a Trump vs Clinton United States Presidential Election in 2016
- Thread starter Charlie Don't Surf
- Start date
But among those who lived through the Cold War, Clinton already lost with a 70/30 margin. It's the young ones who stayed home in hordes who could've tilted the election.
Also, the whole Jewish thing probably would have come into play too.
Necronic
Staff member
A lot of people still don't understand the concept of privelege. I admit it's a complex concept, truly. But what you just said, acting like there's not a serious problem of racism on the right? Only a person with the privelege of a white perspective would think that.
He posted the actual PoV of Trump voters, and your response is to tell him to check his privilege. Which is kind of what the point is in posting that.
GasBandit
Staff member
He didn't say it doesn't exist, he said the brush was very broad and used to dismiss and silence rather than engage.[DOUBLEPOST=1478724966,1478724955][/DOUBLEPOST]
That too.
Necronic
Staff member
I wouldn't even say it's just a race problem. A lot of people of races Trump insulted still voted for him, and a lot of that has to do with class. We have destroyed the middle class over the years, and all those people that felt left behind hoped Trump would bring the nation back to their "values" and bring in jobs too. It won't happen, but that is the wish they have.
As for why a Hispanic would vote for Trump after calling them rapists? I really can't say, but I feel sometimes people, even when they find their own race / gender / religion under fire, always assume the person is talking about "those" members of the racial group. There are a lot of African American citizens who will gladly call inner-city kids thugs, or naturalized Hispanic citizens that will call out illegal immigrants, or even certain Christian denominations that would gladly throw other Christians under the bus. They look at Trump and didn't see someone shouting bigoted rhetoric at them, but instead at other groups in their race that they held just as much ire, not realizing that when it comes to race, people can be blind, and there is a chance they will be caught in the cross-fire and won't realize it till it's too late.
Necronic
Staff member
You know the point about class is interesting, because that really is my own privelege. I come from well educated people who did well financially, and am myself fairly well educated and do well financially. And when I hear people talking about the disappearing middle class I kind of shrug my shoulders because hey, I'm middle class and I'm ok right? I mean hell, I got 2 job offers and was able to use them to negotiate a signing bonus when the Dow was at 6k. So even my perception of the Great Recession is incredibly skewed.
And it goes farther for me as well, but in ways that are very reminiscent of how I hear other people talk about race. I see people complaining about how hard it is to find real work and there's a part of me that says "well maybe you should have worked harder and earned it". I have the same dismissive attitude towards white workers who see their chance of economic prosperity diminish as many of them have towards minorities and immigrants.
And I justify it by saying "hey, I started with the same chances they did. Same race, and I've never had much problem, so my success must just be a factor of me working harder and smarter."
But what I ignore is what I talked about at the beginning. I came from a family that values education so much that they pushed me over a few hurdles that would have stopped other people without that support system.
That, my inability to see that, even as a write about it and yet still can't stop mentally degrading the struggling white working class, that's my own issue of privelege that I need to deal with. And I'll be honest if I was in a position of power I wouldn't be bending over backwards to help these people.
Here's the rub though. This is a problem that needs to be addressed by all sides, and it comes in many different forms than just race or gender. But a large portion of America doesn't understand it as existing beyond those bounds, and dismisses the topic as "SJW nonsense" even though it's something that could actually lead to them being heard more.
And it goes farther for me as well, but in ways that are very reminiscent of how I hear other people talk about race. I see people complaining about how hard it is to find real work and there's a part of me that says "well maybe you should have worked harder and earned it". I have the same dismissive attitude towards white workers who see their chance of economic prosperity diminish as many of them have towards minorities and immigrants.
And I justify it by saying "hey, I started with the same chances they did. Same race, and I've never had much problem, so my success must just be a factor of me working harder and smarter."
But what I ignore is what I talked about at the beginning. I came from a family that values education so much that they pushed me over a few hurdles that would have stopped other people without that support system.
That, my inability to see that, even as a write about it and yet still can't stop mentally degrading the struggling white working class, that's my own issue of privelege that I need to deal with. And I'll be honest if I was in a position of power I wouldn't be bending over backwards to help these people.
Here's the rub though. This is a problem that needs to be addressed by all sides, and it comes in many different forms than just race or gender. But a large portion of America doesn't understand it as existing beyond those bounds, and dismisses the topic as "SJW nonsense" even though it's something that could actually lead to them being heard more.
Unfortunately, having the education and exposure to different kinds of people--which makes it easier to understand that your problems aren't you're neighbor's fault, that we're all people, etc--is a type of privilege.
On the other hand, I'm certain the 11-12,000 voters who wrote-in Harambe weren't baby boomers or Trump supporters.
On the other hand, I'm certain the 11-12,000 voters who wrote-in Harambe weren't baby boomers or Trump supporters.
Necronic
Staff member
Shit I remember talking to my parents a few years ago about my time in magnet schools as a kid and found out that they had pulled all these crazy strings to get me in there, a few of which may not have even been legal. And my education there was something I completely took for granted.
Ignoring the source (most claism are verifiable and/or backed by decent other sources) for a second, yeah, he's great.
Is that real? Please don't be real.
Going to be?
GasBandit
Staff member
And now, one of our clients was in today to change his commercial, one of which mentions "se habla espanol" at the end, just bald-facedly joked if he should add in "busses now available back to Mexico." Wow. I mean, wow.
On the bright side, he's really old and I expect he won't last another 10 years.
Dave
Staff member
http://www.usnews.com/news/politics...ince-priebus-top-potential-trump-cabinet-list
And Giuliani as...Attorney General.
And Giuliani as...Attorney General.
For fucking real?! He barely knows what the fuck is going on half the time.
I don't think it's funny at all.
Somehow I still remember that nine years ago I made a joke that you'd be 95 on your deathbed, dictating to the forums "any day now" and it still wouldn't have happened.
Ha ha ... haaaaaa.
In other news, I logged into Facebook and told whoever voted for Trump to go to hell ... at length ... and hopefully I've at least burned bridges with certain parts of my mom's side of the family so I don't have to attend their funerals someday. Wow, Trump is improving my life already.
A lot of people aren't going to be okay. I'm not going to be okay - I was only able to get medical insurance via the ACA. But a lot of people are at more severe risk than I am.
I feel like I've failed them. I did my part. I voted. I argued for the candidate I believed in. And I failed.
Here's what I'm trying to tell myself: we have to acknowledge that this was the will of the electorate. We must work to compromise and continue the peaceful transfer of power between legitimate and lawful chief executives of our Republic. If we refuse to acknowledge this, it makes us hypocrites and no better than those who have spent 8 years decrying our current President. This does not mean we should completely acquiesce with his agenda - we should oppose policy decisions we disagree with, because that is our responsibility as citizens. We should not be consumed by fear and bitterness. We should protect those of us at higher risk from the President-elect's proposed policies. We must oppose hatred. We must strive to do better.
I'm not believing it.
The worst part is, I can just say this bullshit because I'm a cis hetero white dude, so I'm the least affected by this catastrophe. Women, Muslims, LGBTQ, Immigrants... this is not about ideals to them. This about direct threats that have been levied at them.
I feel like I've failed them. I did my part. I voted. I argued for the candidate I believed in. And I failed.
Here's what I'm trying to tell myself: we have to acknowledge that this was the will of the electorate. We must work to compromise and continue the peaceful transfer of power between legitimate and lawful chief executives of our Republic. If we refuse to acknowledge this, it makes us hypocrites and no better than those who have spent 8 years decrying our current President. This does not mean we should completely acquiesce with his agenda - we should oppose policy decisions we disagree with, because that is our responsibility as citizens. We should not be consumed by fear and bitterness. We should protect those of us at higher risk from the President-elect's proposed policies. We must oppose hatred. We must strive to do better.
I'm not believing it.
The worst part is, I can just say this bullshit because I'm a cis hetero white dude, so I'm the least affected by this catastrophe. Women, Muslims, LGBTQ, Immigrants... this is not about ideals to them. This about direct threats that have been levied at them.
Bush was president--go along with it or you're a traitor.
Obama was president--"not my president."
Can't wait to take the high ground again.
Necronic
Staff member
Remember, Trumps election was all about draining the swamp. No corruption in that cabinet whatsoever.
And just in case you're ready for a laugh:
I mean, there were a lot of "not my president" for Bush too, just from the other side.
With Obama, it was -"you're a racist".
I never saw anyone saying "not my president" during Bush. We were too busy dealing with his Iraq crap and being called "traitor" for it.
With Obama, you're saying liberals were saying anyone who didn't vote for Obama was a racist, or that the people saying "not my president" were racist?
http://www.npr.org/2016/11/09/501451368/here-is-what-donald-trump-wants-to-do-in-his-first-100-days
Trump's plans for the first 100 days of his presidency.
Trump's plans for the first 100 days of his presidency.
