. The. Fuck.
Police brutality videos, don't come back in this thread arguing your pointless bullshit until you watch all 266,000 videos.
Umm, everybody says that, literally everybody, everywhere, all the time. Maybe not in this thread so far, but hey, the night is young. With all the recent revelations about police misconduct, yeah, you hear it less and less, but generally anytime I tell that story, about 80% of the people who hear it call bullshit. Which is part of the problem, because until it happens to you, it didn't happen at all.
So, keep arguing amongst yourselves, since I know from experience that no amount of facts can ever change anybody's mind, ever, ever, ever, and I also know that not only did you not bother to click any of the above links or otherwise conduct any actual research of your own, I bet you never even entertained the idea that you might actually be wrong about any of the information being disseminated here in this thread. Yes, I am aware that all this debate is pointless, because just like politics, religion and the Unified Field Theory, everyone has their own biased opinion and that bias sometimes requires decades to overcome. But maybe, just maybe, in a few years, maybe decades, you might come back around to this topic and decide that there might actually be some truth to all this police state nonsense.
Remember, the next innocent person to get shot in the face could be you. Or your mother. Maybe they will just kill your dog, though, and then let you off with a warning.
You must be a libtard, because pretending people said something completely batshit retarded is a common libtard debate tactic. Right up there with GasBandit foaming at the mouth with his vitriolic nonsense. Nowhere have I said anything like that, please don't let this devolve into the usual ''nuh-uh nuh-uh nuh-uh nuh-uh nuh-uh nuh-uh nuh-uh'' thing that always happens in these forums. We are all adults, or at least pretending to be, leave the strawman out, leave the bullshit out, stick to the facts or just don't bother..
Don't read this part, it is very boring:
From the ''Owning up to past mistakes'' department....
Here are a few things that I was wrong about and changed my mind later.
I originally believed the MSM narrative that Trayvon Martin was a good boy and wouldn't never hurt nobody and George Zimmerman was a remorseless rampaging killer.
I originally believed the MSM narrative that Michael Brown was a good boy and wouldn't never hurt nobody and Darren Wilson was a remorseless rampaging killer.
I originally believed the MSM narrative that _________ was a good boy and wouldn't never hurt nobody and ____________ was a remorseless rampaging killer.
Fill in the blanks. What can I say, they fooled me a few times with the endless media barrage and I fell for it because, lo and behold, I was clearly biased against the police because of all the times they have harassed me and beat the shit out of me for no reason. But after conducting some in depth research and actually paying attention to the forensic information in these cases, it's not hard to find the truth. In fact, it pretty much leaps out at you. Yeah, sometimes the cops put bullets into actual bad guys that totally had it coming.
So, if I can admit that I was wrong, then so can you. Don't be a pussy, admit to yourself that you might actually be wrong about something, even if you don't admit it out loud to anyone else, and for the love of God, conduct some research of your own. That's why you have the ability to read in the first place.
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After re-reading the thread, I found this little nugget. It is perfect and cannot be improved upon in any way.
A literal claim of yours that the "bad cops" are the majority and "good cops" or "good deeds by cops" are rare.
Reply: you haven't watched all 266,000 videos either, so...STFU? Nobody here claims there's no such thing as police brutality.
Reply:
Literally nobody has claimed you're lying about your experiences. So.....
Calling me a "libtard" isn't going to win you any favors. On some topics I'm more left leaning, on others, right leaning. Last elections I voted on 4 levels for 3 different parties; only one ofthem would be considered "left" by you; the other two are fairly right wing. Either way, you literally said your opinion was formed because of your encounters with Florida police. Extrapolating some encounters with Florida police to "the police is the biggest organized crime organisation on the planet" is simply foolish on your end. You literally said that most police everywhere is corrupt/evil/criminal. That's patently absurd.
You must be a libtard, because pretending people said something completely batshit retarded is a common libtard debate tactic. I just wanted to repeat that here, because that is exactly what you have done... Again. I say that not because I actually think you are a libtard, like I give a flying fuck about your political affiliations since all politicians are corrupt pieces of shit, but because you debate like a libtard, i.e. immediately beginning construction of the the strawman, conducting character assassination through personal attack, focusing on specific insignificant points that barely even belong in the conversation or are meant in jest while completely ignoring the salient information because you lack the ability to actually come up with a rebuttal that works (mainly because I'm correct and you are not), and, finally, dismissing the entire argument as ''patently absurd.'' Did you take lessons from Bill or Hillary? Oh, almost forgot to mention one of the most common libtard debate tactics, second only to the Race Card™: Completely ignoring all facts and research. I mean, you didn't even mention the 1100 people murdered by police last year, what's up with that? Is it a lie? Are you going to call bullshit now?
You just took a whole bunch of shit out of context, focused tightly on the Florida thing as if the 266,000 youtube videos just don't exist and even took a stab at my ''I'm lying'' joke in a typical libtard effort to ''debunk'' my argument that even the so called good cops are covering for the bad ones. Oh, the ''watch these 266, 000 videos'' thing was also facetious but that either sailed over your pointy fucking head or you were just reaching for any straw that you could grasp in a pathetic effort to make it appear that I was talking out of my ass.
Either way, I'm sure everyone in this forum is well versed in the art of reading words and understanding their meaning, so I'm not going to put too much effort into explaining how badly you failed with that particular effort. [redacted]
Just because my experiences occurred in Florida means nothing, I lived there most of my life, duh, that's where I'm going to see all the action. [redacted]
The rest of your post is just plain stupid and I won't bother picking it apart, because anybody that read it saw it for what it was.... Butthurt.
You, ser, fail at this debate and I won't be paying attention to anything else that you might have to say about anything, ever. Once again, stay the fuck on topic or just don't bother.
[Redacted] out the personal attacks, but left the rest in. - Dave
You just took a whole bunch of shit out of context, focused tightly on the Florida thing as if the 266,000 youtube videos just don't exist and even took a stab at my ''I'm lying'' joke in a typical libtard effort to ''debunk'' my argument that even the so called good cops are covering for the bad ones. Oh, the ''watch these 266, 000 videos'' thing was also facetious but that either sailed over your pointy fucking head or you were just reaching for any straw that you could grasp in a pathetic effort to make it appear that I was talking out of my ass.
Either way, I'm sure everyone in this forum is well versed in the art of reading words and understanding their meaning, so I'm not going to put too much effort into explaining how badly you failed with that particular effort. [redacted]
Just because my experiences occurred in Florida means nothing, I lived there most of my life, duh, that's where I'm going to see all the action. [redacted]
The rest of your post is just plain stupid and I won't bother picking it apart, because anybody that read it saw it for what it was.... Butthurt.
You, ser, fail at this debate and I won't be paying attention to anything else that you might have to say about anything, ever. Once again, stay the fuck on topic or just don't bother.
[Redacted] out the personal attacks, but left the rest in. - Dave
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Just get the fuck out.
Hey now, unless your going to watch over 200,000 youtube videos and 100% agree with MisterSteve your opinions aren't welcome here. He's trying to have a debate, not have you arguing with his positions.
*You're. Didn't read the rest of your post, you obviously aren't a reasonable individual if you can't get the grammar right.
Dave
Staff member
Redacted out personal attacks but left most of it in, not because I agree or disagree, but because he can say whatever he wants as long as it doesn't break any rules. And no, "libtard" isn't a personal attack as much as a hilariously quick way to make all the rest of your points lose any meaning. Basically anyone who disagrees with you (not Mr. Steve - anyone who uses the term) is considered a "libtard", which is just stupid. It's pretty much one of the things dividing the country - if you don't agree with me in any way I'm going to call you names, stick my fingers in my ears, and scream "LALALALALALALA!!!" until you go away. See? I won!
Liberals have some excellent positions on things and some terrible ones. Conservatives have some excellent positions on things and some terrible ones. This is why we need centrists, not extremists.
Mr. Steve has some good points, but they are wrapped in levels of anger, vitriol, and more than a little condescension. The anger comes from his feeling that nobody is taking the issue of police brutality seriously and thinking that more needs to be done - publicly and openly - by the police themselves and our government. The vitriol and condescension comes from his views that we, like most others, just don't get it! Like he gets the issue that none of us can because he's done the studies and we have not. Or we choose to just use the media as our conscience. This utter disregard of our own individual ideas and viewpoints is what is getting people riled up.
Now, getting down on us because we didn't "watch 266,000 videos on YouTube" is kinda disingenuous. YOU, Mr. Steve, have not watched them all, either. 266,000 at let's say 1 minute each. That's FOUR YEARS of videos if you watch them 8 hours a day, every day. You, sir, should have no opinion on the subject until you've watched all 266,000 videos. I know you said it was facetious, but I don't believe you. That was a retreat tactic and you damned well know it. Nobody goes on a rant like that and in the middle angrily puts a small nugget of humor. Your back-tracking failed.
But you know what? The only thing you've done is to come in, tramp around like a bull in a china shoppe, insulted everyone, and managed to subvert the conversation from police brutality to how you deliver your message! This is what anger and condescension does. It changes the message from the salient points to more mundane and unhelpful minutiae. If that was your aim - bravo! But you've done more to harm the conversation than any of the "libtards" who have been discussing this for 48 pages.
So if you want to continue to rant and actually harm discussion on the topic, you have that right (but we reserve the right to dog you mercilessly on the point). I'd prefer, however, that you step back, gather your points in a more cohesive and less antagonistic way and join the fucking debate.
Said with love,
Dave
Liberals have some excellent positions on things and some terrible ones. Conservatives have some excellent positions on things and some terrible ones. This is why we need centrists, not extremists.
Mr. Steve has some good points, but they are wrapped in levels of anger, vitriol, and more than a little condescension. The anger comes from his feeling that nobody is taking the issue of police brutality seriously and thinking that more needs to be done - publicly and openly - by the police themselves and our government. The vitriol and condescension comes from his views that we, like most others, just don't get it! Like he gets the issue that none of us can because he's done the studies and we have not. Or we choose to just use the media as our conscience. This utter disregard of our own individual ideas and viewpoints is what is getting people riled up.
Now, getting down on us because we didn't "watch 266,000 videos on YouTube" is kinda disingenuous. YOU, Mr. Steve, have not watched them all, either. 266,000 at let's say 1 minute each. That's FOUR YEARS of videos if you watch them 8 hours a day, every day. You, sir, should have no opinion on the subject until you've watched all 266,000 videos. I know you said it was facetious, but I don't believe you. That was a retreat tactic and you damned well know it. Nobody goes on a rant like that and in the middle angrily puts a small nugget of humor. Your back-tracking failed.
But you know what? The only thing you've done is to come in, tramp around like a bull in a china shoppe, insulted everyone, and managed to subvert the conversation from police brutality to how you deliver your message! This is what anger and condescension does. It changes the message from the salient points to more mundane and unhelpful minutiae. If that was your aim - bravo! But you've done more to harm the conversation than any of the "libtards" who have been discussing this for 48 pages.
So if you want to continue to rant and actually harm discussion on the topic, you have that right (but we reserve the right to dog you mercilessly on the point). I'd prefer, however, that you step back, gather your points in a more cohesive and less antagonistic way and join the fucking debate.
Said with love,
Dave
Dave... Why have you never said anything to me with love? 
Sent from my SM-G920T using Tapatalk
Sent from my SM-G920T using Tapatalk
It's not because he doesn't feel the need to articulate it that he doesn't say everything he says with loveDave... Why have you never said anything to me with love?
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assume anything anyone says to one another on here is said with love unless specified otherwise (/snark) and your reading experience immediately turns into more of a feel good experience.
So, onto more important issues ... I guess Charlie left for good because of Jay?