Co-parenting with my ex.
- Thread starter Shawn
- Start date
I mean I’m no therapist or anything but I could totally see someone’s reaction to downplay it for no other reason than to not have to think about it being a big terrible thing that happened to them.
But that begs the question: Why bring it up in the first place, then?
Hi, as an abuse victim, let me assure you that trying to minimize and downplay can absolutely be a coping mechanism. That's not what's at play here, though, clearly.
GasBandit
Staff member
I'm not going to sit here and tell you how your brain works, that would be pretty shitty.
But as Tinwhistler says..
This isn't minimizing or downplaying, if anything it's outright dismissal. This is "I'm telling you something that should make you treat me more favorably but I definitely don't want you to make a big deal about it and definitely we should not go to the cops about it, despite that being the obvious appropriate action."
Granted my experience with rape victims is limited only to my ex of 15 years, but it really beggars belief that anyone would treat it with the same level of gravity as stepping in dog doo.
And it happened with mind-boggling frequency, apparently.
No, this definitely does not smell at all authentic.
For some more context into this: Sarah's list of accusations of people doing horrible things of her is long and goes well back before I met her based on stories she and her parents would tell me. One of the first red flags I should have been aware of when we started dating was she accused my good friend of 7 years of touching her inappropriately. She made it clear to me at the time that she didn't want to make a big deal about it and definitely didn't want me to talk to him about it. I of course talked to him about it, he honestly denied it, and Sarah was seething mad at me for a week because I "betrayed" her.
A few years later, after we were married and Hailey was about 2, she decided to start volunteering for this guy who had a charity that was setting up vegetable gardens at schools. Suddenly this guy wanted to become a city elected official and Sarah got swept up quickly as his campaign manager (also on a volunteer basis). She was working LOOOOONG days with him, so much to the point that I had to start cashing in vacation days at work just so I could stay home with the kids. She had been hinting at this guy having a temper and also making her feel awkward for a while, until one day she came home and casually told me that he raped her. I was freaking out. Obviously we had to do something I told her, to which she said "no. No need". And I told her that she shouldn't obviously go back and she said "no. I'm not a quitter'. She ended up being more mad at me for how I reacted vs at the guy who "raped" her. She went back, and that continued for a few more weeks before he lost the election and Sarah left his "employment", only to join up with this disbarred lawyer that she met on the campaign who wanted to bring her in "ground level" on a campaign fund super PAC business, which of course would be non-paying until some actual money was made. She once again ended up spending entire 16 hour days with him, coming home and telling me how she was convinced her next career was going to be in politics, and that she needed to continue putting this stress on the family for the sake of that career. It didn't even occur to me she was having an affair with this guy until a friend at work asked me if that's what she was doing when I explained the situation to her.
Getting access to her Facebook account I found messages confirming the affair. She was able to gaslight me for a time, convince me of stupid stuff like "I faked those messages to make you jealous so you'd love me more" and allowed herself about another month of the affair before I caught them red handed and she admitted it. Months later she even started claiming THAT was rape the whole time.
I started thinking back about the politician that "raped" her and wondered if there was likely something going on there too. I contacted the guy's wife and asked if she suspected any kind of affair between the two of them (I left out the part where Sarah accused him of raping her) and she could only tell me "My husband wouldn't do that, but I can tell you that your wife really made me feel like I was unwanted in my own home whenever she was here".
So far the other three confirmed affairs she had after those she never claimed were rape. When she started working at JPL as a travel accountant (where she claimed she was raped above) there was apparently a guy at work that was sexually harassing her but he never did anything physical to her. The rape incident above was the most recent "rape" she told me about apart from claiming the disbarred lawyer had raped her for a period of 2 months, at his sister's condo, for 3 hours, three-four times a week.
A few years later, after we were married and Hailey was about 2, she decided to start volunteering for this guy who had a charity that was setting up vegetable gardens at schools. Suddenly this guy wanted to become a city elected official and Sarah got swept up quickly as his campaign manager (also on a volunteer basis). She was working LOOOOONG days with him, so much to the point that I had to start cashing in vacation days at work just so I could stay home with the kids. She had been hinting at this guy having a temper and also making her feel awkward for a while, until one day she came home and casually told me that he raped her. I was freaking out. Obviously we had to do something I told her, to which she said "no. No need". And I told her that she shouldn't obviously go back and she said "no. I'm not a quitter'. She ended up being more mad at me for how I reacted vs at the guy who "raped" her. She went back, and that continued for a few more weeks before he lost the election and Sarah left his "employment", only to join up with this disbarred lawyer that she met on the campaign who wanted to bring her in "ground level" on a campaign fund super PAC business, which of course would be non-paying until some actual money was made. She once again ended up spending entire 16 hour days with him, coming home and telling me how she was convinced her next career was going to be in politics, and that she needed to continue putting this stress on the family for the sake of that career. It didn't even occur to me she was having an affair with this guy until a friend at work asked me if that's what she was doing when I explained the situation to her.
Getting access to her Facebook account I found messages confirming the affair. She was able to gaslight me for a time, convince me of stupid stuff like "I faked those messages to make you jealous so you'd love me more" and allowed herself about another month of the affair before I caught them red handed and she admitted it. Months later she even started claiming THAT was rape the whole time.
I started thinking back about the politician that "raped" her and wondered if there was likely something going on there too. I contacted the guy's wife and asked if she suspected any kind of affair between the two of them (I left out the part where Sarah accused him of raping her) and she could only tell me "My husband wouldn't do that, but I can tell you that your wife really made me feel like I was unwanted in my own home whenever she was here".
So far the other three confirmed affairs she had after those she never claimed were rape. When she started working at JPL as a travel accountant (where she claimed she was raped above) there was apparently a guy at work that was sexually harassing her but he never did anything physical to her. The rape incident above was the most recent "rape" she told me about apart from claiming the disbarred lawyer had raped her for a period of 2 months, at his sister's condo, for 3 hours, three-four times a week.
Unfortunately my word against hers. Plus having serial affairs doesn't make her a bad mother. As far as I can tell Hailey is happy and healthy so I'm not afraid for her while she's in the care of her mother. I need a far better living/working situation before I can ask for more time. But if my ex does screw up and do something stupid that shows she's putting the kids in harm's way or is clearly abusing them, I will take her straight to court.
I went on a date on Monday. I thought it went very well. Fellow single parent, though she's all sorts of intelligent and had a kid via a donor just before she turned 40. We chatted.
I'm honest and did mention some of the frustrations of co-parenting. Did me in though as she emailed me later that evening and said that while I'm a nice guy she's worried about the drama in my life and doesn't want a 2nd date at this time. I agreed with her.
Not much I can do about it. Even if it comes up in conversation during a coffee meet-up or not it has to be brought up at some point.
Not sure which people above 40 don't have drama of some kind in their lives... although it's possible she doesn't since she went the donor method and seems to have her life together.
Oh well. Back to OKcupid.
I'm honest and did mention some of the frustrations of co-parenting. Did me in though as she emailed me later that evening and said that while I'm a nice guy she's worried about the drama in my life and doesn't want a 2nd date at this time. I agreed with her.
Not much I can do about it. Even if it comes up in conversation during a coffee meet-up or not it has to be brought up at some point.
Not sure which people above 40 don't have drama of some kind in their lives... although it's possible she doesn't since she went the donor method and seems to have her life together.
Oh well. Back to OKcupid.
While almost everyone will have some bagage, not everyone necessarily has still-active drama. While it absolutely sucks for you, I can understand someone noping out over it.
Also, of course, on a first date "I have a kid, and sometimes there are some issues with my ex" is pretty much more than enough. I wasn't there and don't know, so don't take this as an insult or judgement on you, but someone spending half their first date complaining/griping about their ex can also be a huge red flag.
Also, of course, on a first date "I have a kid, and sometimes there are some issues with my ex" is pretty much more than enough. I wasn't there and don't know, so don't take this as an insult or judgement on you, but someone spending half their first date complaining/griping about their ex can also be a huge red flag.
Absolutely. Not quite what happened but it was brought up.
This Johnny Depp and Amber Heard trial is important for me, as it really is putting a lot of light on women abusers in relationships.
I've been listening to the audios that Depp has brought to his case. It's actually difficult to do so. It really is. I start hearing how she's talking to him, how she's shaming him for running away from her and hiding in different rooms to flee the fights and the berating, and how she tries to gaslight him into thinking that her abuse is perfectly reasonable for the situation, and I start to well up. This was my life. This was my life for years. In the end I was the one who got put in the spotlight for "abuse" because I'm the male and therefore automatically the problem according to society. I called a domestic violence hotline once and asked them what I should do. They said "Just stay calm and take it until she walks away.". That's awful advice to "just take it" but sadly it's the only advice you can give to a guy in these situations. The second you defend yourself then you're fucked.
I hope cancel culture takes Amber Heard for a death spin.
I've been listening to the audios that Depp has brought to his case. It's actually difficult to do so. It really is. I start hearing how she's talking to him, how she's shaming him for running away from her and hiding in different rooms to flee the fights and the berating, and how she tries to gaslight him into thinking that her abuse is perfectly reasonable for the situation, and I start to well up. This was my life. This was my life for years. In the end I was the one who got put in the spotlight for "abuse" because I'm the male and therefore automatically the problem according to society. I called a domestic violence hotline once and asked them what I should do. They said "Just stay calm and take it until she walks away.". That's awful advice to "just take it" but sadly it's the only advice you can give to a guy in these situations. The second you defend yourself then you're fucked.
I hope cancel culture takes Amber Heard for a death spin.
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I had a parent meeting with Hailey's therapist today. She has noticed that Hailey tends to be always in "happy mode" and doesn't seem to ever shift into other feelings. Hailey loves playing games which the therapist uses to set up a bond with her, but whenever questions about her feelings or about certain parts of her life come up she tends to re-route the conversation. This is exactly what I've seen. So it's not just me she's doing it for. She doesn't like to open up too much about things.
Therapist's advice was to just to remain being patient with her. I told her that one of my concerns is that I'm overcompensating as a parent: spending the entire day with Hailey. Doing what she wants to do. Playing dolls and legos with her. Taking her to movies. Disneyland twice last year. Universal with a year pass. Basically worrying that I'm being a Disney dad. The therapist actually made me feel good when she said "keep being a Disney dad. It's ok."
Therapist's advice was to just to remain being patient with her. I told her that one of my concerns is that I'm overcompensating as a parent: spending the entire day with Hailey. Doing what she wants to do. Playing dolls and legos with her. Taking her to movies. Disneyland twice last year. Universal with a year pass. Basically worrying that I'm being a Disney dad. The therapist actually made me feel good when she said "keep being a Disney dad. It's ok."
My guess, just from what you've shared about your ex, is that she's learning this behavior from your ex wife, who probably punishes or otherwise negatively influences her if she doesn't act like everything is perfect
That's a very frightening thought because of how much sense it could make.
I'm not an expert, so you know, don't rely on me, but what you've described of your ex has been very controlling and narcissistic. She gaslights people into getting her way. I'm don't think she's grounding or formally punishing your daughter, but I'm sure she sends the clear message that she's not happy if you're upset, so a child's natural response to that is "if I get unhappy then Mommy gets mad at me."
Today has been quite a shock.
To lead up to things I have known that in the last month Sarah has made two trips to San Francisco. One with the whole family (her boyfriend John included) and one time with just Hailey. Hailey mentioned to me they were there to visit her friend "Erik". I've had my suspicions that she and this Erik have been spending some quality time together, but I figured that was between her and John. Today I was informed by Sarah that this Erik would be moving in within the next few weeks or months. When I asked what relationship this man would have with Hailey, she informed me that he will be Hailey's new step-father as they are getting married next week.
I'm not sure what status John is. She claims that he has moved out of the bedroom and into a spare room in the house. She also claims that she has been dating this guy for over 6.5 years and has been engaged for over a year. Since Sarah and I only separated 3.5 years ago I asked for clarification. So now that 6.5 years was them dating BEFORE she and I got together, and they have been back together for the last 9 months now. This is also concerning, because when we were together Sarah would claim that her boyfriend in Highschool Erik would violently cut her, and threaten to kill her family if she told anyone. She says that she ended up taking the blame for the cutting and that's what got her put into a mental health clinic by her parents. That same clinic is where she met the father of her first three kids. Personally I always thought that story was bull shit. The someone else cutting her part. I think she is more than capable of harming herself and blaming someone else.
But damn. She just gets crazier and crazier. I also have absolutely no idea how her (I guess ex boyfriend) john factors into all this? She always told me she was settling for him and was just using him for a second paycheck. But I saw the love letters that she sent him to initiate their relationship. She really hooked him and made him think it was true love. She even had him agree to having a baby with within a few months via in-vitro.
I honestly have no idea what to make of all this.
To lead up to things I have known that in the last month Sarah has made two trips to San Francisco. One with the whole family (her boyfriend John included) and one time with just Hailey. Hailey mentioned to me they were there to visit her friend "Erik". I've had my suspicions that she and this Erik have been spending some quality time together, but I figured that was between her and John. Today I was informed by Sarah that this Erik would be moving in within the next few weeks or months. When I asked what relationship this man would have with Hailey, she informed me that he will be Hailey's new step-father as they are getting married next week.
I'm not sure what status John is. She claims that he has moved out of the bedroom and into a spare room in the house. She also claims that she has been dating this guy for over 6.5 years and has been engaged for over a year. Since Sarah and I only separated 3.5 years ago I asked for clarification. So now that 6.5 years was them dating BEFORE she and I got together, and they have been back together for the last 9 months now. This is also concerning, because when we were together Sarah would claim that her boyfriend in Highschool Erik would violently cut her, and threaten to kill her family if she told anyone. She says that she ended up taking the blame for the cutting and that's what got her put into a mental health clinic by her parents. That same clinic is where she met the father of her first three kids. Personally I always thought that story was bull shit. The someone else cutting her part. I think she is more than capable of harming herself and blaming someone else.
But damn. She just gets crazier and crazier. I also have absolutely no idea how her (I guess ex boyfriend) john factors into all this? She always told me she was settling for him and was just using him for a second paycheck. But I saw the love letters that she sent him to initiate their relationship. She really hooked him and made him think it was true love. She even had him agree to having a baby with within a few months via in-vitro.
I honestly have no idea what to make of all this.
I need to do it react with the durr face more than once for this:
And a few more for good measure:
I've said it before, I'm say it a thousand times. Your ex is a narcissistic psycho who uses sex and relationship status to control people in order to validate her own feelings. She'll be be pregnant with this Erik person's kid soon if she isn't already, as having a child in her mind gives her leverage to control someone. She did it to you, she did it to John, she'll do it to the next guy once her current stock start to get wise, and she'll play the victim the entire time
I have reached out to my lawyer with that exact question. If I can somehow win full custody and be able to take Hailey to Colorado that would be a dream come true.
I need to process what I read there. I’m so sorry this is happening.
I hope that you are able to win more custody time as that sounds chaotic.
I hope that you are able to win more custody time as that sounds chaotic.
Been having difficulty keeping my mind off this.
Sarah still will not address my concerns. Completely ignoring them in fact.
1) Is this the Erik that she claims would cut her during high school? Truthfully it's probably just another of her false claims against an ex. Though if there is any reality to it then this is a guy that's going to be living with my daughter.
2) Hailey has met this guy twice. Sarah has been seeing him long distance for 9 months (this is not including the 6.5 years she was with him 13 years ago). I feel that this is moving things too fast for Hailey. Especially since Sarah's M.O. is to try and substitute old dads with the new "dads". I feel like Hailey is going to be exposed to Sarah's idea that father figures are disposable and replaceable.
3) John staying there in the guest room is going to likely be one heck of a powder keg ready to go off at any time. The replaced will literally be living with the replacement. It's going to be like a bizzaro Full House over there, but replace Bob Saget with Amber Heard.
Sarah still will not address my concerns. Completely ignoring them in fact.
1) Is this the Erik that she claims would cut her during high school? Truthfully it's probably just another of her false claims against an ex. Though if there is any reality to it then this is a guy that's going to be living with my daughter.
2) Hailey has met this guy twice. Sarah has been seeing him long distance for 9 months (this is not including the 6.5 years she was with him 13 years ago). I feel that this is moving things too fast for Hailey. Especially since Sarah's M.O. is to try and substitute old dads with the new "dads". I feel like Hailey is going to be exposed to Sarah's idea that father figures are disposable and replaceable.
3) John staying there in the guest room is going to likely be one heck of a powder keg ready to go off at any time. The replaced will literally be living with the replacement. It's going to be like a bizzaro Full House over there, but replace Bob Saget with Amber Heard.
While I doubt your ex has suddenly grown up and become as modern as all that - having a former partner and new partner together in one house can work in some modern family set-ups. Neither love nor parenting needs to be a two-person deal by default, even if our society is used to it.
Having said that, obviously, in this case that's not what's happening :-P I know the type of person (and without being sexist, this is usually women) who simply can't be alone and needs to be "in a relationship" at all times - which often leads to overlap and everything that entails. And they're usually not the most healthy of relationships, since "being part of one" is more important than being in one with the right other person.
Anyway, not very helpful. No idea how much rights you have as a co-parent to ask about a person who will be living with your child. Depending on your state such laws can vary wildly; if you're in conservative enough ground a "family" setup like that might be considered enough of an unhealthy influence on Hailey to change custody rules, though I doubt it.
Having said that, obviously, in this case that's not what's happening :-P I know the type of person (and without being sexist, this is usually women) who simply can't be alone and needs to be "in a relationship" at all times - which often leads to overlap and everything that entails. And they're usually not the most healthy of relationships, since "being part of one" is more important than being in one with the right other person.
Anyway, not very helpful. No idea how much rights you have as a co-parent to ask about a person who will be living with your child. Depending on your state such laws can vary wildly; if you're in conservative enough ground a "family" setup like that might be considered enough of an unhealthy influence on Hailey to change custody rules, though I doubt it.
My mentality does factor in the abuse that I got from Sarah when we were together. I know what she's like. I know that these decisions she makes are not based on logic and careful planning. They are impulses that she acts on in an effort to fuel her need to be adored and loved. It's the same reason she coaxes John in with promises of being a happy couple and even sending the poor man love letters so mushy that you'd swear they were written by a middle schooler. But at the same time she cheats on him once with me and spends the next few months after that semi flirting with me by suggesting our physical relationship can continue on the side and even sends me several nudes of herself (I think John even took one of them). I don't know if he's aware of these things. I'd speak to him about them but he's already expressed no interest in talking to me. Plus I don't think he'd believe me anyway, even if I showed him the texts and pictures.
Perhaps John even has the same situation coming up. He gets sex on the side and all he has to do is stick around, pay his share of the rent, and continue being a dad to the kids. But that kind of situation is bound to get very challenging at times once paranoia starts to peak.
There are just as many men like this as well, it's a pretty common trait
I never said they didn't exist, just that, in my personal, anecdotal and purely unscientific experience, the "can't be alone" mentality seems to be more common in women than men. Perhaps because - certainly around here- women were still taught more often that their self worth and value lies in their partner rather than in themselves. I'm not saying it's some inherent negative feminine trait or whatever. Also, not at all the point of this thread or my post.
My ex was adopted. Her adopted mother was a bit on the lack of loving side. It definitely factors in to her need to be loved and never alone.
We have gotten to point where Sarah took it upon herself to cancel two of my scheduled visits to go on a vacation. She did not ask permission, just let me know. I told her I would like a discussion next time first as a curtesy and wished them a good trip. When I asked for make up visits she has informed me that Hailey said “no thank you” to those requests (she is 9 as a reminder). When I asked to hear this from Hailey directly I was told that Hailey would rather the request just come from her mother. So again, I have no way of knowing if Hailey even said this or, if she did, if she is being manipulated by her mother in anyway.
Hailey is currently with a therapist who is encouraging us to allow hailey to make choices for herself. But at what point do I draw the line as we have officially gotten to the point that Hailey’s choices (supposedly) are now keeping me from seeing her on our court negotiated schedule.
Hailey is currently with a therapist who is encouraging us to allow hailey to make choices for herself. But at what point do I draw the line as we have officially gotten to the point that Hailey’s choices (supposedly) are now keeping me from seeing her on our court negotiated schedule.
