[News] Daniel Tosh is an ass.

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GasBandit

Staff member
I'm not saying we have to set down laws, or even ground rules, of what a comedian can and can't say. Being funny is all about intuition and knowing what to say and when. That means a comedian can still be called on saying the wrong thing at the wrong time. Yes, the lady should just have left... but Tosh said the wrong thing at the wrong time. Very wrong on both accounts.
 
There are probably a lot better ways an experienced comedian should deal with a rude heckler than "lol you should get raped"
 
There's making a joke and giving a heckler insults, which I have no problem with at all! Then there's what Tosh did, which was intimidate and use his position to frighten someone with the threat of sexual violence. That's not okay, no matter where you're standing.

I also really hate hecklers, but as much as I hate agreeing with Gasbandit, this was way the fuck over the line.
 

Dave

Staff member
“Wouldn’t it be funny if that Obama got shot by like, 5 guys right now? Like right now? What if a bunch of guys just shot him…”

Let's see if the Secret Service would think this is not a threat.

At the very least it's inciting violence.
 
She asked for it, just like the heckler...
Difference between "free speech (even if you're an idiot)" in the open, and "interrupting a paid performance". It'sn ot "free speech" to talk during a movie or spoil the plot, for example - that's just asshattishness. Same for the heckler (even though there, as well, the response was too strong). If the heckler had gone back home and made a very angry and bitter blogpost about Tosh being a tosser, it'd be quite something different from interrupting a performance and drawing the attention for....well, I don't know why.
 
Difference between "free speech (even if you're an idiot)" in the open, and "interrupting a paid performance". It'sn ot "free speech" to talk during a movie or spoil the plot, for example - that's just asshattishness. Same for the heckler (even though there, as well, the response was too strong). If the heckler had gone back home and made a very angry and bitter blogpost about Tosh being a tosser, it'd be quite something different from interrupting a performance and drawing the attention for....well, I don't know why.
So the threat of gang rape is justified for letting a comedian know he's crossing the line.
 

Dave

Staff member
So the threat of gang rape is justified for letting a comedian know he's crossing the line.
We're saying (at least what I've read) is that the heckler asked for it but got hit with a nuclear bomb of idiocy instead of the level she should have gotten. The fact that she was wrong does not absolve Tosh of his being super wrong as well.
 
So the threat of gang rape is justified for letting a comedian know he's crossing the line.
...Look, I'm not feeling too great right now, and last time someone told me I was a rape apologist that thread was locked a day later. Let's not go there. Nice try, though.
 
I don't think it would have gotten to the point where someone in the crowd heard that and grabbed her and held her down, etc, but it's certainly threatening.
 
I don't think it would have gotten to the point where someone in the crowd heard that and grabbed her and held her down, etc, but it's certainly threatening.
"Someone go rape that bitch to shut her up" is threatening. Saying it would be amusing if she got raped is not threatening. It's certainly not funny, but I think it goes a little far to claim that he was trying to incite the crowd to any sort of violence.
 
The guy was basically saying, "what if the worst thing happened to this douche-bag who's heckling me... like... right now?"

Is it funny? Not really. Was it ballsy? Hells yeah.

In the end... it worked... the bitch shut the fuck up and got the fuck out.
 
So the threat of gang rape is justified for letting a comedian know he's crossing the line.
no, no it isn't, but I have a sense that neither side is telling the whole truth of what really happened. This reminds me of Mr. Zimmerman in Florida, The argument that keeps coming back is that a fight was started and someone terrible came of it. What I am trying to say is that if you pick a fight with another person, how much right do you have to complain about the repercussions? with Zimmerman, the point I am trying to make is that he allegedly started a course of action that ended with him shooting someone to death. These are two drastically different scenarios both completely unfortunate. There is a defined level of guilt via interaction, neither side made a good choice, and something bad came of it. However, Tosh's threat, I believe, is without teeth. What he said was wrong, and lacking tact. He should have come up with a better response, I am sure he is going to take a lot of heat for this, and in 2 weeks time no one will talk about it, because there will be a new scandal to bitch about.
 
If he had said, "too bad the waiter didn't poison your drink" then it wouldn't be a topic of discussion at all.

Obviously people think gang-rape is worse than murder by an order of magnitude.

I'd love to see a video, because at this point we don't know exactly what she said to heckle him. She may have said something lighthearted to get a rise out of him, and perhaps him going for the nuclear option just to get rid of her was over the top. Alternately she stood up and was making a stand trying to get him off the stage and said something in a way that suggested she wasn't going to back down. In that case he might have only had the option of engaging her verbally for a long time, ruining his set, or saying the worst thing he could wrap his tiny brain around fast enough in order to throw her off balance, making leaving the only option.

Regardless, it was mere verbal sparring, and if she didn't want to get knocked off her horse, or if she didn't want him to use the R word then she should have made a legally enforceable contract with him prior to baiting him.

They are both idiots, and when she lost she took it to the interblogs to try and get the last laugh, and honestly I'd say she won, so it was a successful tactic. She's feeling vindicated, having more publicly stuck it to him, and he's rolling his eyes at her hollow victory. Is he going to change in response to this event? No. Is she going to become more aware of what she's getting herself into? No.

But who cares? Are we trying to suss out some sort of universal human truth by continuing to argue about what two strangers said to each other in a public setting? Let me know when you've cracked that nugget of truth and rephrased it so it'll fit on a bumper sticker.

Go ahead and be offended, if you want, at something two strangers said thousands of miles away and dozens of hours ago. It's your day to spend however you like, and if you want to spend it feeling hatred and unhappiness then knock yourself out.
 

GasBandit

Staff member


"The hell is wrong with you people? Every (comic) that gets (heckled) is not (Dave Chappelle)! Yes, (hecklers) conspire to (ruin the acts) of a lot of (innocent stand up comedians), but (Daniel Tosh) is not one of those men! We all know (the honkey gets laughs), but what happened to standards? What happened to bare minimums? Are you a fan of (Daniel Tosh)? You wanna help (Daniel Tosh)? Then get some (common sense advice) for (Daniel Tosh)! But don't pretend that the man is a hero. And stop the damn (rape apologism)! Act like you got some goddamn sense, people! Damn! Tired of playin' round here."
 
Rape is worse than murder by an order of magnitude. The victim of murder does not have to life with the shame of the event for the rest of his life.
If that were true then the penalties for rape would be worse than the penalties for murder. Society may say that rape is worse, but it's plainly obvious that it's not, or that society isn't willing to back up its words with actions.
 
The guy was basically saying, "what if the worst thing happened to this douche-bag who's heckling me... like... right now?"

Is it funny? Not really. Was it ballsy? Hells yeah.

In the end... it worked... the bitch shut the fuck up and got the fuck out.
I don't see anything ballsy about an already established comedian, who has a pretty large fanbase that will support him due to Tosh.0 and previous stand up, telling a heckler they should be raped.

Should she of said anything? No. Is Heckling rude and annoying? God yes. But let's not pretend Tosh is some edgy mother fucker for saying "lol get raped."
 
If that were true then the penalties for rape would be worse than the penalties for murder. Society may say that rape is worse, but it's plainly obvious that it's not, or that society isn't willing to back up its words with actions.
Penn

State

University.

Our society has many failings.

Also Murder is easier to prosecute. There's a body. Rape is damn hard to even prove that it happened.
 

Dave

Staff member
I think the biggest issue here is that is seems that lately people are thinking that it's okay to threaten women (and men as well) with rape. It's something that has been growing exponentially in online gaming - especially consoles - and it just seems that it's been bleeding into the consciousness of society more and more. Rape jokes wouldn't have been stood for only a few short years ago outside of shock comedy and even there it was frowned on. But now it seems that with /b/ and x-box live and places like that it's become acceptable to equate rape with defeating or humiliating someone.

I'm not sure what I'm trying to say other than, "Back in MY day....!" but it just seems to me that we're going to be having this discussion more and more as it becomes more utilized in the lexicon of society for whatever purpose.
 
Can we all just agree that rape is a really bad thing and not have this bizarro fight?
The problem is that rape didn't occur, the threat of rape didn't occur. So now we're stuck with trying to argue about whether a comedian was "right" or not to make a "joke" directed at an unruly member of the audience.

Some people here a trying to state that since rape is so bad - which we all agree with - then, taken to the logical extreme, even joking about rape is so bad, and thus under no circumstance should or could a reasonable person think that the comedian was "right".

No one is arguing about the relative badness of rape. But some are trying to use the badness of rape as a lever to say that it can never, ever be invoked in humorous conversation. It should instead be given dignified weight and due reverence.

It would be akin to saying that comedians should never take the name of god in vain, or use that subject matter lightly.

It might be offensive.
 
“Wouldn’t it be funny if that Obama got shot by like, 5 guys right now? Like right now? What if a bunch of guys just shot him…”

Let's see if the Secret Service would think this is not a threat.

At the very least it's inciting violence.
ಠ_ಠ
 
The problem is that rape didn't occur, the threat of rape didn't occur. So now we're stuck with trying to argue about whether a comedian was "right" or not to make a "joke" directed at an unruly member of the audience.

Some people here a trying to state that since rape is so bad - which we all agree with - then, taken to the logical extreme, even joking about rape is so bad, and thus under no circumstance should or could a reasonable person think that the comedian was "right".

No one is arguing about the relative badness of rape. But some are trying to use the badness of rape as a lever to say that it can never, ever be invoked in humorous conversation. It should instead be given dignified weight and due reverence.

It would be akin to saying that comedians should never take the name of god in vain, or use that subject matter lightly.

It might be offensive.
Hmm, for me anyway, that's yet another discussion. I think it's perfectly possible and OK to make jokes about the subject of rape; even very shocking/graphic/whatever jokes (though possibly with a bit of warning - though if Tosh is all that well-known his name is warning enough, I guess). But it's not because it's a topic you can joke about and that's a bit edgy, that anything you say about it is always funny or appropriate.
Making a joke about rape is one thing. Telling someone you hopethey get raped is another.

Q: "What's pink and turns red at the press of a button?"
A: "A baby in a blender"
is a joke.
Q: "I hope your baby gets killed by a mass-murderer in a horrific way, because you deserve it, you bitch"
A: "..."
is not a joke, it's being rude and offensive for the sake of being rude and offensive.

I have the feeling that the youth of today (oh god I'm turning into Dave) is more and more confusing these two. "Being offensive" has become funny in its own right; offending people has bercome the goal. That's not the point of joking about a taboo subject.
 
Our society has many failings.
So you are either saying that murderers should receive sentences of five years or less, or that rapists should receive life sentences or death penalty?

I mean you're really going out on a limb asserting that rape is worse than death. It seems to me that society would say there's no possibility of happiness after death, while there is not just the possibility of, but the likelihood of happiness after rape. If this were not true then the majority of rape victims would be committing suicide, rather than tiny percentage of suicides that occur after rape now.

And yet you insist that taking someone's life is better for the victim than sexual violence. I just don't understand your point of view, so I'm hoping you can expand on why death is better than sexual violence?
 
Hmm, for me anyway, that's yet another discussion. I think it's perfectly possible and OK to make jokes about the subject of rape; even very shocking/graphic/whatever jokes (though possibly with a bit of warning - though if Tosh is all that well-known his name is warning enough, I guess). But it's not because it's a topic you can joke about and that's a bit edgy, that anything you say about it is always funny or appropriate.
Making a joke about rape is one thing. Telling someone you hopethey get raped is another.

Q: "What's pink and turns red at the press of a button?"
A: "A baby in a blender"
is a joke.
Q: "I hope your baby gets killed by a mass-murderer in a horrific way, because you deserve it, you bitch"
A: "..."
is not a joke, it's being rude and offensive for the sake of being rude and offensive.

I have the feeling that the youth of today (oh god I'm turning into Dave) is more and more confusing these two. "Being offensive" has become funny in its own right; offending people has bercome the goal. That's not the point of joking about a taboo subject.
RAPE APOLOGIST!
 
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